Driving from the UK to Italy in August....Travel Tips Sought

[suewhistle]

No it doesn't. No idea on the traffic but very early or very late might be a good idea. As for Milan, no idea but my instinct would be clockwise! I'll ask around...

I'm just in at 21.30 after an aperitivo (pre-dinner drinks) but too late for dinner now! I'm sure I'll find a bottle somewhere in the fridge or cantina... this mineral water just isn't doing it.

Anyway, I _did_ ask around at my local tonight: about 5 people and 6 opinions, but it was suggested anti-clockwise around Milan for longer but less traffic: it may depend on the time you do it. (As you can see I'm not accepting any blame: I'm going all Pompey supporterish....).

Ignore saintbletch on roundabouts. The law has changed so you now have priority: even practice seems to have changed, but remember I'm in the slightly more organised north... It's amazing how hardly anybody here uses indicators on roundabouts (or anywhere if you aren't up their chuff): 20/30k away over the border (SW/FR) and they all seem capable...

If sobriety bring anything else to mind I will respond further, but Barbera,Traminer and Prosecco are having a deleterious effect on my typing skills..

Ah yes, ferragosto, 15 August. I'm normally in the UK (the AC on my car has long gone west...) but think bank holiday in the UK and stay put. My only experience here a few years ago was going to a party up in the local mountains: passive smoke stoned and frozen to death as there was fresh snow on the surrounding peaks! Normally it's farrrr toooo hot...

[trousers]

Re: this 15th August date - that's a Wednesday - do they celebrate it on the day itself or the closest weekend? We're due to reach Italy on Saturday 18th...

[jasonb]

Re: this 15th August date - that's a Wednesday - do they celebrate it on the day itself or the closest weekend? We're due to reach Italy on Saturday 18th...

I'm there the week before, hoping to arrive at our campsite on Monday 13th. I'm assuming Venice doesn't shut up shop! Be my luck that! Our honeymoon to Paris coincided with all the museum staff walking out on strike for 3 days!

[jasonb]

Why the obsession with the France/Switzerland route?

Now I've been planning to come back through Germany for a more leisurely drive for the ferry but you have me contemplating going down that way too. I am trying to keep costs down but am also hoping to strike a balance of getting there pronto same as Trousers.

[dubai_phil]

Cheers DP....a few follow up queries below if I may be so bold....


Do they take bank cards as well as cash? If yes, would you still recommend sticking with cash? (maybe crap exchange rate on the card?)

As you approach you can see one shows a cash diagram one shows CREDIT cards. Really do not know IF they take debit cards. I had a rental Pug 508 with a great area to stash coins was then a case of designating FMDP to have notes ready in case

Is it obvious which stations are self-service and which aren't as you approach them? I assume the motorway service stations are all self-serve?

No but when you get in some show Self Service pump. Will find more on the non Autoroutes

And, what's with the painful fingers....?!
Their pump handles TWIST and got a pinched finger they AREN'T the same as UK pump handles

Sounds the complete opposite to German service stations then. I couldn't quite believe the excellent quality of the fresh food on the autobahns. Still, it sounds like a slight improvement on the grease laden excuse for food you get on UK motorways!

Had a decent Ciabatta but one kinda hopes for ore than a cheese & ham toastie on hols in Italy, It was that or a croissant.Not first choice even the bigger Autogrills. You can always have Pizza slices, trouble is after 2 weeks in Italy you kinda want anything EXCEPT Pizza

Hmmm....interestign one that. I tend to rely on the damn thing especially when travelling around Europe as the rest of the family are useless map readers and navigators! Are you recommending that because they tend to be inaccurate in Italy or just a personal preference? Cheers

Easy delegate one person as the map reader and make it an ego thing for them to beat the GPS. FMDP was a girl with maps when we started. She was a true Girl Scout expert when we finished. Let them make a mistake and be cool about the whole turning around thing. Trouble with GPS is some turnings are not right and the signs don't show the where you are heading for, just the next big town/City. At least with the map you have a chance

It's funny you should say that....I've been stung numerous times before (lack of planning and poor use of the 'data off' control on the phone, but I got a text through from O2 last week saying that, as from July, they are going to start capping Europe data charges at £1.99 per day which, given they used to charge £3 per MB, is a pretty hefty change in favour of the customer. Some EU directive I believe....

CHECK IT before you go. I thought I had it covered, after 2 days my Data cost was 100 EUROS

Whereabouts did you park to pick up the metro? We've been recommended the mainline train as we're about 50 miles north of Rome but would entertain driving in closer to the outskirts of the city if it was no bother.

In Rome we stayed at Aurora Gardens Hotel. About 6kms away was the end of one metro line. Was a lot of parking around the station (go Google) BUT when we got there (people were slow) it was all full. I ended up in a disabled space. I limped to the office the guy said no worries. I spent the day worried, but got away with it

Last trip we were nearer to Sienan and took the mainline train - Simples and perfect straight to Termini Best advice I can give PAY for a 24/48 hour all routes hop on hop off ticket and use them. Then use the ap to see the stuff. Farking loved it and so easy think 24 hour tkt was 19 Euro. walkfrom the forum walk to the Coliseum & do the other stuff from the bus. Our plan was Vatican by Metro then Bus the rest - wish we had done Bus first
(oh come out of Vatican North side as you exit the wall take a right (NOT the main drag to the square full of bemused tourists) we got a great Pasta lunch at 1st restaurant there almost in touching distance of Vatican for 9 Euros each. Bargain by Rome CC stds

Are there 'safer' places to park than others? For example, I assume parking in a mainline train station car park would probably be as safe as it gets.

Brit Car? Simple rule leave NOTHING on show I mean NOTHING, not even a scrap piece of paper. You need 19 Euro for the Bus min (google them many different tours) some no kids discount some do. AVOID Gelatos by the Vatican = 10 Euros PER Cornet FFS take back pack of soft drinks & water for the day

Cheers again

HTH

Oh and the BIGGEST idea? IF you can find an OLD laptop, take that AND 2 USB Mem Sticks and download every night and make back ups. I had a 16Gb card in my camera and filled it by end of trip but also had 3 x 4Mb cards so I alternated each day & backed up to the 16Gb and IF the camera had got nicked I would not have lost the whole trip picks (Which are now on FB and for friends only)

[dubai_phil]

I'm there the week before, hoping to arrive at our campsite on Monday 13th. I'm assuming Venice doesn't shut up shop! Be my luck that! Our honeymoon to Paris coincided with all the museum staff walking out on strike for 3 days!

Take a water bus out to Murano for a few hours

[View From The Top]

I'm there the week before, hoping to arrive at our campsite on Monday 13th. I'm assuming Venice doesn't shut up shop! Be my luck that! Our honeymoon to Paris coincided with all the museum staff walking out on strike for 3 days!

If you're going to Venice from Calais or Dunkirk then the Germany route is the best IMHO.

[View From The Top]

Re: this 15th August date - that's a Wednesday - do they celebrate it on the day itself or the closest weekend? We're due to reach Italy on Saturday 18th...

Expect the traffic to be very heavy on the 18th. Leave VERY early.

[colehillsaint]

Cheers - yep, I've read some similar hairy stories about avoiding Italian city centres in general. The Italian owners of the house we are staying in north of Rome have told us we shoud drive 15kms to the nearest mainline station and get a train into the city from there.

Driven into the centre of Rome twice and thought it was a blast tbh. We are English, we drive where we want!

[View From The Top]

Driven into the centre of Rome twice and thought it was a blast tbh. We are English, we drive where we want!

It's when the streets get narrow that I find myself almost breathing in in the hope of making the car thinner!

[saintbletch]

Ignore saintbletch on roundabouts. The law has changed so you now have priority: even practice seems to have changed, but remember I'm in the slightly more organised north... It's amazing how hardly anybody here uses indicators on roundabouts (or anywhere if you aren't up their chuff): 20/30k away over the border (SW/FR) and they all seem capable...

My apologies suewhistle, my information is 10+ years old.

But I would have paid BIG money to be an observer on the roads in Italy the day that law changed!

[alpine_saint]

Greetings fellow forum stalwarts,

6 of us are driving down to Italy in August for our 2 week summer holiday. The first week we are staying 50 ish miles north of Rome (near Viterbo) and the second week we are staying 60 ish miles south of Naples (near Sassano).

On the way down we've got an overnight stay in Switzerland for the outbound and return trips (Luzerne and Lugano respectively).

Anyone got any travel tips for the journey? (e.g. routes to avoid, driving tips, etc). I've done plenty of driving around France, Germany and Denmark but never Italy.

Also, any tips for places to visit whilst there (the obvious Rome and Naples/Pompeii tourist traps aside)?

Cheers me dears,
Lord Trousers and family

Pity you didnt choose to go via Austria, I could have offered you a cuppa.

[alpine_saint]

If you're going to Venice from Calais or Dunkirk then the Germany route is the best IMHO.

This.

Cross over into Austria via the A8 Munich - Salzburg, drive down the A10 to Villach, across the border direction Udine.

[alpine_saint]

I want/need to go the quickest route regardless of which countries that entails. Is there a quicker route than the one that the online map sites come up with? Will happily look into any viable alternatives. Cheers

France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria, especially if you are going to Venice.

No traffic from Aachen onwards, if you time it right.

[jasonb]

France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria, especially if you are going to Venice.

No traffic from Aachen onwards, if you time it right.

I'm going to Venice, not sure trousers is!

All these route options are sending me dizzy. The caveats of "if you time it right" etc only confuse me more lol. I did say I was in-experienced at cross-border/European driving didn't I??

Last night I had convinced myself to go via the Gotthard pass (the old one) for the views and experience. I fancy the Germany route home via Munich as an overnight stop over just because I've been but my misses hasn't.

I can see this route planning taking up most of the next 7 weeks prior to departure :-) However, I welcome the ideas and input from you experienced people!

[View From The Top]

I'm going to Venice, not sure trousers is!

All these route options are sending me dizzy. The caveats of "if you time it right" etc only confuse me more lol. I did say I was in-experienced at cross-border/European driving didn't I??

Last night I had convinced myself to go via the Gotthard pass (the old one) for the views and experience. I fancy the Germany route home via Munich as an overnight stop over just because I've been but my misses hasn't.

I can see this route planning taking up most of the next 7 weeks prior to departure :-) However, I welcome the ideas and input from you experienced people!

If you're going to Venice the route you've planned is the long route with the worst traffic & highest cost at that time of year.

It's quicker, cheaper & easier to head through Belgium & crossing German border at Aachen, drive down through Germany & Austria & into Italy.

The traffic on Saturday's in the peak holiday season can be nightmareish, especially toll booths so "if you time it right" means get out of bed early & hit the road and get the hard miles in before brekkie.

[jasonb]

If you're going to Venice the route you've planned is the long route with the worst traffic & highest cost at that time of year.

It's quicker, cheaper & easier to head through Belgium & crossing German border at Aachen, drive down through Germany & Austria & into Italy.

The traffic on Saturday's in the peak holiday season can be nightmareish, especially toll booths so "if you time it right" means get out of bed early & hit the road and get the hard miles in before brekkie.

This is my biggest fear I think. The driving and navigating doesn't really bother me... but being stuck in queues when I'm on such a tight schedule is keeping me awake at night :-)

[suewhistle]

Re: this 15th August date - that's a Wednesday - do they celebrate it on the day itself or the closest weekend? We're due to reach Italy on Saturday 18th...

They tend to make a "ponte" - bridge, and turn it in to an extra long weekend... No Bank Holiday Mondays like in the UK!

Petrol stations look for "Fai da te": do it yourself. Late night places with machines are often a good bet for prices (which have come down about 7/8c in the last month or so).

[suewhistle]

It's quicker, cheaper & easier to head through Belgium & crossing German border at Aachen, drive down through Germany & Austria & into Italy.

That's true for anywhere down the eastern side. The Mont Blanc tunnel attracts the French and Dutch and Belgians who hack down the middle of France as they can afford the tolls and the fuel prices! The central passes I don't know about but the Great St Bernard + tunnel has never given me grief. I think you can check all of them online for traffic and I presume they all have webcams... I don't do long distance driving in Italy particularly in the summer, I go the other way, plus avoid Saturdays! (Jason, just a bit of common-sense, like avoiding the M25 on a Friday evening!) The train is a lot cheaper than the UK, even for the fast long distance services so you can base yourself somewhere and then explore that way. Was thinking about Rome in early September just before school starts (if they have funds to employ me, that is!). Even here in the mountains at 550m it's hot, so I plan to go up to 1800m and above on Friday. Don't forget the sunscreen, headache tablets and general toiletries folks; all a lot cheaper in the UK.

[trousers]

They tend to make a "ponte" - bridge, and turn it in to an extra long weekend... No Bank Holiday Mondays like in the UK!

Cheers. So, it sounds like not a lot will be open the day we arrive (Saturday 18th August). I'm assuming motorway petrol stations stay open though...? That said, given our overnight stop will be just north of the Italian border we'll no doubt fill up before heading into Italy in the morning. Thanks :-)

[trousers]

Pity you didnt choose to go via Austria, I could have offered you a cuppa.

Cheers - It's not too late to change our stopover plans :-)

[trousers]

France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria, especially if you are going to Venice.

No traffic from Aachen onwards, if you time it right.

My initial destination is a village near Viterbo, which is about 50 miles due north of Rome (so I'm reluctant to drive too far east before crossing the border into Italy)

[trousers]

This.

Cross over into Austria via the A8 Munich - Salzburg, drive down the A10 to Villach, across the border direction Udine.

Just looked at the map again. Salzburg is defo too far east to drive for Rome I reckon. Innsbruck is probably looks the furthest east I'd want to go before heading south

(edit: have just read back through the thread and VFTT has already recommended the route via Innsbruck, so that loosk like the one to consider)

[View From The Top]

Just looked at the map again. Salzburg is defo too far east to drive for Rome I reckon. Innsbruck is probably looks the furthest east I'd want to go before heading south

(edit: have just read back through the thread and VFTT has already recommended the route via Innsbruck, so that loosk like the one to consider)

I've done an awful lot of driving in that part of the world and it's the quicker route for the time of year your travelling.

[stev2001]

My tip is double check your destination if you are using a Sat Nav....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/...ogy-fails.html

Two Swedish holidaymakers were attempting to reach the island of Capri but ended up 400 miles away in an industrial town at the other end of the country after mistakenly typing "Carpi" into their sat nav.

[jasonb]

haha I'm reluctant to take a sat nav as you become a slave to them... I would much rather trust my wife to read out my instructions - rally co-driver stylee.

trousers - it dawned on me this evening that I had done a pretty good job at hijacking your thread - apologies for that mate. I got giddy once I knew there were helpful saints fans with loads more knowledge than me. I hope some of the Venice related replies haven't clouded your own plans too much.

[View From The Top]

haha I'm reluctant to take a sat nav as you become a slave to them... I would much rather trust my wife to read out my instructions - rally co-driver stylee.

trousers - it dawned on me this evening that I had done a pretty good job at hijacking your thread - apologies for that mate. I got giddy once I knew there were helpful saints fans with loads more knowledge than me. I hope some of the Venice related replies haven't clouded your own plans too much.

Trust me, take a sat nav. Yes, plan your route, study a map etc, but if you have the option, take one.

[dubai_phil]

Trust me, take a sat nav. Yes, plan your route, study a map etc, but if you have the option, take one.

Agree.

We had a Sat Nav and used it twice when we really needed it.

BUT the trick is to have a damned good set of maps and keep the tracking going. I've done trips across France before with the kids and made it almost a competition between them to "be the best Navigator" on the trip. FMDP started our trek around Italy unable to even find the right way up on a map, within a couple of days she took great delight in finding us the weirdest C road routes with amazing scenery (and shorter distances). Have your own list of major towns you expect to pass through from Google before you go and then if a mistake gets made you should know pdq and don't make it an issue go 5 or 10km and get back to your last known point or THEN use the Sat Nav.

BUT don't try and use it ALL the time. Mates with us for the wedding must have nearly crashed 5 or 6 times as they tried to read it or then called US to say we had gone wrong (their Sat Nav tried to take them from Pescara to Rome via Naples for eg)

[Kingsland Red]

If you get to Siena on 2nd July or 16th August get to see Il Palio, a fantastic day out with the best atmosphere for a sporting event, with a packed medieval town square-Il Campo - and all with no health and safety legislation- fantastic.

[trousers]

haha I'm reluctant to take a sat nav as you become a slave to them... I would much rather trust my wife to read out my instructions - rally co-driver stylee.

trousers - it dawned on me this evening that I had done a pretty good job at hijacking your thread - apologies for that mate. I got giddy once I knew there were helpful saints fans with loads more knowledge than me. I hope some of the Venice related replies haven't clouded your own plans too much.

No problem at all sir - the more info the merrier - carry on chipping in :-)

[Whitey Grandad]

Don't worry about it too much, just go with the flow. I always find that an automatic makes for more relaxed driving especially as I have to navigate as well. I've done the trip a few times, first in 1967 in an Austin 1100 down to Lausanne, then through the St Bernard to Turin and onto Alassio. Then 1973 in a Hillman Avenger with a pregnant wife via Dieppe, Luxembourg, Freiburg, Zurich, Lugano, past Milan to Florence. No motorways used so far. Then early 1990s with a caravan to Venice via Dijon, Interlaken, Susten Pass, Garda. I've also hired a car and drive in Naples, Sorrento and Amalfi, no big deal in April. Don't try to rush it and enjoy the journey and scenery. In Italy just tell them you're English and they'll feel sorry for you.

[jasonb]

Taking on board the German - Austria advice I have roughed in an outbound route including my overnight campsites (subject to availability):

http://goo.gl/maps/sKC4

I'm not too clear what occurs after leaving campsite #2 just south of Innsbruck. Not sure if the map is indicating the Brenner pass or a motorway?

Might come home another way or might just do this in reverse adding a stop near Munich.

Saturday: land in Calais just after lunch, half day(ish) drive to campsite #1 in Germany. 289 miles
Sunday: Full day driving through Germany towards Stuttgart and on into Austria passing Innsbruck to campsite #2. 621 miles
Monday: half day driving to Venice getting to our campsite for just after lunch. 270 miles

Early starts planned except for the Saturday when I still need to figure out what's best time to get the tunnel.

[BlakeySFC]

We waited for 5 hours at the Gotthard Tunnel on the way back from the Italian GP last year.

Avoid if you can.

[positivepete]

I'm driving down to Treporti, Venice in August and will be doing the tolls through France on the way out (for speed) and stopping just before the Swiss border over night then onto Venice via Gotthard tunnel and Milan onto the autostraders.

On the return I have a bit more time so am planning to come back via Munich and thus avoid the expensive tolls through France.

A fair bit of driving considering I have to get down from Manchester first via So'ton (my mum and dad are dog sitting for us) but I'm looking forward to it. Unlike the OP I haven't got a great deal of Euro driving experience other than France a little bit. Apprehensive but excited.

I'm finding Google maps an excellent way of planning our route and the search nearby 'right-click' context menu feature is great for finding hotels/campsites near to where ever you 'right-click'. I've basically done this to locate stop-offs along the way.

Avoid France! There is no speed on the Motorways during August.

[alpine_saint]

Taking on board the German - Austria advice I have roughed in an outbound route including my overnight campsites (subject to availability):

http://goo.gl/maps/sKC4

I'm not too clear what occurs after leaving campsite #2 just south of Innsbruck. Not sure if the map is indicating the Brenner pass or a motorway?

Might come home another way or might just do this in reverse adding a stop near Munich.

Saturday: land in Calais just after lunch, half day(ish) drive to campsite #1 in Germany. 289 miles
Sunday: Full day driving through Germany towards Stuttgart and on into Austria passing Innsbruck to campsite #2. 621 miles
Monday: half day driving to Venice getting to our campsite for just after lunch. 270 miles

Early starts planned except for the Saturday when I still need to figure out what's best time to get the tunnel.

I personally dont like the A61 down the Rhine. Long, boring, usually full of roadworks, usually full of boy racers in Porsches. I prefer to go further east through Frankfurt.

[suewhistle]

My apologies suewhistle, my information is 10+ years old.

But I would have paid BIG money to be an observer on the roads in Italy the day that law changed!

I would imagine for quite a few years after although they seem to have sorted it out by the time I got here! From my bedroom window I can see the big roundabout near the main hospital and sometimes spend idle but fascinating moments watching the traffic avoid collisions. They seem to manage it, which cannot be said for the pedestrian crossing on my study side of the house. Squeal of brakes and bang, there's another one. I've walked past on my way home and wondered how somebody could have done so much damage during the slow moving rush hour.. Once I heard a bang and a what looked like a newish Peugeot had driven over a kerb to hit a van in the parking below my house. No traffic, dry, good visibility.. I'm a cautious driver over here..

[crouch mask replica]

The mrs and I spent 4 nights staying just outside Viterbo a month ago. Lovely city/town and generally untouched by tourist trade, only takes about a day to see the sights. A great place of an evening to have a meal, a wander and a gelato.
Would recommend visiting 'Parco dei Mostri' about 12km NE at Bomarzo, basically a 16th century theme park comprising fantasy sculptures set in a wooded valley. Apparently a big favourite of Salavado Dali and wonderfully cool in hot weather.
'Civita di Bagnoregio' about 40 km north near Orvieto is worth visiting, an ancient hilltop village now nearly deserted, you get to it via a kilometre long footbridge, worth it for the views alone.
We did a day trip to Tivoli, about 40km east of Rome, Villa d'este is beautiful. 16th century frescos inside, and landscaped, gardens absolutely crammed with spectacular fountains, water spouts and ponds outside. Villa Adriana (Hadrians's Villa) is nearby, the ruins of one the biggest roman villas.
I hired a car from the airport and drove about 400kms, no problems, I find driving in Italy preferable to much of the U.K., the Italians may be mad particularly when overtaking, but seem more courteous and less aggressive.
We drove to Tivoli going round Rome on their equivalent of the M25 at about 10.30, was not busy. The road surfaces leave a bit to be desired, even the main roads. The SS18 Rome-Viterbo was quite rough in places. Also slip roads do not have long acceleration/deceleration lanes, you suddenly find someone joining the carriageway in front of you at quite slow speed.
About 10 years ago spent a couple of family holidays at Palinuro, on the coast about 15 miles from Sassano. Will type a bit about that area later if I get the chance.

[trousers]

The mrs and I spent 4 nights staying just outside Viterbo a month ago. Lovely city/town and generally untouched by tourist trade, only takes about a day to see the sights. A great place of an evening to have a meal, a wander and a gelato.
Would recommend visiting 'Parco dei Mostri' about 12km NE at Bomarzo, basically a 16th century theme park comprising fantasy sculptures set in a wooded valley. Apparently a big favourite of Salavado Dali and wonderfully cool in hot weather.
'Civita di Bagnoregio' about 40 km north near Orvieto is worth visiting, an ancient hilltop village now nearly deserted, you get to it via a kilometre long footbridge, worth it for the views alone.
We did a day trip to Tivoli, about 40km east of Rome, Villa d'este is beautiful. 16th century frescos inside, and landscaped, gardens absolutely crammed with spectacular fountains, water spouts and ponds outside. Villa Adriana (Hadrians's Villa) is nearby, the ruins of one the biggest roman villas.
I hired a car from the airport and drove about 400kms, no problems, I find driving in Italy preferable to much of the U.K., the Italians may be mad particularly when overtaking, but seem more courteous and less aggressive.
We drove to Tivoli going round Rome on their equivalent of the M25 at about 10.30, was not busy. The road surfaces leave a bit to be desired, even the main roads. The SS18 Rome-Viterbo was quite rough in places. Also slip roads do not have long acceleration/deceleration lanes, you suddenly find someone joining the carriageway in front of you at quite slow speed.
About 10 years ago spent a couple of family holidays at Palinuro, on the coast about 15 miles from Sassano. Will type a bit about that area later if I get the chance.

Hi. Wow, great info - thanks for that. Slightly spooky that you've stayed more or less in the same two slightly obscure places that we're going to! I much prefer going to 'unspoilt' places so your insights into the Viterbo and Sassano localities are really appreciated.

Cheers - appreciated

[trousers]

With regards the route from the UK, I've taken onboard the advice to go France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria (rather than France -> Switzerland) and have booked into a nice looking motel at Kempten, Germany (not far from the Austrian border) for our overnight stop.

One further question on this though.....

Are the traffic problems going via Switzerland as bad going back as they are coming down? Or is it worse in a particular direction?

I'm thinking it would be nice to come back via the Swiss alps rather than go back the same route we came down by - a change of scenary and all that. But if it's as bad going north across Switzerland as it is going south then I may re-think that one.

cheers!

[trousers]

p.s. thanks again to everyone for all the feedback and superb info on the this thread - this is what makes this message board a great place to visit - well worth a fiver!

Cheers one and all

[Whitey Grandad]

Do you still need to buy a vignette for the motorways in Switzerland?

[View From The Top]

I'm not really keen on Southern Italy if I'm honest. Lacks the scenery, class & style of the North.

[View From The Top]

With regards the route from the UK, I've taken onboard the advice to go France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria (rather than France -> Switzerland) and have booked into a nice looking motel at Kempten, Germany (not far from the Austrian border) for our overnight stop.

One further question on this though.....

Are the traffic problems going via Switzerland as bad going back as they are coming down? Or is it worse in a particular direction?

I'm thinking it would be nice to come back via the Swiss alps rather than go back the same route we came down by - a change of scenary and all that. But if it's as bad going north across Switzerland as it is going south then I may re-think that one.

cheers!

Saturdays in August are always bad on the main routes in my experience.

[jasonb]

I'm thinking it would be nice to come back via the Swiss alps rather than go back the same route we came down by - a change of scenary and all that. But if it's as bad going north across Switzerland as it is going south then I may re-think that one.

cheers!

Great minds and all that!

I too was thinking of coming back via Switzerland but I may duck it entirely and go back through Germany and call in at Munich as I think I've mentioned already.

Good news is that the two campsites I want for the way down are open for on-spec camping and never have a problem with people just turning up! They look bloody gorgeous too when compared to some of the awful and expensive sites in the UK that I have been to... can't wait

[suewhistle]

Do you still need to buy a vignette for the motorways in Switzerland?

Yep, see above...

As for Bomarzo... I went there as a kid in the mid 1960s and somewhere I suspect Mum has the photos to prove it! Dad did shiftwork at Fiumicino airport and during the week in summer and school holidays we'd disappear off from Rome into Tuscany and Umbria.

Tivoli (and the Villa d'Este) we knew well. Bloomin 'eck, and I still ended up a Saints fan!

[anothersaintinsouthsea]

With regards the route from the UK, I've taken onboard the advice to go France -> Belgium -> Germany -> Austria (rather than France -> Switzerland) and have booked into a nice looking motel at Kempten, Germany (not far from the Austrian border) for our overnight stop.

That's the route I took for skiing earlier this year down to Austria. You've got a couple of options for Belguim to Germany. We went Brussels > Namur > Luxembourg > Zweibrucken > Karlsruhe. Petrol is significantly cheaper in Luxembourg so worth a pitstop here. There's a non-motorway stretch between Zweibrucken and Karlsruhe but its dual carriage way most of the way and worth taking IMO.

From Kempten we went to Fussen and took the Fernpass through the "Zugspitze arena" into Austria which has stunning views of the mountains. Traffic was pretty heavy back in February (Saturday change-over day in all the ski resorts) but imagine should be lighter in the Summer. In any case if you make a fairly early start from Kempten you'll be ahead of the game. In February petrol was a good 15c a litre cheaper in Austria than Germany. You'll need to stop at some point either side of the border anyway to get the Austrian motorway vignette. The end of the Fernpass isn't too far from Innsbruck and the route into Italy.

[jasonb]

That's the route I took for skiing earlier this year down to Austria. You've got a couple of options for Belguim to Germany. We went Brussels > Namur > Luxembourg > Zweibrucken > Karlsruhe. Petrol is significantly cheaper in Luxembourg so worth a pitstop here. There's a non-motorway stretch between Zweibrucken and Karlsruhe but its dual carriage way most of the way and worth taking IMO.

From Kempten we went to Fussen and took the Fernpass through the "Zugspitze arena" into Austria which has stunning views of the mountains. Traffic was pretty heavy back in February (Saturday change-over day in all the ski resorts) but imagine should be lighter in the Summer. In any case if you make a fairly early start from Kempten you'll be ahead of the game. In February petrol was a good 15c a litre cheaper in Austria than Germany. You'll need to stop at some point either side of the border anyway to get the Austrian motorway vignette. The end of the Fernpass isn't too far from Innsbruck and the route into Italy.

Nice one.. I'll be checking this info out for my route too.

When you say "significantly" cheaper... how much roughly?

trousers - you can get the vignette before you go: http://www.tolltickets.com/country/a...spx?lang=en-GB

[Whitey Grandad]

Yep, see above...

As for Bomarzo... I went there as a kid in the mid 1960s and somewhere I suspect Mum has the photos to prove it! Dad did shiftwork at Fiumicino airport and during the week in summer and school holidays we'd disappear off from Rome into Tuscany and Umbria.

Tivoli (and the Villa d'Este) we knew well. Bloomin 'eck, and I still ended up a Saints fan!

Thanks, I thought it had been mentioned but I was on a difficult connection. I believe you need an extra one for the caravan too. The last time I drove through Switzerland I *****ed at paying the extra so we went on ordinary roads. Whenever I got a funny look in Bern I just shouted at them that it was their own stupid fault for charging so much. How much is it these days?

Edit: I've just looked up the costs. Bloody 'eck, €33 each for the car and caravan.

[pressingon]

Great minds and all that!

I too was thinking of coming back via Switzerland but I may duck it entirely and go back through Germany and call in at Munich as I think I've mentioned already.

Good news is that the two campsites I want for the way down are open for on-spec camping and never have a problem with people just turning up! They look bloody gorgeous too when compared to some of the awful and expensive sites in the UK that I have been to... can't wait

Which camp sites are you looking at?

[the colonel]

If you enjoy driving...Naples is hilarious. Done it a few time.... even better when you have nervous back seat drivers.

Driving in Italy is nuts...only place I've driven that is worse is India.