Surprised we haven't tried harder to pick up a couple from the relegated sides. We're allegedly keen on Dann again, but what about Lee Chung Yong at Bolton? Had an awful injury last season but the seasons before that he was very good.
We could do a lot worse IMO.
We are in the Premier League now, but we are still far from the most attractive proposition around for a player. We will have targets, but other, richer, more established clubs will also have the same targets. Sometimes we will be able to convince the player to sign for us early (Rodriguez, Clyne, Davis, Cork, Fox) but others will perhaps want to keep their options open, or maybe the selling club have to sort something out before selling. As such, if we want that player we may sometimes have to wait. In the end sometimes that deal will come through towards the end of the window (Sharp), or perhaps we are forced to give up on our primary target in the end and take a more risky backup option (Hooiveld), either way if we are waiting it's because there is something worth waiting for.
It's really not that difficult to understand, is it?
I haven't read much of this thread as I don't have time so apologies if I'm repeating what's been said. My feeling for a while has been that now Markus is unfortunately not with us, getting funding is harder and takes longer going through the family.
That's where the money is being sourced for the academy/training ground and other club developments - and transfers. Maybe we've almost used it all up though...! And who knows what happens when we no longer have that investment to call on.
As for the window, the signings were surprising, I was delighted, but again surprised we haven't made more. Expected CBs in by now but it's not always that easy is it. Fine for people to sit back and moan, but I doubt many on here have been involved in a football transfer. Any suggestion that Adkins and Cortese are being lazy or don't care seems crazy to me, but I can't think what else people are suggesting when they moan that is should have happened earlier. We get some moaning about lower quality targets, but then moaning about higher quality targets as we won't get them. Just moaning for the sake of moaning. Logically with any club, the higher you aim the less chance you have of completing a deal. So many of the moaning posts on here are with the benefit of hindsight. One even said it's better to sign an average player early than go for better, miss out and sign an average player late. Without hindsight, that's just saying you should accept mediocrity to get signings done soon. With big money and long term contracts, why would you rush or settle for less? We did that enough under Lowe and ended with a bloated squad lacking in talent.
We'll clearly sign a few more before the deadline and our season will be defined by how the whole squad and Adkins do. Whether 2 signings came in in June or August is ridiculously unlikely to be the difference. In terms of relegation, if you can't save yourselves with 35 or 36 games left, then you really don't deserve to anyway.
Surprised people are more pleased with Rodriguez, Davis and Clyne. All 3 surprised me. Clyne was linked to far bigger clubs and has huge potential. Rodriguez is a great player, one of the best strikers in the championship. The championship produces a lot of players plenty good enough for this league, and we have the 3 best championship strikers. The odds are at least one of them will do well, and I have confidence in all 3. Tadanari Lee shouldn't be forgotten either. Yes defence needs attention, but efforts are clearly being made. 1 or 2 decent signings and our squad will look very good indeed. We haven't had in so good in 8 or 9 years, yet still people moan like hell, state the obvious or base strong opinions on zilch and hope the future will bring them a chance to say 'told you so'.
I must be stupid for thinking lower expectation in a higher league might bring some vague degree of patience, perspective and common sense. None in evidence so far.
I appreciate peoples views, they are from older and wiser heads than mine in terms of football experience. However I truly think that with a class winger and cb we have a team easily capable of midtable this year.
Very well said!
These type of clubs don't do much more then achieve mid table obscurity. I'm not complaining about this at all, but if that's the extent of the owners investment, all talk of Champions League and stadium extensions would be pure nonsense.
Always amazes me the polarised view of the few, they must all live in the same house. One minute we're the wet fannies, the next they are, I just don't know what to think anymore............but here goes, I'm surprised we haven't had more bods through the door, I fear we may take a few hammerings
Why is so much effort put into pre-season if key positions are not filled until after the season begins?
The CBx2 signings are crucial, having shipped out 2CBs. But those coming in will need time to bed in and are not even here yet.just suppose Fonte gets a red card on Sunday and Jos is injured.
Also, on the basis that most final positions in the league are decided by a maximum of one or two points, then yes every game does count and a team needs to be as close to full strength asap.
Our defence isn't that bad against the bottom half the table teams. I think people look at the top clubs and go 'yeah they'll rape us'...well most fans of teams in the bottom 8 will think that. Get a decent CB in and we will be ok this season.
As everyone on here is aware, I agree with the sentiments of TDD, Kraken, Hypo and Alpine (that's a sentence I never thought I'd say).
Norwich last summer: 8 signings
Swansea last summer: 11 signings
Reading this summer: 7 signings
W ham this summer: 8 signings
Us this summer: 4 signings
Our team for Sunday currently looks like
Clyne* Hooiveld* Fonte* Fox*
Guly*/Puncheon* Lallana* Rodriguez*
(Subs from : Gazzaniga*, Richardson*, Seaborne*, Stephens*, Shaw*, Guly*/Puncheon*, Sharp*, Lee*, Ward-Prowse*, De Ridder*, Chaplow*, Hammond*).
The asterisks are for players who as yet haven't proven themselves as regulars in a mid-table side in the Premier League. It's everyone other than Steve Davis. Even if Matt Phillips signs...
Just checked, Richardson played 4 Prem matches for Leeds nearly 10 years ago. Chaplow had 11 Prem appearances for West Brom in 2005 (and then signed for us on loan).
Last edited by The9; 16-08-2012 at 10:03 AM.
For Swansea they included Siggurdson, McEachran, Caulker, Graham, Routledge, Lita and Vorm.
For Norwich Vaughan, Morisson, Bennett, de Laet, Pilkington, Johnson, Naughton and Ayala were all important last season, maybe de Laet less so.
Some of these were loans, so maybe that is part of our strategy too.
1) people don't seem to be saying we are short of as many players as they did this time last season, we did ok!
2) every year, the same posters forget that the majority of transfers are late in window.
3) where we were 3 years ago is hugely relevant. Not for sentimental reasons, but because the people you are doubting, questioning, (or strangely in alps case criticising for not even having good rumours???!!) have shown they know what they are doing, more successfully than any club in the country. no club has improved as much summer window, to summer window as us.
4) we knew we would be in premiership last January. the signings in that window were signed for the premiership.
5) Rodriguez looks decent signing. a lot to prove but good attitude, attributes, well thought of in the game. how alps can already be slagging the signing off I don't know, guess things never change).
6) read a lot about clyne before linked with us, very widely tipped to play for England.
7) IMHO, the position we have been lacking, for years, is CM capt type. we have signed player still to reach his peak. who at 21 was villa's player of the season, in prem. been a capt for rangers - uefa cup finalist, 10 Scottish trophies (I know about Scottish football but more pressure than playing for us in prem)
we know business isn't complete.
9) have top clubs finished?
10) have we missed out on anyone?
I don't know how we will do. however, last 3 years would lead any mature adult to believe that if we fall short it is not due to inability to manage a transfer window!
I think the main problem though, is that we're lacking at CB. Jos will be decent I reckon but get caught out by pace, Fonte is good but switches off at times and struggled against any pace last year. Our third choice CB has gone on loan to Palace, and our 4th struggled in L1. Our 5th is 17 and never played competitvely. I know its a bit of an ongoing joke that we need a CB on here, but we really do. Just someone with that bit of experience in the Prem, solid and also gives us an option if god forbid one of Fonte and Hooiveld gets injured. We shouldn't be going into the season with Seaborne, Cork or Schneiderlin as our only back ups at CB. 2 weeks left of the transfer window, I'm certain that this gap will be filled.
[QUOTE=Sour Mash;1440979]Where has anyone said that Adkins or Cortese are lazy or don't care? Do you have to have been involved in a football transfer to have an opinion on one? Would negate these forums a bit.
They didn't, I said I can't see what other thought process would justify the comments. You don't have to be involved to have an opinion on targets, which are good/bad, which areas need more attention etc., the subjective stuff. That's what forums are for. But to make absolute statements about transfer policy, chairman holidays, salaries, negotiations, timespan etc isn't subjective. It's plucking opinion out the air based on a whim.
People jump on little things and think you're disagreeing without taking time to think. I don't think our transfer activity has been as good as it should. If I were in charge I'd want to have CB signings wrapped up. The point is, and the reason I don't moan about it on every thread, is that I have no reason to doubt that Adkins and Cortese are doing their best to sort that out, and know a hell of a lot more than me about transfer policy.
The CB issue has been f**king obvious since about March. Its obscene that we are 3 days from kick off with nothing done.
As long as we bring in a couple of decent defenders then we will more than hold our own this season.
There will be 12 teams battling to avoid relegation and my prediction is we will finish top of this mini league.
And as for all this guff about needing to sign Premiership standard players, well there are too many examples of youngsters being thrown in at the deep end from lower divisions and from academies (ours being a notable example) who have done very nicely, thank you. Why, some even get to play for England with little or no Premiership experience. And there are also too many examples of overseas players having never played in the Premiership who also come here and set it alight with their talent.
And just to add to the list, there are also teams like Norwich and Swansea who were predicted to flounder when they were promoted last season and proved the doubters wrong. Isn't Lambert a better striker than Holt? Were those teams filled with marquee signings? I'd never heard of half of them. It is not impossible that an entire team consisting of the team of the year from the Championship, could beat most Premiership teams, provided that they melded together as a team. As Bexy says, team spirit is an important factor and we appear to have that. A team comprising lesser talents can often beat a star-studded team, provided that they play well together with determination and the right mental attitude.
As for dismissing the progress that has been made these past couple of years, at the very least it has given us impetus, belief and confidence. It is a track record that demonstrates that the people who manage and run the club know what they are doing and deserve some respect and faith.
I'm up for us finishing mid-table and will love coming on here at the end of the season and showing up the wrist-slashers' predictions when this thread is resurrected.
No they won't have egg on their faces. I haven't come across a post yet that says we definitely won't sign players before the end of the window. Have you?
I've seen quite a few (including my own) who relate to the fact that Nigel Adkins identified a requirement for up to 6 more new players (2 x GK, 2 x CB, 1 x RM, 1 x LB/LM), and that he wanted/expected them before the season started. To date we have one of those on his list (Gazzaniga), and are now linked with a formal bid for 1 more. So at the moment there's a bit of a discrepancy between what the manager was expecting by now, and what has happened.
I didn't read the rest as that first line was so inaccurate to the actual discussion. Why do people have to make things up and put words in other people's mouths just to form a counter-argument. Is is that difficult to actually debate the issue that you have to make up a new one to rail against?
I have to agree that the CB issue (as you call it) isn't closer to being resolved, but I do think that a number of other "issues" were looked at.
Firstly, all players don't necessarily have to have first team / Prem. type experience to be considered... otherwise why was Jack Butland selected to play for England with his lack of experience (even if it was a friendly).
However, We knew Jaidi was going to retire, and it must have taken a bit of thought ..before deciding that best solution for Aaron Martin was a loan-out (even though I felt he performed very well when called upon).
The loan should make him a better player, but I really feel that NA wanted to give Dan Seaborne a chance to show his paces before deciding, but it was more hope than anything. so... Loan out for Dan - also a good idea.
He (NA) may have changed his mind about those at the top of the list, or their clubs won't sell, or are asking for exaggerated fees (and we haven't heard the rumour)......or simply they don't want to come ..
However, I am sure that after Sunday's game we will have signed at least one CB ...and for a number of reasons. It would be a negative thing for existing players (especially defenders) to see someone else come in on the eve of such a huge match, and not the confidence boost they need.
A good result on Sunday (a draw of better) would bring the chance to" bolster the defence in the case of injury or suspension."..whereas a catastrophic result says... " clearly we need more options when we consider there are 37 League games left ".
There you are... I've written Nigel Adkins' after-match press quotes for him already.
I'm sure that NA has had a target list for several positions, but players who played well six-nine months ago aren't necessarily better now.
He quoted in a live interview I viewed that " the majority of signings aren't made until after the end of july " (if I recall exactly). Our problem is that every season we have a huge load of fans who expect us to resolve every transfer deals before 1st June!.
As we have seen with deals like; Tadanari Lee, Jay Rod and Steven Davis the time taken is more often measured not on a watch.... but on a calendar.
Last edited by david in sweden; 16-08-2012 at 12:11 PM.
our championship dream team will do the business. we have 5, going on six, and have spent around £15m, rising to £25m if u include Phillips and wot Davis is worth, and our January spending was done with promotion/safety in mind.
is there no muddle ground between fantasist and realist?
and that he wanted/expected them before the season startedCorrect me if I'm wrong, but the season hasn't started yet.So at the moment there's a bit of a discrepancy between what the manager was expecting by now, and what has happened.
Clearly Nigel is saying he wants to bring players in and bring them in before the season starts. I dont see how anyone can argue with this. I keep hearing in Nigel we trust and so on and clearly he wants to make new signs and thinks the squad isn't strong enough.
All I can see is the usual suspects petulantly stamping their feet and bemoaning things they simply do not know.
Do you mongs who make the same complaints over and over, and say how the world will implode week in week out, only to be proven wrong time and again never learn?
Transfers of players are not as easy as they seem on Footy Manager, with a lot of money, people, circumstances and vested interests all having to be aligned for them to come off.
I'm sure both Adkins & Cortese are aware there are holes in the squad that could do with plugging - I mean, the former has won 4 promotions in the last six years, suggesting he probably knows something more about managing a football club than any of us on here. The latter, is a very successful businessman and in his short time as a Football Club CEO has done pretty well thus far.
Just because things have not come off, or we have not heard about them, doesn't mean they are not doing anything, or working day & night to try and get things done. Probably worth bearing in mind it has been an unusually busy summer with the Euro's and Olympics, therefore dealings are often put on hold, with scouts, players, managers, and agents all otherwise engaged.
Yes, we could do with extra CB cover & possibly a new winger/AM. It does look like we are making movements towards this in the form of Matt Phillips, and I would be willing to lay down a reasonably large sum that the club are trying to put something together for Saints to bring in at least one CB, if not also a second.
Yes, the season does start this weekend, but let's face it - new CB or not, it's going to be a big fat bagel for Saints come Sunday.
We have made some very good signings thus far, and I trust the people actually in Football, not sat on a mongboard throwing hissyfits every other week (yes you, Alpine) know what they are doing, and are trying to address these problems.
Keep calm ladies.
Your post adds nothing to the discussion; its just full of the same, tired "I'm an Über Fan, and morally superior to you" cliches as every other post with the same tone and objective.
We know that Nigel Adkins said he wanted to bring in up to 6 more players before the season started. We know that of those 6 he has been successful so far in bringing in 1 of those player positions, that of a reserve goalkeeper. We know that the season kicks off in 3 days time and its going to be going some (in the extreme) to have those players in place by then.
What more is there to know? The manager set a target of bringing in players before the start of the season. That target looks set to fail. We may or may not bring those players in before the window shuts at the end of the month, time will tell.
Stick your fingers in your ears if that makes the world carry on spinning for you if you wish. But no-one has suggested the club are doing nothing, and o-one has suggested we won't bring in anyone before the end of the window. once again I'm minded to wonder why some people need to invent a point of view to counter; can you really not counter the actual argument in the first place, so you have to make another one up?