I have been a bit disappointed about the nos of threads started on the likely fate of our manager. Yes he has made mistakes, yes his after match interviews are repetitive and becoming patronising, yes he could be doing better but.....
if the season closed tonight we would be safe and that for me is enough as things stand.
But the reason I started yet another NA thread is I have just watched the U21 game v Man United and very enjoyable it was too (we equalised with the last kick but were far the better side all night).
Who was there watching in the stands? Yes Nigel Adkins, 24 hours after a Prem game. His presence would have been a real boost to the youngsters who performed well (esp Reeves).
I am not a happy clappy and I am not trying to overtake NickG as the club's chief propagandist, but I would just like all fans to rally behind our manager for a while longer. Yes not everything is right, his substitutions are questionable etc etc but why don't we all hold fire until at least Xmas and the January window transfer. The fact that he went all the way to Lancashire today to support thr U21s shows his commitment to the cause.
I think we got it far from right in our recruitment in the summer but that might not be his fault - back-to-back promotions have earnt him the chance to prove himself without being judged after a handful of games.
Apologies to NickG for stealing his thunder.
Great post. As you said, I think he's earned a fair bit of slack here. But he does need a bit more luck with injuries, otherwise his hands a seriously tied.
Exactly, we have our signings, only supporting can help now.
I agree too, but it's probably best for me if I don't visit this forum again until we have played more games.
It is said that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one. It seems to me though that our forum members have exceeded the opinion/arsehole ratio.
Sorry fitzhugh, there is absolutely no room on this forum for positivity. Unless you have a knife in your hand, you are not welcome.
Btw I completely agree with you.
It matters not one iota what we think. Only one persons thoughts will have any bearings at that's NC.
Totally agree FF.
It is a shame that we did not have the honeymoon of relatively easier fixtures like say Blackpool did. The fixture men never gave us that luxury, so we have our stall set out already ,rather than gradually slip down the table.
I hope NA, Crosby etc are given a good time period to sort things out as our downfall last time around was the merry go round of managers we had in the seasons after the 2003 cup final.
Without wishing to sound pessimistic, I have always admired West Brom, who accepted they were the 18th -20th ranked club and moved up and down for many years before finding their feet in the top 15 sides.
Good OP. Couldnt agree more. If the season ended now it would be mission accomplished.
According to the forum rules duplicate threads on the same topic weren't allowed and Admins use to close duplicate threads. I get the feeling someone has an agenda and enjoys seeing the forum filled with repetitive and negative threads about our manager. Bar the Poll the majority cover the same rant.
Yep, good post
Adkins has more then enough in the bank to allow him plenty more time this season for me
I'm already sick of it. Seen people moan for years about lack of good managers, lack of loyalty in football, lack of patience etc from boards and now look at everyone. People criticise modern football for not creating the Ted Bates like figures, but it's clear a huge, dominant part of that is fans like Saints fans now. What would be so wrong with giving the young manager who takes you to 2 promotions a couple of years to develop in the top flight? If he fails and it's relegation, who better to bring the club back up and learn from his mistakes?
I'm utterly convinced that over a period of 10 years or so a club giving managers a proper chance will prosper more. You might save a relegation by changing a manager, but that's one season, where does it end? You can't ask for loyalty from the new guy when you so easily replaced the last one, and clearly you'll sack him too if it's not going your way again. Look at QPR now, an utter mess and everything I'd hate in my club. All the premiership experience people wanted to sign, a premiership proven manager, and they're rubbish. They must have signed 3 new teams over the last 18 months. They have a lot of talented players but it's so lacking in any sense of team or stability they'll struggle to get anywhere. Yet technically Hughes took over and saved them. Would they have gone down, who knows. Did they deserve to stay up? It was only fractional at best. But will it benefit them long term, or is it just a huge amount of wasted time and money chasing short term results.
Personally, I'd rather see a Saints that means something and have other fans say 'least they stick by their manager'. He's clearly good enough to give proper time. All he needs is some decent support now. As do the players. If you think they aren't good enough, help them out rather than getting on their backs.
Amen well put .....
Secondly, who is getting on the backs of the players? Unless I missed it at the Fulham game there wasn't any barracking of our players, and no booing of individuals. Puncheon, our recently most derided player, was given a standing ovation when he went off. What "getting on players backs" am I missing here?
It seems like a few people are getting themselves at it about a situation which doesn't really exist, or if it does only in the heads of a complete minority. If you're searching for 100% of the fanbase to agree with you 100% of the time then you're always going to come up disappointed; there will always be the unhinged such as Dalek or Lard to skew the percentage away from total conclusivity.
What a great line to start yet another thread on the subject of the likely fate of our manager.I have been a bit disappointed about the nos of threads started on the likely fate of our manager.
We're spoilt for choice on this forum; if we wish to add our opinions on either what will become of our manager and who will replace him, or what the attendance figures are/should be, then it's a real dilemma knowing which one to choose. It's the same after a match too, when instead of posting on the match thread, separate threads are required to examine the substitutions and strategy in minute detail.
Got round to watching Adkins post-match interview from Sunday. Really never seen him like that, the bloke looks absolutely gutted about something. As a side point, Fonte came over brilliantly in his interview, very focused at performing better.
Man Utd & Arsenal have been the top 2 consistent performers in the league over the past 20 years or so. They must be doing something right. Liverpool used to be part of that group, but have slipped out in the last few years. Can't think why.
What Nigel Adkins and Cortese have done with Saints is pure fantasy football, it's the dream, it's how you would want your perfect Football Manager game to go - successive promotions, invest in training and youth academy, attractive modern football, young hungry players coming though, get to the premiership and sign wonderkids to complement your homegrown wonderkids. Yet after all that, after a mere 7 games, where we have played some great football against some of the best teams in the land people aren't happy, it's sickening.
Let the team grow, let them learn and see where we are at the end of the season then comment. Something special is brewing at our club, people laugh about our Chairman seeking European football, yet I'm sure there were a few giggles about getting the premiership in 5 years when we were on -10pts in league 1. However to realise those ambitions we need to be patient, it won't happen overnight and we have seen purely at this club that changing managers doesn't help, we need stability.
I was happy with the transfers and still am, disappointed with the number of errors we have made and the subsequent lost points, have never liked Adkins' when he speaks, but always wanted him here, felt he made a massive mistake in the substitutions against Manu, less so on Sunday, but overall his substitutions have been very effective over the last two years. I am more than willing to back him for a lot longer. Amazed the number of people doubting him. I guess that's football these days. No patience.
Sorry. What we have done is not pure fantasy football.
Getting out of league 1 in 2nd place was the bare minimum... Had we not, Adkins would have been sacked on the spot and fans would have been right pished off. More so as the reaction to him coming in the first place was poor to say the least
Coming 2nd was good.. But it was not a miracle... Phil Brown, Neil Warnock, Tony pulis , Steve Bruce, Roy Keane... And other managerial masterminds have done the same or better
As for QPR... Are you sure they don't have a decent youth setup?
As for letting our team grow... We did that under poortaloo... We played some good football to start with... Nice to watch and the confidence dropped and so did the standard of football... Look what happened there
If adkins continues to get defeats or facing to beat such poor teams at home soon... He will be gone in the next 3-5 games
No matter what, nigel will be a saints legend but that does not mean sitting by if it rapidly become apparent that the premiere league is a step too far for him right now....sounds all romantic to keep a Manager but look at Bolton... A manager they love is having a mare
Going down means we would have been terrible all season and in a losing habit
We will lose players.. Cut backs will have to be made.. More people will lose their jobs... Fans will turn on Cortese and sms won't be a happy place
I would rather the club did all it could to stay up this time... If that means come mid November moving adkins on... So be it.... He will have a nice pay off and his stock would never have been higher
Last edited by Thedelldays; 09-10-2012 at 08:13 AM.
I'm astounded anyone wants him gone after all he's done for us. Yes we only have four points, but this is the Premier League and we've had the hardest start of any club. Of course questions will be raised of Nigel's capability to manage at this level, after all Paul Sturrock wasn't given much time to prove he could manage at this level, but that judgement is up to Cortese and the Liebherrs. For the rest of us we should really get behind Adkins, very few people could have done for this club what he has done in the last couple of years.
We have the manager who is settled, something we've been crying out for for years, and the makings of a very good, young, Premier League team. Yes, perhaps we should have signed a couple more defenders in the transfer window, but overall I was very pleased with our signings, and of course we were very close to signing Buttner to improve the left back spot. Contrary to opinions I think we will sign the necessary defenders in the window, and will be more than safe come the end of the season. It's the players we already had on board that are underperforming, Jos was a mountain last season but has started very slowly this season, and Fox started slowly too, but had a better performance on Sunday.
Would I want Mark Hughes for example, blowing money on largely past it, underachieving players? Hell no. It would cost a small fortune for Fernandes to sack and replace him too. (Perhaps why he said he's got faith in him for the whole season.) Would I rather have Hughton? No. He's a nice guy that got an already good Newcastle team promoted, and has done little else since. For those who think Adkins is limited as a manager, we also look at McDermott. The Reading fans I know worship him and even if they go down this season, I would expect them to stick by their man and give them the opportunity to get them promoted again. Would we with Adkins? Who knows, but that is Cortese's decision. I would certainly hope so.
Some will pick fault with him, this is a forum and that is their choice, but it baffles me that they're so quick to want Adkins out. As for me, I'll support him as long as it takes. I'm confident from what I've seen this season that we'll pick up a few good results yet, yes there'll be losses too but that's no immediate reason for wanting the manager out. Will my opinion change? Well I'm not that stubborn, losing every game until December would certainly see me wobble in my support of him, but that won't happen. Get behind him. We could do much worse.
Am I surprised that 'people' on this forum are calling for Nigel to be sacked? No. 'People' thought we were going to crumble last year, we didn't, we gained automatic promotion behind the best team in the league last season. If I remember rightly, when we got promoted in 1977, it was behind Tottenham and it was Lawries first real stab at management in the top flight. Anyhow, I would like it known that I was disappointed with the double substitution on Sunday. It is really unfortunate that we have conceded so close to the subs being made on this occasion and also against Utd. I hope Nigel learns from this practice. But, that's what I want, Nigel to learn, not be sacked for never having to make these decisions against such high calibre teams. He was trying to secure the win, but, again, we failed, but he tried! He didn't do a Burley and freeze on the touchline, paralized by the occasion, he made his decision early and stuck to it. A manager should not be sacked for getting it wrong, he needs to be judged on 2 things, nbr 1, results, nbr 2, performances. So far, the performances against Fulham, Villa, City, Utd have all been good. Unfortunately, results have not been good, and unfortunately for Nigel,results are the most important. It will be down to Cortese to align the plan to the results, even Cortese knows we weren't aiming to be in the Prem this year, but hey, we're here, let's compete.
Lastly, I just want to point out the empty seats after our equalizing goal against Fulham. The amount of seats clattering when Fulham scored their second was deafening. I was ashamed to be considered part of those idiots. We equalized and some of those walking down the stairs, start jumping up and down, in the concourse, they were celebrating. Just so you know, you 'people' disgust me. Go away and don't come back, we don't need 80min fans, we need supporters and loyalty, fickle, fickle 'people' need not turn up.
For Goodness sake, get off his back and just remember the idiots we have sufferred in the dug out in the past.
We all know where our failings in the closed season signings were. If we know that, then I have a wee feeling that NA does as well!!! I suspect that things didn't work out as expected, such as Buttner.
i have never been on the bus but at the same time acknowledge how well NA has done. Iam all for stability but if he does not learn from his mistake yet again then i can see him losing a lot of goodwill.
Those lost points due to his bad substitutions could cost us dear at the end of the season.
It is not only Saints fans who could not believe subbing RL in both games, it has been said to me by many fans from other clubs
Stability and continuity makes for great teams.
All those managers you listed have got promotions from the Championship to the Premiership, they got established Championship teams promoted, a good achievement yes, but nothing close to taking a newly promoted team to successive promotions.
It's also 7 games in, it's plain stupid to discuss sacking him as is this statement "If adkins continues to get defeats or facing to beat such poor teams at home soon... He will be gone in the next 3-5 games".
It's crazy to think that just two weeks ago the whole stadium was chanting "There's only one Nigel Adkins" in support of the man. That's football for you though!
We need to give him a fair crack of the whip, and that's not just me blindly saying so for the sake of stability. He's clearly a very intelligent bloke and I am sure he will be studying the videos in depth working out what he/the team can do to improve things. Clearly we have got to try and tighten up at the back as otherwise we'll be on course for letting in 100 goals this season, but at the same time we need to try and keep our attacking belief.
Teams that struggle always have issues scoring goals, and I am sure he will be pleased that we have shown (so far) that we are more than capable in that area.
I know that the players will be looking to finish higher than 17th this year, but the reality is that's all we need to do - stay up, consolidate and move forward. If we stay up having scored 70 goals and let in 100, well so be it!
A poll on here was voted on by nearly 600 people; and it came back that around 6% of posters agreed Nigel should be replaced. At least one of those posters admitted that he pressed the wrong button and was actually behind the manager. So you're talking about a very fine minority of people that aren't behind the manager; yet this forum has got about 5 different threads all alluding to how terrible it is that "people" want the manager out.
Get a grip. Most people are still completely behind the manager. A few oddballs aren't, but they're in the minority. Football is a game of opinions and you will rarely get 100% consensus on any opinion; this is entirely no different, and 95% behind the manager is about as good as you're realistically going to get.
I'm really not bothered if he gets us relegated this year, obviously prefer him not to but it's massive learning curve for everybody and time is what it will take to achieve their visions for the club.
They've got as much as they want for me.
Alpine first of all claims that its nonsense to make any sort of judgement of our position after only 7 games, as it'll probably bear little relation to where we'll be after 38 games. However, he then goes on to claim that (in his opinion) those first 7 games played tells us all we need to know about our squad and that our position after 7 games is actually fairly accurate.
It's a complete rambling mess of a statement.
By all means let's discuss substitutions and tactics but not always against the backdrop of NA's job situation.
So, Adkins needs our support, but he needs Cortese to have faith in him more so. If he continues to make 'mistakes' then Cortese will deal with this, not us (the fans). Adkins is a young manager and a premiership newbie, he HAS to learn fast, and I hope he does. But, it's a business, not a charity or a finishing school, tough times for Adkins, good luck.
FF was making a sort of vaguely positive prelim judgment after 7 games. I pointed out it bears no relation to where we are after 38 games. Do you disagree ?
From my perspcetive we have learned a lot about the squads ability to compete at this level in the last 7 games - and it has significant shortcomings. Therefore with limited ability, oppoprtunity, and probably money (after our summer spunking) to improve the squad, and the weaknesses on view for all to see, drawing comfort that we are out of the relegation zone after 7 games is ridiculous.
When all is said and done it matters not that he has got us promoted twice, that he is a great motivator, that he's a general all round good guy. If the team is hovering round the relegation zone for so long, he's history. I think if someone said now we are going to finish 12th would you like it to be with NA or not, Everybody would say yes of course but the "he deserves his chance" approach probably doesn't wash with NC.
I really really hope we start winning soon for SFC's sake and for Niges as I really rate him. I'm sure he will go on to be one the best managers in the PL hopefully with us.
Got that feeling though that one of these days I'm going to log on here and he'll be gone.
If we aspire to progress at Premier League level then stability is a key factor !!
Chopping and changing managerial positions is seldom the answer and if we are not prepared to allow even a quarter of the season as a learning period then I despair !
There is nothing to be gained by short term solutions which are built on sand, solid foundations are necessary, patience and resolve are required to achieve this !
Good business people recognise this and I'll be very disappointed if NC does not !
Nigel has made mistakes like anyone would in his situation, but has clearly shown that he has strong personal characteristics and the motivation to succeed !
IMO he truly deserves the full support of everyone (board and fans alike!) and I am happy to note that over 90% on this website are in agreement !!
I posted the above on the 'Poll' thread but it is probably more applicable here (yes, there are too many threads about the same subject!).
But no; I don't understand why FF's view of saying where we are after 7 games is unacceptable, but your view of where we are after 7 games as an indicator to the rest of the season and the overall quality of the squad is accurate.