Puncheon vs Ramirez

Yeah, cos you don't see his body language enough to make an informed judgement.

Can you only comment on his body language, if you go to every game and solely watch Ramirez?

That would mean no one is qualified to comment and makes your point kind of ridiculous

I cant speak for Barry or Alpine, but I watch 95% of Saints games live on TV (or PC) presumably watching games live on TV disqualifies anyone from an opinion?

Can you only comment on his body language, if you go to every game and solely watch Ramirez?

 

That would mean no one is qualified to comment and makes your point kind of ridiculous

 

I cant speak for Barry or Alpine, but I watch 95% of Saints games live on TV (or PC) presumably watching games live on TV disqualifies anyone from an opinion?

No, but I don't believe Barry watched that many games live, otherwise I can't understand how he says he doesn't make any effort as it is untrue.

As I say, have a go at him for not living up to his pricetag, but if you think he can't be arsed then I question whether you watch the games or just have no idea what you're talking about.

Correct.

 

Strange that so many people make so much fuss about a player that clearly didn´t want to be here....

Respect. That was one of the biggests twists of what was written on here in many a month.

Your campaign to become Happy Clapper #1 of TSW has really gathered apace..

Pity about the Sell Jack Cork black mark on your copy...

Is there anywhere Puncheon hasn't had a good run of form?

 

Well that's more than The Gash has had, certainly...

Respect. That was one of the biggests twists of what was written on here in many a month.

 

Your campaign to become Happy Clapper #1 of TSW has really gathered apace..

 

Pity about the Sell Jack Cork black mark on your copy...

I haven´t won it yet?

Damn.

Both players lack consistently.

its kinda irrelevant as we never but anyone else wish we'd signed phillip coutino instead of ramirez? looks twice the player gaston will ever be and they signed him for around the same price

Both players lack consistently.

But one cost £500k while one cost £14,000,000

Also one was paid about £10k a week, the other £35-65kpw (TBC)

The fact that there is not much between them (contribution wise) shows how poor Gaston has been

Punch joined us in league 1 and was here to do a job, Gaston was a marquee signing that has delivered next to nothing.

Reality is - id prefer to have Punch over Gaston regardless of fee and wages - he's the better player imho

But one cost £500k while one cost £14,000,000

 

Also one was paid about £10k a week, the other £35-65kpw (TBC)

 

The fact that there is not much between them (contribution wise) shows how poor Gaston has been

 

Punch joined us in league 1 and was here to do a job, Gaston was a marquee signing that has delivered next to nothing.

 

Reality is - id prefer to have Punch over Gaston regardless of fee and wages - he's the better player imho

He might not be the better player on paper and in terms of so called natural skill but theres no denying on current form he would add much more to the team than gaston ever does and this is what most people are in denial of

its kinda irrelevant as we never but anyone else wish we'd signed phillip coutino instead of ramirez? looks twice the player gaston will ever be and they signed him for around the same price

we paid 50% more for Gaston AFAIK.

But one cost £500k while one cost £14,000,000

 

Also one was paid about £10k a week, the other £35-65kpw (TBC)

 

The fact that there is not much between them (contribution wise) shows how poor Gaston has been

 

Punch joined us in league 1 and was here to do a job, Gaston was a marquee signing that has delivered next to nothing.

 

Reality is - id prefer to have Punch over Gaston regardless of fee and wages - he's the better player imho

Now that is an actual opinion that can be debated/argued/discussed and might have been the better choice for your OP rather than

Did we offload the wrong player? Sure looks like it

Which seemed factually incorrect as general consensus was that Puncheon asked to leave rather than being offloaded. If you lead with this it 'might' have saved a couple of pages of the usual BS.

For what my opinion is worth, the comment that Puncheon may well have been the better player for us this season than Ramirez, I think on balance i would agree with (but I would also take fee and wages into consideration).

Unfortunately Puncheon allegedly chose to leave for personal reasons (although depending on your stance, some posters prefer to believe that he was forced out / pushed with no evidence to support this. We do have quotes / articles from Puncheon and the club that he left for personal reasons but again some posters would rather choose to ignore this) so not much we can do about it.

Not looking to overly knock Ramirez but I would say it is apparent that his contributions to date have not been that great.

But can't compare the two in the way the OP tried

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2603073/Southampton-0-1-Cardiff-match-report-Juan-Cala-stunner-gives-Ole-Gunnar-Solskjaer-hope-fight-against-relegation.html

Why argue with people who have never seen him play?

Its like arguing about which painting is better, when someone who has never seen one of paintings comment. Actually its worse, when they haven't seen the painting and know nothing about art.

You would smile, nod and let them have their pointless rant.

Ramirez is good young player who was kept out by good form of others - as Cork was and as Puncheon would have been.

At times inconsistent and too many injuries.

But looked good whenever called upon this season - straight away on Saturday his touches / passes were good, gets into space (not used enough) always wanted the ball and one of better players.

Played well before bad injury.

Resale value and age far in his favour over JP

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Punch any day!

Puncheon really did have personal reasons...

For which the club reluctantly allowed the loan and subsequent transfer to Palace.

His other half had been very ill after the birth of their child.....I believe the infant was also very ill.

The lady had her family in Croydon and Punch by playing for Palace could move with his family..

Very good player albeit inconsistent......would have been useful for game and squad player but the domestic side was only going to be a problem.

Punch looks a bit of a bargain - scored again this evening.

Is that his 4th goal in 3 games?

We really messed this up.... Gutted

Oh well, Ramirez will be good next season im sure

Punch looks a bit of a bargain - scored again this evening.

He was a bargain. Its what sometimes happens when situations get forced one way or the other. He would always have been a great squad player to have, but his situation played its hand and that's football, oftentimes you cant just keep players that you want.

Puncheon slipped out of our hands, we could have done with him now. Miles better than Ramirez.

Is that his 4th goal in 3 games?

 

We really messed this up.... Gutted

 

Oh well, Ramirez will be good next season im sure

I would suggest that the form Puncheon has shown recently is form we never really saw in the Premier League. Football is like that - sometimes a move reenergises a player (Davies to Bolton? Marsden to Saints!!!). It is not a linear sport, why players succeed at one club and struggle at another is something no-one can really claim to understand, otherwise buying players would be easy. How many other clubs were after him, by the way? Not a long line...

Not a big Ramirez fan either, before you start quoting stats, £ numbers etc. I would happily lose both players, I am not sure either have really cracked it at Saints as Premier League players (Puncheon did do a good job for us in L1 and Champ, but then so did Hammond, and I got over losing him also). I would like to see us back a younger British player (either through the academy or from the lower leagues), as I believe this has been our best strategy so far (Lallana, Shaw, Clyne, Chambers, Rodriguez, Ward-Prowse etc.). Failing that I think the French league offers better deals than the Italian league (for a club like us) - I think if you play in Italy, Southampton can feel like a hell of a step down.

I would suggest that the form Puncheon has shown recently is form we never really saw in the Premier League. Football is like that - sometimes a move reenergises a player (Davies to Bolton? Marsden to Saints!!!). It is not a linear sport, why players succeed at one club and struggle at another is something no-one can really claim to understand, otherwise buying players would be easy. How many other clubs were after him, by the way? Not a long line...

 

Not a big Ramirez fan either, before you start quoting stats, £ numbers etc. I would happily lose both players, I am not sure either have really cracked it at Saints as Premier League players (Puncheon did do a good job for us in L1 and Champ, but then so did Hammond, and I got over losing him also). I would like to see us back a younger British player (either through the academy or from the lower leagues), as I believe this has been our best strategy so far (Lallana, Shaw, Clyne, Chambers, Rodriguez, Ward-Prowse etc.). Failing that I think the French league offers better deals than the Italian league (for a club like us) - I think if you play in Italy, Southampton can feel like a hell of a step down.

The difference is that, in the Premier League, Puncheon should really only have been what he proved to be; a solid squad player. At the price, Ramirez was bought very much with being a first choice (if not first name on the team sheet) in mind. Puncheon was and still would be a great squad player. The finances of Ramirez are that, for a club like SFC, if he's not a first choice player he's a big burden.

The difference is one is playing every minute of every game the other isn't. Simples.

GR is a better player than JP, just he needs a run of games.

The difference is one is playing every minute of every game the other isn't. Simples.

Well that's the simple minded reasoning for it I suppose, yes.

What a truly unbelievable job Pulis has done, seriously. They were dead in December, yet somehow he's got them mid-table. Incredible achievement.

What a truly unbelievable job Pulis has done, seriously. They were dead in December, yet somehow he's got them mid-table. Incredible achievement.

Indeed. Manager of the year (unless Liverpool win the title).

I Remember being told in no uncertain terms on here that Antonio was a far better player than puncheon and would be a premier league star.

People seem to forget that Puncheon was our League 1 Ramirez.

Luxury player with an attitude (ok, Ramirez seems a less complicated character), who everyone knew had loads of talent and potential, but failed to deliver it consistently.

I'm surprised we didn't offload him in one of his "luxury" loans to PL Blackpool and QPR. It was actually a bit like what the rumour mill suggests we want to do with Ramirez (except with the Italian powerhouses).

People seem to forget that Puncheon was our League 1 Ramirez.

 

Luxury player with an attitude (ok, Ramirez seems a less complicated character), who everyone knew had loads of talent and potential, but failed to deliver it consistently.

 

I'm surprised we didn't offload him in one of his "luxury" loans to PL Blackpool and QPR. It was actually a bit like what the rumour mill suggests we want to do with Ramirez (except with the Italian powerhouses).

Let's look at his career here

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

Let's look at his career here

 

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

 

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

 

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

 

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

Jesus, you do actually form prospective (rather than retro) opinion sometimes then! Hate to admit that you actually spot on with that assessment.

Is that his 4th goal in 3 games?

 

We really messed this up.... Gutted

 

Oh well, Ramirez will be good next season im sure

You clearly never went to the games that he played. Which is a stupid comment I guess, as you don't go to any games.

Let's look at his career here

 

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

 

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

 

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

 

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

Absolutely fantastic post!

Absolutely fantastic post!

This

Thought we were silly to get rid of JP as he gave us something different. Fair enough to let him go had we had someone else lined up but we didn't. With Osvaldo getting the boot and Jay Rod's injury we really could've done with him this season. He scored some vital goals last term and I think he would've done the same this year.

Let's look at his career here

 

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

 

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

 

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

 

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

Would agree with every single part of that.

Thought we were silly to get rid of JP as he gave us something different. Fair enough to let him go had we had someone else lined up but we didn't. With Osvaldo getting the boot and Jay Rod's injury we really could've done with him this season. He scored some vital goals last term and I think he would've done the same this year.

A lot of talk were that we had Piatti lined up, but he got injured just a few days before the transfer window was shut.

Let's look at his career here

 

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

 

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

 

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

 

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

Good post.

I still think Puncheon is the better player though which I presume is what the op is asking, but both are equally frustrating.

Let's look at his career here

 

Th first 3 months were okay, a few decent performances but 6 months in and a few poor performances later he threw a tantrum because he was not selected ahead of oxlaide chamberlain. This resulted in him being loaned out to millwalla and Blackpool and we didn't see him again that season.

 

After our promotion to the championship and AOC now gone he could have been part or that squad, instead he went on loan to QPR where he hardly featured, he also tweeted that he was happy to run down his contract with us and take every penny he could. After his failure to make a mark at QPR he returned to us towards the end of our championship season where he could smell the premier league, despite this he made little impact and spent most of the time as a sub.

 

Premier league to give him his due he made a few decent appearances and scored a great goal at Chelsea, signed a contract extension and before the Ink was dry and signing on fee banked he decided he wanted to leave and move back to London.

 

In short Jason puncheon is only interested in Jason puncheon. He's clearly a talented player but a few decent peformances against the lesser lights of the premier league don't make him the missing link some seem to make him out to be. The truth is he's been out on loan and sulking for the majority of his time here. Quite why some fans hold him in such high regard is beyond me.

*LIKE*