William Louis Sharp (1986)

1. Did you rate him?

2. In hindsight did he just seem better than he actually was because of the class of player he was playing alongside?

3. Are you suprised he has done f**k all since (effectively) leaving us nearly 3 years ago?

4. CHDAJFU? (Obviously not but some will say yes)

yeah we should have signed the other guy at doncaster, whatever his name was. world class.

yeah we should have signed the other guy at doncaster, whatever his name was. world class.

Lewis Guy? Hasn't played for Donny since 2010! You are in a timewarp!

****e

I thought sharpy was hard done by here. Obviously he got well paid while he was here, but you've got to think he was expecting a long term stint after promotion, otherwise why would he have made the switch he was so clearly underwhelmed by? If he'd been given a chance in the first team and blown it I wouldn't feel the same way, but did he actually play a competitive game in the PL?

Deserved more of a chance than Mayuka has had!

Deserved more of a chance than Mayuka has had!

Yeah Mayuka has had loads of game time!

Sharp is a lower league journeyman really. Can't even get starts in a poor Leeds team, didn't at Forest and not even all the time at Doncaster when he was there on loan.

Was pretty clear he was nowhere near a PL quality to me.

Did what we needed when we needed it - seemed like a good guy.

I'm not really bothered about what he's done since to be honest.

Billy sharp did a great job for us but you can't compare Billy Sharp from three seasons ago to Billy Sharp now. Different team, different time.

Yeah Mayuka has had loads of game time!

 

Sharp is a lower league journeyman really. Can't even get starts in a poor Leeds team, didn't at Forest and not even all the time at Doncaster when he was there on loan.

 

Was pretty clear he was nowhere near a PL quality to me.

I'd of much rather afforded Sharp (a player who scored goals for us and helped get us promoted) a few early season sub appearances than Mayuka wouldn't you?

Billy sharp did a great job for us but you can't compare Billy Sharp from three seasons ago to Billy Sharp now. Different team, different time.

Personally I think we contributed to his down fall , was scoring g regularly in the championship before we chewed him up and spat him out!

Some of our more 'learned' posters have openly slated Billy as second rate and not fit beyond the Championship. Like many outsiders did with Rickie.

Personally I would have liked Billy to have been given a fair crack in the PL. We have been in dire need of a six yard striker in many games this season and Billy could have done that job.

I'd like to know why, and who decided he wasn't up to it, and I get the impression Billy does too.

Will always be fondly remembered by Saints fans for those two goals V Pompey if nothing else.

a striker of his type needs pace, even if it's just over a few yards, he hasn't got any - can just about cut it in the champ but would look ridiculous against most premiership defences

As said before, did a great job for us but I always thought he would struggle in the Premiership. Perhaps we should have given him more of a chance but then why didn't another Premiership club come in for him? There is a huge divide between the divisions and football managers are no mugs. It is a shame as he seems like a top bloke, but clearly it was felt that he couldn't cut it at the highest level. Rickie has no pace but like Sheringham uses his brain to buy himself time and space. Shape had no pace and wasn't blessed with Rickies football brain.

Some of our more 'learned' posters have openly slated Billy as second rate and not fit beyond the Championship. Like many outsiders did with Rickie.

 

Personally I would have liked Billy to have been given a fair crack in the PL. We have been in dire need of a six yard striker in many games this season and Billy could have done that job.

 

I'd like to know why, and who decided he wasn't up to it, and I get the impression Billy does too.

Adkins, Pochettino and Koeman all looked at him and thought he wasn't good enough.

How many teams have a six yard box poacher who has a poor allround game? Closest I can think of was Hernandez at United/Real who is obviously miles better than Sharp.

Look at his career and there are more teams he has flopped at than been good at.

He was playing with Lallana, Lambert, Cork, Schneiderlin - very good PL players. Doesn't mean he was one, just like Chaplow or Guly who we all knew wouldn't cut it once we went up.

Deserved more of a chance than Mayuka has had!

100% agree. Why Mayuka gets a crack I don't know.

Answers to OP

1- I did (then)

2-Yes

3-Disappointed but .....No

4-No.

I thought he deserved a chance when we got promoted, he did the job Adkins brought him into do.

Did a fantastic job for us in the Championship. Not good enough for the Prem, but had a good contract to make up for it. Worth every penny.

Thought we treated him like crap but no he's not good enough for us now.

Did a fantastic job for us in the Championship. Not good enough for the Prem, but had a good contract to make up for it. Worth every penny.

^^This^^

Did a fantastic job for us in the Championship. Not good enough for the Prem, but had a good contract to make up for it. Worth every penny.

Couldn't agree more, would also love to add that I was over the moon that we signed him when we did. Top professional, very decent bloke.

I'd of much rather afforded Sharp (a player who scored goals for us and helped get us promoted) a few early season sub appearances than Mayuka wouldn't you?

I'd much rather HAVE given Sharp more game time in the PL, but Mayuka deserved his chance too. We now know that Mayuka has not impressed. We will never know if Billy Sharp could have impressed were he given the opportunities that Mayuka has had. But they are not really comparable. Sharp was a lethal goal poacher if not fast (though neither is Pelle, nor was Rickie). How we could do with someone other than Mane who could hit the net at present. Mayuka is a speedy but aimless forward who can't score.

Couldn't agree more, would also love to add that I was over the moon that we signed him when we did. Top professional, very decent bloke.

Ditto that.

Did a fantastic job for us in the Championship. Not good enough for the Prem, but had a good contract to make up for it. Worth every penny.

As my previous post, we will never know if he was good enough for the PL.

We will be always indebted to him for his contribution, without which we might not have been promoted.

I will always be ashamed at the way Nigel treated Sharp.

Thought we treated him like crap but no he's not good enough for us now.

Do we know how he was treated? Perhaps someone behind the scenes took him to one side and told him thanks but we don't think you are up to what we want in the Premiership?

Sometimes I wish somebody else had scored those derby goals so we wouldn't still be talking about him.

1. Did you rate him?

 

2. In hindsight did he just seem better than he actually was because of the class of player he was playing alongside?

 

3. Are you suprised he has done f**k all since (effectively) leaving us nearly 3 years ago?

 

4. CHDAJFU? (Obviously not but some will say yes)

1. No

2. Yes. He was/is an average Championship player who was playing above his ability at Donny when we signed him.

3. No, as above - no idea what all the fuss is about - just remember Tadanari Lee was ahead of him in the pecking order.

4. No - he isn't Premier League standard and won't be for as long as he has a hole in his backside.

80 appearances over three seasons playing above his ability. that's some impressive above ability consistency there.

F

As my previous post, we will never know if he was good enough for the PL.

 

We will be always indebted to him for his contribution, without which we might not have been promoted.

I will always be ashamed at the way Nigel treated Sharp.

'Ashamed' lol slightly too strong a word wouldn't you say .....!

As my previous post, we will never know if he was good enough for the PL.

 

We will be always indebted to him for his contribution, without which we might not have been promoted.

I will always be ashamed at the way Nigel treated Sharp.

LOL. "Ashamed". FFS.

I will never understand the "we'll never know if he was good enough for the Premier League" stuff.

We do know. He wasn't. A fundamental part of being "good enough" is being selected to play in matches at that level. He wasn't, because he wasn't.

Before you get to test yourself against Premier League defenders you need to show a Premier League manager that you are good enough to hold down a place in a Premier League team.

Billy had three Premier League managers to directly influence and failed three times, and let's also include all the other Premier League managers when given the opportunity to take him off us, declined that opportunity. Because he wasn't good enough.

So don't say we'll never know. We do do know he wasn't good enough.

As my previous post, we will never know if he was good enough for the PL.

 

We will be always indebted to him for his contribution, without which we might not have been promoted.

I will always be ashamed at the way Nigel treated Sharp.

Completely agree. If the treatment of Billy was an isolated incident perhaps it would be forgivable but there seemed to be a culture at club at the time of treating players little better than slaves. When you add in the shocking treatment of people like Bernard, De Ridder, Dickson not to mention how due to Adkins poor man management skills players such as Forecast were turned Into figures of fun by the fan base we really should forever be ashamed of how we as a club ruined the careers of these professionals. We will never know if they were good enough for top flight because of the deplorable treatment they received here. Perhaps it's time to get an online petition going to encourage those at the club to issue a statement of apology to the former fringe players at the club who through no fault of their own never got the chance to taste top flight football? I feel that that may be the only way we can eve move on from that sorry period in our history.

Completely agree. If the treatment of Billy was an isolated incident perhaps it would be forgivable but there seemed to be a culture at club at the time of treating players little better than slaves. When you add in the shocking treatment of people like Bernard, De Ridder, Dickson not to mention how due to Adkins poor man management skills players such as Forecast were turned Into figures of fun by the fan base we really should forever be ashamed of how we as a club ruined the careers of these professionals. We will never know if they were good enough for top flight because of the deplorable treatment they received here. Perhaps it's time to get an online petition going to encourage those at the club to issue a statement of apology to the former fringe players at the club who through no fault of their own never got the chance to taste top flight football? I feel that that may be the only way we can eve move on from that sorry period in our history.

I really don't understand this. I feel bad for the players who fought hard to achieve promotion and then never got the chance to play in the Premier League, but I cannot assume they were good enough and unfairly not given a chance. If Sharp, for example, were good enough for the Premier League someone would have taken him on loan from us and played him in the Premier League. Or bought him from us. It didn't happen which means that an awful lot of knowledgeable people thought he was not good enough. The same is true for all the other players discussed above.

Contrast this with Puncheon who, when he wasn't getting playing time with us, was in demand by other Premier League teams. Or, for that matter Cork. I am not saying that professional football coaches, managers, and scouts do not make mistake in judging talent. But it seems unlikely that so many made the same mistake over and over again. Moreover, if Sharp were Premier league quality wouldn't he have proved it in the past three years by tearing up the Championship?

I'm thinking of organising a "March for the Forgotten Heroes" through the city centre. Jonathan Forte is owed an apology and an explanation. Who's with me?

I'm thinking of organising a "March for the Forgotten Heroes" through the city centre. Jonathan Forte is owed an apology and an explanation. Who's with me?

Great idea. I'll be at front in my 2012/13 shirt with 'Seaborne' on the back.

I really don't understand this. I feel bad for the players who fought hard to achieve promotion and then never got the chance to play in the Premier League, but I cannot assume they were good enough and unfairly not given a chance. If Sharp, for example, were good enough for the Premier League someone would have taken him on loan from us and played him in the Premier League. Or bought him from us. It didn't happen which means that an awful lot of knowledgeable people thought he was not good enough. The same is true for all the other players discussed above.

 

Contrast this with Puncheon who, when he wasn't getting playing time with us, was in demand by other Premier League teams. Or, for that matter Cork. I am not saying that professional football coaches, managers, and scouts do not make mistake in judging talent. But it seems unlikely that so many made the same mistake over and over again. Moreover, if Sharp were Premier league quality wouldn't he have proved it in the past three years by tearing up the Championship?

Why I try to make sense of it all I always think what i did when I got Sheffield United to the premier league on FM08.

Tommy Forecast was hard done by?

It seems to me that he, and the likes of Anthony Pulis for that matter, were extremely fortunate to find themselves in the enviable position of being paid professional footballers when their ability to perform at a high level in the game was questionable at best.

Why I try to make sense of it all I always think what i did when I got Sheffield United to the premier league on FM08.

It is true that when playing Southampton in FM 2013, I used Sharp and Lee and got rid of Lambert--at least while using the fall database. But it is just a game and quite plainly did not accurately reflect reality. Obviously, the fan based over estimate of Lee and Sharp was present in the FM data base as well.

Your contrary opinion of me notwithstanding, when I use FM in my analyses I am aware of its limitations and do not blindly assume everything about it is correct.

Also, what did you do when you got Sheffield United to the premier league in FM08?

It is true that when playing Southampton in FM 2013, I used Sharp and Lee and got rid of Lambert--at least while using the fall database. But it is just a game and quite plainly did not accurately reflect reality. Obviously, the fan based over estimate of Lee and Sharp was present in the FM data base as well.

 

Your contrary opinion of me notwithstanding, when I use FM in my analyses I am aware of its limitations and do not blindly assume everything about it is correct.

 

Also, what did you do when you got Sheffield United to the premier league in FM08?

And there we have the proof that they are good enough given the chance.

LOL. "Ashamed". FFS.

 

I will never understand the "we'll never know if he was good enough for the Premier League" stuff.

 

We do know. He wasn't. A fundamental part of being "good enough" is being selected to play in matches at that level. He wasn't, because he wasn't.

 

Before you get to test yourself against Premier League defenders you need to show a Premier League manager that you are good enough to hold down a place in a Premier League team.

 

Billy had three Premier League managers to directly influence and failed three times, and let's also include all the other Premier League managers when given the opportunity to take him off us, declined that opportunity. Because he wasn't good enough.

 

So don't say we'll never know. We do do know he wasn't good enough.

All this is true.

Tommy Forecast was hard done by?

 

It seems to me that he, and the likes of Anthony Pulis for that matter, were extremely fortunate to find themselves in the enviable position of being paid professional footballers when their ability to perform at a high level in the game was questionable at best.

I would question their ability to perform ....at any level.

For Sharp also see Adkins.

Both did a job but neither are anywhere near good enough for the PL.

For Sharp also see Adkins.

 

Both did a job but neither are anywhere near good enough for the PL.

I wonder, by any small chance, that Saint Lard might suddenly feel the need to contribute to this thread.

1. Did you rate him?

 

2. In hindsight did he just seem better than he actually was because of the class of player he was playing alongside?

 

3. Are you suprised he has done f**k all since (effectively) leaving us nearly 3 years ago?

 

4. CHDAJFU? (Obviously not but some will say yes)

Yes, no, not really given the timing and his clearly changed priorities and not now, no.

Also, the thread title made me think he was dead, not impressed with that.