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Thread: Puel v Koeman...

  1. #1

    Default Puel v Koeman...

    So, we are just over a quarter of the way through the season, and I was wondering what people's reactions are now to our French tactician?

    Personally, after a gruelling Summer for a lot of our players due to the Euro's, the loss of Mane/Pelle/Wanyama, and a change of formation to the Diamond, I think we look like a better team that we did last season, and this can only be down to Puel. The way he has our team switching to and from the diamond to a fluid 4-3-3, the integration of youngsters and the superb rotation of a squad which has had a lot of games and injuries has been genius, and with more in form strikers we'd have far more wins than we do now. Yes, it is still early days, but if we can continue to play like this and build momentum I see no reason why we cannot challenge for another top 6 place. Some players are looking far better under him than Koeman, namely Romeu, Austin, Martina and JWP. We also manage to play ourselves out of trouble brilliantly at times, almost Barcelona-esque. He does however need to improve on his press conferences as this is one of the most important facets of the game now

    Everton on the other hand, although they picked up a number of points in early games (and a very easy fixture list), have looked pretty abject since the early run, and are looking a bit like our recent Dec/Jan out of form teams. Everton fans are also a bit surprised at his non-use of youngsters, although obviously we know all about that. I think we may well see Everton drop off as their fixtures get harder over the coming two months.

    So far I see no reason to lament the loss of Koeman, and I think Puel has obviously won himself some grace to get this team playing the way he wants them to.

    UTS.

  2. Default

    Yep, I concur.
    Puel appears more of a football technician looking at alternatives and all aspects of a player's game. I also believe he will last more than two seasons.
    Koeman, like Poch, was in it to enhance his own career path towards Barca.

  3. #3

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    Puel is less of a ****

  4. #4

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    I have no problem with Koeman and you can't really argue with 7th and 6th place finishes. However three things have stood out with Puel compared to Koeman:

    1. He's been much more trusting of the young players, notably McQueen in the last couple of weeks. I think if Koeman was in charge, Yoshida would be playing at right back and Martina at left back instead.
    2. We have a much more identifiable style. Last year, particularly away from home, we just wanted to soak things up and then hope to catch someone on the break for a 1-0 victory. This year, things seem much more joined up, although it is quite difficult to specify exactly how
    3. The players seem much more praiseworthy of Puel, which is quite telling. Tadic and Mane quite clearly fell out with Koeman last year. VVD, Austin and Romeu have been gushing in their praise the last few weeks from what I've seen

    Plus, I hope Puel gives the FA Cup and/or the EL knock out stages more of a go after Christmas. You felt as though Koeman threw the cups in order to protect his Premier League bonus money

  5. #5

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    Also in terms of Puel v Pochettino, I admire the fact that Puel doesn't use a translator. I mean, his interviews are boring and incomprehensible most of the time, but Poch hid behind a translator because he knew he could get away with it at a 'smaller' club

  6. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lickierambert View Post
    Also in terms of Puel v Pochettino, I admire the fact that Puel doesn't use a translator. I mean, his interviews are boring and incomprehensible most of the time, but Poch hid behind a translator because he knew he could get away with it at a 'smaller' club
    He used a translator for a question after the City game, but his English is getting better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lickierambert View Post
    Plus, I hope Puel gives the FA Cup and/or the EL knock out stages more of a go after Christmas. You felt as though Koeman threw the cups in order to protect his Premier League bonus money
    Hmm not sure about that- I felt Koeman always put strong teams out in our cups: lost 6-1 to a Liverpool side, Palace twice (both in the FA Cups), and Sheffield United away just wasn't our night (the Mane thread that night )

    Koeman was a winner and ofc he would want any trophies he could win

  8. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingsland Red View Post
    Yep, I concur.
    Puel appears more of a football technician looking at alternatives and all aspects of a player's game. I also believe he will last more than two seasons.
    Koeman, like Poch, was in it to enhance his own career path towards Barca.
    I totally agree that we may get more than 2 years with this manager and I really hope we do on the evidence so far. It'd be lovely to have a manager for a while - another thing I hate about modern football is the constant changing of managers, it's ridiculous.

  9. #9

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    i think he has managed the defense and the midfield, especially, well. I still have some creeping doubt about our offensive strategy and whether we have the right players for what we are trying to do. Now, this is not all Puel's fault, he's got what he's got; but i would be interested to see what our January and next summer transfer targets are. I will trust Les and Claude will coordinate needs.

    I would love to see more offensive fluidity and feel that players know their roles and are working well with each other a bit better. Most goals seem to be one offs.

    i hope I don't come off as negative, i think we are a really good team and i think Peul is doing a fine job, but its the final third were we need the most improvement.

  10. #10

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    Ronald who?

  11. #11

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    No one can doubt RK achievements with Saints but I never really warmed to him or his tactics and sure some utter dirge under him, away at WBA and Norwich spring straight to mind.

    CP, however, I'm liking. I don't know what he's done or how he's done it but he's got Saints playing some wonderfully fluid football where everyone is looking for the ball and wanting to attack. He's prepared to take risks with the youngsters, something RK would never do and it strikes me that he hasn't a "big" move in mind where as we all know/knew RK really wants the Barca job.

    Yes we will hit rough patches and the usual cu_nts wll be calling for his head but he's certainly impressed me with the way he's got us playing, squad management and general ethos.

  12. Default

    100% agree VFTT. Wasn't keen on him at first with some of the other options but, as ever, the club really did its homework. Some of the play right now is beautiful to watch and, on the whole, way better than under RK.

    We are well drilled, everyone knows their role and CP is not afraid to mix it up and blood the youngsters which will, in turn, make them hungrier as they know they will get a chance if they show potential.

    Hopefully the style of play will continue and we will get more clinical in front of goal: that is the one thing that is missing and if that clicks we will be as good as anyone in the League.

  13. #13

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    If we improved our shot conversion by 5-10% we'd be title contenders

  14. #14

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    Common theme of fluid football mentioned above.
    Mrs JBS knows her football, (footie on the TV it's her reaching for the remote and 4xx being pressed). She will identify a flaw with a player and 99 times out of 100 she will be spot on. Sunday evening when we got home out of the blue she just said "some of the football we are playing is almost hypnotic"............. Not the sort of thing that she says, slightly out of character.

  15. #15

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    to be fair, aside from Utd and Arsenal away (which are hardly unbeatable), until Sunday our fixture list has been easy as ****, especially at home.
    The real test comes with the next few home games.
    But tbf, he seems to know what he is doing.

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodles34 View Post
    to be fair, aside from Utd and Arsenal away (which are hardly unbeatable), until Sunday our fixture list has been easy as ****, especially at home.
    The real test comes with the next few home games.
    But tbf, he seems to know what he is doing.
    To be even more fair, our 4 away games against Man U, Man C, Arsenal & Leicester were all teams who finished in the top 5 last year and WHU were 7th so you couldn't get much more difficult than that !
    If you assume that we have a better chance of home points against bigger teams then the 2nd half of the season bodes well !
    I realise that we dropped silly points v Watford and Sunderland but Puel had not yet settled in by then so may be excused for that IMO !

  17. #17

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    Always puzzled by Koeman when he brings on his subs while Puel seems to do better.
    The big test is if Puel can get the team playing better at the start of December and through to January.
    Always struggle to get anything that I can remember.

  18. #18

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    I suspect at some stage this season we'll have a sticky patch unless we can continue to defy gravity and not allow Europa fixtures to damage PL form. Really hope everyone stands by CP then- the whole team will need it!

  19. #19

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by salisbury saints1 View Post
    I suspect at some stage this season we'll have a sticky patch unless we can continue to defy gravity and not allow Europa fixtures to damage PL form. Really hope everyone stands by CP then- the whole team will need it!
    We had a sticky patch at the beginning of the season...

  21. #21

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    That's called the summer.

  22. #22

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    I really like what I'm seeing now. The blip at the start of the season was just down to settling in rather than anything more worrying fortunately. Good times ahead, especially bearing in mind CP is doing what he's doing with players that he inherited rather than his own players.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by rallyboy View Post
    That's called the summer.
    I predict we won't win again next year from June to mid-August.

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pilchards View Post
    Always puzzled by Koeman when he brings on his subs while Puel seems to do better.
    The big test is if Puel can get the team playing better at the start of December and through to January.
    Always struggle to get anything that I can remember.
    Agreed on both counts! Koeman's subs often caught me by surprise. Think I'm more in the Puel school of thought.

    We've suffered over the congested fixtures for the last couple of seasons. Bit early too say conclusively if Puel is better but if Redmond, Tadic and J-Rod start scoring we will be quite a force.

  25. #25

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    From a first team player who has been at the club a decent time. Pull is the best manager he has played under and is very popular with the players who really like him.Very happy squad apparently

  26. #26

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    Puel gives the impression of being more cerebral than Koeman. As a disciple of Wenger's he has that air of the professor about him. Tactically he seems to get everything pretty well spot on so far. When he brings on substitutes during a match, you find yourself applauding both the players involved and the timing and soon after, the results on the pitch are palpable tactically, whether it is introducing a fresh pair of legs, minimising the chances of a second yellow card, or neutralising a threat down a weaker flank or strengthening the midfield.

    The juggling act required to rotate the players over the additional matches because of the Cup and the Europa League shows that he is able to manage the players and their egos very well, and that they understand that their team mates, even the youngsters, have to have the opportunity to step up to the breach for the greater good of the team. He must therefore command the respect of the players and have earned their trust.

    It is still early days, but on the face of it, we have pulled off another managerial coup. Personally I am finding the style of play more entertaining and exciting than under Koeman and surely that's what it's all about.

  27. #27

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    I had Puel totally wrong after the first 2 games. Looks like he could be a great manager.

    Nice to see Koeman struggling at Everton.

  28. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by lickierambert View Post
    Also in terms of Puel v Pochettino, I admire the fact that Puel doesn't use a translator. I mean, his interviews are boring and incomprehensible most of the time, but Poch hid behind a translator because he knew he could get away with it at a 'smaller' club
    Adkins interviews were also incomprehensible and he didn't use a translator - maybe part of the southampton way, after all chipsh without mayonnaise isn't chipsh

  29. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Personally I am finding the style of play more entertaining and exciting than under Koeman and surely that's what it's all about.
    Very much this.

    We have a fluidity about us this season that we didn't have under RK, and it is a joy to watch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saintadjg View Post
    If we improved our shot conversion by 5-10% we'd be title contenders
    And it would only cost us about 50m to do it...

  31. #31

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    It's a well known fact that Arsenal have a contract with Saint's for Puel to be Arsene's replacement at the end of the year (organised by the same brokers who sorted the original Schneiderlin deal).

  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alain Perrin View Post
    It's a well known fact that Arsenal have a contract with Saint's for Puel to be Arsene's replacement at the end of the year (organised by the same brokers who sorted the original Schneiderlin deal).
    ..... and we've got a contract with Spurs for Pochettino to come back to replace Puel and he's bringing Toby, Dia and Kane with him.

    Worst kept secret in town

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by New Forest Steve View Post
    ..... and we've got a contract with Spurs for Pochettino to come back to replace Puel and he's bringing Toby, Dia and Kane with him.

    Worst kept secret in town
    Noooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!

  34. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alain Perrin View Post
    It's a well known fact that Arsenal have a contract with Saint's for Puel to be Arsene's replacement at the end of the year (organised by the same brokers who sorted the original Schneiderlin deal).
    Obviously the above is written very tongue-in-cheek but I was listening to the radio the other day where they were discussing Wenger's retirement.

    It did make me consider who they would go for and it's no coincidence that the press have made the connection between Wenger and Puel.

    If he does exceptionally well at Saints I am sure Wenger would be putting a word in at the Arse re his student.

    However, if this were to happen it would mean Saints had been successful and we would march on and perform another reincarnation, hopefully :-)

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    Got to hold my hands up and say I was wrong. It just didn't feel right from day 1 for me. Then the first few games the tactics looked all over the place, the subs were so bad people booed, his interviews were completely uninspiring and the players body language was awful.

    In a very short space of time that has all been reversed (apart for the interviews)

    All I ask from him is to take the cups seriously. We need to win a trophy whilst we continue to be in a position to do so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by angelman View Post
    He used a translator for a question after the City game, but his English is getting better.
    ...think that was Eric Black (off screen), as he was hired because of his personal history with Claude and his ability in French.

    Admitedly....he does occasionally struggle with "English football vocabulary". He often says "first time" ..when he means "first half"
    but he is improving, although to be fair some of the questions he gets fed are somewhat incomprehensible, too.

    Some journalists puts words into the interviewee's mouth, when they may be expecting to answer a straigtforward question.
    If you pay attention to the form of some of the questions, it's easy to see why it can catch a non-native speaker off guard.
    Last edited by david in sweden; 26-10-2016 at 02:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Balls View Post
    Got to hold my hands up and say I was wrong. It just didn't feel right from day 1 for me. Then the first few games the tactics looked all over the place, the subs were so bad people booed, his interviews were completely uninspiring and the players body language was awful.

    In a very short space of time that has all been reversed (apart for the interviews)

    All I ask from him is to take the cups seriously. We need to win a trophy whilst we continue to be in a position to do so.
    Same here. I was worried his best years were behind him ala Mourihno, choice of coaching staff and lack of language. Very pleased he (and Les) have proved me wrong.

  38. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by david in sweden View Post
    ...think that was Eric Black (off screen), as he was hired because of his personal history with Claude and his ability in French.

    Admitedly....he does occasionally struggle with "English football vocabulary". He often says "first time" ..when he means "first half"
    but he is improving, although to be fair some of the questions he gets fed are somewhat incomprehensible, too.

    Some journalists puts words into the interviewee's mouth, when they may be expecting to answer a straigtforward question.
    If you pay attention to the form of some of the questions, it's easy to see why it can catch a non-native speaker off guard.
    Having lived and worked in France for a number of years when I was younger, I can wholly understand why he says "first time". He is translating from French to English, as opposed to thinking in English which is what you do when you are fluent, so presume he took in this instance and translated "la premiere mi-temps". Not a problem for me, and Koeman who few would criticise over his language skills, also made mistakes (not that I would really call them mistakes as the meaning was/is clear enough) of this ilk. And frankly, so long as the results on the pitch are good ie he can communicate with the players, I couldn't care less what his language skills are like. Quite refreshing to not have to listen to a manager pontificate about things.

  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wade Garrett View Post
    I had Puel totally wrong after the first 2 games. Looks like he could be a great manager.

    Nice to see Koeman struggling at Everton.
    Snap!

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