Matalan in racism story

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2773181/Matalan-monkey-suit-row-catalogue-photo-child-s-onesies-shows-two-black-children-modelling-ape-outfits.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Thoughts? Is this racist or are people finding racism when none exists? Is dressing a child in an animal onezie racist? Or is it just "unfortuante" and what is unfortunate about it?

This is a bit like when Roy Hodgson called Townsend a monkey last year. There wasn't a sane person in the country who thought he was actually being racist but that didn't stop the media telling us all it was a big race row.

It's not racist as they have not discriminated unfairly against anyone. Quite the opposite actually, you would be more inclined to say they were insensitive by treating the black and white models the same, as there are obviously those who have had racial abuse directed at them involving the word monkey.

Many people would have preferred them to show more discrimination in choosing which children should model which outfit. It looks like they did it without a thought about race, meaning there is no racism, only possible insensitivity.

Own goal that didn't need scoring.

Dress white kids up as rabbits and black kids up as apes.

What can possibly go wrong?

I doubt there was a white supremacist pulling the strings. Probably just some thick c**t that continually needs to be told what racism is.

Own goal that didn't need scoring.

 

Dress white kids up as rabbits and black kids up as apes.

 

What can possibly go wrong?

 

I doubt there was a white supremacist pulling the strings. Probably just some thick c**t that continually needs to be told what racism is.

That's not racism. Don't go looking for it where it doesn't exist.

That's not racism. Don't go looking for it where it doesn't exist.

How would you know, Whitey?

You reckon a primary school teacher would get away with it?

It might be tho mightn't it? I mean the photographer could have been Nazi and made the black kids wear monkey-suits just for lols Maybe the black kids were crying (that's why their faces is blur) and saying they wanted to be rabbits or horses or whatever and photograher was like *rage* NO! GET IN UR F*CKING MONKEY SUIT! AND DANCE!

We Just Don't Know

How would you know, Whitey?

 

You reckon a primary school teacher would get away with it?

It wasn't a primary school. The only factor that matters is the way that the models were chosen. The only racist aspect of this is those people who associate a black person with a monkey. The truly innocent see nothing wrong with it. As I said, don't go looking for racism where it doesn't exist.

It might be tho mightn't it? I mean the photographer could have been Nazi and made the black kids wear monkey-suits just for lols Maybe the black kids were crying (that's why their faces is blur) and saying they wanted to be rabbits or horses or whatever and photograher was like *rage* NO! GET IN UR F*CKING MONKEY SUIT! AND DANCE!

 

We Just Don't Know

You make an interesting point, Bear

It wasn't a primary school. The only factor that matters is the way that the models were chosen. The only racist aspect of this is those people who associate a black person with a monkey. The truly innocent see nothing wrong with it. As I said, don't go looking for racism where it doesn't exist.

So you acknowledge that a primary school teacher, with influence over maybe 40 kids per year, would be pulled up on such "casting decisions".

But it's okay for a clothing company with a marketing budget of millions and national reach to dress black kids up as monkeys and put them in the printed press.

Have fun getting those polar opposites to stick.

Probably just a bit unfortunate I'd imagine. Can see how it would be perceived that way, but don't think there was any malice in it (not that that necessarily makes it ok).

I also think it's worse for having two black kids in ape suits, perhaps if there was both a black kid and a white kid in the ape suits it may not be perceived in quite the same manner.

Own goal that didn't need scoring.

 

Dress white kids up as rabbits and black kids up as apes.

 

What can possibly go wrong?

 

I doubt there was a white supremacist pulling the strings. Probably just some thick c**t that continually needs to be told what racism is.

Except that in the article it says that they chose the outfit themselves.

Own goal that didn't need scoring.

 

Dress white kids up as rabbits and black kids up as apes.

 

What can possibly go wrong?

 

I doubt there was a white supremacist pulling the strings. Probably just some thick c**t that continually needs to be told what racism is.

Christ you talk some nonsense at times

The retailer however said it was disappointed the photograph had been perceived in this way.

 

'We regularly work with the two boys and they chose the outfits they wanted to wear, as did all the other children on the shoot.

 

'Their parents were with them the whole time and they all really enjoyed the day. It is very sad that some people have turned this into a race issue,' a spokesman said.

 

What could possibly go wrong? Nothing except narrow minded people trying to "see" a problem where none exists. Next someone will be pointing out the boys are shown in the costumes that appeal to boys and the girls in the ones that appeal to girls Should they have insisted on some cross dressing as well for the photo? Or maybe no children at all, just dummies of indeterminate sex and a neutral colour?

Christ you talk some nonsense at times

 

 

 

What could possibly go wrong? Nothing except narrow minded people trying to "see" a problem where none exists. Next someone will be pointing out the boys are shown in the costumes that appeal to boys and the girls in the ones that appeal to girls Should they have insisted on some cross dressing as well for the photo? Or maybe no children at all, just dummies of indeterminate sex and a neutral colour?

Ah, pre-emptive outrage. Always good.

Pap wasn't accusing anyone of anything really, just that maybe the people should have been a little more alert. Perhaps it was just a coincidence that those two kids were the only two that chose to wear ape suits. But still, you would think someone on the shoot or when putting the catalogue together would have been switched on enough to spot that this might cause a problem.

As Pap said, it's an unnecessary own goal. No doubt no one at Matalan has deliberately plotted to portray the kids in this way, or gone out to upset people. But it could have easily been avoided.

Ah, pre-emptive outrage. Always good.

 

Pap wasn't accusing anyone of anything really, just that maybe the people should have been a little more alert. Perhaps it was just a coincidence that those two kids were the only two that chose to wear ape suits. But still, you would think someone on the shoot or when putting the catalogue together would have been switched on enough to spot that this might cause a problem.

 

As Pap said, it's an unnecessary own goal. No doubt no one at Matalan has deliberately plotted to portray the kids in this way, or gone out to upset people. But it could have easily been avoided.

If you can't see the irony in that yourself I'll point it out for you.

"Sorry little boy but you can't wear that monkey suit because you are black. "

Forgive the choice of phrase, but it's not black and white is it?

Clearly, if the children chose the outfits themselves then at a very base level there is absolutely nothing wrong with their choices and the subsequent photo.

The problems arise when people start to pre-empt the possible reactions, because, like it or not, we all know there are lots of people who would judge such a photo without knowing the full story behind it, and as a result, some might expect Matalan to pre-empt that possible reaction and not allow it to be taken/published in the first place... that's a lot of pre-empting.

Bearing in mind we live in an incredibly judgemental and black and white society, there are many people who will see the picture, not read the back story, and decide that Matalan are racist. They're clearly not, but since when have many people been interested in the truth?

So it's clearly understandable that some people may question the wisdom of releasing such a picture, not because of the picture itself, but because of large sections of society who cannot think for themselves and pass judgement unfairly. It shouldn't be necessary to have to think that way, but it's not surprising that we do. That's why PR and marketing departments exist ultimately... to try and influence what and how we think about their company, and not leave it to chance.

It's just another sad indictment on modern society to be honest.

If you can't see the irony in that yourself I'll point it out for you.

 

"Sorry little boy but you can't wear that monkey suit because you are black. "

Ah, yes people looking for things that aren't there. And then putting words in my mouth. Very good.

I never said don't let the kids wear them, but there's plenty of easy solutions - isn't there. Let them pick, then just change round a little after. "Here, let's all swap outfits", it looks slightly better then. Show the same kids in different outifts, problem solved. Is it ideal, no? Is the climate at the minute one where people may be a bit miffed about this, well yes. Like it or not, you have to think about these things when you are putting catalogues and the like together.

I don't think there was any racist intent whatsoever. I just think, it's an incident that could have been avoided. Dressing up two black kids in ape suits and two white kids as bunnies is going to cause trouble, intentionally or not (I've said several times I don't at all think it's deliberate).

If you can't see the irony in that yourself I'll point it out for you.

 

"Sorry little boy but you can't wear that monkey suit because you are black. "

Well yes, if children are being racist I should hope the adults present would educate them and/or punish them if necessary.

Ah, yes people looking for things that aren't there. And then putting words in my mouth. Very good.

 

I never said don't let the kids wear them, but there's plenty of easy solutions - isn't there. Let them pick, then just change round a little after. "Here, let's all swap outfits", it looks slightly better then. Show the same kids in different outifts, problem solved. Is it ideal, no? Is the climate at the minute one where people may be a bit miffed about this, well yes. Like it or not, you have to think about these things when you are putting catalogues and the like together.

 

I don't think there was any racist intent whatsoever. I just think, it's an incident that could have been avoided. Dressing up two black kids in ape suits and two white kids as bunnies is going to cause trouble, intentionally or not (I've said several times I don't at all think it's deliberate).

I liked the bit where a Daily Mail article was used as a foundation for an attack on the narrow-minded

i had a look at the pictures, they look more like bear onesies

the ladybird suit looks awful

What I dont understand is why the person who complained took their story straight to the SUN according to the article, and not the EOC Maybe the EOC disagreed with their view

It's just another sad indictment on modern society to be honest.

This.

It might be tho mightn't it? I mean the photographer could have been Nazi and made the black kids wear monkey-suits just for lols Maybe the black kids were crying (that's why their faces is blur) and saying they wanted to be rabbits or horses or whatever and photograher was like *rage* NO! GET IN UR F*CKING MONKEY SUIT! AND DANCE!

 

We Just Don't Know

This

So you acknowledge that a primary school teacher, with influence over maybe 40 kids per year, would be pulled up on such "casting decisions".

 

But it's okay for a clothing company with a marketing budget of millions and national reach to dress black kids up as monkeys and put them in the printed press.

 

Have fun getting those polar opposites to stick.

That's not what I said, as you know very well.

I think the elephant in the room here is the fact that a darker skin tone is more monkey like.

I think the elephant in the room here is the fact that a darker skin tone is more monkey like.

Is it?

It's just another sad indictment on modern society to be honest.

I think it's the customers making the complaint that are being racist!

I think it's the customers making the complaint that are being racist!

Racist is as racist sees.

If you can't see the irony in that yourself I'll point it out for you.

 

"Sorry little boy but you can't wear that monkey suit because you are black. "

"There are none so blind as those who will not see", I'm afraid Wurzel that you'll never convince the lefties that conspiracy theories don't exist in every innocent situation !

Maybe they should be more concerned about Prezza and his Chumbawumba comment but I suppose they'll put that down to

" Ha ha, that's Prezza, what's he like, eh? Daft as a brush he is !

God forbid that a Tory or Ukipper had said something similar, the do-gooders would have gone into meltdown !!

I don't like monkeys. One stole my sunglasses once. Dirty, thieving little sh*t.

It is ridiculous and it does appear to be very bored people with very little to do in their lives that seem to look for problems everywhere and complain about nothing.

Juvenile Unit #2's three word response on reading the story, "switch it around", has more common sense than most of these posts, which was what was lacking in the first place.

Juvenile Unit #2's three word response on reading the story, "switch it around", has more common sense than most of these posts, which was what was lacking in the first place.

Put a monkey in a child's costume? What good would that do?

Put a monkey in a child's costume? What good would that do?

It'll scare the hell out of the children when they see you locking it in a cage and making it s*it in the corner.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2773181/Matalan-monkey-suit-row-catalogue-photo-child-s-onesies-shows-two-black-children-modelling-ape-outfits.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

 

Thoughts? Is this racist or are people finding racism when none exists? Is dressing a child in an animal onezie racist? Or is it just "unfortuante" and what is unfortunate about it?

Certainly ill advised as they'll always be someone that takes offence, though Id find it hard to call it racist tbh

Daily Mail article - subtext is PC gone mad, clearly.

Be interesting to see how many people actually complained. Also, why is it media outlets now deem comments from some random spanner on Twitter as newsworthy? The BBC even do it - you might as well take half the posts from here and treat them as gospel.

Put a monkey in a child's costume? What good would that do?

It'll scare the hell out of the children when they see you locking it in a cage and making it s*it in the corner.

Even the Mail article isn't making a big deal about this. The article qualifies the "customers" as mostly people on Twitter with someone sending in a story to the Sun. It also provides a bit of historical context. Some mentioned in the article label the image as racist, but I don't think any say outright that Matalan's intent is to offend

Most of these outraged customers are merely of the opinion that Matalan needs to have a teeny bit more nous about them.

It's the PC brigade gone sarcastic.

Certainly ill advised as they'll always be someone that takes offence, though Id find it hard to call it racist tbh

Isn't it about time we just told these people to f**k off, rather than pandering to their stupid desires to make like awkward for the rest of us.

Isn't it about time we just told these people to f**k off, rather than pandering to their stupid desires to make like awkward for the rest of us.

Fill your boots.

https://twitter.com/search?q=%23matalan

Telling everyone you disagree with to f**k off might require effort. Maybe start a f**k off posse, spread the load?

Apart from the lunacy of the twittosphere, there are lots of people in the UK that made a career choice to earn their living highlighting "racism" in society. What would they do if there wasn't any?

LOL, great thread!

Many times have I heard the comment passed from adult to child, "you cheeky little monkey" is this term exclusively available to white children only?

"There are none so blind as those who will not see", I'm afraid Wurzel that you'll never convince the lefties that conspiracy theories don't exist in every innocent situation !

Maybe they should be more concerned about Prezza and his Chumbawumba comment but I suppose they'll put that down to

" Ha ha, that's Prezza, what's he like, eh? Daft as a brush he is !

God forbid that a Tory or Ukipper had said something similar, the do-gooders would have gone into meltdown !!

You really do chat sh*t.

Kids pick outfits. Knobbers get upset on kids behalf. Normal people go "get a life". End of story.

LOL, great thread!

 

Many times have I heard the comment passed from adult to child, "you cheeky little monkey" is this term exclusively available to white children only?

No, but it's offensive to little people.

LOL, great thread!

 

Many times have I heard the comment passed from adult to child, "you cheeky little monkey" is this term exclusively available to white children only?

A neighbour reported us to ofsted because a staff member said that. Thankfully on that occasion ofsted employed some common sense (sadly quite a rare thing).

LOL, great thread!

 

Many times have I heard the comment passed from adult to child, "you cheeky little monkey" is this term exclusively available to white children only?

Nope. My mixed race nieces and nephews get it all the time.

If you went round exclusively calling black kids monkeys, you might have a problem.

No, but it's offensive to little people.

Why are you smiling then?

A neighbour reported us to ofsted because a staff member said that. Thankfully on that occasion ofsted employed some common sense (sadly quite a rare thing).

Certainly very little on this thread.

Or literacy, it would seem.

A wink is not necessarily a smile.

No racism, perhaps a poor choice in a society that is far from resolved on the matter of racism though.

It does however raise the question of would it be discriminatory to forbid the black child from wearing a monkey suit. Literally, they can't do what they want due to the colour of their skin.

I'm not quite sure why being called a monkey is a negative thing anyway. They're pretty cool are monkeys and most of them are hard, funny and intelligent animals. If you were going to be compared to an animal there are far worse things than monkeys. Rabbits are pretty pathetic and pointless animals, get shot, eaten by foxes, carry diseases like myxomatosis, not really got a lot going for them. If someone made my kid dress up as a rabbit i'd be most upset.

I'm not quite sure why being called a monkey is a negative thing anyway. They're pretty cool are monkeys and most of them are hard, funny and intelligent animals. If you were going to be compared to an animal there are far worse things than monkeys. Rabbits are pretty pathetic and pointless animals, get shot, eaten by foxes, carry diseases like myxomatosis, not really got a lot going for them. If someone made my kid dress up as a rabbit i'd be most upset.

Rabbits get laid...a lot...

The picture is basically saying that white kids are sexier than black kids.

Disgusting.

Rabbits get laid...a lot...

 

The picture is basically saying that white kids are sexier than black kids.

Disgusting.

or white kids are slags with poor morals??

Rabbits get laid...a lot...

I dunno think that might be MYTH, i reckon girl rabbits are just v.fertile. I.e. if anything male rabbit prob gets laid less than other animal bros, cos bitch is constantly pregnant