Ramiez, time to settle or not good enough?

Just wondered people's on thoughts on Ramirez, took his goal well today but apart from that another poor performance, is it just needing time to settle in or is he not good enough? or maybe other reasoning (not suiting our style of play) etc..

Personally I haven't seen him put in many performances which have made me think he is anywhere near the level of £12 million pounds, notably played very well against Villa (at home) but apart from that I am struggling to pick out performances where he's looked the 'real deal'?

He was bloody rubbish today, but he's got something about him that none of our other players have, and as long as someone teaches him how to take non-shooting free-kicks I can see him and Rodriguez linking up well next season. At the moment though, he's probably not in our best XI as he's a bit of a luxury with the (usual) pressing game.

Telling that we chose to sit our holding midfielders much deeper today to counter their hoof knock downs, and expected Ramirez to sit ahead of their flick-on mop-up squad and exploit the space in the hole. Seemed to be working early on, but he never quite found the right pass.

What Ramirez really needs right now is people booing, moaning and jeering when he misplaces a pass. This will really help him when he's looking low on confidence.

Rickie Lambert must be thinking why is he on £30000, £40000 a week.

For the money, he is not doing it.

Mind you, said the same about Jay Rodriguez at first, now look at him, brilliant.

Punch has got more to offer than Ramriez at the moment.

Slash the singing until he actually earns it.

I mean we were singing his name over everyone else's before he even scored his first goal for us. I saw MLT doing better things and being given half the amount of dedicated singing.

Rickie Lambert must be thinking why is he on £30000, £40000 a week.

What has Lambert got to do with anything? Why would he care what Gaston is earning, Rickie has just signed a new contract which I doubt he is doing too badly out of. You might have a point if Gaston wasn't putting a shift in but that isn't his problem.

Slash the singing until he actually earns it.

 

I mean we were singing his name over everyone else's before he even scored his first goal for us. I saw MLT doing better things and being given half the amount of dedicated singing.

Yes, the last thing a struggling player needs is support from his own fans.

not good enough

Of course he is good enough anyone who thinks he is not has rocks in their head. The lad has bags of talent. He has clearly struggled to adjust in his first season, showing a lack of stamina, a bit lightweight and now maybe a drop In confidence. But after a Complete pre season and fitness program he will be one of our best. He has skill and vision ahead of the others but needs to get a grip of the speed and physical aspects of the EPL.

I really want this lad to prove why we paid a lot of money and believe he will. I know he has taken longer than many would have wished but give him a break and let's back him.

COYR

He actually wasn't that bad yesterdsay if you took away the poor free kicks and he took the goal really well with a cool finish.

He is a young player from a foriegn country and a different league getting used to the premiership. Just look at how long Jay Rod took to settle and he only came down from the North!

He has the skill is keen, works hard and he will settle what is required is patience and support.

You can see he is a class footballer - give him time.

Well, you can tell one thing.

Guly isn't getting a game.

So someone has to be the target of the moaners.

Well, free kicks aside, I thought he had a good game. He definitively got stuck in, and worked back really well. At the moment some of his flicks and tricks are not coming off, but at some point they will.

He's got great movement, touch and vision. He will take this league by storm next season.

Rickie Lambert must be thinking why is he on £30000, £40000 a week.

For the money, he is not doing it.

Mind you, said the same about Jay Rodriguez at first, now look at him, brilliant.

Punch has got more to offer than Ramriez at the moment.

Rickie Lambert is a professional footballer and is therefore likely to be able to recognise a hugely talented player. Yes, I concede, his free kicks and corners yesterday were awful. But I just don't get the general slagging of Ramirez. In the type of game he plays - the clever, unexpected pass - not everything is going to come off. Sometimes his pass will go astray or sometimes the recipient will not have anticipated it. But, when it works, it's a joy to watch. And he's not just about fancy passing either. He's shown he's not afraid to get stuck in and made some really good tackles yesterday, as he has done in other games.

Some fans seem to have a need to find one or two players they can blame for everything. It's the same with Jos. If you're playing centre back and you make a mistake it's more likely to lead to a goal against than if a forward or midfielder makes a mistake. Fox had a good game yesterday and Guly didn't get on the pitch so it seems some have to find someone else to have a go at. I don't see the point. None of our players go out to make mistakes. All of them try their best. If we had players who just turned up to pick up their wages I could understand picking on them but we don't. Under Pochettino, and under Adkins, there is a real team ethic. Anyone not giving their best does not stay in the team.

How about we support our players and stop trying to find this week's scapegoat.

£12 million quid for Ramirez ?

Just think, we could have had Matt Jarvis instead for the same money !!

So glad we have another new thread on this ffs

Well, free kicks aside, I thought he had a good game. He definitively got stuck in, and worked back really well. At the moment some of his flicks and tricks are not coming off, but at some point they will.

 

He's got great movement, touch and vision. He will take this league by storm next season.

Agree.

Think he was playing very well yesterday.

Good attitude, chasing, physical.

Good runs and passing.

Scored the goal.

But those free kicks were wasted.

Think some do feel the need to slag off a player, he is one of our youngest and most skillful.

How many of these did we have about Rodriguez? Including comments such as " why the f### did we sign Rodriguez?"

Enjoy the building of a squad.

Think some struggle to recognise quality and view things simplistically - which is why had us being relegated all season - quality has been clear, always said comfortable safety.

not good enough

well not yet anyway. Remember, he didn't start the season...was out injured a while ...and it has to be said, he didn't look any better under Adkins.

Pochettino may have other ideas. If we follow up the " alleged " media interst, we will get our money back if he moves on, but he's still young and may yet develop into something special.

For me - the jury is still out.

Ignoring the dodgy free kicks, Gaston had a good game yesterday IMO.

Rickie Lambert must be thinking why is he on £30000, £40000 a week.

For the money, he is not doing it.

Mind you, said the same about Jay Rodriguez at first, now look at him, brilliant.

Punch has got more to offer than Ramriez at the moment.

with this comment - I agree.

Pucheon would have been a better bet against the very "physical " Wham side on a wet, and blowy day.

Apart from his poor free-kicks, I didn't think Ramirez did so badly, but we would have done better if Jay Rod had been able to play from the start.

Ignoring the dodgy free kicks, Gaston had a good game yesterday IMO.

This, it seems like the new fashion is to say he's rubbish. He played well yesterday. People are expecting a little too much from him at the moment, he is still only 22.

Look around at what 12 million brought other clubs in the summer then tell me hes rubbish ! God how many more thread's do we need give the lad a chance to show his worth next season

Have to agree does annoy me that we sing his song over others, when players like Lambo deserve there song 1st, what happened to us singing his name before league one and championship games, he used to always clap and thank us for singing it.

Gaston is a good player and does flashes for brilliance may it be a flick and pass or a goal, however i feel he does need some more time to settle, i would expect a better performance from him vs a passing side like Swansea, and start Punch vs the more psychical sides like WHUFC Stoke Sunderland.

In the interest of accuracy, not all of his free kicks were rubbish. The delivery for Lamberts chance that didn't cross the line was fast and accurate, which I guess is what MP was seeing when he got him to take them. Are people only capable of retrieving 10 minutes of game from their heads?

I think we will keep seeing him hauled off on 60 minutes, when he seems to lose the plot. Hopefully he will mature, but who knows?

Took 1 decent free kick which Lambert nearly turned in at the far post if I remember correctly... Has flattered to deceive most of the season but I have a feeling he'll suddenly just 'click' and not look back and we'll wonder why we doubted him. A bit like J-rod.

Rickie Lambert is a professional footballer and is therefore likely to be able to recognise a hugely talented player. Yes, I concede, his free kicks and corners yesterday were awful. But I just don't get the general slagging of Ramirez. In the type of game he plays - the clever, unexpected pass - not everything is going to come off. Sometimes his pass will go astray or sometimes the recipient will not have anticipated it. But, when it works, it's a joy to watch. And he's not just about fancy passing either. He's shown he's not afraid to get stuck in and made some really good tackles yesterday, as he has done in other games.

 

 

 

Some fans seem to have a need to find one or two players they can blame for everything. It's the same with Jos. If you're playing centre back and you make a mistake it's more likely to lead to a goal against than if a forward or midfielder makes a mistake. Fox had a good game yesterday and Guly didn't get on the pitch so it seems some have to find someone else to have a go at. I don't see the point. None of our players go out to make mistakes. All of them try their best. If we had players who just turned up to pick up their wages I could understand picking on them but we don't. Under Pochettino, and under Adkins, there is a real team ethic. Anyone not giving their best does not stay in the team.

 

How about we support our players and stop trying to find this week's scapegoat.

Good post!

Took 1 decent free kick which Lambert nearly turned in at the far post if I remember correctly... Has flattered to deceive most of the season but I have a feeling he'll suddenly just 'click' and not look back and we'll wonder why we doubted him. A bit like J-rod.

Thank you. And for everyone else who mentions crap free kicks on this thread from now on I want the clause "except that really good one" inserted, or you will be marked down for blatant negative exaggeration!

Rickie Lambert is a professional footballer and is therefore likely to be able to recognise a hugely talented player. Yes, I concede, his free kicks and corners yesterday were awful. But I just don't get the general slagging of Ramirez. In the type of game he plays - the clever, unexpected pass - not everything is going to come off. Sometimes his pass will go astray or sometimes the recipient will not have anticipated it. But, when it works, it's a joy to watch. And he's not just about fancy passing either. He's shown he's not afraid to get stuck in and made some really good tackles yesterday, as he has done in other games.

 

Some fans seem to have a need to find one or two players they can blame for everything. It's the same with Jos. If you're playing centre back and you make a mistake it's more likely to lead to a goal against than if a forward or midfielder makes a mistake. Fox had a good game yesterday and Guly didn't get on the pitch so it seems some have to find someone else to have a go at. I don't see the point. None of our players go out to make mistakes. All of them try their best. If we had players who just turned up to pick up their wages I could understand picking on them but we don't. Under Pochettino, and under Adkins, there is a real team ethic. Anyone not giving their best does not stay in the team.

 

How about we support our players and stop trying to find this week's scapegoat.

100% agree with this.

A couple of awful free kicks and suddenly he's had a shocking game?Great finish for the goal, excellent delivery for the Lambert chance which almost went over the line, great flick for Clyne to run onto into the box in the first half, looked very dangerous after his goal for a spell. It's getting boring every week having to point out everything he does well for those who choose not to see it.Clearly good enough. Proves it most weeks.

He wasted a few freekicks but on the other hand he hits them very high risk. The one where Ricky almost scored (and where the ref ruled offside, which it wasn't) was brilliant and he did a carbon copy of that freekick a bit later but the nobody got on the end of it so it looked a waste. In reality that was also a good freekick its just that Ramirez didn't have their timing synced to perfection, a bit unfair to criticize him too much for that since he obviously gets instructions to take the freekicks like that.

He is suffering from the fact that a lot of our fans are small time and think 12 million should buy you a world beater.

Probably his best game yet in a saints shirt. Rickie's free kicks got a it wild and wooly just before he scored two crackers against Liverpool and Chelsea so here's hoping....

Out of interest, does anyone ever look for the positives in Ramirez rather than the negatives? The pundits certainly don't slate him and i'm sure if they thought he was gash then they would have mentioned it.

Fox should have been taking our free kicks. Wasting one or two you can live wit, but that was just too many for my liking. He needs to have it drummed into him that sometimes it's ok to just play a simple ball. Maybe he's trying too hard to be clever at times. He's still got bags of talent and as stated further up, can see him and Rodriguez linking up well, but still a very frustrating player.

He is suffering from the fact that a lot of our fans are small time and think 12 million should buy you a world beater.

The goal aside, he was pretty poor yesterday. Not his worst, but still a passenger.

If he hasn't started producing by January, get rid.

Out of interest, does anyone ever look for the positives in Ramirez rather than the negatives? The pundits certainly don't slate him and i'm sure if they thought he was gash then they would have mentioned it.

Stop being so dramatic. No one is saying he is "gash", but when you cost £12m then a benchmark is set whether you like it or not. Ramirez is a considerable potential talent, I've yet to see anyone seriously deny that.

If he came in as a free transfer people would not be moaning about him at all, its not like you paid the £12 million so why does it matter what he cost? He wasn't terrible yesterday just his set plays weren't the best

He is man for man far superior to anyone else that has ever played in his position in this country in the entire history of Soccerball and would get into any team in the country.

He is suffering from the fact that a lot of our fans are small time and think 12 million should buy you a world beater.

Haha yeah I think that is truth!

Gaston is the new guly

Every week, a differen't Ramirez thread. Some fans just don't get that you have certain players on the pitch who try and do something different or unexpected which will create chances. The downside is that when you try risky stuff, mostly it won't come off. He has to pick his moments a bit better but he can create and score for us as he has shown plenty of times this season.

He does some great things and the most stupid things like give the ball away to a west ham player 5 yards away.

He's frustrating & exciting if that makes sense.

A lot of young foreign players have a poor first season whilst they adjust (prime example is Henry - look how he ended up).

Lets judge at the end of next season!

Some complete idiots on here. He's 21 years of age, he's South American that had to adjust to Italian life & now he has to adjust to English life as well as the EPL.

Would not be gutted if sold as I know Cortese would get a fantastic replacement.

A lot of young foreign players have a poor first season whilst they adjust (prime example is Henry - look how he ended up).

 

Lets judge at the end of next season!

If he came in as a free transfer people would not be moaning about him at all, its not like you paid the £12 million so why does it matter what he cost? He wasn't terrible yesterday just his set plays weren't the best

Because cost is always a benchmark. Always.

Nathaniel Clyne was an utter bargain at £2.5M. Steven Davis was a great acquisition at less than £1M. Boruc was a great signing for little outlay. JRod had a shaky start but its looking game by game as if £7M for him is going to be an absolute steal.

There, I've compared lots of our players with the price tag paid for them. No dramas there I hope.

Well, free kicks aside, I thought he had a good game. He definitively got stuck in, and worked back really well. At the moment some of his flicks and tricks are not coming off, but at some point they will.

 

He's got great movement, touch and vision. He will take this league by storm next season.

This

His tackle down in the Northam/kingsland corner, before chipping it through to Rodriguez, who drew a foul from Pogatetz, was quality.

Took his goal well.

Good Free kick to Lambert for the goal line incident.

West Ham defending quite last ditch at times to cut out some his passes.

I think a few over hit set pieces put a blotch on his performance, but it wasn't a bad display like people are crying about.

A couple of things.

Anyone thinking Gaston was a passenger yesterday, look at the game again. He was probably one of our 3-4 best yesterday and chased back, were involved in much of our link-up play, tried to put that dangerous pass on and that´s why the manager is putting him out there. Anyone thinking he is on the pitch to make easy safe passes dont understand the game.

People saying Davis was MOTM, look at the game again. Yes he is secure with the ball, almost never gives it away but he almost always plays the safe pass. For a AM to never really threaten the opposition defence with a pass is not good enough from that position. Still thinking he had a good game, but never a MOTM-performance.

Freekicks....yes some poor distributions for sure, but you really have to question our movement in the box from the players. Very rarely that someone makes a move to create space for other players and it´s like all in the box want to score and wait for the ball on a silverplate.

You really need 1-2 players just moving around, making runs to create space for others or try to block defenders, but we rarely do that. If you open up space, even a bad distribution can go through to a player but as long as the defence can stay in their positions they will have an easy task defending it.