Palace 1 Saints 0 - The end of the world?

Stats

Palace Soton

Possession 43% 57%

Goal attempts 12 15

Shots on goal 5 3

Shots off goal 3 8

Blocked shots 4 4

Keeper saves 3 4

Did you watch the game?

They had clearer-cut chances than us and were happy to play on the counter after going one up.

We did very little. Our chances -apart from Long's- were scrappy, contested chances, often moving away from goal. Davis header which was the only other chance which drew a proper save was fine. Fill your boots and carry on deluding yourself if you think it's just about the finishing.

How long before RK + Team lose the fans backing, if this form continues......

They lost it a few weeks back if you use this forum as a yardstick.

Wind just helped Bompey...,

@JacquiOatley: Koeman: "Pelle was not fit enough to start. He's been struggling for several weeks with a knee injury. He needs an injection". #saintsfc

Would you have posted this after the Chelsea game a couple of weeks back?

More than two months ago. About the same time Gary Monk was Manager of the Month. Things change.

Did you watch the game?

 

They had clearer-cut chances than us and were happy to play on the counter after going one up.

 

We did very little. Our chances -apart from Long's- were scrappy, contested chances, often moving away from goal. Davis header which was the only other chance which drew a proper save was fine. Fill your boots and carry on deluding yourself if you think it's just about the finishing.

You say playing on the counter as if it is a negative thing? Plenty of teams set themselves up to play counter attacking football. Plenty of teams do not play brilliantly but get a goal and take the points. Without wishing the state the obvious, you do not win games without scoring goals.

More than two months ago. About the same time Gary Monk was Manager of the Month. Things change.

Things do change. Which is why there is no point in slitting your wrists half way through a season.

We played quite well. A good even game all in all. Just the result that sucks

Switched off for 3 or 4 seconds and paid the price

So pleased for Gazzaniga after all his years at Saints

We can still have a reasonable season

Looks like Saints having another great December....

Things do change. Which is why there is no point in slitting your wrists half way through a season.

Yes you're right. I think we are going to take Spurs and Arsenal to the cleaners in our next two games.

Yes you're right. I think we are going to take Spurs and Arsenal to the cleaners in our next two games.

Good for you! There you go, a bit of optimism doesn't cost a thing (and yes, I know you are being sarcastic).

I think we are the team dropping from relative safety into the relegation zone. We might well be relegated this year.

Genuine question - not on wind up - but I would be interested to know if anybody feels that relegation is a real possibility. Are we too good to get sucked into a dogfight? Are there enough teams far worse than us? We just don't seem to be able to get out of the funk we are in so would be interested to know if anybody feels this could / will get worse. As I say, genuine question.

You say playing on the counter as if it is a negative thing? Plenty of teams set themselves up to play counter attacking football. Plenty of teams do not play brilliantly but get a goal and take the points. Without wishing the state the obvious, you do not win games without scoring goals.

Eh? What are you on about?

Im saying quite the opposite. You point to the match stats to suggest we were unlucky given our supposed superiority in a number of categories -possession being one example. I'm saying there are perfectly sound reasons why palace had less of the ball. Just in the same way you cannot infer much from the number of shots we had when most were half-chances.

Pretty basic stuff to understand....

They lost it a few weeks back if you use this forum as a yardstick.

RK loses it here everytime we don't hammer someone 8-0

I think we are the team dropping from relative safety into the relegation zone. We might well be relegated this year.

No we won't.

Genuine question - not on wind up - but I would be interested to know if anybody feels that relegation is a real possibility. Are we too good to get sucked into a dogfight? Are there enough teams far worse than us? We just don't seem to be able to get out of the funk we are in so would be interested to know if anybody feels this could / will get worse. As I say, genuine question.

A few more defeats in the 3-4 games and we will find ourselves around the bottom 6.

We need to be a great deal better than we are for that not to happen. We have been better earlier this season, so we know it is well within our locker

Genuine question - not on wind up - but I would be interested to know if anybody feels that relegation is a real possibility. Are we too good to get sucked into a dogfight? Are there enough teams far worse than us? We just don't seem to be able to get out of the funk we are in so would be interested to know if anybody feels this could / will get worse. As I say, genuine question.

See how the table looks in Feb, too early to say. Wasn't too long ago we were unbeaten for a while.

Genuine question - not on wind up - but I would be interested to know if anybody feels that relegation is a real possibility. Are we too good to get sucked into a dogfight? Are there enough teams far worse than us? We just don't seem to be able to get out of the funk we are in so would be interested to know if anybody feels this could / will get worse. As I say, genuine question.

I am not on a wind up. I think we will be in a relegation fight this year.

Genuine question - not on wind up - but I would be interested to know if anybody feels that relegation is a real possibility. Are we too good to get sucked into a dogfight? Are there enough teams far worse than us? We just don't seem to be able to get out of the funk we are in so would be interested to know if anybody feels this could / will get worse. As I say, genuine question.

I don't think so, but if we don't pick up more than 3 points in the next say 4 or 5 then we could get sucked in.

Still have lots of quality, just not playing well and very reliant on the form of 1 or 2 players to get results.

Glad we have the points we do though and not 5 or 6 less.

Could use a couple of back to back wins soon and maybe one good Jan signing.

Stats

Palace Soton

Possession 43% 57%

Goal attempts 12 15

Shots on goal 5 3

Shots off goal 3 8

Blocked shots 4 4

Keeper saves 3 4

You forgot

Points Palace 3 Saints 0

to be fair, we have a bottom 4 budget

which is incredible when players, staff and people running the club come out with champions league aspirations.

I agree.

I wasn't in the least part surprised that we lost today. We look like a side with no energy and confidence. A couple of signings in January is a must.

Weird tactics, weird selection and another poor display, Gazzaniga aside.

 

Have totally lost the pressing, tempo and energy we used to have.

 

Poor summer signings mean we aren't better than lots of teams we were superior to last year. Others have improved and we have made ourselves worse being trying to be too clever in the transfer market.

 

Top 10 seems a bit of a way off considering upcoming fixtures.

 

Very disappointing, and fans becoming disillusioned with the team which is never good. Only a short time ago we had academy players playing, 5 Eng Intls etc and a lot of positive feeling about the club.

 

Even the press conferences are so negative now and negativity breeds.

This is the most disappointing aspect - it's the same squad, manager, facilitates etc. so why slackened off, and why is RK allowing it to happen? Most teams have a poor run, so that I can accept if we are still trying our level best - don't get the impression we are right now. Is this down to RK losing the faith / motivation? Recent snippets in media are hardly reflecting a strong team spirit, which has been our advantage over bigger teams, so if this is gone then it's a bigger worry than a poor run. If RK is unhappy or not backed to his liking he needs to move on now (much as I like him) - conflict, however civilized never ends well in the end. If this is the case the owner / board need to let us know that is our ambition, so we can adjust to it and not build up hope of CL or title or forever improving! It's the hope that kills.

Some goals from midfield would transform this side. We do okay at conceding them but we're really crap at scoring them. It's not as though the problem isn't obvious to Koeman and Reed when we're picking Davis and Ward-Prowse as a duo.

December probably isn't going to be pretty, results-wise, but I can see us addressing the attacking midfield problem in January and pushing on strongly from there.

I am not on a wind up. I think we will be in a relegation fight this year.

If we continue to rest on our laurels snd bssk in past glories then we could. I doubt it will happen but blind faith as dome on here have is not the answer. Things need to chsnge.

You forgot

Points Palace 3 Saints 0

No I didn't forget that. I just published the stats. Make of them what you will.

Some goals from midfield would transform this side. We do okay at conceding them but we're really crap at scoring them. It's not as though the problem isn't obvious to Koeman and Reed when we're picking Davis and Ward-Prowse as a duo.

 

December probably isn't going to be pretty, results-wise, but I can see us addressing the attacking midfield problem in January and pushing on strongly from there.

Davis has scored some goals from midfield and nearly did again.

I don't think we will get pulled into a relegation scrap

BUT I do think Katerina may need to get the cheque book out in January

Davis has scored some goals from midfield and nearly did again.

Yes, two* in 19 appearances. And "nearly" didn't get us a point.

* That's two more than JWP.

Look around the division and see what other forward midfielders are doing.

I don't think we will get pulled into a relegation scrap

BUT I do think Katerina may need to get the cheque book out in January

Am reassured by what you and others say. My worry though is that the weaknesses we can all see won't be addressed in January and we will sleep walk into a situation far worse than the one we are in now. Could just be the natural pessimist in me though.....

Yes, two* in 19 appearances. And "nearly" didn't get us a point.

 

* That's two more than JWP.

 

Look around the division and see what other forward midfielders are doing.

Yes we could get more from midfield but you cant say that Davis doesn't score or have chances.

Yes, two* in 19 appearances. And "nearly" didn't get us a point.

 

* That's two more than JWP.

 

Look around the division and see what other forward midfielders are doing.

In all fairness to Davis, he came closer to scoring for us today than anybody else did. It was only a truly outstanding save that kept his header out.

Maybe we picked a different formation and team v palace as we are focusing on the FA Cup?

Well you can always hope!

Yes we could get more from midfield but you cant say that Davis doesn't score or have chances.

I didn't say "Davis doesn't score" - I said that we don't get enough goals from midfield. Two between him and JWP is woeful.

And yes, he does have chances but he seldom scores from them, which is the very problem I'm talking about.

Maybe we picked a different formation and team v palace as we are focusing on the FA Cup?

Well you can always hope!

You'd hope that we are focusing on the FA cup about 4 games before we even play in it? Christ. No one aims to be a cup team as much as it would shatter the hearts of so many on here.

What I can say about Davis and JWP is they are not attacking midfielders. Davis might get the odd goal, but it is only 2 in 19 this season when did he score before that? Maybe we should parcel up JWP, Davis and Wanyama and move them on for a couple of powerful attacking midfielders that can score like Wijnaldum does. Tadic is another that openly says he prefers to pass rather than score, somebody needs to disillusion him and set him a target. It's no good filling the midfield with slow possession oriented midfielders, we need quick powerful players running the channels and pulling defenders around. Static in the middle, slow to attack and only Mane making runs usually down mass defended blind alleys means we are struggling to score.

Where did this shoot by side footing come from? put the boot through the ball and keep it down, that's where the power comes from.

First chance I've had to watch us in a good few weeks and must say and I'm quite concerned with how little we created. It felt like we could have played that second half for hours and we weren't going to score. We look laboured and lacking in any sort of intensity or urgency.

Big few weeks needed.

I thought our formation worked quite well in containing them, but our 'wing' backs weren't attacking enough, they were no different to playing in a back 4. Could have been different had Davis' header gone in.

We weren't abysmal, but just not quite good enough. Unfortunately that gets punished in the PL. Worryingly I think it's more of a whole-team (or manager?) issue than one or two underperforming. I thought Romeu was our best outfield player (though apparently he lost Cabaye for the goal?) Bertrand was woeful, worst player on the pitch. Mane made the wrong decision every time in the last 20 mins. Wanyama is not the same player, Davis is decent but doesn't possess the creativity or individual ability to be the only link between defence & attack.

Thought the support was pretty good, shame about the morons who thought it would be funny to set off a flare and start chucking bottles and barrels around at half time...

The depressing bit is that losing doesn't even matter much now. We aren't going to be challenging for Europe and we aren't going to be fighting relegation. Best thing we could do is build a decent young attacking side playing football the right way and leave something to improve on in the summer and get excited for next season.

 

I mean 5 more wins before May and we're probably safe with the dross down the bottom in this league.

We need some points pretty quick to be totally comfortable IMO although certainly should be.

All the teams at the bottom will spend in January given the huge financial impact of staying up versus going down.

The depressing bit is that losing doesn't even matter much now. We aren't going to be challenging for Europe and we aren't going to be fighting relegation. Best thing we could do is build a decent young attacking side playing football the right way and leave something to improve on in the summer and get excited for next season.

 

I mean 5 more wins before May and we're probably safe with the dross down the bottom in this league.

Yeah I said this after the game, the players won't be playing for anything now. Even though I don't think it will happen, we are more at risk of being sucked into the mire than anything else. This game was there for the taking but we came up short, which has been the case on many occasions lately. But Ronald says it was a good performance, so what do I know?

I thought our formation worked quite well in containing them, but our 'wing' backs weren't attacking enough, they were no different to playing in a back 4. Could have been different had Davis' header gone in.

 

We weren't abysmal, but just not quite good enough. Unfortunately that gets punished in the PL. Worryingly I think it's more of a whole-team (or manager?) issue than one or two underperforming. I thought Romeu was our best outfield player (though apparently he lost Cabaye for the goal?) Bertrand was woeful, worst player on the pitch. Mane made the wrong decision every time in the last 20 mins. Wanyama is not the same player, Davis is decent but doesn't possess the creativity or individual ability to be the only link between defence & attack.

 

Thought the support was pretty good, shame about the morons who thought it would be funny to set off a flare and start chucking bottles and barrels around at half time...

I think maybe Bertrand's head has been turned by being in the England squad. It has happened before to our players after all. Wanyama is definitely going backwards.

There are a couple of things that worry me. When we still got some OK results, we weren't really playing that well and now we are in a bit of a slump.

Perhaps there is more than a bit of complacency when it comes to our transfers, with it assumed that we will always replace departing players with better. We only did that for one season, it's not like it has been something that has happened consistently over a number of years. Like players do, maybe the transfer committee believe their own hype a little too much.

And with the transfers out, the one thing you cannot replicate easily when bringing in new players is team spirit and in a couple of matches this year, it has been noticeable that this is not that great. When we go a goal down, it's pretty much game over, or worse, a total capitulation like against Liverpool in the cup.

Maybe we won't be relegated but at the moment, it seems we are probably going to finish far lower than expected. Kind of the opposite of last season and hugely disappointing if that happens. Hopefully this run of bad form will be the kick up the backside that is needed and we can turn it around and finish top half at least.

to be fair, we have a bottom 4 budget

which is incredible when players, staff and people running the club come out with champions league aspirations.

And the amount of money we've made from player sales the last two summers.

Pathetic to be honest.

Let's get this correct! This result has little to do with the players (Bertrand accepted) and more to do with the coaching staff.

Today was fantasy football. Who changes the system so radically before a match? How can you expect players at the highest level to gel with so many changes??? Mayo left, Fonte middle, Van Dijk right. We played a 3-4-1-2 system. We showed great respect to Crystal Palace with this formation, hoping we'd hit them on the counter attack with the speed of Long and Mane. We would have been better playing a 4-2-3-1 system and playing our own game.

Unlike most I rate Gazza, but his footwork sometimes isn't quick enough. He was MOTM.

Last week JWP was considered as MOTM, but he didn't make the starting 11???? If you want JWP to aspire to what we expect you have to show faith and play him week in, week out.

Long one on one in the last minute must score!!

All in all very disappointed. Koeman must go back to basic's or he will lose the dressing room.

£40 wasted today and I expect more for my money.

Wanyama sits in that section of a Venn Diagram where woeful finishing, disintersted, and first touch of a camel intersect.

We are not a well run club.

Sorry, but the last few weeks are all down to lack of squad depth, an inability to hold on to players (because we have to operate within our means) and we sell. We sell our players. We are not ambitious. We got lucky as RK arrived.

There is more chance we will sell our best players in January than buy quality players ourselves. Our owner needs to sell up. Only way forward to support and keep Koeman is to find a wealthy owner like Leicester have.

We are about to enter a relegation battle. Simply no depth, no ambition, no new youth of note to bail us out, no money from our owners and Boardroom.

Eddy Howe after defeating Man U just said he's strengthening his squad in Jan. We aren't saying that.

Bubbles bursting?

Like players do, maybe the transfer committee believe their own hype a little too much.

Ha, weirdly I was saying exactly the same thing to my Dad a minute ago.

I find Koeman's casual approach to our slump most perturbing.

Could be a long, hard, and anxious winter.

We are not a well run club.

 

Sorry, but the last few weeks are all down to lack of squad depth, an inability to hold on to players (because we have to operate within our means) and we sell. We sell our players. We are not ambitious. We got lucky as RK arrived.

 

There is more chance we will sell our best players in January than buy quality players ourselves. Our owner needs to sell up. Only way forward to support and keep Koeman is to find a wealthy owner like Leicester have.

 

We are about to enter a relegation battle. Simply no depth, no ambition, no new youth of note to bail us out, no money from our owners and Boardroom.

 

Eddy Howe after defeating Man U just said he's strengthening his squad in Jan. We aren't saying that.

 

Bubbles bursting?

Agree with this completely. I did warn at the start of the season about complacency and I predicted a relegation fight. This is exactly what we are going to get !

Agree with this completely. I did warn at the start of the season about complacency and I predicted a relegation fight. This is exactly what we are going to get !

Usual Dalek over-reaction. There are some truly awful sides in the Premier League this season so we wont go down. But we have definitely gone backwards since last season and we look like a team without much confidence up front.

I was at the game today, and it was one that we could well have got a point from - if anyone could be bothered to have a shot. Palace sat back in the second half, but we only really tested Hennessey once, and that was right at the end when Long should have scored. Too many touches, especially from Mane. If Arsenal make a silly offer for Wanyama, then we should take it [ he looked well off the pace. And Pelle and Long together simply doesn't work - they get in each others way.

On the plus side, Gazzaniga actually looked a decent keeper today. He made a number of good stops, and his distribution was generally OK. Which does make you wonder why Kelvin played against Leicester. Thought Davis had a good game, and was surprised when he was subbed.

And putting the TV gantry under the stand roof to block everyone's view is daft

Feels like deja vu to the Lowe era.

We've sold our better players and failed to replace with similar potential (established quality would have been too expensive).