View Poll Results: Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum

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  • Leave Before - Leave Now

    35 22.15%
  • Leave Before - Remain Now

    8 5.06%
  • Leave Before - Not Bothered Now

    2 1.27%
  • Remain Before - Remain Now

    88 55.70%
  • Remain Before - Leave Now

    6 3.80%
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    0 0%
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    3 1.90%
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    4 2.53%
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    2 1.27%
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    10 6.33%
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Thread: Brexit - Enter at Your Own Risk

  1. #16251

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    We'll be out on 31st December on WTO if no FTA has been agreed with the EU before then. If they want to put to postpone trade talks beyond that, then that's up to them.
    It's kind of up to us as well, seeing as we did want to do a deal and evidently that isn't going to happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    We'll be out on 31st December on WTO if no FTA has been agreed with the EU before then. If they want to put to postpone trade talks beyond that, then that's up to them.
    The EU is totally fragmented and the individual member states are acting in self interest, as they always do. We just have to prepare for an Australian WTO exit. An example of the EU's effectiveness in our time of need has been demonstrated with Italy. Italian ambassador to the EU: “Italy has already asked to activate the EU Mechanism of Civil Protection for the supply of medical equipment for individual protection. But, unfortunately, not a single EU country responded to the Commission’s call.
    We're on our own, lads...

  3. #16253

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    Quote Originally Posted by benjii View Post
    It's kind of up to us as well, seeing as we did want to do a deal and evidently that isn't going to happen.
    Yes, we would prefer a FTA deal along the lines of those already arranged between the EU with Canada, Japan and S.Korea. But we have placed a 31st December deadline on it, and also made it conditional on no level playing field rules and regulations equivalence, no continued fishing access to our territorial waters as if we were still an EU member, and no continued jurisdiction of the ECJ. Before there is talk of delays to the trade talks, it should not take long for the EU to accept those conditions from us. If they aren't prepared to do so, then there is really no point in taking it any further and we go to WTO, similar to what the EU have with Australia.

    I note that the EU would love to keep us in a status quo situation whereby we continue to pay into their pot for as long as possible. I also note that many remoaners continue to delude themselves that substantial delays might mean that we will either go for a really soft Brexit, or even their fantasy unicorn dream, that we will decide against leaving altogether.

  4. #16254

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Yes, we would prefer a FTA deal along the lines of those already arranged between the EU with Canada, Japan and S.Korea. But we have placed a 31st December deadline on it, and also made it conditional on no level playing field rules and regulations equivalence, no continued fishing access to our territorial waters as if we were still an EU member, and no continued jurisdiction of the ECJ. Before there is talk of delays to the trade talks, it should not take long for the EU to accept those conditions from us. If they aren't prepared to do so, then there is really no point in taking it any further and we go to WTO, similar to what the EU have with Australia.

    I note that the EU would love to keep us in a status quo situation whereby we continue to pay into their pot for as long as possible. I also note that many remoaners continue to delude themselves that substantial delays might mean that we will either go for a really soft Brexit, or even their fantasy unicorn dream, that we will decide against leaving altogether.
    The deadline was based on an expectation of a certain amount of time in which to seek a deal. The discussions necessary to achieve that seem unlikely to happen. It would be logical to move the departure date back to ensure sufficient time to hold those discussions in line with the original plan.

  5. #16255

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    Quote Originally Posted by benjii View Post
    The deadline was based on an expectation of a certain amount of time in which to seek a deal. The discussions necessary to achieve that seem unlikely to happen. It would be logical to move the departure date back to ensure sufficient time to hold those discussions in line with the original plan.
    If your assessment of the time required is based on delays brought about by the coronavirus, then you infer that talks can only take place if face to face. Modern communication facilities allow for alternative methods by which talks can continue remotely. Precedent of EU strategy shows that they will always extend the amount of time necessary to finalise talks to the maximum length available to them, especially when as I pointed out, we would have to continue paying into the EU cash trough. In any event, as I also pointed out, it shouldn't take long to establish whether we are wasting our time negotiating with them if they are not prepared to accept our conditions for the talks to advance, should it? As to the FTA, blueprints for what we are asking for are already in existence from the Canada/Japan/S.Korea deals. The deadline is one of our strongest cards and will concentrate their minds wonderfully. I'm sure that the EU and the remaining remoaners here would love us to extend the deadline for as long as possible.

  6. #16256

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    It would be retarded not to extend the implementation period under the circumstances.

  7. #16257

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    It would be retarded not to extend the implementation period under the circumstances.
    Indeed......

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    It would be retarded not to extend the implementation period under the circumstances.
    Remember we're talking about arch-swivels like Les here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Remember we're talking about arch-swivels like Les here.
    Says arch-remoaner EU arse-licker Gavyn.

  10. #16260

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Says arch-remoaner EU arse-licker Gavyn.
    Do you think an extension to the transition period is sensible in the present circumstances?

  11. #16261

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Do you think an extension to the transition period is sensible in the present circumstances?
    Generally Wes doesn't think, he feels and he wants.

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    Quote Originally Posted by buctootim View Post
    Generally Wes doesn't think, he feels and he wants.
    There's always the Norway option, isn't there, Timmy. Or maybe there isn't. You think, but you think wrong.

  13. #16263

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    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...s-says-johnson

    Here's the government's position clearly stated. All you remoaners shut your eyes, cover your ears, and deny it all you want, insult anybody who delivers the message, but you're all just p*ssing in the wind.

  14. #16264

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    Wes, the fact that you are still gnashing your teeth about this given the current situation makes you sound a bit mental.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...s-says-johnson

    Here's the government's position clearly stated. All you remoaners shut your eyes, cover your ears, and deny it all you want, insult anybody who delivers the message, but you're all just p*ssing in the wind.
    I’m not asking what the government’s position is - I’m asking if you think it’s sensible.

  16. #16266

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    ...
    Last edited by buctootim; 16-03-2020 at 02:46 PM. Reason: wrong thread

  17. #16267

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Iím not asking what the governmentís position is - Iím asking if you think itís sensible.
    You appear to have developed an inability to draw simple correlations between posts and opinions, Gavyn. Are you feeling well?

    Is it more likely that I would post links to articles that I approved of, or disapproved of?

    In general terms, as a Conservative Party member and voter, I expect broadly to agree with government policy. Does that come as a surprise to you for some reason? In typical insult mode, you have labelled me an arch-swivel, terminology that you aim as an insult to those Brexiteers who take a firm line over our leaving the EU , those prepared if necessary to leave on WTO terms if a sensible FTA is not forthcoming.

    Given all that, and the additional opinions that I posted (and which were largely supported by that article), do you really need to ask me whether I thought that it was sensible for the government to state that they would not extend the Implementation period?

    Just in case it still doesn't penetrate, the answer is yes, I do think that not extending is sensible.

  18. #16268

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    You appear to have developed an inability to draw simple correlations between posts and opinions, Gavyn. Are you feeling well?

    Is it more likely that I would post links to articles that I approved of, or disapproved of?

    In general terms, as a Conservative Party member and voter, I expect broadly to agree with government policy. Does that come as a surprise to you for some reason? In typical insult mode, you have labelled me an arch-swivel, terminology that you aim as an insult to those Brexiteers who take a firm line over our leaving the EU , those prepared if necessary to leave on WTO terms if a sensible FTA is not forthcoming.

    Given all that, and the additional opinions that I posted (and which were largely supported by that article), do you really need to ask me whether I thought that it was sensible for the government to state that they would not extend the Implementation period?

    Just in case it still doesn't penetrate, the answer is yes, I do think that not extending is sensible.
    Good to have it on the record in black and white. A rambling post apart, that wasn’t too hard, was it?

    Of course, it’s still far from clear what your position would be if government policy changed and it decided that an extension was desirable -given the ambiguities in your position but I don’t want to confuse you any further pal
    Last edited by shurlock; 16-03-2020 at 03:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Plastic View Post
    Wes, the fact that you are still gnashing your teeth about this given the current situation makes you sound a bit mental.
    Some of the fanaticism of Brexiteers in the current circumstances is astonishing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Good to have it on the record in black and white. A rambling post apart, that wasnít too hard, was it?

    Of course, itís still far from clear what your position would be if government policy changed and it decided that an extension was desirable -given the ambiguities in your position but I donít want to confuse you any further pal
    When I make three or four points, it's a rambling post. When you make several times more points , it somehow is not. Right, Mr Hubris-Egotist.

    But I'm pleased that the responses finally penetrated. You needed it on the record for what purpose? So that for some pettiness you might at some future date throw it back in my face?

    And you still haven't got the gist of my post that you responded to, have you? I thought that I had made it quite clear that I saw no reason why the Implementation period should be extended. Your position as an arch-remoaner gives you reasons that would justify an extension of the Implementation period that are likely to be totally different to mine. Can't you see that? If the government were to extend it, I can see no reason for justifying it, so I would adopt a position of opposing the decision. Is that too difficult a concept for you to grasp?

    There is no ambiguity in my position, neither am I in the least confused by it. Something isn't so just because you say it is, Gavyn.

  21. #16271

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Howís the pound faring at this time of stress
    Better than your investment fund?

  22. #16272

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    When I make three or four points, it's a rambling post. When you make several times more points , it somehow is not. Right, Mr Hubris-Egotist.

    But I'm pleased that the responses finally penetrated. You needed it on the record for what purpose? So that for some pettiness you might at some future date throw it back in my face?

    And you still haven't got the gist of my post that you responded to, have you? I thought that I had made it quite clear that I saw no reason why the Implementation period should be extended. Your position as an arch-remoaner gives you reasons that would justify an extension of the Implementation period that are likely to be totally different to mine. Can't you see that? If the government were to extend it, I can see no reason for justifying it, so I would adopt a position of opposing the decision. Is that too difficult a concept for you to grasp?

    There is no ambiguity in my position, neither am I in the least confused by it. Something isn't so just because you say it is, Gavyn.
    Thanks for clarifying beyond doubt your position Les. As you say, you are a Conservative Party member and voter and generally supportive of the current Government. From that, its not inconceivable to envisage a situation where the government changed its policy and you supported it due to party loyalty. In such a situation, you might also give the Government whose Brexit credentials are impeccable the benefit of the doubt and accept it was seeking an extension for the right reasons - in the interests of both the UK and Brexit itself. Or you might decide that regardless of the circumstances or party loyalties, any extension was completely unjustifiable. Which turns out to be your position. Noted.
    Last edited by shurlock; 16-03-2020 at 05:35 PM.

  23. #16273

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Thanks for clarifying beyond doubt your position Les. As you say, you are a Conservative Party member and voter and supportive of the current Government. From that, its not inconceivable to envisage a situation where the government changed its policy and you supported it due to party loyalty. In such a situation, you might also give the Government whose Brexit credentials are impeccable the benefit of the doubt and accept it was seeking an extension for the right reasons - in the interests of both the UK and Brexit itself. Or you might decide that regardless of the circumstances or party loyalties, any extension was completely unjustifiable. Which turns out to be your position. Noted.
    You still haven't quite got it, Gavyn, have you? I've already told you that I support the government's current position on not extending the Implementation period and saw no particular reasons why it should be extended, so the highlighted bit is just confused and contradictory ramblings from you. Also, as I've already said, what you as a Remoaner and me as a Brexiteer consider to be in the best interests of Brexit and the country, are almost certainly two different things.

  24. #16274

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    You still haven't quite got it, Gavyn, have you? I've already told you that I support the government's current position on not extending the Implementation period and saw no particular reasons why it should be extended, so the highlighted bit is just confused and contradictory ramblings from you. Also, as I've already said, what you as a Remoaner and me as a Brexiteer consider to be in the best interests of Brexit and the country, are almost certainly two different things.
    Diametrically opposite one might say

  25. #16275

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    You still haven't quite got it, Gavyn, have you? I've already told you that I support the government's current position on not extending the Implementation period and saw no particular reasons why it should be extended, so the highlighted bit is just confused and contradictory ramblings from you. Also, as I've already said, what you as a Remoaner and me as a Brexiteer consider to be in the best interests of Brexit and the country, are almost certainly two different things.
    As I say, thanks for clarifying matters. There’s no situation (within the range of Coronavirus-related outcomes) in which you would support an extension, even if the government claimed it was in the interests of the UK and Brexit. I know Brexiters who think that kind of inflexibility in the face of an epic economic shock is completely mental but your position is noted. It’s in black and white.
    Last edited by shurlock; 16-03-2020 at 06:08 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    As I say, thanks for clarifying matters. There’s no situation (within the range of Coronavirus-related outcomes) in which you would support an extension, even if the government claimed it was in the interests of the UK and Brexit. I know Brexiters who think that kind of inflexibility in the face of an epic economic shock is completely mental but your position is noted. It’s in black and white.
    By Jove, I think that you've finally got it! You certainly took your time getting there. I'm not holding my breath that the EU negotiators will be any quicker to accept that we are serious about not extending the end of year deadline.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guided Missile View Post
    We have been lectured by politicians and economists for years and they are all now shown as the false prophets they are.
    ...and as if by magic, up pops an economist:
    Robert Chote, Chairman of the OBR says he produces forecasts to inform fiscal events. He said that the value added in trying to do another forecast in a month's time was "virtually nil". "We are not going to be any the wiser on how deep or how long this is going to be." Professor Sir Charles Bean, member of the Budget Responsibility Committee, warned that due to the fast moving situation, in both the health and economic spheres, the "notion that an economic forecast is going to tell you anything useful about the next year or two is a pie in the sky".

  28. #16278

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    UK 'prepares to seek Brexit transition extension' as coronavirus crisis grows
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...avirus-crisis/

    Didn’t take long. If it is the case, it’s entirely sensible in the circumstances. Little Les will be angry -who knows a delay could have a higher mortality rate among the Brexiter swivels than coronavirus. But it’s obviously the right decision.
    Last edited by shurlock; 17-03-2020 at 07:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...avirus-crisis/

    Didnít take long. If it is the case, itís entirely sensible in the circumstances. Little Les will be angry -who knows a delay could have a higher mortality rate among the Brexiter swivels than coronavirus. But itís obviously the right decision.
    It's not just sensible, it's the only thing they should be doing. I'm not sure why anyone would think otherwise to be honest.

  30. #16280

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    It's not just sensible, it's the only thing they should be doing. I'm not sure why anyone would think otherwise to be honest.
    Are we about to witness one of those very rare events? Les changing his mind. I think it is likely to happen when / if the government decides on an extension to the extension.

    Lets wait and see.
    Last edited by Tamesaint; 18-03-2020 at 04:38 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamesaint View Post
    Are we about to witness one of those very rare events? Les changing his mind. I think it is likely to happen when / if the government decides on an extension to the extension.

    Lets wait and see.
    Or will he simply turn his wrath on BoJo for betraying his trust ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamesaint View Post
    Are we about to witness one of those very rare events? Les changing his mind. I think it is likely to happen when / if the government decides on an extension to the extension.

    Lets wait and see.
    Either you haven't read my posts on my thoughts about the possibility of a delay, or you're just totally lacking in comprehension of plain English. Just so that there can be no doubt in your mind what my position is, I'll state it again, just for your benefit. I do not see the coronavirus providing any excuse for delaying the deadline for the Implementation period. Has that penetrated your cranium? I told Gavyn that I saw no circumstances under which the deadline should be extended and he had to be told several times too before the message was understood. Therefore if it happens, I will not be changing my mind about whether it would be the wrong decision. Got it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...avirus-crisis/

    Didnít take long. If it is the case, itís entirely sensible in the circumstances. Little Les will be angry -who knows a delay could have a higher mortality rate among the Brexiter swivels than coronavirus. But itís obviously the right decision.
    I'm only a few months older than you, Gavyn. I realise from the usual insults that you hurl at those who disagree with you on anything that you are quite a nasty piece of work, but expressing thoughts along those lines really is plumbing the depths.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Either you haven't read my posts on my thoughts about the possibility of a delay, or you're just totally lacking in comprehension of plain English. Just so that there can be no doubt in your mind what my position is, I'll state it again, just for your benefit. I do not see the coronavirus providing any excuse for delaying the deadline for the Implementation period. Has that penetrated your cranium? I told Gavyn that I saw no circumstances under which the deadline should be extended and he had to be told several times too before the message was understood. Therefore if it happens, I will not be changing my mind about whether it would be the wrong decision. Got it?
    I don't see how anyone would think it unreasonable for there to be an extension under the circumstances which really are unprecedented in over a century. Just like virtually everything else, brexit needs to be put on pause until this is over. I'd hope for a years extension at least, possibly longer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    I'm only a few months older than you, Gavyn. I realise from the usual insults that you hurl at those who disagree with you on anything that you are quite a nasty piece of work, but expressing thoughts along those lines really is plumbing the depths.
    Calm down Les it’s not good for the blood pressure. All reasonable people can agree that an extension is desirable in the circumstances and that at this unprecedented time the last thing we need is additional uncertainty and distractions. I hope you can temporarily put your dogmatism to one side pal.
    Last edited by shurlock; 18-03-2020 at 08:52 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Either you haven't read my posts on my thoughts about the possibility of a delay, or you're just totally lacking in comprehension of plain English. Just so that there can be no doubt in your mind what my position is, I'll state it again, just for your benefit. I do not see the coronavirus providing any excuse for delaying the deadline for the Implementation period. Has that penetrated your cranium? I told Gavyn that I saw no circumstances under which the deadline should be extended and he had to be told several times too before the message was understood. Therefore if it happens, I will not be changing my mind about whether it would be the wrong decision. Got it?
    Last edited by Plastic; 18-03-2020 at 09:18 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Either you haven't read my posts on my thoughts about the possibility of a delay, or you're just totally lacking in comprehension of plain English. Just so that there can be no doubt in your mind what my position is, I'll state it again, just for your benefit. I do not see the coronavirus providing any excuse for delaying the deadline for the Implementation period. Has that penetrated your cranium? I told Gavyn that I saw no circumstances under which the deadline should be extended and he had to be told several times too before the message was understood. Therefore if it happens, I will not be changing my mind about whether it would be the wrong decision. Got it?
    Wow. Self isolation is clearly making some people grumpy.

    Would you not support an extension even if the Government and the rest of the Conservative party agreed to it?

    You lapped up the sudden change in fiscal policy that was announced in the Budget last week . Wouldn't you likewise approve of an extension if it was proposed by Johnson as being "common sense? "

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Calm down Les itís not good for the blood pressure. All reasonable people can agree that an extension is desirable in the circumstances and that at this unprecedented time the last thing we need is additional uncertainty and distractions. I hope you can temporarily put your dogmatism to one side pal.
    There's nothing wrong with my blood pressure, Gavyn, but thanks for your concern. I'm deeply touched by it. I accept your apology for the crass way that you brought the age of Brexit voters into the debate.

    I note that all reasonable people would vote for an extension, so it is only the unreasonable thickos who would oppose it, right? The same ignorant thickos who voted to leave the EU in the first place, eh?

    For some reason though, you do not seem to understand that a delay to the Implementation period is in itself a serious factor increasing uncertainty and distractions. Surely you must have accepted that extending the WA three times exacerbated business and finance confidence, so it is an easy step to understand that likewise an extension to the Implementation period would also not be helpful in the same way. What could be decided in say an extra year that could not be decided in the forthcoming few months? Either the EU are prepared to agree a Canada style FTA or they are not. The sooner that this is resolved, the better.

    It comes as no surprise to me that the Remoaner/Rejoiner establishment are doing their damnedest to use the coronavirus pandemic as an excuse to postpone the Implementation period as long as they possibly can. The EU of course have indicated right from the start that they lack the bureaucratic efficiency or indeed the political will to get this done by the end of the year, so naturally they will also use this pandemic as an excuse. As far as I am aware, the government are due to release our FTA proposals very shortly. There is no reason why those proposals cannot be shown to all of the 27 EU member states and their reactions quickly received in return. We can proceed from there.

    As things stand at the moment, the deadline for the Implementation period is set in law for the 31st December and would require for that to be repealed if it were to be extended. Personally, I don't think that it would pass the House, so that is the crux of the matter. My local MP says "I am completely against an extension and was elected on a promise to deliver the deadline."

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    I've never really slagged off Wes before but this dogged adherence to ending the transition period at any cost is insane. No wonder people call you extreme if that's genuinely your attitude when faced with this situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamesaint View Post
    Wow. Self isolation is clearly making some people grumpy.

    Would you not support an extension even if the Government and the rest of the Conservative party agreed to it?

    You lapped up the sudden change in fiscal policy that was announced in the Budget last week . Wouldn't you likewise approve of an extension if it was proposed by Johnson as being "common sense? "
    He was very opposed to Johnson’s Withdrawal Agreement at first and then swung behind it and was like a giddy toddler by the end of things, so who knows. But he’s really boxed himself in on this one, so perhaps he won’t fold. There’s no shame in changing your mind. Far from it if it’s the pragmatic thing to do. Certainly better than looking like a complete lunatic

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamesaint View Post
    Wow. Self isolation is clearly making some people grumpy.

    Would you not support an extension even if the Government and the rest of the Conservative party agreed to it?

    You lapped up the sudden change in fiscal policy that was announced in the Budget last week . Wouldn't you likewise approve of an extension if it was proposed by Johnson as being "common sense? "
    How many times do I have to repeat myself before the penny finally drops?

    I do not see the coronavirus providing any excuse for delaying the deadline for the Implementation period.
    Please read my post above as many times as it requires before comprehension finally dawns on you. I've highlighted the relevant part that covers your questions, which was also asked by Gavyn, had you bothered to read back a few posts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    There's nothing wrong with my blood pressure, Gavyn, but thanks for your concern. I'm deeply touched by it. I accept your apology for the crass way that you brought the age of Brexit voters into the debate.

    I note that all reasonable people would vote for an extension, so it is only the unreasonable thickos who would oppose it, right? The same ignorant thickos who voted to leave the EU in the first place, eh?

    For some reason though, you do not seem to understand that a delay to the Implementation period is in itself a serious factor increasing uncertainty and distractions. Surely you must have accepted that extending the WA three times exacerbated business and finance confidence, so it is an easy step to understand that likewise an extension to the Implementation period would also not be helpful in the same way. What could be decided in say an extra year that could not be decided in the forthcoming few months? Either the EU are prepared to agree a Canada style FTA or they are not. The sooner that this is resolved, the better.

    It comes as no surprise to me that the Remoaner/Rejoiner establishment are doing their damnedest to use the coronavirus pandemic as an excuse to postpone the Implementation period as long as they possibly can. The EU of course have indicated right from the start that they lack the bureaucratic efficiency or indeed the political will to get this done by the end of the year, so naturally they will also use this pandemic as an excuse. As far as I am aware, the government are due to release our FTA proposals very shortly. There is no reason why those proposals cannot be shown to all of the 27 EU member states and their reactions quickly received in return. We can proceed from there.

    As things stand at the moment, the deadline for the Implementation period is set in law for the 31st December and would require for that to be repealed if it were to be extended. Personally, I don't think that it would pass the House, so that is the crux of the matter. My local MP says "I am completely against an extension and was elected on a promise to deliver the deadline."
    Let’s be clear I wasn’t bringing the age of Brexiters into things pal. Not sure how you worked that one out. I was simply making a joke about the health complications caused by extremist Brexiters getting angry, stressed and depressed over any delay in the negotiations. As for the rest of your post, it’s a characteristic combination of economic ignorance (why did the currency markets react so negatively when Johnson set the December 31 deadline which in your book increased certainty?) and muddled delusion (what has the remoaner establishment got to do with anything if Johnson and his 80+ majority decide its in the country’s interests to extend the transition period?).
    Last edited by shurlock; 18-03-2020 at 10:06 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    Letís be clear I wasnít bringing the age of Brexiters into things pal. Not sure how you worked that one out. I was simply making a joke about the health complications caused by extremist Brexiters getting angry, stressed and depressed over any delay in the negotiations. As for the rest of your post, itís a characteristic combination of economic ignorance (why did the currency markets react so negatively when Johnson set the December 31 deadline which in your book increased certainty?) and muddled delusion (what has the remoaner establishment got to do with anything if Johnson and his 80+ majority decide its in the countryís interests to extend the transition period?).
    Re your jokes; you should cut them out, as you economists and accountant types are not very funny generally, and you're no exception.

    Well done trying to correlate the fluctuations of the Pound which occur on a daily basis for all sorts of reasons, with business confidence, increased because of the ability of individual businesses to make planning and investment decisions based on a greater degree of certainty and stability, brought about by knowledge of the outcome of future events.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Tender View Post
    Re your jokes; you should cut them out, as you economists and accountant types are not very funny generally, and you're no exception.

    Well done trying to correlate the fluctuations of the Pound which occur on a daily basis for all sorts of reasons, with business confidence, increased because of the ability of individual businesses to make planning and investment decisions based on a greater degree of certainty and stability, brought about by knowledge of the outcome of future events.
    As the young mum in the supermarket queue who has just lost her couple of shifts at the local pub which she uses to supplement the income from the other two PT jobs she works, said to the man next to her in the queue who has just been laid off and has no idea what comes next 'Thank God we got Brexit done'.

    Said no one ever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    I've never really slagged off Wes before but this dogged adherence to ending the transition period at any cost is insane. No wonder people call you extreme if that's genuinely your attitude when faced with this situation.
    I can't believe from what I'm reading from Wes, I think he must be seriously unwell. This is the biggest challenge the NHS has had in it's 70 year+ history, Brexit and indeed party politics are just irrelevant right now whatever standpoint people have on those issues.

    The EU itself is a side issue for quite some time now as well whilst the member states who are part of it battle to limit the severe damage to their populations with whatever measures they need to take especially Italy, Spain and France.

    Of course the transition period needs to be extended, it clearly will be. I agree Hypo that firm dates on that aren't important right now. I don't believe frankly in the circumstances that anyone other than utter loons are focused on anything other than battling COVID-19 and taking measures which limits the clinical, economic and social impact of COVID-19. As the Chancellor said this is not a time for ideologies.

    Even if a few loony MPs did vote against, Boris's majority is more than big enough.

    Yes, the transition period and trade talks will emerge again in the future no doubt but I think UK HMG and the EU member states have got a rather bigger set of priorities at present.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sandwichsaint View Post
    As the young mum in the supermarket queue who has just lost her couple of shifts at the local pub which she uses to supplement the income from the other two PT jobs she works, said to the man next to her in the queue who has just been laid off and has no idea what comes next 'Thank God we got Brexit done'.

    Said no one ever.
    Pretty pathetic to try to make the coronavirus crisis about brexit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    Pretty pathetic to try to make the coronavirus crisis about brexit.
    Not really, it was Les that spent all morning banging on about business as usual, apologies if I threw a brick through his window and that offended you.
    We might as well lock this thread now if we are all going to fall in behind the group-think and only be allowed to comment on one issue at a time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypochondriac View Post
    I've never really slagged off Wes before but this dogged adherence to ending the transition period at any cost is insane. No wonder people call you extreme if that's genuinely your attitude when faced with this situation.
    Are you saying that those responsible for negotiating Brexit are not able to continue unless they have face to face meetings, or that they have been tasked with other duties at present?

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    Pound sinks under $1.18 in deepening coronavirus market crisis
    Currency has not stuck under $1.20 since 1980s


    Sterling has dropped under $1.18 to a level it has not consistently traded at since the 1980s, as the coronavirus outbreak continues to rip through global markets.

    On Wednesday, the pound fell as low as $1.1754 against the dollar, extending a decline over the past week with a fresh 2 per cent drop.

    Part of the decline stems from a global scramble for dollars that has built up since companies started hoarding funds to give themselves buffers to ride out the pandemic.

    On March 9, before travel restrictions in Europe and the US kicked in, sterling was trading at $1.31. But the likely global impact of the disease has spurred a sharp decline in riskier assets, sending stock indices around the world tumbling and investors rushing to the safety of the dollar.

    “Everyone thought that Brexit was the big deal for sterling this year but . . . the currency has been completely overwhelmed by the coronavirus,” said Richard Benson, co-chief investment officer at Millennium Global Investments in London.

    Sterling has lost more than 6 per cent against both the dollar and the euro since the start of the month, taking its year-to-date slide to more than 9 per cent against the dollar. The slide continued this week despite new measures from the UK government to fight a looming economic downturn.

    Paul Jackson, global head of asset allocation research at Invesco, said that efforts to fight the crisis had not been rewarded in currency markets due to the UK’s departure from the EU, which he said had left the UK economy in a compromised position.

    “If you are already weakened by an underlying condition (Brexit, in the case of sterling), then the risks are greater,” he said.

    Some analysts also said that the UK’s initially measured approach to the virus, in contrast to a more urgent response seen elsewhere, had also weighed on the currency.

    “The UK is really at odds with the responses we’ve seen in other European countries and I think that’s one of the reasons why sterling is so out of favour,” said Silvia Dall’Angelo, a senior economist at Hermes Investment Management in London.
    https://www.ft.com/content/40272e84-...9-1fe6fedcca75

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