Caceres

Looks like he's only here as half-season cover and no intention of making it permanent. I can understand Puel/the club giving all the game time to Stephens instead; one of our own, young and will greatly benefit. Could only see Caceres coming in for Yoshi but I think it's great Maya is getting a regular run this season. He's been a great humble backup player for years and has more than earned these games. So I don't really mind Caceres not getting a sniff, the club is thinking longer term getting games into the other 2 CB's.

exactly

 

The bloke is a one mistake a game type of player. Guaranteed.

And Fonte was bloody perfect?!!!!!!!............ give it a rest.

He is insurance. Expensive but necessary. Of course cover for injuries but maybe also as it was not possible to tell how Jack Stephens would progress.

And Fonte was bloody perfect?!!!!!!!............ give it a rest.

According to many West Ham fans Fonte is the worst defender they've ever seen, Twitter is a goldmine in this regard. Be interesting if they go down.

much of that was not due to brilliant defending though.

I think we might sneak a win v Palace and lose at WBA, and at this stage I guess we probably have to take the points any way they come. Losing VVD and Fonte will hopefully teach the club a lesson as the bad luck/gross incompetence will likely cost us at least a few league positions. What's the financial difference between 8th and 12th these days?

Yet another clean sheet for Maya Yoshida and Jack Stephens, they must have got lucky again.

Caceres' absence must be contractual. Or he was hopelessly match unfit.

Be interesting to see the terms of his contract and how much of that is relevant to his exclusion.

Recall seeing something when he was supposed to join AC Milan - fell through as they didn’t agree terms? Can’t remember the details but think it was saying £30k a week + £50k each time he played and he wanted more upfront.

Perhaps we have agreed a similar deal - so the reported 100k a week he's on is actually (maybe) 60k a week + 40k a game bonus?

Either that or he's not showing the skills in training.

think this bloke was taken just in case stephens or yoshida get injured

the other theory might be we are looking to take him in the summer and are purely spending this 6 months building him back up to what his pedigree suggests.

I'd like to see him play incase he could be our replacement for Fonte long term. But on the other hand, I know that if he plays and demonstrates he's fit and anywhere near the level he once was then he will just trot off to some other club in the summer on a free. Or perhaps we are preventing him putting himself in the shop window so that other clubs would still see him as a risk and he might fancy staying put here if we believe he's physically up to it. Would be a shame to have a player of that supposed quality and never see him play!

I'd like to see him play incase he could be our replacement for Fonte long term. But on the other hand, I know that if he plays and demonstrates he's fit and anywhere near the level he once was then he will just trot off to some other club in the summer on a free. Or perhaps we are preventing him putting himself in the shop window so that other clubs would still see him as a risk and he might fancy staying put here if we believe he's physically up to it. Would be a shame to have a player of that supposed quality and never see him play!

believe we have an option to extend heavily weighted in our favour already

Could it just be the fact that Puel, who sees the players every day in training, knows which of his defenders is sharpest and is best suited to a place in the starting line-up?

I, for one, have been impressed with how Stephens has progressed alongside a vastly improved Yoshida.

There is enough belly aching - both on this forum and in football in general - about clubs taking the easy route and signing ready-made foreign players instead of developing young English players.

Somebody might mention our EFL Cup final defeat, but I can't recall any opposing striker completely undressing him since he came into the starting line-up and he's been integral to some of our better defensive displays (Liverpool in the EFL semi-final, West Brom on Saturday)

Stephens has got a chance he might not otherwise have got but for VVD's injury and I think he has taken it. Good for him, good for Puel and good for the club.

Having played almost half a season in the top flight, and with a full first-team pre-season under his belt, we could have a cracking central defender on our hands next season.

Let's throw this out there, then.

At this moment, which young English central defender would you rather have in your line-up. Stone or Stephens?

Perhaps it says something about Puel's

I'm quite happy with Maya and Jack !

Yeah sorry my post probably came over as being not happy with the current two. I've always been a massive supporter of Yoshida, from the first game I saw him (against Spurs when they beat us 2-0 at St. Mary's and Bale scored both I believe) when despite Bale scoring there was a couple of times Yoshida handled him superbly like many others defenders wouldn't have. So i'm extremely happy that he's finally getting recognition. I'm more than happy with Maya and Stephens being our pairing, but I think most would admit we need another CB in some form, even to give us Maya, Jack, Virgil and another. Hopefully, Caceres may be the other one.

Caceres' absence must be contractual. Or he was hopelessly match unfit.

He was clearly fit when he played for the U23s. He just hasn't been needed because Stephens and Yoshida have been excellent. You don't drop players who are playing well for the sake of it.

Be interesting to see the terms of his contract and how much of that is relevant to his exclusion.

 

Recall seeing something when he was supposed to join AC Milan - fell through as they didn’t agree terms? Can’t remember the details but think it was saying £30k a week + £50k each time he played and he wanted more upfront.

 

Perhaps we have agreed a similar deal - so the reported 100k a week he's on is actually (maybe) 60k a week + 40k a game bonus?

 

Either that or he's not showing the skills in training.

No-one has reported we signed him for £100k per week. He clearly isn't on that at all.

No-one has reported we signed him for £100k per week. He clearly isn't on that at all.

see post 25

Can't believe the negativity from some over Caceres' situation!

I think some people are forgetting the fact he had been out of contract for 8 months. For whatever reason, no other club had taken a punt on him since last summer.

IMO I expect the club will have given him some assurances that they will help him sort out his long-term future (and help him train and build up his fitness) in exchange for being happy to accept a back-up role with us.

Clearly the club have sufficient faith in Stephens until the end of the season, and why shouldn't they?

In guesstimated ballpark figures, Saints have spent c.0.5% of their income on 'insurance' for our centre back position, i.e. the acquisition of Caceres. I have also spent around the same ballpark percentage of my income on household insurance. I may not use the insurance but I'm glad I've got it...

In guesstimated ballpark figures, Saints have spent c.0.5% of their income on 'insurance' for our centre back position, i.e. the acquisition of Caceres. I have also spent around the same ballpark percentage of my income on household insurance. I may not use the insurance but I'm glad I've got it...

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

Dunno, go on you tell us...

Another great thread by 9-3

Maya and Jack are vastly improved both individually and crucially as a pairing.However the pressure from WBA in the last 10 minutes had it come from one of the top 6 I think we would have conceded; mainly because the superb composure in the first half was replaced by slack clearances and that is the difference between them and Vvd atm. Caceres will get his chance I am sure, hopefully not from injury but when we are 3-0 up at home to Hull.

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

Jumping to conclusions aside, how do we know he's not "actually good enough to play"?

(hope that question is daft enough for you?)

I like Caceres! He's like when the National Lottery email me and tell me that I'm a Winner and I put off going their website as long as possible, because upto that point I'm a fkn millionaire yo! Puel is doing the same. Caceres could be World Class! Puel don't want to play him and find out he's just 2 ball match and a free fkn lucky dip. It's the same thing with Schrodinger's cock, if u want a more Science analogy.

I can't recall any opposing striker completely undressing him since he came into the starting line-up

I think he struggled against Carroll but otherwise he has been superb.

Completely agree with everything else you've said, i don't think there's much between Stones & Stephens other than game time!

Coming into an era where decent english center backs are thin on the ground, I think we have a gem on our hands. A future england international.

Playing for the U23s again tonight along with Pied

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

please tell me who we could have bought on a free (this is what I'm taking the budget of "said insurance" to be) that is better than Stephens and Yoshida?

please tell me who we could have bought on a free (this is what I'm taking the budget of "said insurance" to be) that is better than Stephens and Yoshida?

Sakho

Sakho

technically there was a £2m loan fee...

Jumping to conclusions aside, how do we know he's not "actually good enough to play"?

 

(hope that question is daft enough for you?)

We should have signed that Schrödinger lad.

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

Such as? Because I wouldn't have signed any of the CBs other Prem clubs signed in January.

The Caceres situation is a little weird, but it makes all the sense in the world to sign someone as cover and give Stephens all the time he needs to develop - he's doing alright, as well - certainly making fewer mistakes overall already as he gets used to the pace of the Premier League.

I'm no longer expecting us to sign Caceres on the cheap in the summer. I am expecting us to sign another CB though and possibly two, whether Van Dijk stays or not (and I think he will).

Having said that, I'd laugh if Arsenal offered us Chambers money for Stephens in the summer...

why didnt we spend said insurance on someone who is actually good enough to play?

LOL, pipe down:lol:

Could it just be the fact that Puel, who sees the players every day in training, knows which of his defenders is sharpest and is best suited to a place in the starting line-up?

 

I, for one, have been impressed with how Stephens has progressed alongside a vastly improved Yoshida.

 

There is enough belly aching - both on this forum and in football in general - about clubs taking the easy route and signing ready-made foreign players instead of developing young English players.

 

Somebody might mention our EFL Cup final defeat, but I can't recall any opposing striker completely undressing him since he came into the starting line-up and he's been integral to some of our better defensive displays (Liverpool in the EFL semi-final, West Brom on Saturday)

 

Stephens has got a chance he might not otherwise have got but for VVD's injury and I think he has taken it. Good for him, good for Puel and good for the club.

 

Having played almost half a season in the top flight, and with a full first-team pre-season under his belt, we could have a cracking central defender on our hands next season.

 

Let's throw this out there, then.

 

At this moment, which young English central defender would you rather have in your line-up. Stone or Stephens?

 

 

 

Perhaps it says something about Puel's

I'd take Stephens over Stones and Redmond over Stirling. Roughly a 90 million pound valuation difference when you compare the amounts Man City paid out, which is another reason to admire Saints recruitment and academy policy. Like a lot of people I've been curious to have a look at Carceres play, but I applaud Puel's decision to stick with Stephens and Yoshida. Had one of them faltered badly, Carceres could have come in to steady the ship - but they've done the job and there's no reason to halt the development of Stephens nor not reward Yoshida for his good form.

Stephens needs a bit of luck and recently he's got it (AFCB misses and penalty + WBA misses in dying minutes)

His first 7 games we conceded 18 goals and I thought the experience might be more damaging than good, but 2 wins helps alot and his confidence will be high.

Some proper tests coming up, City, Chelsea, Liverpool..... Let's see how he performs in the last few games before we start rating his as England's best CB and "better than stones"

In guesstimated ballpark figures, Saints have spent c.0.5% of their income on 'insurance' for our centre back position, i.e. the acquisition of Caceres. I have also spent around the same ballpark percentage of my income on household insurance. I may not use the insurance but I'm glad I've got it...

We could have spent 1% of our income on an assurance player, one we'll definitely use

We could have spent 1% of our income on an assurance player, one we'll definitely use

Yes, agree, we could have taken that equally valid approach instead

Let's see how he performs in the last few games before we start rating his as England's best CB and "better than stones"

A bit like not judging Puel until he's been here a season or two rather than judging him during a below-par spell in his first season?

Ultimately even if he doesn't play - there has probably been some value to have him training with the squad and playing with the U23's.

He was clearly brought in for the League Cup final and that alone - Stephens stepped up and has kept the spot, fair play to him.

I can imagine Cacaeres starting the last game of the season for us for his first and final cap!

It's essential we have (someone like) Cácares. We're just one injury or suspension away from really needing him.

Ultimately even if he doesn't play - there has probably been some value to have him training with the squad and playing with the U23's.

 

He was clearly brought in for the League Cup final and that alone - Stephens stepped up and has kept the spot, fair play to him.

 

I can imagine Cacaeres starting the last game of the season for us for his first and final cap!

He clearly wasn't.

Sakho

We have conceded one goal in three games,while putting three past Sakho and Palace. I would say the wheels aren't coming off....

It's essential we have (someone like) Cácares. We're just one injury or suspension away from really needing him.

Exactly if there had been no injury to VVD Cacares wouldn't even be here.

We looked at two other CB loans in Jan after VVDs injury and neither played out so he was seemingly the best free agent available as cover.

As he seems to be seen as a temporary option by the club I would rather we gave Stephens the experience of playing regular PL football.

Also I wonder how many people calling for Cacares to play, because he is "better than our other CBs", have even seen him play on a regular basis?

He clearly wasn't.

He clearly was - it was an insurance policy if Stephens wasn't going to be good enough. Evidently Jack did well in training and kept his spot.

He clearly was - it was an insurance policy if Stephens wasn't going to be good enough. Evidently Jack did well in training and kept his spot.

It was an insurance policy for the league cup final... and the rest of the season.

Did anyone watch the u23's game last night? How did he perform?

Did anyone watch the u23's game last night? How did he perform?

Watched bits and pieces. From what I saw he played okay.

Josh Sims on the other hand was top notch

He looked in stroll mode, passed the ball well but didn't dominate and wasn't particularly strong in the air or appeared that quick. We conceded two late goals after being two up. Hassan looked ok and saved a penalty but the rebound was put in. I'm not really sure how good Caceres is.

Watched bits and pieces. From what I saw he played okay.

 

Josh Sims on the other hand was top notch

Sims is the player I'd like to see get much more game time as this season ends and certainly next season. Just think he's going to develop into a very good player.

Exactly if there had been no injury to VVD Cacares wouldn't even be here.

 

We looked at two other CB loans in Jan after VVDs injury and neither played out so he was seemingly the best free agent available as cover.

 

As he seems to be seen as a temporary option by the club I would rather we gave Stephens the experience of playing regular PL football.

 

Also I wonder how many people calling for Cacares to play, because he is "better than our other CBs", have even seen him play on a regular basis?

I doubt many people have. He hadn't played for a year before we signed him. I'd class him as semi-retired. At the other end of the career spectrum is, as others have said, is Josh Sims: one of the most promising youngsters we have ever had at Southampton.