Clasie or Hojbjerg?

You'd have to assume one of these two players is leaving. Clasie would be the more obvious candidate but it wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility for Hoj, his agent or Saints to decide the Premier League isn't really for him and ask for a move. It happened with Juanmi and a few others.

It'll be JC. He's the third one of the three I mentioned earlier today.

It'll be JC. He's the third one of the three I mentioned earlier today.

Well...

Cheers, mods you can lock this now.

G'night all!

Shame for Clasie but I think his times up. He never got regular gametime playing further forward than DM (where I think he is best suited). Whenever he did get closer to the opposition box he looked a lot better, including scoring a couple of goals from the edge of it.

It'll be JC. He's the third one of the three I mentioned earlier today.

It's a shame as I like him as a player, but perhaps he was never going to be a "Premier League style player".

Why does it have to be either of them that leave? It will depend on how many more players we sign, but surely the first players to make way are likely to be Gazzaniga (or possibly Taylor) and Florin Gardos. After those we might also loan out Gallagher. Surely Clasie is more likely to be picked than any of those three and certainly Gazzaniga and Gardos.

Shame for Clasie but I think his times up. He never got regular gametime playing further forward than DM (where I think he is best suited). Whenever he did get closer to the opposition box he looked a lot better, including scoring a couple of goals from the edge of it.

Yep poorly used by successive managers.

Shame if JC goes. Think there is a good player there somewhere...... just not for the EPL.

Why does it have to be either of them that leave? It will depend on how many more players we sign, but surely the first players to make way are likely to be Gazzaniga (or possibly Taylor) and Florin Gardos. After those we might also loan out Gallagher. Surely Clasie is more likely to be picked than any of those three and certainly Gazzaniga and Gardos.

We're not talking about squad numbers, we're talking about centre midfield numbers. For those two slots we now have Romeu, Lemina, Hojberg, JWP, Davis and Clasie. If you argue he can play further forward you still have JWP, Davis, Tadic, Boufal and Gabbiadini who might end up playing there.

JC is the obvious one which is a shame as he had a few good games last season then dropped. Classic Puel.

That said since signing, he hasn't really done enough overall and we are bloated in that area.

Hoj started so well but has really struggled since. Think we need to persevere with him but he needs to step up as he did when he came in.

Sorry, but I've tried hard to like Clasie, but apart from odd flashes he's always seemed too lightweight, yet lacks the stamina to finish a game strongly.

Wasn't too keen when we signed him, and I think he'd be best advised to go look outside of the English leagues.

Not that I'm exactly enthralled with Hojbjerg, but I'm hoping he'll start to show his early promise.

JC is the obvious one which is a shame as he had a few good games last season then dropped. Classic Puel.

"A few", that's a bit of an exaggeration isn't it. Two , at a push 3. He's done nothing to deserve a place under Puel or Koeman

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I rate JC, reckon he would do well in Italy/France- potentially even a Spanish side.

Just not suited for the physical side of things in the English game, and that fault isn't for his height as players such as Kante excel there, even Cazorla has played deep for Arsenal at certain times.

It'll be JC. He's the third one of the three I mentioned earlier today.

Any idea if a loan or permanent?

Always wanted him to do well. I was so excited when we signed him, but I always had concerned about how he'd fair physically in this league.

Jordy leaving basically gurantees PEH more game time as he'll cover both Romeu & Lemina. This might even open up a space for another academy player if we get short of numbers or in cup matches.

Shame, good player but not suited to the EPL

Does he want to leave, or does the club want him gone?

I prefer Hojbjerg so I REALLY hope he steps up this year... and learns to shoot! Much potential there.

Clasie has many positives, but seems to have struggled to really make his mark on a regular basis (Puel's fault?). Scored some good goals.

It'll be JC. He's the third one of the three I mentioned earlier today.

Ah that's good, no one key, and makes sense considering the competition there and he's not likely to get any better whereas Hojberg has potential.

I wonder if there is any chance we get back what we paid for Clasie. 8 million was quite significant at the time but in this inflated market..?

RC signed Jordy for us originally but there have been no rumours linking him to Everton which says it all. I think he will be the one to leave.

Good player who probably wasn't given a fair chance for us, however Hojbjerg has to have more potential and Clasie couldn't finish 90 minutes. Makes sense for him to go.

Clasie would be excellent in the Spanish or Italian leagues.

Premier League is just a bit too fast for him.

Hojbjerg really needs to step up this year.

Clasie would be excellent in the Spanish or Italian leagues.

 

Premier League is just a bit too fast for him.

 

Hojbjerg really needs to step up this year.

I think that judging by the pre season interviews etc that were on the club's website, that they have plans for PEH.

Weren't Lazio after JC earlier on? The days of their big spending seem way way behind them (at the turn of the century).

So far Clasie has been better for us than Højbjerg, and I like Clasie. But for the club it still seems to make more sense to keep Højbjerg.

How does this work? If we decide either or both are surplus to requirements what happens next as presumably they are under contract and we cannot breach contracts either after all the vD politicking? Does that mean we cannot put them up for sale unless they agree? Or do we just pay off their contracts in full and they are free agents? what if no clubs come in for them does that mean we must keep them?

Answers please from those who know how these things work...

I guess it works with a bit of honesty. You tell them that they have fallen down the pecking order and that playing time will most likely be limited and if they want to find a new club then they can, or they can stay and fight for a place but not expect to get one. They might even be left out of the 25 man squad, which is the real kiss of death.

As you say, they have a contract, and a contract is cast iron unless both parties agree on it. Koeman and Ross Barkley situation was wrong, or rather what Koeman said was 100% wrong. He said that unless he signs a new contract he will be sold. No, he will only be sold if he agrees that the contract can be broken. There is usually some pragmatism, as players don't want to sit on their hands. Of course there are exceptions - wasn't it Adebayor who always (rightly or wrongly) seemed to be criticised by Spurs for just sitting out his rather generous contract?

In the old days didn't clubs just put players surplus to requirements on a transfer list to give notice they were open to selling if anyone was interested?

In the old days didn't clubs just put players surplus to requirements on a transfer list to give notice they were open to selling if anyone was interested?

There would presumably be an agreement to cancel the contract by mutual consent in return for a free transfer. The other alternative, I suppose, would be to pay off the contract and release as a free agent, but that's unlikely.

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In the old days didn't clubs just put players surplus to requirements on a transfer list to give notice they were open to selling if anyone was interested?

The transfer list! I'd forgotten about that ... wonder if it still a thing or not? I guess agents have stepped in more now - as a player you're probably told if you're in the plans for the season or not and if not, your agent touts you around?

The transfer list! I'd forgotten about that ... wonder if it still a thing or not? I guess agents have stepped in more now - as a player you're probably told if you're in the plans for the season or not and if not, your agent touts you around?

I wonder if even if you are told if you are in or out for the season that stops Agents touting you about...

Interestingly when Leicester signed Kante is was a toss up between him and JC. It just goes to show how difficult it is to predict potential in the recruitment process.

I wonder if even if you are told if you are in or out for the season that stops Agents touting you about...

Clasie has never really worked. Seems an odd thing to say but he just seems to small ! Doesn't have the presence to make an impact. That said, PEH hasn't shown me anything to convince me he's going to make it either. Looks ok, but I don't see what his strengths are.

Needs to deliver this year or he'll be off next summer too.

Sorry, but I've tried hard to like Clasie, but apart from odd flashes he's always seemed too lightweight, yet lacks the stamina to finish a game strongly.

 

Wasn't too keen when we signed him, and I think he'd be best advised to go look outside of the English leagues.

 

Not that I'm exactly enthralled with Hojbjerg, but I'm hoping he'll start to show his early promise.

could not have put it better. Our failure to genuinely compete in games against the top sides is down to very average players in midfield such as Clasie. We must find better if we are to get back to the great days of Morgan and Wanyama dominating a midfield area/game.

Hoj needs to pass to someone in the same team before he is of any use to us.

Clasie is a constant 6/10, who occasionally has flashes of something better. He rarely does anything badly wrong, he's consistent, but rarely looks superb.

Hojbjerg is a 4/10 one game and an 8/10 in the next. He's shown how good and how talented he is in flashes, he now needs to find consistency.

Given we're not short of central midfielders, I'd let Clasie go and hope Hojbjerg achieves what he is capable of.

No transfer list nowadays. Agent will just be told that we're open to offers, given a ball park figure & the agent touts him around

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I'd prefer to keep Clasie over Hojbjerg

I'd prefer to keep Clasie over Hojbjerg

Why? It's difficult to compare the two, but I am the other way around. The first couple of games that PEH played he looked clever and a real prospect. And then it went Pete Tong. Why was that? Was it CP's doing? Was it PEH's and he isn't that good?

We're not talking about squad numbers, we're talking about centre midfield numbers. For those two slots we now have Romeu, Lemina, Hojberg, JWP, Davis and Clasie. If you argue he can play further forward you still have JWP, Davis, Tadic, Boufal and Gabbiadini who might end up playing there.

If you want to include all midfield and attacking players then for completeness you need to also include at least Redmond, Austin, Sims, Long and Gallagher and you need to talk about seven different positions:

Defensive midfield

Box-to-Box

Attacking midfield

Right Wing

Left Wing

Striker

Second striker ('in the hole')

Alternatively, lets remove Gabbiadini, Tadic and Boufal from the reckoning and just look out the straight-forward midfield positions (i.e. ignore wingers and strikers). That leaves the following players to fill three midfield positions:

Romeu, Lemina, Hojberg, JWP, Davis, Clasie, JWP, Davis - eight players for three tactical positions (or four if we were ever to pack the midfield and play two defensive midfielders and no wingers - though not advocating that particular set up!).

On the basis that we have sought to have 2 or 3 players for every position I wouldn't say we suddenly have far too many midfielders at all just because we have signed one more! A few days ago many of us were arguing that we look incredibly short in the defensive midfield positions if Romeu were to get injured with only Clasie as direct back-up (in the sense of being a defensive midfielder).

Compare it with the eight or so players in attacking positions, whether strikers, wingers or playing 'in the hole'. Or compare it with the ten players we have in defence (where many of us are also arguing we need to strengthen!):

Left Back: Bertrand, McQueen, Targett

Right Back: Cedric, Pied

Centre back: VVD, Yoshida, Stephens, Bednarek, Gardos

(NB You could of course also add in Flanagan, Jones and Wood, but equally you could add Valery and Hesketh as midfield options, so I am ignoring them for now - I don't it makes much difference)

My point is that whether or not we keep Clasie is actually more about whether there is scope in the squad numbering system and I am arguing that while we do need to shed at least one player from the current squad I believe Gardos is more likely to be that player than Clasie.

If you want to include all midfield and attacking players then for completeness you need to also include at least Redmond, Austin, Sims, Long and Gallagher and you need to talk about seven different positions:

 

Defensive midfield

Box-to-Box

Attacking midfield

Right Wing

Left Wing

Striker

Second striker ('in the hole')

 

Alternatively, lets remove Gabbiadini, Tadic and Boufal from the reckoning and just look out the straight-forward midfield positions (i.e. ignore wingers and strikers). That leaves the following players to fill three midfield positions:

 

Romeu, Lemina, Hojberg, JWP, Davis, Clasie, JWP, Davis - eight players for three tactical positions (or four if we were ever to pack the midfield and play two defensive midfielders and no wingers - though not advocating that particular set up!).

 

On the basis that we have sought to have 2 or 3 players for every position I wouldn't say we suddenly have far too many midfielders at all just because we have signed one more! A few days ago many of us were arguing that we look incredibly short in the defensive midfield positions if Romeu were to get injured with only Clasie as direct back-up (in the sense of being a defensive midfielder).

 

Compare it with the eight or so players in attacking positions, whether strikers, wingers or playing 'in the hole'. Or compare it with the ten players we have in defence (where many of us are also arguing we need to strengthen!):

 

Left Back: Bertrand, McQueen, Targett

Right Back: Cedric, Pied

Centre back: VVD, Yoshida, Stephens, Bednarek, Gardos

 

(NB You could of course also add in Flanagan, Jones and Wood, but equally you could add Valery and Hesketh as midfield options, so I am ignoring them for now - I don't it makes much difference)

 

My point is that whether or not we keep Clasie is actually more about whether there is scope in the squad numbering system and I am arguing that while we do need to shed at least one player from the current squad I believe Gardos is more likely to be that player than Clasie.

Oops! Actually of course since we don't have two lots of two players called Davis and Ward-Prowse it is only six players - which only serves to strengthen mny argument that we are not overloaded in midfield! LOL

I would not be surprised of Clasie leaves before the window shuts. I think the arrival of Lemina will signal the end for one of our midfielders. I think Clasie is the most obvious contender.

I did also notice that he appears to have made exactly 49 appearances for us to date (in all competitions, including starts and as a sub). Perhaps another add-on is payable if he plays another game for us? Therefore another reason why selling him now (if there are any suitors out there) might be advantageous.

Is either going to get on the subs bench in the league anytime soon?

Any news on Højbjerg? What's going on with him?

Any news on Højbjerg? What's going on with him?

If he's not injured, then he's fallen massively out of favour.

Both in the training video that was just released.

Both in the training video that was just released.

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Both in the training video that was just released.

tbf they were both in the Wolves training vid too.

Who is tall peroxide blonde young lad in that video

Looks like Christoph Klarer.

tbf they were both in the Wolves training vid too.

We know Clasie is off... its Hojbjerg's absence that puzzles me.

We know Clasie is off... its Hojbjerg's absence that puzzles me.

Yeah, ditto.

In a positive note, Lemina looked pretty impressive in those short seconds!