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Thread: Puel 0-0 Pellegrino reactions

  1. #1

    Default Puel 0-0 Pellegrino reactions

    Yes we played with a higher tempo and resulted in more chances but how on Earth is missing seven or eight chances somehow better than missing two chances?!
    Last edited by Instant Classic; 12-08-2017 at 04:21 PM.

  2. #2

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    Tadic - 16 goals in last 122 games
    Redmond - 21 goals in last 174 games
    Boufal - 2 goals in 26 saints games
    JWP - 8 goals in 173 games
    Davis - 11 goals in 196 saints games

    It's not our manager.
    It's not our playstyle.
    This is our problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultimatt View Post
    Tadic - 16 goals in last 122 games
    Redmond - 21 goals in last 174 games
    Boufal - 2 goals in 26 saints games
    JWP - 8 goals in 173 games
    Davis - 11 goals in 196 saints games

    It's not our manager.
    It's not our playstyle.
    This is our problem.
    Exactly.

    Turn up with the same eleven players, you're going to get roughly the same results.

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    Where's Gabbi's stats in there?

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    This is why we need to find a formation that gets both Gabbi and Austin on the pitch together. We just don't have enough other scoring.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by striker View Post
    This is why we need to find a formation that gets both Gabbi and Austin on the pitch together. We just don't have enough other scoring.
    That isn't the answer. We got worse when Austin came on.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by striker View Post
    This is why we need to find a formation that gets both Gabbi and Austin on the pitch together. We just don't have enough other scoring.
    We lose our mobility in attack with Austin on, it's sad to say. Not entirely sure he's a fit for us.

    That team today will get goals, I'm filing today in the 'one of those days' category as opposed to anything being wrong. If we play like we did today for the next 37 games, we will have a storming season.

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    Same players & we play too much in front of the opposition defence at home. You need someone with pace & trickery to cause panic or open up a defence. Mane had both in bundles & spread terror with his unpredictability. I'm not sure Boufal or Redmond quite cause the same level of panic and, therefore, opportunity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan Katalinic's 'tache View Post
    Same players & we play too much in front of the opposition defence at home. You need someone with pace & trickery to cause panic or open up a defence. Mane had both in bundles & spread terror with his unpredictability. I'm not sure Boufal or Redmond quite cause the same level of panic and, therefore, opportunity.
    I thought Boufal played well when he came on. Much more disciplined in possession and excellent control. Would start him over Redmond who I thought was the weak link up top today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan Katalinic's 'tache View Post
    Same players & we play too much in front of the opposition defence at home. You need someone with pace & trickery to cause panic or open up a defence. Mane had both in bundles & spread terror with his unpredictability. I'm not sure Boufal or Redmond quite cause the same level of panic and, therefore, opportunity.
    To be fair, we got in behind them and down the sides of them on numerous occasions today with Tadic's tricky and Redmonds pace. Redmond is frustrating though, you just feel there's more to come from him. I like the little cameo from Boufal, big season for him I feel and he can certainly be the player who worries the opposition. He was noticeably tracking back a hell of a lot in his short time on as well, looked a lot stronger in his ability to hold off defenders.

  11. #11

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    Yes, I thought Boufal was much better when he came on. Tracked back & won the ball too. Hopefully he'll assert himself on games in time. It was better today though, certainly more purpose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-Clarke View Post
    To be fair, we got in behind them and down the sides of them on numerous occasions today with Tadic's tricky and Redmonds pace. Redmond is frustrating though, you just feel there's more to come from him. I like the little cameo from Boufal, big season for him I feel and he can certainly be the player who worries the opposition. He was noticeably tracking back a hell of a lot in his short time on as well, looked a lot stronger in his ability to hold off defenders.
    Redmond is a bit lazy with his distribution I think. There were a number of times he got into good positions and then over hit a cross or under/over hit a pass. There was one in particular where he absolutely fired a pass at Cedric and we lost possession because Cedric couldn't control it. Strikes me as a lack of concentration as he does have the ability but is incredibly inconsistent even when it comes to doing the simple stuff.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Redmond is a bit lazy with his distribution I think. There were a number of times he got into good positions and then over hit a cross or under/over hit a pass. There was one in particular where he absolutely fired a pass at Cedric and we lost possession because Cedric couldn't control it. Strikes me as a lack of concentration as he does have the ability but is incredibly inconsistent even when it comes to doing the simple stuff.
    Yep, although I thought the problem was more that it was behind Cedric, so the whole move slowed down and they got numbers back.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Redmond is a bit lazy with his distribution I think. There were a number of times he got into good positions and then over hit a cross or under/over hit a pass. There was one in particular where he absolutely fired a pass at Cedric and we lost possession because Cedric couldn't control it. Strikes me as a lack of concentration as he does have the ability but is incredibly inconsistent even when it comes to doing the simple stuff.
    Absolutely correct.

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    I don't understand what's happened to Gabbi. When he first started with us, he was electric. Now he's trying to play the same way but end result is just a trickle across the goal mouth or a shot that's well wide.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusic View Post
    That isn't the answer. We got worse when Austin came on.
    no we didn't most of our attacking play throughout the game was in front of a wall Swansea players we rarely managed to get in behind them to any effect all game.
    Last edited by doddisalegend; 12-08-2017 at 08:13 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    no we didn't most of our attacking play throughout the game was in front of a wall Swansea players we rarely managed to get in behind them to an effect all game.
    Don't agree with that. We got in behind them plenty of times in the first half.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I thought Boufal played well when he came on. Much more disciplined in possession and excellent control. Would start him over Redmond who I thought was the weak link up top today.
    yeah but Boufal was playing in behind the striker rather than on the wing I'd play him there instead of JWP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Dad View Post
    I don't understand what's happened to Gabbi. When he first started with us, he was electric. Now he's trying to play the same way but end result is just a trickle across the goal mouth or a shot that's well wide.
    I think all of the attacking players have a monkey on their back after last year. Gabbi has been snatching a bit at chances. He's got quality and will come good I'm sure.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultimatt View Post
    Tadic - 16 goals in last 122 games
    Redmond - 21 goals in last 174 games
    Boufal - 2 goals in 26 saints games
    JWP - 8 goals in 173 games
    Davis - 11 goals in 196 saints games

    It's not our manager.
    It's not our playstyle.
    This is our problem.

    Little bit harsh on Boufal there IMO, I mean how many minutes are those games and how many of those games was he actually match fit and up to speed. Given game time he'll score some goals, he is the most likely of that lot to score IMO.

    Plus JWP is improving his goalscoring, 50% of his total goals came last season so hopefully he'll kick on.

    One of our mifielders needs to get to like 9-11 goals this year in the league, with hopefully one of the strikers scoring 15 plus, then everyone else chips in.

    The team was just a bit unlucky today IMO, I'd rather see us creating than not creating, the goals will come.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Don't agree with that. We got in behind them plenty of times in the first half.
    Not to any great effect maybe twice that really counted and both those were low cutbacks from the by-line. Far to often we get it wide then bang a high hanging cross into a box full Swansea players and one saints player. Given that physically we are quite a small squad I just don't see how endless high crosses from out wide are playing to our strengths.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    Not to any great effect maybe twice that really counted and both those were low cutbacks from the by-line. Far to often we get it wide then bang a high hanging cross into a box full Swansea players and one saints player. Given that physically we are quite a small squad I just don't see how endless high crosses from out wide are playing to our strengths.
    I do agree about the high crosses, we don't have anyone to head them in. A couple fell to JWP in the first half and it was just embarrassing.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Dad View Post
    I don't understand what's happened to Gabbi. When he first started with us, he was electric. Now he's trying to play the same way but end result is just a trickle across the goal mouth or a shot that's well wide.
    I thought Gabbi was one of our better players today tbh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Instant Classic View Post
    I thought Gabbi was one of our better players today tbh.
    I didn't really understand the straight swap of Gabbi and Austin. Would have thought we'd have done well to take off JWP and have Gabbi as one of the three behind Austin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I think all of the attacking players have a monkey on their back after last year. Gabbi has been snatching a bit at chances. He's got quality and will come good I'm sure.
    Maybe you are right. The game seemed to lose a bit of tempo half way through the second half, Swansea players included. I guess what you are saying is that it's the first game of the season and not an indication of how things will go for the rest of the season. There's been some surprizes in other games too!

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-Clarke View Post
    We lose our mobility in attack with Austin on, it's sad to say. Not entirely sure he's a fit for us.

    That team today will get goals, I'm filing today in the 'one of those days' category as opposed to anything being wrong. If we play like we did today for the next 37 games, we will have a storming season.
    but we won't play like that all season - if we played how we did against burnley at home last year for the whole season, we'd have won the league.

    the team is proven to not have enough goalscorers in it, as op points out. throw in that Cedric never scores for an attacking full back and that we aren't much of a threat from set plays, we're asking a hell of a lot from Gabbiadini on his own.

    obviously I think we'll be find position wise this season but there's a reason we didn't score many last year and it categorically was not Claude Puel

  27. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beckenham Saint View Post
    but we won't play like that all season - if we played how we did against burnley at home last year for the whole season, we'd have won the league.

    the team is proven to not have enough goalscorers in it, as op points out. throw in that Cedric never scores for an attacking full back and that we aren't much of a threat from set plays, we're asking a hell of a lot from Gabbiadini on his own.

    obviously I think we'll be find position wise this season but there's a reason we didn't score many last year and it categorically was not Claude Puel
    I didn't see any reduction in play with Austin on for the last 25 minutes. However thats not what I meant, I don't advocate pulling Gabbi for Austin. I guess I am thinking about a 4-4-2, or a 4-3-3 setup where they both play. If we go 3 upfront, then Gabbi, Redmond, and Austin (for example) play. I don't think this would slow down our play and gets our best scorers on the pitch. It may leave us more vulnerable at midfield, but maybe Redmond can drop a little in the middle so its closer to a 4-4-2. Just spitballing here, but after watching the same thing last year also I think more tweaking is needed.

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    Lads, go take a pint and chill, the goals will come. It was not Puel written all over this game besides the 0-0. I'm excited for the new season.

  29. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultimatt View Post
    Tadic - 16 goals in last 122 games
    Redmond - 21 goals in last 174 games
    Boufal - 2 goals in 26 saints games
    JWP - 8 goals in 173 games
    Davis - 11 goals in 196 saints games

    It's not our manager.
    It's not our playstyle.
    This is our problem.
    As I said a couple of weeks ago, they're all average players. I'd gladly see 4 of them replaced with 1 quality addition.

  30. #30

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    The 6th home league game in a row without a goal, virtually the same players. Putting Redmond, Tadic and JWP with one striker is virtually certain to result in no goals unless a defender gets one. 60% possession with 29 shots, 2 on target, that is absolute rubbish. Several times the ball went across the goal area but none of the forwards had anticipated and made a run just ball watching. It is a fact, only Gabbiadini, Austin and Long will get on the end of things, JWP, Redmond, Tadic, Boufal, Davis do not have goal scoring instincts, they will get the odd goal but that is their limit, it doesn't matter how often they get into the box or shoot they will not get goals regularly.

    It is no good the manager going with this he has to come up with something different to make better use of those players that can get goals.
    Last edited by derry; 12-08-2017 at 08:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    no we didn't most of our attacking play throughout the game was in front of a wall Swansea players we rarely managed to get in behind them to an effect all game.
    We got behind them many times actually, just couldn't do anything with it when we did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VectisSaint View Post
    We got behind them many times actually, just couldn't do anything with it when we did.
    so like I said we didn't get behind them to any effect...

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    Exactly the same as last season.


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  34. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by derry View Post
    The 6th home league game in a row without a goal, virtually the same players. Putting Redmond, Tadic and JWP with one striker is virtually certain to result in no goals unless a defender gets one. 60% possession with 29 shots, 2 on target, that is absolute rubbish. Several times the ball went across the goal area but none of the forwards had anticipated and made a run just ball watching. It is a fact, only Gabbiadini, Austin and Long will get on the end of things, JWP, Redmond, Tadic, Boufal, Davis do not have goal scoring instincts, they will get the odd goal but that is their limit, it doesn't matter how often they get into the box or shoot they will not get goals regularly.

    It is no good the manager going with this he has to come up with something different to make better use of those players that can get goals.
    Long hasn't shown this much over his career.

  35. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Exactly the same as last season.


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    No was better than last season we had a go.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Instant Classic View Post
    I thought Gabbi was one of our better players today tbh.
    Really? I thought the poor guy had a stinker. Those two 'shots' in the second half were so unlike his previous accuracy. We know he can do so much better.

    I'd be genuinely interested to know what I missed about his play today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Exactly the same as last season.


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    It really wasn't.

  38. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    It really wasn't.
    Of course not. 0-0 against an incredibly poor side, keep trying to convince yourselves. The penny will drop in about a month

  39. #39

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    I didn't see much different to our 1st 6-7 games last season.plenty of good possession,plenty of good chances ,**** poor final product.we'll do fine this season just like last.Swansea were terrible could be a long hard season for them.

  40. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Of course not. 0-0 against an incredibly poor side, keep trying to convince yourselves. The penny will drop in about a month
    Or you'll eventually accept that Puel is gone

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    We will settle down with Romeu and Lamina holding, then either Tadic or Redmond, and any two from Davis, Boufal and JWP.

    That's a pretty good midfield imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Instant Classic View Post
    Yes we played with a higher tempo and resulted in more chances but how on Earth is missing seven or eight chances somehow better than missing two chances?!
    This calls for a rigorous application of Bayes theorem.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bayes-Theor...=bayes+theorem

  43. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Of course not. 0-0 against an incredibly poor side, keep trying to convince yourselves. The penny will drop in about a month
    Of course Puels biggest fan thinks that way. I guess some of the hardcore Puels fans wants Pellegrino to fail just to prove it wasn't about Puel. Thats why we after one game see stupid thread headlines like this.
    Last edited by saintadam; 13-08-2017 at 09:45 AM. Reason: spelling

  44. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by saintadam View Post
    Of course Puels biggest fan thinks that way. I guess some of the hardcore Puels fans wants Pellegrino to fail just to prove it wasn't about Puel. Thats why we after one game see stupid thread headlines like this.
    Has nothing to do with the manager. We're saying the players are the problem. The 5 most advanced players behind the striker offer next to nothing goals wise.

    Pelle averaged 0.37 goals per game. Similar output to both Gabbi & Austin so that's fine.

    Mane averaged 0.33 goals per game(GPG).
    Tadic averages 0.13 GPG.
    Redmond averages 0.12 GPG.
    Boufal averages 0.08 GPG.
    Mane 0.33 GPG = Tadic+Redmond+Boufal 0.33 combined.

    Schneiderlin averaged 0.12 GPG in his 3 PL seasons with us.
    Davis averages 0.06 GPG.
    JWP averages 0.05 GPG.
    Schneiderlin 0.12 GPG > Davis+JWP 0.11 combined.

    Schneiderlin 0.12 + Mane 0.33 > Redmond/Tadic/Boufal/Davis/JWP 0.42 GPG combined.

    The stats don't lie. Our current players behind our lone striker are woeful at finding the net.

    The only creative linkup play we have is out wide when Bertrand/Cedric make overlapping runs. That's not great since at best it creates a cross to a team without a target man (Pelle gone). We have no creative linkup inside or on the top of the box. Guardiola couldn't get these players scoring prolifically.

  45. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Exactly the same as last season.


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    Agreed. Exactly the same, just alot different.

  46. #46

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    Well for reference here are the top 20 goal scoring midfielders in the prem last season. Redmond is tied 13th on 7.

    1. Dele Alli Tottenham Hotspur 18
    2. Eden Hazard Chelsea 16
    3. Son Heung-Min Tottenham Hotspur 14
    4. Philippe Coutinho Liverpool 13
    4. Sadio Mané Liverpool 13
    6. Michail Antonio West Ham United 9
    6. Gylfi Sigurdsson Swansea City 9
    8. Willian Chelsea 8
    8. Christian Eriksen Tottenham Hotspur 8
    8. Adam Lallana Liverpool 8
    8. Manuel Lanzini West Ham United 8
    8. Mesut Özil Arsenal 8
    13. Etienne Capoue Watford 7
    13. Nathan Redmond Southampton 7
    13. Robert Snodgrass West Ham United 7
    13. Junior Stanislas AFC Bournemouth 7
    13. Wilfried Zaha Crystal Palace 7
    18. Joe Allen Stoke 6
    18. Kevin De Bruyne Manchester City 6
    18. Leroy Fer Swansea City 6

    Anyone thinking we can easily get a midfielder who can score 10+ a season just needs to look at the names above to see how likely that is. Most will be at big clubs already and the ones that aren't such as Gylfi now have an asking price of Ł50m which I can't see us paying. We found a gem in Mane and he was snatched up by a bigger club in no time and it would be foolish to assume we can easily find another little-known player like him so easily.

    Yes we do need our midfielders to contribute more goals but i'm hopeful a change in playing style will help with that rather than needing to completely revamp the midfield.

  47. #47

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    Following the sale of our 2 top goal scorers and best strikers, Mane and Pelle, and their replacement with Redmond, Puel did exceptionally well to get us to 8th place and a cup final. The loss of our 2 best central defenders, Fonte and van Dijk, and their replacement with Bednarek, will mean Pellegrino will have to perform miracles to do as well as Puel. The squad has been progressively stripped of its best players over the last 2 years and the replacements Ross Wilson and Les Reed have come up with haven't been up to the same standard. Good luck, Pellegrino. I hope you can perform miracles with the very limited resources at your disposal. If you fail, you'll be the scapegoat, but the fault won't lie with you.

  48. #48

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    Redmond slows the attack down. He always runs down blind alleys then plays it back into midfield by which time all the defenders are facing the right way leaving us with 2 banks of 4 in front of us. Very frustrating and not very entertaining
    An improvement in last season whereas I didn't spend the entire 90mins on my seat, but not much of one.
    You nee defenders running towards their own goal.

  49. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    yeah but Boufal was playing in behind the striker rather than on the wing I'd play him there instead of JWP.
    Agree with that. Thought he played well. Looks a bit stronger now. I would play him in front of JWP all day long.

  50. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Duckhunter View Post
    Of course not. 0-0 against an incredibly poor side, keep trying to convince yourselves. The penny will drop in about a month
    Were you at the game?

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