Saints 0 Wolves 2 (Carabao Cup)

We should have sold Tadic in the summer. He moans at everyone & takes zero responsibility for his own mistakes. Cant understand why both Hojberg & Clasie weren't playing. All well & good going on about Davis & how much we missed him, but not sure how much he would have done in a different formation.

I think some people are forgetting it was wolves RESERVES!!!!!

Shameful really.

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Were you there? Don't suppose it matters really as your view of JWP is set. I guess you just copy and paste this comment after every game.

 

JWP worked hard, was always available, looking for the ball forward which was rarely on because of lack of movement. He fed the wings time and time again.

 

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I am a consistent supporter of the last five managers, and was not in the Puel out camp. These are very early days for the manager and it will take a few weeks to form any real judgement. However...

...the second half against Wet Spam and last night were seriously worrying. We went backwards against ten men, were fortunate to get out of jail in stoppage time and last night was awful. I didn't blame MP for the changes, which were fewer than Wolves made, or the ambition to try a different formation against a side we should comfortably beat. However the lack of interventions and urgency just after halftime when we started the second half in awful mode is a concern to me. It was obvious we were losing control of the game to Wolves and to leave the big changes until the last 15 mins or so when we changed personnel and formation was poor.

With no European football and playing once a week until Xmas I expect significant improvement as a result of his uninterrupted coaching during the weeks ahead. He has a significantly easier hand of cards to play than poor Claude did last year. Am making the trip up north Saturday and let's hope we are all smiling afterwards because that was a horror show last night if you were there.

Pellegrino seems like the sort of guy who can connect with the players. If so I really hope he can cajole the likes of Boufal and Tadic to apply themselves differently/better than they are currently.

It beggars belief that footballers are so unimpressionable that they wouldn't listen to or take on board any advice or instruction. Surely they want to be better?

I guess there's a reason phrases about leopards and spots, and old dogs and tricks exist, but I can live in hope!

Puel did wonders with a squad that had 30+ plus goals ripped from it. I will back the new man as we need him to succeed, but he has to start getting something out of this average squad

Look stupid? Come on, after over a decade it's pretty clear he IS incredibly stupid. Some people have blissful ignorance, the alpinesque daily mail style ignorance is woe and fear type is far more common.

Alpine is just as entitled to an opinion as you are. He doesn't agree with what my agenda is, therefore he is a idiot, is not very democratic. I think Reed should be sacked immediately.My opinion.

In your opinion (as I know you can't give any ITK info until after Sept 1st), do you think the VVD situation is affecting the players and hence this result?

Put the result to one side because any side can lose a game, but last night was up there with one of the worst performances I've seen for a few years. Slow, ponderous, lack of intensity, lack of interest. I was bored watching it. I don't think one player came away with any credit not even Romeu. My mind is now made up on Boufal; he's never going to be the player we all hoped he would be. Before he got taken off, I commented that he looked like he was trying to get himself subbed off. He kept giving the ball away like he was doing it deliberately.

 

To further dampen my mood, I was told of two players we are interested in signing before the window closes (will be one or the the other not both). Both are black box, Hojbjerg/Bednarek, hidden gem types. Might be useful in time but definitely not the proven attacking/creative impact player we desperately need. Vietto not going to happen apparently.

Puel did wonders with a squad that had 30+ plus goals ripped from it. I will back the new man as we need him to succeed, but he has to start getting something out of this average squad

you've put your finger on it there, average, that's what we are, average manager, average players signed for average prices.

If you want the best you have to pay for it and or pay to keep it and we don't do that.

you've put your finger on it there, average, that's what we are, average manager, average players signed for average prices.

If you want the best you have to pay for it and or pay to keep it and we don't do that.

We are, absolutely just average. We will have bad days like yesterday and we will have good days. We are average middle of the table Premier League. Nothing wrong with that, it beats battling relegation year after year BUT the club keep selling us this vision of pushing on and breaking regularly into Europe. It's not going to happen unless we buy one or two high quality established players to go along with a Hoedt, Lemina, Gabbiadini. Every successful team has to have a mix. We mix promising with average, we should mix promising with proven and established but we won't pay the transfer fees for that or the salaries.

The club want to be self sustaining, again that's fine and when the balloon bursts the club will be one of the healthiest around financially.

But please don't be surprised when VVD, Bertrand, Cedric and before them Mane, Wanyama, Lallana etc want to move on to being better than average and earning more money.

We have been spoilt in recent seasons, we punched above our weight. I think finishing 7th/8th is beyond us currently.

Put the result to one side because any side can lose a game, but last night was up there with one of the worst performances I've seen for a few years. Slow, ponderous, lack of intensity, lack of interest. I was bored watching it. I don't think one player came away with any credit not even Romeu. My mind is now made up on Boufal; he's never going to be the player we all hoped he would be. Before he got taken off, I commented that he looked like he was trying to get himself subbed off. He kept giving the ball away like he was doing it deliberately.

 

To further dampen my mood, I was told of two players we are interested in signing before the window closes (will be one or the the other not both). Both are black box, Hojbjerg/Bednarek, hidden gem types. Might be useful in time but definitely not the proven attacking/creative impact player we desperately need. Vietto not going to happen apparently.

I know what you mean about Boufal, and he's very frustrating to watch. But he's never had a proper run in the side. Maybe in training he doesn't look like he deserves one, but you don't know until you try. Seeing as we invested nearly 20 million in him, I'd be inclined to put an arm around his shoulder, tell him he's starting the next four games (instead of Tadic would be my preference), and that this is his big chance.

If he fails, or if he's never given that chance, then it's another pretty damning indictment of our Black Box marquee signings. Over the years... Osvaldo, Ramirez, Boufal... only Gabbi looks like he's going to be worth the money we paid. We got more success from players we spent a bit less on - Pelle, Mane etc... which just goes to show that money isn't everything. SO maybe one of the hidden gems you've been told about will come up trumps.

I wish the black box could find a right back thats a decent size , can overlap and cross for when Cedric isnt playing.

Martina and Pied are what we paid cheap poor quality there has to be better even in Championship .

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Last night sounds like it was a disgraceful performance and a carry over from the 2nd half against 10 man West ham where we were abysmal....slow, ponderous and no cutting edge at all.

As ever, our players struggle to find the back of the net.

Without being there it sounds like we were yet again slow with very little movement and the managers tactics were horrifically wrong. This - for me - is the most worrying thing. he needed to change things earlier against West ham and out-thought himself last night by playing 3 at the back at home against a young Wolves side. Why not go for it and play attacking, fast paced football?

Not really seen much so far to suggest he is an upgrade on Puel although early days. yes, we may play slightly more attacking football but the defending is comical and lack of movement/pace and finishing is about the same. Puel's tactics were far better than Pellegrinos too.

I know what you mean about Boufal, and he's very frustrating to watch. But he's never had a proper run in the side. Maybe in training he doesn't look like he deserves one, but you don't know until you try. Seeing as we invested nearly 20 million in him, I'd be inclined to put an arm around his shoulder, tell him he's starting the next four games (instead of Tadic would be my preference), and that this is his big chance.

 

If he fails, or if he's never given that chance, then it's another pretty damning indictment of our Black Box marquee signings. Over the years... Osvaldo, Ramirez, Boufal... only Gabbi looks like he's going to be worth the money we paid. We got more success from players we spent a bit less on - Pelle, Mane etc... which just goes to show that money isn't everything. SO maybe one of the hidden gems you've been told about will come up trumps.

Couldn't agree more. He needs a run of games. 70/75 minutes in a semi-2nd string side playing badly and in a strange formation, doesn't give a fair representation of the boy.

Last night sounds like it was a disgraceful performance and a carry over from the 2nd half against 10 man West ham where we were abysmal....slow, ponderous and no cutting edge at all.

 

As ever, our players struggle to find the back of the net.

 

Without being there it sounds like we were yet again slow with very little movement and the managers tactics were horrifically wrong. This - for me - is the most worrying thing. he needed to change things earlier against West ham and out-thought himself last night by playing 3 at the back at home against a young Wolves side. Why not go for it and play attacking, fast paced football?

 

Not really seen much so far to suggest he is an upgrade on Puel although early days. yes, we may play slightly more attacking football but the defending is comical and lack of movement/pace and finishing is about the same. Puel's tactics were far better than Pellegrinos too.

No chance of that with an attacking quartet of Tadic, Austin, JWP and Boufal the Wolves defenders grew in confidence when they realised they they had the beating of all our main attacking threats in a foot race to the ball the only player that posed a danger was Boufal but it didn't take the opposition long to realise that he would eventual lose the ball trying one trick to many and fall over his own feet.

I know what you mean about Boufal, and he's very frustrating to watch. But he's never had a proper run in the side. Maybe in training he doesn't look like he deserves one, but you don't know until you try. Seeing as we invested nearly 20 million in him, I'd be inclined to put an arm around his shoulder, tell him he's starting the next four games (instead of Tadic would be my preference), and that this is his big chance.

 

If he fails, or if he's never given that chance, then it's another pretty damning indictment of our Black Box marquee signings. Over the years... Osvaldo, Ramirez, Boufal... only Gabbi looks like he's going to be worth the money we paid. We got more success from players we spent a bit less on - Pelle, Mane etc... which just goes to show that money isn't everything. SO maybe one of the hidden gems you've been told about will come up trumps.

Spot on - The boy clearly has talent and to me it just looks like he's almost trying to hard to impress, which is probably due to a lack in confidence. There's still time for him, he's a young lad and he's adjusting to a new country.

I have every faith that he will come up trumps, given the right management (time for you to earn your ££'s MP).

FWIW, from what I've been told he's generally well liked in the dressing room - he's a bit of a joker.

I know what you mean about Boufal, and he's very frustrating to watch. But he's never had a proper run in the side. Maybe in training he doesn't look like he deserves one, but you don't know until you try. Seeing as we invested nearly 20 million in him, I'd be inclined to put an arm around his shoulder, tell him he's starting the next four games (instead of Tadic would be my preference), and that this is his big chance.

 

If he fails, or if he's never given that chance, then it's another pretty damning indictment of our Black Box marquee signings. Over the years... Osvaldo, Ramirez, Boufal... only Gabbi looks like he's going to be worth the money we paid. We got more success from players we spent a bit less on - Pelle, Mane etc... which just goes to show that money isn't everything. SO maybe one of the hidden gems you've been told about will come up trumps.

Yep, same. By the same token I'd also be taking Tadic to one side and tell him that I want him to be a key cog in the team, that he is to be the main creator etc, but that he needs to start showing that he wants to be that person. Give him a few games off to assess games, making an impact later in the match as a sub if we need to break a team down. See how he responds to that. I accept Tadic being inconsistent, that one week he is unplayable and the next he's ineffective, but it has to be better than a 20 minute spell every 4 games.

Yep, same. By the same token I'd also be taking Tadic to one side and tell him that I want him to be a key cog in the team, that he is to be the main creator etc, but that he needs to start showing that he wants to be that person. Give him a few games off to assess games, making an impact later in the match as a sub if we need to break a team down. See how he responds to that. I accept Tadic being inconsistent, that one week he is unplayable and the next he's ineffective, but it has to be better than a 20 minute spell every 4 games.

It wouldn't go down well, he's not that sort of person.

Yep, same. By the same token I'd also be taking Tadic to one side and tell him that I want him to be a key cog in the team, that he is to be the main creator etc, but that he needs to start showing that he wants to be that person. Give him a few games off to assess games, making an impact later in the match as a sub if we need to break a team down. See how he responds to that. I accept Tadic being inconsistent, that one week he is unplayable and the next he's ineffective, but it has to be better than a 20 minute spell every 4 games.

Go all 'Arry?

There is a lot of talk about individuals here.... I we missing the main point thought though...?

Apart from Forster who is really not good enough the rest of the team, though not world beaters are suffering from poor coaching. The players are not supporting the man on the ball. In fact quite the opposite ....All we see is misplaced passes because there is no one to pass to.... It's nothing to do with tactics or formations it's to do with players making themselves available to be passed to. It's basics but the players are hiding and the coaches are letting them get away with it!

This has been a common theme from the first friendly this season...

Christ even Wolves B Team managed it! Lacking in basics is not acceptable, the buck stops at the Managers door on this one, average players or not!

We are, absolutely just average. We will have bad days like yesterday and we will have good days. We are average middle of the table Premier League. Nothing wrong with that, it beats battling relegation year after year BUT the club keep selling us this vision of pushing on and breaking regularly into Europe. It's not going to happen unless we buy one or two high quality established players to go along with a Hoedt, Lemina, Gabbiadini. Every successful team has to have a mix. We mix promising with average, we should mix promising with proven and established but we won't pay the transfer fees for that or the salaries.

 

The club want to be self sustaining, again that's fine and when the balloon bursts the club will be one of the healthiest around financially.

 

But please don't be surprised when VVD, Bertrand, Cedric and before them Mane, Wanyama, Lallana etc want to move on to being better than average and earning more money.

 

We have been spoilt in recent seasons, we punched above our weight. I think finishing 7th/8th is beyond us currently.

Catch 22 though isn't it? Can you imagine the meltdown on here if the club issued a statement saying 'We don't have the financial clout to challenge the Top 6 or to push for Europe, so instead we're aiming for a consistent mid-table 9th-14th, not-to-get-relegated position. Anything else is an unexpected and unanticipated bonus so don't get your hopes up'. It might be realistic, but what sort of message would it send it out to both fans and potential signings??

Go all 'Arry?

If that what it takes! Failing that, I'd just tell him to "go out there and f**king run araand a bit!"

If that what it takes! Failing that, I'd just tell him to "go out there and f**king run araand a bit!"

Mike Reid?

Well, that was a shambles but entirely predictable. Last Saturday we saw what was needed Gabbiadini received a ball in his own half broke forward passed to Redmond and kept running, Redmond through ball and Gabbiadini finished. When did anyone ever see JWP, Tadic, Davis, Boufal, Clasie, Hojbjerg, Redmond or anyone else for that matter make a lung bursting run breaking the defensive lines. Never, pass it to death but none of them make the runs, pass, then stand and watch and wait for the ball to pass it again.

It's down to the management to change that. We cannot continue with the static three behind one striker taking so many passes that the whole opposition get between the ball and the goal. The three attackers behind the striker have to get out of their comfort zones and make those runs getting up in support of the striker and breaking into the penalty area. If the management don't get them doing that then we have to leave them out, because if the lone striker doesn't get a hat full of goals and the three won't then we are in deep trouble. The only way to change that is either to make the players change or change the players.

There were major management errors last night. Why the hell were we changing our way of playing to counter the reserve team of a Championship side. Why wasn't it changed as soon as it was obvious it was a cluster****. Why was Austin played as a lone striker, he is a goal area player with great anticipation and finish lacks the pace and mobility to play as an isolated striker in front of players intent on making more than 500 meaningless passes. Surely they know that by now. The only player we have that can play that role in isolation with the pace and strength to rough up the opposition is Long with Gabbiadini close to him. Personally I'd play all three because two of them will get goals and Long will sure as hell get more than the static so called attackers that are failing week in week out. I don't think they have it in them to change. We sure as hell can't keep playing the way we are.

Another thing, we keep playing players on their wrong side which makes them either come inside or check back and play the ball back. I know the idea is to open up the shot on their good foot but that doesn't work for us because none of them can hit a cow's arse with a banjo.

Mike Reid?

Just attempting to continue the 'Arry theme in text...! But Mike Reid, close enough.

On a side note, I hope we don't have a bad season with this kit... it looks bl00dy brilliant and don't want it to be soiled by terrible performances and underwhelming or disastrous results!

Well, that was a shambles but entirely predictable. Last Saturday we saw what was needed Gabbiadini received a ball in his own half broke forward passed to Redmond and kept running, Redmond through ball and Gabbiadini finished. When did anyone ever see JWP, Tadic, Davis, Boufal, Clasie, Hojbjerg, Redmond or anyone else for that matter make a lung bursting run breaking the defensive lines. Never, pass it to death but none of them make the runs, pass, then stand and watch and wait for the ball to pass it again.

 

It's down to the management to change that. We cannot continue with the static three behind one striker taking so many passes that the whole opposition get between the ball and the goal. The three attackers behind the striker have to get out of their comfort zones and make those runs getting up in support of the striker and breaking into the penalty area. If the management don't get them doing that then we have to leave them out, because if the lone striker doesn't get a hat full of goals and the three won't then we are in deep trouble. The only way to change that is either to make the players change or change the players.

 

There were major management errors last night. Why the hell were we changing our way of playing to counter the reserve team of a Championship side. Why wasn't it changed as soon as it was obvious it was a cluster****. Why was Austin played as a lone striker, he is a goal area player with great anticipation and finish lacks the pace and mobility to play as an isolated striker in front of players intent on making more than 500 meaningless passes. Surely they know that by now. The only player we have that can play that role in isolation with the pace and strength to rough up the opposition is Long with Gabbiadini close to him.

Another thing, we keep playing players on their wrong side which makes them either come inside or check back and play the ball back. I know the idea is to open up the shot on their good foot but that doesn't work for us because none of them can hit a cow's arse with a banjo.Personally I'd play all three because two of them will get goals and Long will sure as hell get more than the static so called attackers that are failing week in week out. I don't think they have it in them to change. We sure as hell can't keep playing the way we are.

Can't argue with that. I don't think Southampton has the players to play 4 lines; link-up is poor, there is no directness to the play and the opposition always has time to get organised in defence without the fear of the killer pass and run into a scoring area. Play 4-3-3, 4-4-2 or my preferred option (subject to LOTS of training, after last night's shambles) 3-4-3. Romeu often looks for a forward pass, Lemina appears to have the potential as a box-to-box player, we have decent players at full-back/wing back (I think Bertrand in particular is better as the latter, though he could make up one of a back three). Boufal seems to get bored after 60 minutes, I don't see him as anything other than an impact substitute. Redmond tries hard but, again, better to come on against tired legs. Anyone fancy organising a whip-round for Tadic's flight to Italy?

There is so much debate about who to play out of Tadic, Redmond and Boufal. I am with Derry in saying none of them!

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but I don't think we were very good last night.

I hope that people notice though that rather than just noise and usual negativity from the normal suspects there are a number of what I would call thoughtful posters who's views I respect that are unusually angry about a real shambles, with the coach in the dock after that. Not only is it one less cup final and European place up for grabs it will have a big impact on squad players who may now be brought in for a one off game after months of no first team football. We remember the damage that did to Maya a few years ago.....I haven't been seen pi**ed off after a Saints game for many years

I hope that people notice though that rather than just noise and usual negativity from the normal suspects there are a number of what I would call thoughtful posters who's views I respect that are unusually angry about a real shambles, with the coach in the dock after that. Not only is it one less cup final and European place up for grabs it will have a big impact on squad players who may now be brought in for a one off game after months of no first team football. We remember the damage that did to Maya a few years ago.....I haven't been seen pi**ed off after a Saints game for many years

There have been lots of worse games. I remember coming away from the Hapoel game despondent. Then you had Shef U in the quarters a few seasons back, Sunderland in the last 16. There have been plenty worse.

I hope that people notice though that rather than just noise and usual negativity from the normal suspects there are a number of what I would call thoughtful posters who's views I respect that are unusually angry about a real shambles, with the coach in the dock after that. Not only is it one less cup final and European place up for grabs it will have a big impact on squad players who may now be brought in for a one off game after months of no first team football. We remember the damage that did to Maya a few years ago.....I haven't been seen pi**ed off after a Saints game for many years

I was thinking there are a few posters that last season would have gone into an apocalyptic breakdown if the team had played like that but this season seem ok with it...

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but I don't think we were very good last night.

I agree but when were we last any good

I feel we have been poor since the League Cup Final

The manager usually gets the blame but the players most of whom are earning over a £million a year surely must take the responsibility we are pretty impotent when it comes to scoring goals

Put the result to one side because any side can lose a game, but last night was up there with one of the worst performances I've seen for a few years. Slow, ponderous, lack of intensity, lack of interest. I was bored watching it. I don't think one player came away with any credit not even Romeu. My mind is now made up on Boufal; he's never going to be the player we all hoped he would be. Before he got taken off, I commented that he looked like he was trying to get himself subbed off. He kept giving the ball away like he was doing it deliberately.

 

To further dampen my mood, I was told of two players we are interested in signing before the window closes (will be one or the the other not both). Both are black box, Hojbjerg/Bednarek, hidden gem types. Might be useful in time but definitely not the proven attacking/creative impact player we desperately need. Vietto not going to happen apparently.

Is that supposed to be sarcastic?!

What's happened to Hojbjerg? Is he out of favour with the boss?

Stop being so uptight and relax. But sarcasm is lost on some people, and feel offended by it. Case in point!

Lol wut? I'm relaxed. You're highly confused.

There have been lots of worse games. I remember coming away from the Hapoel game despondent. Then you had Shef U in the quarters a few seasons back, Sunderland in the last 16. There have been plenty worse.

I'd say last night was worse, to be honest.

I'd say last night was worse, to be honest.

Last night wasn't worse than Sheff Utd.

Prague was worse than last night too.

Prague, Hapoel and Sheff Utd were all 100x worse then last night.

I was at Prague and Hapoel and we played better in those two matches IMO.

I was at Prague and Hapoel and we played better in those two matches IMO.

Does it really matter how bad we were last year

What matters surely is that for the last few months we have not been very good how many goals have we scored in open play at home when opponents are usually happy to defend and hope for the best in attack

I was at Prague and Hapoel and we played better in those two matches IMO.

And we were still in the league cup after those results. This one felt worse because as last year showed with a bit of luck we've a chance of winning it.

Prague & Hapoel are better sides than Wolves reserves.

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The worst part of last night's result was mentioned by someone in this thread. We no longer have these games to give the fringe players a run out. That means more unhappy players.

The worst part of last night's result was mentioned by someone in this thread. We no longer have these games to give the fringe players a run out. That means more unhappy players.

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Wrote this after the Wolves game; forgot to put it up.

As this is the current negative thread I'll put this here so I can come back to it to see how I did. My thoughts on our current first team squad and with the backdrop of our club's stated desire to be on the coat tails of the better teams in a mediocre league and not simply a mid-table, easily ignored, local team with no interest to any save a few in Hampshire.

Forster. Not a natural goalkeeper. Apparently if he goes so does Dave Watson. I wonder if it's time for a change all round.

Pied. He's a converted winger (like Cedric). One of the articles that was posted when he signed said he wasn't a very good defender. Let his contract expire.

Cedric. Decent, not great. Should be better going forward (see above). Minimum standard of player we should look to sign and I expect we'll keep him provided nothing silly happens.

Aaron Martin (sorry, Bednarek). Enough said.

Gardos. Would have liked to have seen him get a chance but understand he's a confidence player and he won't get the time/space allowed in this league to build that. Sorry, but keep only as back-up if at all.

Yoshida. Overall not good enough for us and our aspirations. Would let him go on a free so he can make some money.

Hoedt. I hear he's slow and has lapses of concentration. I think he will find parts of the English game difficult (the speed), but not the stand there and head it. If he has an immobile front line in front of him (as he's a passer, apparently) maybe he can bypass the midfield and hit Gabbiadini's runs early.

Stephens. It will take a massive amount of work for him to learn to think differently and I don't think he will so this will limit him as defensively he's weak. I would have to say the weakness of switching off/being out of position (I class the latter as being a result of the former) means we should get rid of him if he can't iron this out of his game in the next 2 to 3 years.

Clasie. Gone. Not right for the league, otherwise a good player.

Davis. He should be phased out over the next two years. Not dominant enough. Does a fair bit of good work and is a good player but mostly doesn't seem to knit it all together with the team. This could be a team thing though.

JWP. Is well-coached. I've said before he's not a footballer as in there's nothing natural about his approach. For comparison, watch Thomas O'Connor in the (I think) under 18s and see how he addresses the ball, keeps his head up, look at his posture, look at what he does. He is a footballer.

Romeu. Decent, but we're his level and he's ours.

Lemina. From what little I've seen, the same as Romeu. Happy to keep both, would require an upgrade if we really do want to challenge for the Champions League.

Boufal. Not a game-changer, nor a real goal threat. Don't think he will ever make it to the top. I have now seen instances where he plays with himself and then involves others later (think Fabrice Fernandes, but fewer crop circles) so understand the comments from others that he tries to be 'too clever'. He should dribble less and pass (incisively) more. But again, it could be because we have a team of mannequins.

Hojbjerg. Jury's out because I can't yet work out why he isn't a guaranteed starter. Obvious weaknesses are head down too much (especially when charging forward) and weak on his left foot, but he should show what a good player he is. I do think the team need to get on his wavelength as they are too static (a problem among English teams, our team – is this over-coaching?) and when he wins the ball back as he often does they neither show for him, move to support him even though he wins a lot of balls that he possibly shouldn't, move quickly enough if at all, or look to move back into 'shape' rather than being able to quickly react to what is happening on the field which is pretty much a part of the very fluid game that is football, unlike American Football.

Gabbiadini. ****ing good. Wish we had some bastard to pass to him at the right time (and someone to follow up for when he misses but the keeper knocks it back out into play).

Redmond. Said it before, don't think it will (now) ever change. Flatters to deceive. Won't improve and I don't think he thinks he needs to.

Bertrand. Very good player. Probably first on the team sheet for me though Gabbiadini runs him close. Maybe just never take them off it.

McQueen. I think he pretty much puts in a shift whenever he plays, better than I thought he would be, haven't seen enough yet. Suspect he's too limited to ever really be a good player at this level, but he's proved me wrong before and I hope he does again. I still find him quite ponderous though and he seems to play better when he doesn't have time to think.

Targett. Let's wait and see.

VVD. Not as good as anyone thinks he is, but still very good. Won't work hard enough to get good enough to play for the likes of Barcelona. We should look to have lots of players of his calibre (bearing in mind my opening comment).

Tadic. Not as good as he thinks he is. Slows it down unnecessarily and wants to do a Boufal. It's a team game. Not good enough for us/this league. Get rid.

Sims. Potentially bloody good. Needs to not get injured and be played lots.

Gallagher. See above but obviously he's not injured.

Reed. Let's see what the loan does for him. Hope he comes good; he has a bit of arrogance that I think the team sometimes lacks.

Hesketh. Needs to be aware of his surroundings more when the game's hard and fast and really needs to develop an adult body or he'll go the way of Ben Reeves (very good player) except he won't do as well.

Long. Somewhere in there is actually a good footballer. I think he probably needs to slow things down a bit but also be a bit more bloody-minded when it comes to finishing. I think he's probably a little bit mentally 'off' and wonder if that's because he is in some way 'too relaxed'.

Austin. Hmm. Undoubtedly a good player and goalscorer. I think he (and some other of our players) suffer from the structure and way we play. I'd rather we were more fluid and adaptable rather than how we still seem to be which is a bit (still) unimaginative and 'safe'. Think he struggles somewhat from the modern fascination with the 'all-round single forward' (who doesn't exist) rather than us as a team just looking to create things quickly where he can exploit space. Bit like Gabbiadini, but he's a different type of player.

McCarthy. I really wanted us to sign him when he broke through at Reading. I think he should be a much better bet than anything we have currently.

I would like to see some players (not Tadic) get a proper run so at least they get match fit and I wonder if we now have managers who can't handle the pressure. Koeman at least could because he was very confident in his ability.

The black box. I think this probably works just fine; it's just user-error that explains why we want to focus on 'potential' rather than doing what other teams do/did and mix this up with a strong spine and some good experience so that the team as a whole is stronger.

We are, absolutely just average. We will have bad days like yesterday and we will have good days. We are average middle of the table Premier League. Nothing wrong with that, it beats battling relegation year after year BUT the club keep selling us this vision of pushing on and breaking regularly into Europe. It's not going to happen unless we buy one or two high quality established players to go along with a Hoedt, Lemina, Gabbiadini. Every successful team has to have a mix. We mix promising with average, we should mix promising with proven and established but we won't pay the transfer fees for that or the salaries.

 

The club want to be self sustaining, again that's fine and when the balloon bursts the club will be one of the healthiest around financially.

 

But please don't be surprised when VVD, Bertrand, Cedric and before them Mane, Wanyama, Lallana etc want to move on to being better than average and earning more money.

 

We have been spoilt in recent seasons, we punched above our weight. I think finishing 7th/8th is beyond us currently.

Spot on. We've stood still, in fact no, gone backwards in last two years and others have pushed on. Pelle is a huge miss and is a proper target man who brought players in to play.

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I thought we were 'average' (to use the common phrase) first half, but we were the better team 2nd half and absolutely bossed them last 20. No different to under Puel .

Spot on. We've stood still, in fact no, gone backwards in last two years and others have pushed on. Pelle is a huge miss and is a proper target man who brought players in to play.

 

 

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True, but he did have some rather frustrating spells without scoring or contributing that would've had us on our nerves right now anyway (just like it did).

Wanyama was the big loss, and no matter what people say we are yet to try and replace him.

True, but he did have some rather frustrating spells without scoring or contributing that would've had us on our nerves right now anyway (just like it did).

 

Wanyama was the big loss, and no matter what people say we are yet to try and replace him.

He was a big loss based on his first two seasons with us, but he was utter trash in his last season and not on it at all. I don't miss that Wanyama.

Lemina and Romeu are evidence that the club have looked to replace his power and physicality.

He was a big loss based on his first two seasons with us, but he was utter trash in his last season and not on it at all. I don't miss that Wanyama.

 

Lemina and Romeu are evidence that the club have looked to replace his power and physicality.

He wasn't utter trash. And he was so-so in his first season.

He was a big loss based on his first two seasons with us, but he was utter trash in his last season and not on it at all. I don't miss that Wanyama.

 

Lemina and Romeu are evidence that the club have looked to replace his power and physicality.

He was a massive loss for me last season.

He played a key role in us finishing 6th and honestly I think if his head wasn't in a strop we would have had two Europa League group stage matches.

Changed the game when he came on against our win Liverpool in 2015-16 (the 3-2 win)

Over the time Wanyama was here he was our best player. The fact he wasn't Andrea Pirlo didn't detract from the fact that we were really, really hard to break down. It's hard to replace a player of that quality but Romeu is a good fit and it looks like we're going back to a pair, ala Wanyama and Schneiderlin, with Lemina in there. That's very welcome.