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Thread: Right back cover for Cedric - Valery or A.N. Other?

  1. #1

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    Question Right back cover for Cedric - Valery or A.N. Other?

    While we have been having a good close-season so far as far as transfers are concerned, one position that remains of some concern is right back. We have a good first choice in Cedric, but if he gets injured we seem to have very little cover in that position, having released Jeremie Pied.

    Therefore, I am wondering if there is any news about this? Are we in the market to sign anyone?

    Of course it may be that it is felt that Yan Valery is ready to take a step up into first team contention. If so that will be great to see and I hope he will be a great success. Alternatively, could Hughes be considering the possibility of one of our right backs providing cover on the left? Or could another youngster like Alfie Jones or Jake Flannagan be converted into playing at right back?

  2. #2

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    Buying back up is such a waste. Cedric will play most games. We'd only get someone people would quickly dub rubbish anyway.

    We have 2 good back up options at LB due to the academy. So do the same for RB. That's supposed to be what the club is about right? Stephens or Yoshida can play there if needed anyway.

    Don't know why people want such a bloated squad of expensive average signings.

  3. #3

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    I'm assuming Stephens is cover although I've not read anything about it, just seems to make sense in terms of backup. If Valery makes big strides this year (figuratively not literally) (although that might help too) then that's great and maybe then we have a succession plan in place for when Cedric finally gets too old and goes to join west ham or something.

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    Harrison Reed played successfully at right back for Norwich for much of last season. I can't see him breaking into Saints midfield, so if he's not going out on loan again, I would guess that this is his "path to the first team" as they say.

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    Harrison Reed is the obvious cover having played there and successfully for Norwich last season. Can't see him getting a look in as MF.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VectisSaint View Post
    Harrison Reed is the obvious cover having played there and successfully for Norwich last season. Can't see him getting a look in as MF.
    This
    Tenacious, seemingly good engine to get up and back, knows where the goal is.

  7. #7

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    Yeah I think Stephens and Reed will be the back ups for right back

  8. #8

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    I'd rather we just signed a new first choice RB.

  9. #9

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    Valery, Stephens, Reed, JWP... more than enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaptopSaint View Post
    Valery, Stephens, Reed, JWP... more than enough.
    Only if all four play at the same time will we have an adequate back-up

  11. #11

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    Most people on here donít rate Cedric, so sell him and play some random 17 year old.


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    Valery is a hell of a talent. He deserves his chance and alongside Stephens gives good back up. We've then got various players who can "do a job" ie Yoshida, JWP, Hoj, Reed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage_Face View Post
    Most people on here don’t rate Cedric, so sell him and play some random 17 year old.
    Did you have a random 17-year-old in mind?

    (Yan Yalery is 19 years old)

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    Agree with the majority, we have enough versatility in the squad to cover a right wing back position (Reed if he stays, Stephens, even JWP and Redmond have been mooted of late) and Valery if we want to trust the youth, assuming Cedric gets injured. Crystal Palace played Wan-Bissaka from their youth academy at the tail end of last season and he did very well against top 6 teams - there's no reason why Valery, who has looked good on the odd occasion I've seen him play, can't do a job if needed.

  15. #15

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    Seems like Hughes is wedded to wing backs from all pre season evidence thus far.

    Valery is promising, Reed CDAJ, and I think I'm right in saying Armstrong played a few games at right back for Celtic with distinction - good engine, lots of pace getting up and down the wing.

    And as others have said, we could bung up the right side with a plodding tortoise like Prowse or Stephens if things got desperate.

    It'd be nice to have a clear back up option, but it wouldn't be a surprise if we settled for what we've got.

    We were linked to some Croatian bloke a few weeks ago. They seem to produce half decent players...

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyell View Post
    We were linked to some Croatian bloke a few weeks ago. They seem to produce half decent players...

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    Karlo Bartolec?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Le God View Post
    Did you have a random 17-year-old in mind?

    (Yan Yalery is 19 years old)
    Harold McKeegan from Christmas Island. Random enough?


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  18. #18

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    Signing some player to sit on the bench IMO goes against what we should be doing, our like 2nd/3rd choice slots should be filled from the academy, especially with our current bloated squad and unwanted players like Forster sitting there on £60-70k a week.

    Why waste another £40-50k a week on some back up we won't use, give Valery a chance to show what he can do.

    Also as we are playing wingbacks I am pretty sure most of centre-mids could easily play there, IIRC Hojberg played right back or wing back for Bayern, JWP could easily do it, Stephens too and Reed seems to have done it a few times in pre-season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tajjuk View Post
    Signing some player to sit on the bench IMO goes against what we should be doing, our like 2nd/3rd choice slots should be filled from the academy, especially with our current bloated squad and unwanted players like Forster sitting there on £60-70k a week.

    Why waste another £40-50k a week on some back up we won't use, give Valery a chance to show what he can do.

    Also as we are playing wingbacks I am pretty sure most of centre-mids could easily play there, IIRC Hojberg played right back or wing back for Bayern, JWP could easily do it, Stephens too and Reed seems to have done it a few times in pre-season.
    Spot on

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    Quote Originally Posted by tajjuk View Post
    Also as we are playing wingbacks I am pretty sure most of centre-mids could easily play there, IIRC Hojberg played right back or wing back for Bayern, JWP could easily do it, Stephens too and Reed seems to have done it a few times in pre-season.
    Hojbjerg, Stephens and Ward-Prowse don't have the pace needed to be good wing backs. They'd get exposed by a half decent opposing winger.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Le God View Post
    Hojbjerg, Stephens and Ward-Prowse don't have the pace needed to be good wing backs. They'd get exposed by a half decent opposing winger.
    Agree MLG - they donít have the pace. Worth noting that Lemina has played as a wingback.

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    ...I’d stick Long there...

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    Quote Originally Posted by 23rdSaint View Post
    ...Iíd stick Long there...

    Yeah his terrible first touch, inability to trap a ball, and lack of crossing ability would all be useful traits in that role...but at least he is quick

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    Didn't Yoshida once play RB?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage_Face View Post
    Didn't Yoshida once play RB?

    I thought it was LB and he was ****ing awful.

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Le God View Post
    Hojbjerg, Stephens and Ward-Prowse don't have the pace needed to be good wing backs. They'd get exposed by a half decent opposing winger.
    Disagree, you don't necessarily need out and out pace to be a good wingback, as you have cover behind you in the 3 centre-backs. It certainly helps no doubt but it doesn't mean players can't be good in that role if they don't have lots of pace.

    Wingbacks need to be good all rounders and be able to run all day, all those 3 have those abilities. They also have good footballing brains so would adjust their game accordingly depending on who they face.

    Super quick quality wingers barely exist anyway, most of them that are genuinely quick have no end product and those that do are few are likely to expose whoever we play there, especially in a wing-back system as they are naturally going to be further up the pitch.

    Like Cedric as wing-back against Zaha is going to have just as much trouble as anyone else, even if he is quick, it's the natural weakness of the system and the centre-backs have to be good stepping out to deal with the threats in behind the full back.

    People get too focused on pace.

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage_Face View Post
    Didn't Yoshida once play RB?
    I'm sure he's played there a few times - once I think in League Cup at home to Villa, scored a beauty.

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    Prefer to have Stephens/Valery as backup rather than sign another journeyman to bloat the squad.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    I thought it was LB and he was ****ing awful.
    It was RB and he was ****ing awful. Most of the negative opinions about Yoshida come from the times he was played at RB, but people forget the RB bit and remember he was ****ing awful.

  30. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Le God View Post
    Hojbjerg, Stephens and Ward-Prowse don't have the pace needed to be good wing backs. They'd get exposed by a half decent opposing winger.
    amen.

  31. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Valery is a hell of a talent.
    Like the sound of that. is he regarded as highly as, dare I say it, Bale/Shaw/Bridge or more along the lines of Targett/McQueen?

  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by adriansfc View Post
    Don't know why people want such a bloated squad of expensive average signings.
    Cedric gets injured and we have stop gaps. Signings don't have to be average. Club found Cedric and can sign another, maybe better right back. Do that and the first team improves and we have more chance of winning games. If Valery is good enough to start pushing Cedric then no worries...

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Valery is a hell of a talent. He deserves his chance and alongside Stephens gives good back up. We've then got various players who can "do a job" ie Yoshida, JWP, Hoj, Reed.
    What points to Valery being a hell of a talent? Interesting that in the only preseason game he’s featured, Hughes preferred Reed over him at wingback.

  34. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chez View Post
    Cedric gets injured and we have stop gaps. Signings don't have to be average. Club found Cedric and can sign another, maybe better right back. Do that and the first team improves and we have more chance of winning games. If Valery is good enough to start pushing Cedric then no worries...
    We didnít sign Cedric as backup to clyne but as his replacement. We arenít going to sign a better right back and have the first choice Portugal right back as an unhappy reserve.

  35. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baird of the land View Post
    We didn’t sign Cedric as backup to clyne but as his replacement. We aren’t going to sign a better right back and have the first choice Portugal right back as an unhappy reserve.
    Why can't we sign someone better than Cedric? He's decent, but he has several weaknesses not least strength and ability in the air - both still important.
    if we manage to sign someone better than Cedric (that is a big if) and he becomes a reserve so be it. Middling teams signing squad players is folly. Every signing should be equal or better than we have or at least has the potential to become better.

  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chez View Post
    Why can't we sign someone better than Cedric? He's decent, but he has several weaknesses not least strength and ability in the air - both still important.
    if we manage to sign someone better than Cedric (that is a big if) and he becomes a reserve so be it. Middling teams signing squad players is folly. Every signing should be equal or better than we have or at least has the potential to become better.
    He may not be perfect but he’s a good highly paid international first choice right back. We’ve enough unhappy players we need to loan out without creating another one because there isn’t a chance in a million of Cedric accepting being our reserve right back. If we sell him try and buy a better replacement sure but can’t see how a club our size can or should maintain a bloated squad of players, let alone the potential detrimental effect on the quality of first team signings from having to maintain such a squad.

  37. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baird of the land View Post
    He may not be perfect but he’s a good highly paid international first choice right back. We’ve enough unhappy players we need to loan out without creating another one because there isn’t a chance in a million of Cedric accepting being our reserve right back. If we sell him try and buy a better replacement sure but can’t see how a club our size can or should maintain a bloated squad of players, let alone the potential detrimental effect on the quality of first team signings from having to maintain such a squad.
    One of the reasons I reckon Bertrand and Cedric where so poor last season is the knew they where first names on the team sheet there was no one pushing for their places even if the where crap week after week. We'd get more out of them if they thought their position was under threat that way they have to play well to keep their place. That isn't going to happen using JWP or Reed as a stop gap RB.

  38. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    One of the reasons I reckon Bertrand and Cedric where so poor last season is the knew they where first names on the team sheet there was no one pushing for their places even if the where crap week after week. We'd get more out of them if they thought their position was under threat that way they have to play well to keep their place. That isn't going to happen using JWP or Reed as a stop gap RB.
    Bertrand has had the same level of cover since heís been here, when he developed into an England international.
    If we believe he is complacent sell him(i donít Believe he is) and buy a new first choice one.
    If they are under threat itís likely weíll have a hole elsewhere in the squad.

  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baird of the land View Post
    He may not be perfect but he’s a good highly paid international first choice right back. We’ve enough unhappy players we need to loan out without creating another one because there isn’t a chance in a million of Cedric accepting being our reserve right back. If we sell him try and buy a better replacement sure but can’t see how a club our size can or should maintain a bloated squad of players, let alone the potential detrimental effect on the quality of first team signings from having to maintain such a squad.
    the squad maybe bloated, and that needs sorting, but having one right back of reasonable quality is not sufficient. We were at our best when we had Clyne and Chambers at the club. We must strive for those heights again, not settle for mediocre. As I have said, if Valery can genuinely challenge Cedric for his place then we don't need to enter the market, but if not then we must consider it.
    As for a club of our size, I thought we had the 20th biggest turnover of any club worldwide? is that not sufficient to justify having two right backs? Not sure why you re so concerned with the happiness of Cedric. If he is unhappy at being a reserve he can fight for his place or **** off. He's here to serve the club. The club is not here to pay him fortune and keep him sweet.
    Last edited by Chez; 17-07-2018 at 09:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doddisalegend View Post
    One of the reasons I reckon Bertrand and Cedric where so poor last season is the knew they where first names on the team sheet there was no one pushing for their places even if the where crap week after week. We'd get more out of them if they thought their position was under threat that way they have to play well to keep their place. That isn't going to happen using JWP or Reed as a stop gap RB.
    Or it could be that we had an imbecile for a manager that thought about defence first and didnít give 2 international standard footballers the freedom they had in previous years. I appreciate your argument and in general I would agree but Iím just not sure who we would get in to play second fiddle. Iím also left wondering what would happen if Hughes dropped the first choice for one of the players you mention? Strop or strive?

  41. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by RobM View Post
    It was RB and he was ****ing awful. Most of the negative opinions about Yoshida come from the times he was played at RB, but people forget the RB bit and remember he was ****ing awful.
    He was also toss at CB for a good while too, as well as RB and LB. He has improved a lot, but he's still the benchmark for "you need to be better than this for us to be in the top half" as far as CBs go at Saints.

  42. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by shurlock View Post
    What points to Valery being a hell of a talent? Interesting that in the only preseason game he’s featured, Hughes preferred Reed over him at wingback.
    Is that an actual question or are you just being an idiot? It's based on his ability as a player. Whether Reed has preferred him in a couple of friendlies doesn't detract from Valery talent.

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