Everton vs Saints - Build Up

Nice to get our annual ‘not winning at Goodison’ out of the way nice and early.

 

I’d go with the same team which finished today’s game, depending on Armstrong’s injury. Another idea would be a 4-2-3-1 with Elyo - Armstrong - Redmond behind Gabbi, with Ings off the bench.

Start with 3 at the back and it will be game over by HT

Nice to get our annual ‘not winning at Goodison’ out of the way nice and early.

 

I’d go with the same team which finished today’s game, depending on Armstrong’s injury. Another idea would be a 4-2-3-1 with Elyo - Armstrong - Redmond behind Gabbi, with Ings off the bench.

 

Ings off the bench after his display today are you for real

Ings off the bench after his display today are you for real

 

Everton away is a different prospect to a tired Burnley at home. We can always start with the more conservative option and bring on an extra striker if looks like it will improve our fortunes.

Certainly wont be the Everton we played off the park at Goodison last season..............lets face it they just went through the motion,but different this time round.

I'd go for 4-2-3-1...

 

McCarthy

 

Cedric Vestergaard Hoedt Bertrand

 

Lemina Armstrong

 

Redmond Ings Elyounoussi

 

Austin

 

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

I don't see how Austin gets into people's starting 11, seen him in pre season and said he isn't good enough and offers very little, today has backed that up even more

 

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

I don't see how Austin gets into people's starting 11, seen him in pre season and said he isn't good enough and offers very little, today has backed that up even more

 

He was isolated in the first half (which isn't really his fault), if we play 4-2-3-1 and have the 3 supporting him he'll be a lot more effective. No harm giving Gabbiadini a try, but I wouldn't be writing Austin off just yet.

This could get messy! If we **** about like we did today (first 60-70 minutes) we will get hammered.

 

Have a feeling well try and keep it tight and catch them on the break, just doubt we will do it successfully.

 

Going for 3-0 Everton.

McCarthy

Cedric Vestergaard yoshi Bertrand

Lemina Romeu hojberg

Remond Ings Armstrong

 

Subs

Gunn, Stephens, Elyounoussi, Austin, gabbi, jwp, targett

If we play that awful 5-2-2-1 formation again we will get stuffed.

 

I'd take a point right now, the one blessing is they are still weak at the back and I think we'll be able to counter effectively. It depends if Vestergaard can bale out Hoedt again constantly.

Let’s hope Hughes has learnt his lesson pretty early.

 

McCarthy

Cedric

Yoshida

Vestergarrd

Bertrand

Lemina

Romeu

Ely

Armstrong

Redmond

Ings

I didn’t think Hoedt did much wrong today, personally. Considering the mess of a formation we started with and the number of balls the defence had to deal with.

 

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

 

Wouldn't have Hoedt anywhere near the starting XI. Yoshida for me any day. Not sure if I'd start with Ings either. He was good today but think he'll be good as an impact sub, so CA or Gabbi to start

I don’t think Hughes will dispense with the 3CBs. Check out the quotes in this article:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/16414078.southampton-manager-mark-hughes-on-stuart-armstrong/?ref=rss

If 4-2-3-1

 

---------------McCarthy-------------------

Cedric--Yoshida--Vestergaard--Bertrand

-----Romeu--------------Lemina----------

Redmond-----Armstrong-----Elyounoussi

------------------Ings----------------------

 

If 4-4-2

 

-----------------McCarthy-----------------

Cedric--Yoshida--Vestergaard--Bertrand

Redmond--Romeu--Lemina--Elyounoussi

------------Ings-------Gabbiadini---------

 

if 5-2-3

 

hell no.

I'd go for 4-2-3-1...

 

McCarthy

 

Cedric Vestergaard Hoedt Bertrand

 

Lemina Armstrong

 

Redmond Ings Elyounoussi

 

Austin

No more Austin, please.

 

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

I don’t think Hughes will dispense with the 3CBs. Check out the quotes in this article:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/16414078.southampton-manager-mark-hughes-on-stuart-armstrong/?ref=rss

 

I hope it's just a ruse to fool Everton

I don’t think Hughes will dispense with the 3CBs. Check out the quotes in this article:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/16414078.southampton-manager-mark-hughes-on-stuart-armstrong/?ref=rss

 

isnt that why he was sacked from Stoke as it didnt work there and he refused to change

I don’t think Hughes will dispense with the 3CBs. Check out the quotes in this article:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/16414078.southampton-manager-mark-hughes-on-stuart-armstrong/?ref=rss

 

What does he say there that leads to this conclusion?

What does he say there that leads to this conclusion?

 

The way I interpreted it was that the 3CBs need more time to learn their roles in the system. To me that means he’ll persist with it.

 

 

Can we get away with 4-4-2

 

Gabbi would thrive alongside Ings, feeding off Armstrong and Elyounoussi you feel

Start with 3 at the back and it will be game over by HT

We played with 3 at the back at Everton in May and were seconds away from getting a win. Just saying.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

away to a good side.....

 

 

McCarthy

Cedric

Yoshida

Vest

Bertrand

Rom

Lemina

Armstrong

Redmond

Mo

Ings

I think this is a nailed on Everton win, we can change our managers, change our players, change our formation but some things never change and that is we just don't win at Goodison (or get any luck) .

 

I expect we'll play with 3 centre backs and try to hit them on the break so will try to utilise what pace we have in the squad.

 

Everton have several new signings to settle in so fingers crossed we can somehow scrape a draw.

If 4-4-2

 

-----------------McCarthy-----------------

Cedric--Yoshida--Vestergaard--Bertrand

Redmond--Romeu--Lemina--Elyounoussi

------------Ings-------Gabbiadini---------

We played with 3 at the back at Everton in May and were seconds away from getting a win. Just saying.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

 

Not really the same situation though. That game was meaningless to the Everton players while ours where battling to avoid relegation we wanted it a lot more than they did. This Everton team will be right up for it with a new manager to impress and places to fight for with new signings.

We need to control midfield more. I'm not sure 4-4-2 is going to do that any more than Hughes 5-2-1-2 does.

I didn’t think Hoedt did much wrong today, personally. Considering the mess of a formation we started with and the number of balls the defence had to deal with.

 

 

Agreed. Heaps in the post match forum suggesting he was awful from start to finish, but I reckon he had an ok game. Certainly no more awful than the rest for the first 30 minutes or so.

One weird header that allowed Lennon in, but aside from that seemed solid enough to me.

 

Better than a lot of showings from last season certainly.

We played with 3 at the back at Everton in May and were seconds away from getting a win. Just saying.

 

Indeed. I'm going to buck the trend and suggest we stick with 3 CBs given its a tricky away tie where we'd be happy to come away with a point, and with Yoshida slotting in to add some pace to the formation.

 

So, I'd go with...

 

------------------------- McCarthey ------------------------

 

------ Yoshida ----- Vestergaard ---- Hoedt -----

 

Cedric ------------------------------------------- Bertrand

 

------------------- Lemina -------- Romeu --------------

 

---- Elyanoussi ------- Ings -------- Redmond ----

 

 

Subs: Gunn, Targett/McQueen, Bednarek/Stephens, JWP/Hojbjerg/Davis, Long/Gabbi/Austin

 

 

Edit: bugger... Missed out Armstrong altogether... Oh well, back to the drawing board!!

 

(Maybe I should go back to picking a starting 12... Far easier that way )

Edited 13 August, 2018 by trousers

Not really the same situation though. That game was meaningless to the Everton players while ours where battling to avoid relegation we wanted it a lot more than they did. This Everton team will be right up for it with a new manager to impress and places to fight for with new signings.

Yes, agree Everton will be a tougher proposition this time around. I just don't agree with some that 3 at the back is necessarily a total lost cause that should never be considered in any scenario from now on. It probably wasn't the best formation for Burnley at home but could be of use against teams with more attacking threats.

 

Also, I don't think the change in formation was the only reason for our improvement in second half, it was also the changes in personnel, with more dynamic sharper players coming on.

 

That said, at this point I would go with a 4231 for Everton as it allows us to carry the impetus of that last half hour into this game more easily.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

I personally would go:

 

McCarthy

 

Cedric Hoedt Vestergaard Bertrand

 

Lemina Romeu

 

Redmond Armstrong Elyounoussi

 

Ings

 

But all depends if we go with the back 4 or not.

I seem to recall in one of Koeman's seasons with us that he ended a run of very poor results by switching to a back 3 at home to Everton and we smashed them 3-0.

 

Obviouls y they are a different looking team now, and so are we, but I don't think we should just abandon the idea of using a back 3 completely. I reckon there will be occasions where it can be used effectively, but it depends on the personnel. Cedric was completely ineffective as a RWB yesterday, and I would feel happier if Yoshi was one of the three CBs.

 

Some people have been calling for Stephens to be tried in a CDM role. I wonder if there is a way that we can set up to switch between the 3-4-2-1 and the 4-2-3-1 without needing to make subs to do it. Stephens can step forward into CDM with Bertrand and Cedric slotting back into a more traditional full back position, freeing up Lemina to move to a more advanced role.

away to a good side.....

 

 

McCarthy

Cedric

Yoshida

Vest

Bertrand

Rom

Lemina

Armstrong

Redmond

Mo

Ings

 

That's what I would do. 4231. Only question is whether to start Ings or go with Gabbi and have Ings ready for the last 30 mins.

 

-------------------------McC--------------------

 

Cedric----Vester------Yoshida--Bertrand

 

----------------Romeu----Lemina----------

 

Redmond-------Armstrong----------Mo

 

------------------------Gabbi---------------------

 

Subs: Gunn, Stephens, Hojbjerg, Davis, Long, Ings, Sims

Edited 13 August, 2018 by benjii

I'd like to see Hughes go with a 4-4-2 and start building a good partnership up front right from the get go.

 

At the moment I'd probably opt for Gabbi - Ings with Charlie as an inpact sub but that could change later on in the season if the combo doesn't work.

 

Vital that we get our goal potential cranked up right at the start of the season. It's an area where we spectacularly failed on last year because of stupid selections and almost cost us. Get it right now and I think we'll have a comfortable season.

The problem with the five at the back against Burnley was the midfield Lemina and Romeu where playing a sort of flat line I front of the CBs. We just surrender control allowing Burnley to ping the ball about under no pressure. If we are going to play it ( I think Hughes will) we'd be better with just Romeu sitting and play Lemina higher up with Armstrong maybe with Hoj, JWP or Davis or play Mo and then Ings or Gabbi yo try and get control.of the middle of the park.

I think we'll see the same setup if I'm honest, but Yoshida for Stephens. Probably Ings for Austin as well.

 

Hoedt left, Vestergaard central and Yoshida right side. That at least gives us a bit more pace at the back, but we need to be much more sure of our jobs compared to Sunday.

He was isolated in the first half (which isn't really his fault), if we play 4-2-3-1 and have the 3 supporting him he'll be a lot more effective. No harm giving Gabbiadini a try, but I wouldn't be writing Austin off just yet.

He became isolated up front simply because everytime the ball was played up to him it was coming straight back at us as he was easily dispossessed, and until the point where he was subbed he hadn't won a single header in a challenge,

You ain't going to keep passing a ball forward if it just keeps coming back at you, because it ain't sticking with the bloke you have passed it to.

My team:

 

----------- McCarthy ----------

 

Stephens - Vest - Yoshi - Bertrand

 

----- Lemina - Romeu --------

 

Redmond - Ings - Armstrong

 

-----------Austin -------------

 

Ings has to start, he was an absolute breath of fresh air when he came on. I think away from home it's best to keep the likes of Moi and Gabbi on the bench, and keep it relatively tight for the first hour or so and bring them on if we need them. I think Austin deserves another chance with a bit of support around him. I said in the other thread I like JS at full back, particularly in a game where we may be under more pressure. Cedric can always be brought on as an attacking sub later on.

 

The team I think will start:

 

------------ McCarthy -----------

 

Cedric - Stephens - Vesti - Yoshi (if fit) - Bertrand

 

----------- Lemina -------- Romeu-----------------

 

------------------ Armstrong -----------------------

 

--------- Ings -------------- Austin ----------------

I didn’t think Hoedt did much wrong today, personally.

 

Did you miss the suicidal header back to McCarthy which was intercepted by Lennon? McCarthy saved Hoedt's blushes there. I feel nervous every time the ball is near him, definitely our weak link in my opinion.

4-0 defeat.

4-0 defeat.

 

Why do you think that?

Why do you think that?

 

Not confident at all just a feeling they'll hammer us

Did you miss the suicidal header back to McCarthy which was intercepted by Lennon? McCarthy saved Hoedt's blushes there. I feel nervous every time the ball is near him, definitely our weak link in my opinion.

 

Looked like a mix up between Hoedt and Vest to me, if it's the one I'm thinking of where they both went for it and Lennon nipped in.

I haven't watched enough football recently to have an opinion on it here, but at the end of last season everyone was going on about Bednarek being the only decent centre back we had, now everyone is calling for Yoshida, Hoedt or Stephens to play. What happened? Is he injured?

I don't see how Austin gets into people's starting 11, seen him in pre season and said he isn't good enough and offers very little, today has backed that up even more

 

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

 

And yet, you have Hoedt in your starting XI.

He was isolated in the first half (which isn't really his fault), if we play 4-2-3-1 and have the 3 supporting him he'll be a lot more effective. No harm giving Gabbiadini a try, but I wouldn't be writing Austin off just yet.

 

We were stronger with Gabbi on the pitch and Austin off it towards the end of the match, so why start with Austin up front?

Have only just about got over that absolute sickener at Goodison last season. Possily the most gutted I've ever felt watching Saints that was.

 

We never do well here, would definitely take a point, and am more positive of doing so from that second half performance yesterday. That said, this Everton side will be much tougher this year so really won't be easy.

I don’t think Hughes will dispense with the 3CBs. Check out the quotes in this article:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/16414078.southampton-manager-mark-hughes-on-stuart-armstrong/?ref=rss

 

isnt that why he was sacked from Stoke as it didnt work there and he refused to change

 

It's an odd one. The top teams - well, Chelsea anyway play 3 CB and 2 wing backs and it makes them better. Yet when we try it, it's a mess. Why?