What we need to do in the short term, to fix the first team

Don't need to discuss GK. Finally we seem to have two decent ones.

Right back - we only have one, so that's that.

Left back - Bertrand isn't a captain but I don't think he merits being dropped. In any case, it's not a problem area and Targett is a capable deputy.

Centre back - everyone will have their personal favourites but it's all much of a muchness due to our failure to sign a standout CB.

SO - the important question is how we get more out of the midfield and attack.

WHICH PLAYERS HAVE THE ABILITY TO PLAY FOR GENUINELY GOOD TEAMS? Lemina, Ings and maybe Hojbjerg. Gabbi slightly below. The rest of them are bog standard. So we need to get the most out of the best ones.

How do we do this?

We don't play a wide open 442. Teams who play this way successfully rely a lot on strength and pace. We don't have too much of either.

We go with 3 in midfield.

Romeu protects the back 4 and Lemina and Hojbjerg play in front or one of them plays alongside Romeu. This shape also allows JWP and Armstrong more chance of getting a start in central midfield if someone is injured or out of form. Proceeding through the season with two central midfielders isn't going to work without a proper "back to goal" striker who can help get us up the pitch.

We play Ings and we play Gabbi coming in from the right to support.

On the left hand side we play Redmond or Elyounoussi or Gallagher.

In Jan we try hard to sign a decent centre back and a striker who can hold the ball up.

We try to shift:

Forster

Bednarek

Davis

Long

Austin

Ideally, we get a manager in with a clear and communicable philosophy as well.

Lemina is potentially our best player and Hojbjerg has been our best in-form player this season. Let's give them the chance to control matches.

Difficult as our midfield seems so poor when we play 2 in there.

I'd like to see something like:

----------------Hojbjerg------------------

--------Lemina----------JWP-------------

Elyounoussi----------------------Redmond

------------------Ings---------------------

Redmond seems to be more effective off the left, and JWP adds more energy into the midfield.

I thought the geniuses on here told us playing two up front was going to fix all the problems?

I thought the geniuses on here told us playing two up front was going to fix all the problems?

They did. Last season people where desperate for 4-4-2 and getting the ball forward quicker. Now we do that people don't want 4-4-2 hoofball and want to go back to 4-3-3 or 4-3-2-1.

Personally I couldn't care less what formation we play if it gets us winning some ****ing games.

I thought the geniuses on here told us playing two up front was going to fix all the problems?

They weren't geniuses though, they were wrong. What's your view?

They did. Last season people where desperate for 4-4-2 and getting the ball forward quicker. Now we do that people don't want 4-4-2 hoofball and want to go back to 4-3-3 or 4-3-2-1.

 

 

 

Personally I couldn't care less what formation we play if it gets us winning some ****ing games.

So, to paraphrase, "I dunno".

Difficult as our midfield seems so poor when we play 2 in there.

 

I'd like to see something like:

 

----------------Hojbjerg------------------

--------Lemina----------JWP-------------

Elyounoussi----------------------Redmond

------------------Ings---------------------

 

Redmond seems to be more effective off the left, and JWP adds more energy into the midfield.

I’d buy this, however I’d swap JWP for Armstrong and try Gabbi RW.

Less emphasis on forwards getting back, leaving them high to hit teams with pace on the counter. Similar system to Liverpool, just with significantly less talent.

Bloody hate 442, especially when one of your strikers is as bad as Austin.

We cannot get hold of the ball and dominate possession in the midfield with just Lemina and Hojbjerg. We have played some really poor teams who are comfortable knocking the ball around with us putting no pressure on the ball as we just don't have enough players in there.

We're at the point IMO where we need to change it up and try something different rather than playing the same old crap way every week.

So, to paraphrase, "I dunno".

Not at all. Short term fix for me would be extra training sessions (for fitness), a back to basics approach from the coaches ( to get the players completing the basics of football that they struggle,with at the moment) and the manager drilling the players hard (oh err misses) on the training ground so the know there roles inside out.

Finally pick a team and stick with it. If we are playing two upfront for example we need the two to form a partnership which means same two week in week out (Thus avoiding the strikers getting in each others way like the Newcastle game)

Poor quality players, like ours, best chance of success is to be very fit, work hard, and be well drilled in things like pressing. We won't be world beaters or pretty but we will stay up.

Love the title and I would go as far as this.

Double training!!

After your morning session the players come back for two hours of speciality.

Defending, forward play and fitness.

The players can moan as much as they like but in the long term they will see the bigger picyure.

Just to add.

I watched them training recently and the only ones who stayed behind for extra practice was Sims, Taggert and Gallagher.

The rest probably couldn’t wait to get away to the races or bookies.

Personallly I would shift the following

Targett

McQueen

Hoedt

Reed

JWP

Sims

Gallagher

Austin

Davis

Forster

This would free up wages and capital to sign some players of better quality. Sadly we won't.

Judging from our last two games, Jack Stephens has now become the best central defender we have. He and Hojbjerg are our standout players now.

Although, some fans don't seem to like Bertrand, he is arguably the only player we have left good enough for a top six side. So, those three should be automatic selections. Cedric's height is a problem and the opposition exploit it by playing high crosses over him but he is still a classy player.

Ings looked by far our best striker when he first arrived but a few months of SFC coaching seem to be reducing him to the same level as the rest of our strikers. In one pre-match warmup I saw Kelvin Davis coaching Charlie Austin how to shoot. That could explain a lot, What other team would be stupid enough to have three goalkeepers as first team coaches? But, still, Ings must retain some of his Liverpool quality and so should be picked ahead of Long, Austin and Gabbiadini.

Talking of Gabbiadini, we seem to have acquired quite a few players in the Boufal mould, who show occasional flashes of brilliance and every now and then have a good game but most of the time have little impact. Lemina and Gabbiadini fall in to that category. So, as that is better than being mediocre all of the time, like many in our squad, they should be in too.

We have two good goalkeepers.

So, here we have the core of a team that should be good enough for the Premier League:

Gunn/McCarthy

Cedric

Stephens

Bertrand

Lemina

Gabbiadini

Ings

Lemina

That leaves us three short and we are spoilt for choice when it comes to mediocre players, who are not really good enough at this level, to fill those positions. If we could place any faith in Ross Wilson or Mark Hughes to find decent players, we should try to shift as much of the dross as possible and bring in 2 or 3 good players in January if we want to stay up.

Kick towards the Chapel first half....going the other way isnt working is it....desperation

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I’d go with a 4-3-3 personally;

Armstrong - Hojbjerg - Lemina

Redmond - Ings - Gabbi

Give SA and ML license to push forward when able and win the midfield battles when not in possession. Not saying it will be amazing but we can’t be much worse than the sludge of the last 2.5 years.

Lemina shouldn't be in there twice. One should be Romeu, who although nothing special, has proved that he is OK at this level.

Bring in Gallagher for Austin.

Bring in Targett for Bertrand the jogger.

Bring in Gallagher for Austin.

 

Bring in Targett for Bertrand the jogger.

I'd completely forgotten about Targett.

He & Gallagher must be royally p*ssed off.

Bloody hate 442, especially when one of your strikers is as bad as Austin.

 

We cannot get hold of the ball and dominate possession in the midfield with just Lemina and Hojbjerg. We have played some really poor teams who are comfortable knocking the ball around with us putting no pressure on the ball as we just don't have enough players in there.

 

We're at the point IMO where we need to change it up and try something different rather than playing the same old crap way every week.

Well it is just about 4-4- One and a half!

Gabbiadini is crap.

I'd completely forgotten about Targett.

 

He & Gallagher must be royally p*ssed off.

They can be as p*ssed off as they like, neither have looked like PL players for any notable period in their careers. Gallagher was something like the 35th top scorer in the Championship, with his goals all coming in a 7 game purple patch.

442 is generating chances but if the forwards can't convert then it's nullified. Short term I'd give Gabi a run and drop Charlie but the problems are deep rooted and start at the top. There needs to be a culture of success built up again but with our stay away chairman the whole structure has gone into malaise. Unfortunately we can't sack the chairman so we're stuck with what we have.

It's definitely time to stop persisting with Austin, that much is certain.

We lack a creative number 10 IMO. Boufal should've been that player but barely turned up.

They can be as p*ssed off as they like, neither have looked like PL players for any notable period in their careers. Gallagher was something like the 35th top scorer in the Championship, with his goals all coming in a 7 game purple patch.

If you are right then they should not be back in the squad this season and should have been shipped out.

They weren't geniuses though, they were wrong. What's your view?

Pretty much what you said to be fair. You’re one of the few people on here that appears to know what you’re on about.

We have to play with 3 in midfield, the only tweak I’d make to your team is give Gabbadini and start of the left of a front 3, a friend of mine is a Napoli fan and said he looked his best there for them.

I think we should go all out to get Gary Cahill in January. Even at this stage of his career he’s better than anything we’ve got and would give some much needed experience and leadership to the back 4.

I think its a simple solution to take us from bottom 5 to bottom 10, Stop playing Hoedt and Austin. Stephens and Vester or Yoshida, Ings and Gabbi or Long. But what do i know, I'm Kenyan.

I think its a simple solution to take us from bottom 5 to bottom 10, Stop playing Hoedt and Austin. Stephens and Vester or Yoshida, Ings and Gabbi or Long. But what do i know, I'm Kenyan.

Hoedt's arguably been our best player the last two games, he's not the problem.

Hoedt's arguably been our best player the last two games, he's not the problem.

Lol, one of those games the opponents didn't attack, and numerous times vs Bournemouth he got let off the hook. He IS the problem, on the pitch and in the dressing room. just ask Lazio fans.

They can be as p*ssed off as they like, neither have looked like PL players for any notable period in their careers. Gallagher was something like the 35th top scorer in the Championship, with his goals all coming in a 7 game purple patch.

23 years of age, shipped out on loan to one of the worse teams in the league, then the following season shipped out to another basket case club and played out of position...................... yup the lad is a steaming pile of what you would find in a farm yard. Agree throw him in the bin and keep playing the same misfiring strikers week in week out.

Jeez!!!!!

Only 23 give him a bloody chance, with the experience he has he can't be any worse than what is being sent out to play at the moment.

IMO a manager that has some of philosophy and defined way of playing, that wants to improve players on the training field and makes sure they know exactly what their roles are and what is expected of them.

AND

Some pace going forward, some players than can beat a man with a bit of direct running.

23 years of age, shipped out on loan to one of the worse teams in the league, then the following season shipped out to another basket case club and played out of position...................... yup the lad is a steaming pile of what you would find in a farm yard. Agree throw him in the bin and keep playing the same misfiring strikers week in week out.

Jeez!!!!!

Only 23 give him a bloody chance, with the experience he has he can't be any worse than what is being sent out to play at the moment.

Considering most our fans wont give a new signing more than 5 games to prove himself, i wouldnt hold your breath,

Do we still do agility and perception training sessions? Remember under poch or kieman seeing videos of training to improve reactions and peripheral vision and so on. That seems to be missing on the pitch- we look ponderous and incapable of finding teammates quickly. Either that, or we just need players with a bit more about them- an injection of youth up front may be no bad thing (or attacking mid).

23 years of age, shipped out on loan to one of the worse teams in the league, then the following season shipped out to another basket case club and played out of position...................... yup the lad is a steaming pile of what you would find in a farm yard. Agree throw him in the bin and keep playing the same misfiring strikers week in week out.

Jeez!!!!!

Only 23 give him a bloody chance, with the experience he has he can't be any worse than what is being sent out to play at the moment.

If we signed a striker with 17 goals in 3 years playing in the championship, we’d all be fuming. He’s shown nothing to suggest he is a Premier League player at all. Plenty of excuse from some but a whole succession of coaching and management teams have decided he’s not even worth a place in the matchday squad.

We’ve done the whole ‘the kids can’t be any worse’ argument before and got relegated from the Championship in 08/09.

If we signed a striker with 17 goals in 3 years playing in the championship, we’d all be fuming. He’s shown nothing to suggest he is a Premier League player at all. Plenty of excuse from some but a whole succession of coaching and management teams have decided he’s not even worth a place in the matchday squad.

 

We’ve done the whole ‘the kids can’t be any worse’ argument before and got relegated from the Championship in 08/09.

But if he isn't going to be any worse why not give him a go, an opportunity to prove the coaches wrong. What is there to lose? We don't have any other options, so we just continue playing Long, Austin and Gabbi who have forgotten how to score. What is the point in continuing to flog a dead horse, try something/someone different. It won't be any worse and has the bonus of indicating to these so called strikers that they are not irreplaceable and perhaps make them buck their ideas up. I'd give Gallagher a go with Ings, it may not work but at least we.oukd then say we tried.

Pretty much what you said to be fair. You’re one of the few people on here that appears to know what you’re on about.

 

We have to play with 3 in midfield, the only tweak I’d make to your team is give Gabbadini and start of the left of a front 3, a friend of mine is a Napoli fan and said he looked his best there for them.

 

 

I think we should go all out to get Gary Cahill in January. Even at this stage of his career he’s better than anything we’ve got and would give some much needed experience and leadership to the back 4.

Yep, he'd be well worth it but I fear he's not #thesouthamptonway

If we signed a striker with 17 goals in 3 years playing in the championship, we’d all be fuming. He’s shown nothing to suggest he is a Premier League player at all. Plenty of excuse from some but a whole succession of coaching and management teams have decided he’s not even worth a place in the matchday squad.

 

We’ve done the whole ‘the kids can’t be any worse’ argument before and got relegated from the Championship in 08/09.

No one is saying to change the whole team for kids. What gave you that idea?

Plus we know Gallagher’s history of what he has had to deal with and the unlikely case he’ll make it in the PL... not some random player with 17 goals in 3 years.

We need to get a new manager in who can inspire and an entire coaching squad who can coach

We should be doing a lot more one and two touch training sessions, as we move the ball far too slowly, which allows teams to get organised and shut down any space.

Hopefully Austins shoulder will keep him out for a while as his most significant contribution this season has been tackling Ings on Saturday.

Gabbi and Ings both have a bit off intelligence about them so give them a few games together. Armstrong was singed as a goal scoring no 10 so play him in that position.

For now, I would persevere with Long on the bench, as we don't have any pace there, but Obafemi and Gallager need to be given a chance.

4-2-3-1

Cedric Stephens Hoedt Bertrand

Hojbjerg Romeu

Redmond Lemina Targett

Ings

At the very least there's width, and Lemina gets to play further upfield where he could cause damage. A sorry reflection on our signings that Targett seems the best option to provide width.

Switch to a 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1.

Have Ings as main striker and 2 of Gabbiadini, Elyounoussi or Redmond as wide men.

Extra body in midfield allowing Romeu/Ward-Prowse/Armstrong/Davis a chance to stake their claim and give genuine competition for places (which the 4-4-2 doesn't provide at all, not least when Hughes keeps playing the same players most weeks despite us looking utter gash, some of our players must be wondering how they'll ever get a game at the moment).

Get some youth in the team since we have been playing like we are preparing for the Championship..... Might As well get ahead of the game and give the youth a head start and play time together.

Mccarthy

Cedric- Yoshi - VG - Bertrand

Hoj - Lemina

El You - Armstrong/Gabbi - Redmond

Ings

Bit of credit to Stephens/Hoedt as they have kept 2 clean sheets in a row but I think this is probably our best bet at our strongest starting 11, yet it has never been played. I don't know what Armstrong has done wrong, we need a midfielder who can score and he's not getting a sniff. Long should be nowhere near the first day squad, rather Gallagher/Obafemi who have good attributes and might actually score once in a while.

In reality Hughes going would be a solid start.

Short term - get rid of Hughes.

Simple, get Superman to turn the world back until February 2014 and take a different path in time.

Short term is to get a goal or two (more than the opposition). The strikers need to get firing.....

Ings - 3 goals in 9 games this season

Austin - last scored a league goal in April, and before that it was December 2017.

Long - doing better than Austin, as he has managed 2 league goals this calendar year. But last season at 789 minutes per goal....!!!

Gabbi - doing the same as Long with 2 goals this calendar year. But last season he scored once every 214 minutes

Gallagher - does he exist?

U23

Afolabi

Barnes

N'Lundulu

Obafemi

Barnes and Obafemi seem to know where the back of the net is. So far for the U23 in all comps, Barnes has 6, Obafemi has 5 and Gallagher has 1. Not sure about appearances. If we point blank refuse to look towards U23 and instead persist with 3 strikers who can't buy a goal, then that is madness, as well as asking what the point of the academy is. I don't expect them to start straight off, but surely one of them should be in the match day squad. Obafemi came on last season vs Spurs, probably should have scored, and ran around a bit too keenly. He's got a taste of it. He knows what it is about. Give him and/or Barnes the chance.

New manager

Goa needs to get a grip.

All the forwards seem to be lacking confidence. I'd pick a forward line and tell them they've all got a run of maybe 6 games. Maybe they'd get to know each other's play better, maybe they'd relax a bit and take a chance or two, and then maybe their confidence would return. Perhaps consistency of selection is more important right now than who we pick but I'd include Gabbi and Ings because they both clearly have talent.

We need to get a new manager in who can inspire and an entire coaching squad who can coach

Yep. agree. The OP calls this "short term fix" but then lists player movements that would take 5 years to bring about. In the short term - our forwards need coaching on choosing the best option in front of goal and the midfielders to slide the balls into them. We are creating the chances but "profligate" in front of goal. This has to be the first thing to change.

Why not play Targett at LB with Bertrand in front of him.When he was at Fulham MT has Sessegnon in front of him and they quickly formed a useful pairing. Bertrand has shown often, that he can be dangerous going forward plus has the know how to cover MT when needed.

We need a strong, agile and tough tackling midfield player. No team of lightweights has ever won the title so we need more muscle. This lot needs toughening up and it needs to be done now not in February.