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Thread: Summer Transfer Window 2019

  1. #2051

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    Cant complain about the in's we've brought so far, definitely seem to suit the style of what Ralph wants to do. Would really like to see some others out the door though, and it doesn't appear as if any of Gallagher, Austin, Hoedt, Carillo, Forster, MacCarthy, Clasie, Boufal etc are leaving in the overly near future. Certainly no really strong links at this moment. And that doesn't even take into account the guys like Reed, Hesketh, McQueen who clearly have almost no future here.

    Be as happy to see some of them go as I would a new signing at this point, but I think it's as hard work getting people out as it is getting them in nowadays.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leo_ARG View Post
    If we are to play a Gegenpress game there is still not a suited personel to do it.
    Kind of agree though most of our forward players are suited to pressing opposition defenders (very natural for the likes of Long and Ings for example), but Ralph doesn't really play a gegenpress a la Klopp, we press the opposition high up the pitch if they play out from the back, but tend to play more of a low block if they have more advanced possession, so I don't think there is as much requirement for our defenders to push so far up the pitch, mainly because we don't have as much possession as say a Liverpool. We are more a counter attack based team.

    That will mean less space in behind and less need for super quick centrebacks, though they are nice to have.

    But it does put more onus on the midfield being highly mobile, which is why I agree we need a more mobile DM than Romeu long term.

    Plus it would be great to have someone who can dribble out of opposition presses to start attacks, a Dembele like player and the sort of role Naby Keita played for Ralph at Leipzig. Though you'd think Lemina could play this role, but obviously he wants to move on.

  3. #2053

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    Quote Originally Posted by saint77 View Post
    Nothing to do with paying transfer fees it’s the wage bill that’s the problem
    This - we need to ensure that we get the wage bill down - it'll give us much more opportunity to bring in players:

    Forster - £80k
    McCarthy - £60k
    Austin - £60k
    Lemina - £60k
    Cedric - £55k
    Hoedt - £50k
    Carillo - £50k
    Elyounoussi - £50k
    Clasie - £40k
    Stephens - £40k
    Reed - £40k
    Gallagher - £30k

    That is £615k per week, or £32m per year.

    It is also known as, in the business, a ****ing mental waste of money.

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    Bookmakers still have as favourites to sign Jarrod Bowen, but can't see why really, don't seem to be many concrete links and you'd think a position we have a decent amount of players in.

  5. #2055

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    So what happens to all those players who do not make the final PL first team squad, cannot find a club to take them yet are still on our books... Austin for example?

    I suppose Ralph will say 'not my problem" but how do you handle umpteen surplus but expensively remunerated footballers who will not even be allowed to figure in training.

    There are still a few weeks to go in this window so a mass exodus is still possible and one or two show real signs of being rehabilitated.

  6. #2056

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unbelievable Jeff View Post
    This - we need to ensure that we get the wage bill down - it'll give us much more opportunity to bring in players:

    Forster - £80k
    McCarthy - £60k
    Austin - £60k
    Lemina - £60k
    Cedric - £55k
    Hoedt - £50k
    Carillo - £50k
    Elyounoussi - £50k
    Clasie - £40k
    Stephens - £40k
    Reed - £40k
    Gallagher - £30k

    That is £615k per week, or £32m per year.

    It is also known as, in the business, a ****ing mental waste of money.
    So only the first four in that list earn over the average premier league wage (£57.6k per week). Worth bearing in mind when discussing the apparent parlousness of our financial situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Wayman View Post
    So what happens to all those players who do not make the final PL first team squad, cannot find a club to take them yet are still on our books... Austin for example?

    I suppose Ralph will say 'not my problem" but how do you handle umpteen surplus but expensively remunerated footballers who will not even be allowed to figure in training.

    There are still a few weeks to go in this window so a mass exodus is still possible and one or two show real signs of being rehabilitated.
    In reality, loans with heavily subsidised wages is the main solution.

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    I'd reckon if we want to shift them for transfer fees, especially to European middling clubs or championship clubs we'll end up subsidising some of those wages.

    Lemina should be little issue, seems to be plenty takers who'll pay the fee and we should even earn a profit there on transfer fee I reckon. I think Cedric, Austin, McCarth, Gallagher, Reed and Boufal we should be able to sell for decent fees and not have to subsidise the wages. Clasie should have some takers in Holland and seems willing to drop his wages.


    Its Hoedt, Forster, Carillo, and Elynoussi are the ones that are going to be hard to shift. On big wages and they have basically all either been bad out on loan or basically have barely played in a year, so can't see many takers.

    I reckon those 4 will end up on loan or just sitting here eating up wages.

    I think the rest will have enough suitors and we'll clear wages and pick up a decent transfer fee.

  9. #2059

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    Quote Originally Posted by verlaine1979 View Post
    So only the first four in that list earn over the average premier league wage (£57.6k per week). Worth bearing in mind when discussing the apparent parlousness of our financial situation.
    FFFP is also worth consideration as we can’t sell a few of them due to making huge losses in our annual report.

  10. #2060

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    Quote Originally Posted by sir_fred View Post
    FFFP is also worth consideration as we can’t sell a few of them due to making huge losses in our annual report.
    Almost all of them have been here a couple of seasons now - presumably their book value would have been marked down over the percentage of their contract already.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unbelievable Jeff View Post
    This - we need to ensure that we get the wage bill down - it'll give us much more opportunity to bring in players:

    Forster - £80k
    McCarthy - £60k
    Austin - £60k
    Lemina - £60k
    Cedric - £55k
    Hoedt - £50k
    Carillo - £50k
    Elyounoussi - £50k
    Clasie - £40k
    Stephens - £40k
    Reed - £40k
    Gallagher - £30k

    That is £615k per week, or £32m per year.

    It is also known as, in the business, a ****ing mental waste of money.
    You’re spot on about the wages being the main problem.

    I know there is still time, but the concerning thing is how close we are to genuinely shifting anyone.

  12. #2062

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    Free transfer the lot.... Haha

  13. #2063

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSAINT View Post
    You’re spot on about the wages being the main problem.

    I know there is still time, but the concerning thing is how close we are to genuinely shifting anyone.
    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSAINT View Post
    You’re spot on about the wages being the main problem.

    I know there is still time, but the concerning thing is how close we are to genuinely shifting anyone.
    Clearly we are going to end up keeping some we would rather get rid of, which is less than ideal.

    I am worried that there are about 30 days of the window left and its feasible to need the following as a minimum I would say:

    Sales/Loans:

    Austin
    Gallagher
    Carillo
    Boufal
    Lemina
    McCarthy or Forster
    Reed
    Hesketh
    Clasie
    At least one CB
    Cedric

    Buys:
    CB
    Fullback cover (if Cedric goes)
    CM (if Lemina goes)

    Thats basically a deal completed every two days until the end of the window.

    I think Cedric will end up staying til hia contract expires and therefore we won't bring in a full back.

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    We need a big sign outside the stadium. "Everything must go, 5 million each!"

  15. #2065

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    any sign of a CB, anyone?

  16. #2066

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    Quote Originally Posted by DT View Post
    any sign of a CB, anyone?
    No chance unless we ship Hoedt and/or Stephens out.

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  17. #2067

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    It'll be another season of shipping goals if we're not going to sign a CB. Pretty sure we will though.

  18. #2068

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    Quote Originally Posted by verlaine1979 View Post
    So only the first four in that list earn over the average premier league wage (£57.6k per week). Worth bearing in mind when discussing the apparent parlousness of our financial situation.
    Eh? Why does it matter that only 4 out of the 12 players listed earn over the PL average wage? Surely the relevant fact is that we're spending £32m a year on players that have no future at the club?!

  19. #2069

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Eh? Why does it matter that only 4 out of the 12 players listed earn over the PL average wage? Surely the relevant fact is that we're spending £32m a year on players that have no future at the club?!
    And that is the crux of the matter. Paying for stuff we are not or have no intention of using is ruinous to our ultimate goal.

    What’s even more annoying is there is jack we can do about it.

  20. #2070

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    If we can't get them to go what's the answer?

    Do we let them train with the squad when RH wants to work with his core to get them playing well together?
    Do we let them become the B team in training and hope they don't injure the A teamers?!
    Do we make them train with the U-23s?
    Do send them off on gardening leave?
    Do we accidentally leave them behind in China?
    Send them out on loan (Totton, Sholing, who knows) and pay all the wages?
    Ask someone from Chelsea how they manage it? Monk??!!

  21. #2071

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    Quote Originally Posted by suewhistle View Post
    If we can't get them to go what's the answer?

    Do we let them train with the squad when RH wants to work with his core to get them playing well together?
    Do we let them become the B team in training and hope they don't injure the A teamers?!
    Do we make them train with the U-23s?
    Do send them off on gardening leave?
    Do we accidentally leave them behind in China?
    Send them out on loan (Totton, Sholing, who knows) and pay all the wages?
    Ask someone from Chelsea how they manage it? Monk??!!
    The difference sue is that Chelsea have players that other clubs want on loan. Our fringe players are sh1te. The reality is that those surplus to requirements will train, be available if needed and take the wages. Its a horrendous situation and I can't think of another club who have wasted such a huge amount on transfer fees and wages.

  22. #2072

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    The difference sue is that Chelsea have players that other clubs want on loan. Our fringe players are sh1te. The reality is that those surplus to requirements will train, be available if needed and take the wages. Its a horrendous situation and I can't think of another club who have wasted such a huge amount on transfer fees and wages.
    Off the top of my head, Everton, West Ham, Bournemouth, Man Utd. In fact all clubs gamble in the market -some transfers come off and some don’t. In many respects we’ve been more successful than most.

  23. #2073

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    Quote Originally Posted by Faz View Post
    Off the top of my head, Everton, West Ham, Bournemouth, Man Utd. In fact all clubs gamble in the market -some transfers come off and some don’t. In many respects we’ve been more successful than most.
    not recently we haven't.....last last 24 months, I would suggest

  24. #2074

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Eh? Why does it matter that only 4 out of the 12 players listed earn over the PL average wage? Surely the relevant fact is that we're spending £32m a year on players that have no future at the club?!
    Since our total wage bill is about £113m, that means about 28% of wages are going on players who 'have no future at the club' (though I'd suggest from that list, McCarthy, Lemina, Cedric and Austin would probably make most match day squads if present and fit, so you can remove them from the waste equation - if they're still here, they'll play significant parts).

    We have a large-ish squad, in which not all players are in contention for the first team. We don't appear to pay above the average PL wage, and at £80k, our highest earner earns around the same as the highest earners at Watford, Newcastle and less than the highest earner at Wolves (source https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobbymc.../#3b10f8433938).

    So my point is simply that our situation seems no different to any other club of our stature. As a % of turnover, we spend around the same as Palace, Bournemouth and Leicester on wages - we aren't a special case and the club has no excuse to plead poverty on this account.

  25. #2075

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    Quote Originally Posted by verlaine1979 View Post
    Since our total wage bill is about £113m, that means about 28% of wages are going on players who 'have no future at the club' (though I'd suggest from that list, McCarthy, Lemina, Cedric and Austin would probably make most match day squads if present and fit, so you can remove them from the waste equation - if they're still here, they'll play significant parts).

    We have a large-ish squad, in which not all players are in contention for the first team. We don't appear to pay above the average PL wage, and at £80k, our highest earner earns around the same as the highest earners at Watford, Newcastle and less than the highest earner at Wolves (source https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobbymc.../#3b10f8433938).

    So my point is simply that our situation seems no different to any other club of our stature. As a % of turnover, we spend around the same as Palace, Bournemouth and Leicester on wages - we aren't a special case and the club has no excuse to plead poverty on this account.
    Surely you can see that having at least 12 unwanted players on our books earnings circa £32m a year is a bad thing and a bar to us bringing in other players and growing as a club? Frankly how that compares to other clubs is irrelevant, it's a fact that hampers out club and that's all that matters.

  26. #2076

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Surely you can see that having at least 12 unwanted players on our books earnings circa £32m a year is a bad thing and a bar to us bringing in other players and growing as a club? Frankly how that compares to other clubs is irrelevant, it's a fact that hampers out club and that's all that matters.
    Having a smaller, better paid squad and ability to pay that bit more to players will obviously increase the quality of players available.

  27. #2077

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    Quote Originally Posted by egg View Post
    Surely you can see that having at least 12 unwanted players on our books earnings circa £32m a year is a bad thing and a bar to us bringing in other players and growing as a club? Frankly how that compares to other clubs is irrelevant, it's a fact that hampers out club and that's all that matters.
    My point is that all clubs recruit unsuccessfully, and I don't see any reason why our list of 'players with no future' (many of whom were matchday squad regulars last season) is any more of a burden than it is on other clubs of similar means who are able to outspend us.

  28. #2078

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    Quote Originally Posted by tajjuk View Post
    Kind of agree though most of our forward players are suited to pressing opposition defenders (very natural for the likes of Long and Ings for example), but Ralph doesn't really play a gegenpress a la Klopp, we press the opposition high up the pitch if they play out from the back, but tend to play more of a low block if they have more advanced possession, so I don't think there is as much requirement for our defenders to push so far up the pitch, mainly because we don't have as much possession as say a Liverpool. We are more a counter attack based team.

    That will mean less space in behind and less need for super quick centrebacks, though they are nice to have.

    But it does put more onus on the midfield being highly mobile, which is why I agree we need a more mobile DM than Romeu long term.

    Plus it would be great to have someone who can dribble out of opposition presses to start attacks, a Dembele like player and the sort of role Naby Keita played for Ralph at Leipzig. Though you'd think Lemina could play this role, but obviously he wants to move on.
    Perceptive post amongst a thread full of meaningless nonsense.

    Agree with you that a more mobile DM should be our top priority for Ralph’a likely system.

  29. #2079

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    Quote Originally Posted by baggytrousers View Post
    Perceptive post amongst a thread full of meaningless nonsense.

    Agree with you that a more mobile DM should be our top priority for Ralph’a likely system.
    Kalvin Phillips is that man.... I know we have been tenuously linked with him before and Leeds are of course desperate to keep him, but if we can move on some of our "for sale" players then we should have enough to put in a bid.
    Anyone know if we are still registering an interest with Phillips?

  30. #2080

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    Quote Originally Posted by Foxstone View Post
    Kalvin Phillips is that man.... I know we have been tenuously linked with him before and Leeds are of course desperate to keep him, but if we can move on some of our "for sale" players then we should have enough to put in a bid.
    Anyone know if we are still registering an interest with Phillips?
    Seems Spurs want him and if thats the case, they will get him.

  31. #2081

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    CB please

  32. #2082

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toadhall Saint View Post
    CB please
    What’s happening to our CB we want?

    (1) Been involved in a competition and is now on holiday.
    (2) The other club are looking for a replacement first?
    (3) Still trying to sort out a price for one?
    (4) Going to give a current donkey at the club a 2nd/3rd/4th Chance?
    (5) Dont have a 5th one!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pilchards View Post
    What’s happening to our CB we want?

    (1) Been involved in a competition and is now on holiday.
    (2) The other club are looking for a replacement first?
    (3) Still trying to sort out a price for one?
    (4) Going to give a current donkey at the club a 2nd/3rd/4th Chance?
    (5) Dont have a 5th one!

    5) The most obvious one of all - run out of cash, and can't afford one

    6)The one we wanted doesn't want to come/is awaiting other offers
    7)Ross can't find one in the Black Box
    8Les hadn't paid the meter on the Black Box

  34. #2084

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger View Post
    5) The most obvious one of all - run out of cash, and can't afford one

    6)The one we wanted doesn't want to come/is awaiting other offers
    7)Ross can't find one in the Black Box
    8Les hadn't paid the meter on the Black Box
    (9) we're waiting to sell Lemina as we can't afford one without doing that

  35. #2085

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saints foreva View Post
    It'll be another season of shipping goals if we're not going to sign a CB. Pretty sure we will though.
    100% agree ... let's hope the wait isn't in vain

  36. #2086

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    The biggest, most important signing for us right now, and has been for an age, is a centre back. Really hope we're pulling out all the stops to get one.

  37. #2087

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    Starting to believe we have a clear CB target in mind but we're possibly waiting on the host club finding a replacement. Think Ralph wants a leader and someone he possibly knows/trusts. Either of the two Leipzig players Orban or Upamecano may be the ones we're pursuing

  38. #2088

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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsaint View Post
    Starting to believe we have a clear CB target in mind but we're possibly waiting on the host club finding a replacement. Think Ralph wants a leader and someone he possibly knows/trusts. Either of the two Leipzig players Orban or Upamecano may be the ones we're pursuing
    Could be right as they are spending big on getting Lookman back with some of the money from us perhaps?

  39. #2089

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    There is more chance of Carillo being PL top scorer than us signing Upamecano.

  40. #2090

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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsaint View Post
    Starting to believe we have a clear CB target in mind but we're possibly waiting on the host club finding a replacement. Think Ralph wants a leader and someone he possibly knows/trusts. Either of the two Leipzig players Orban or Upamecano may be the ones we're pursuing
    Then we're dreaming as they're not leaving an upwardly mobile Champions' League club to join our annual relegation dogfight.

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  41. #2091

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyell View Post
    Then we're dreaming as they're not leaving an upwardly mobile Champions' League club to join our annual relegation dogfight.

    Sent from my F3311 using Tapatalk
    Ralph could have the influence and its not like players havent left a champions league club to join mid table PL clubs before. Better to dream and either player signing is more likely than old timer Cahill who still gets a mention on here

  42. #2092

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyell View Post
    Then we're dreaming as they're not leaving an upwardly mobile Champions' League club to join our annual relegation dogfight.

    Sent from my F3311 using Tapatalk
    Of course they would they would double the wages

  43. #2093

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    Quote Originally Posted by Faz View Post
    Seems unlikely.
    Why not

    You cant sack somebody because they are unwell you usually come to some arrangement

  44. #2094

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    RB Leipzig back in for the oft-Saints-linked Ademola Lookman according to the BBC. Not sure we'd still be interested now we have Djenepo anyway.

  45. #2095

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    so far, we have moved on Targett and Gallagher

    thought we would have shifted more by now

  46. #2096

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batman View Post
    so far, we have moved on Targett and Gallagher

    thought we would have shifted more by now
    It's much harder to sell players that nobody wants. I expect the players aren't that interested in most of the teams that are interested in for them and are hoping that more attractive offers come in later in the window if the clubs that they want to move to have other targets that fall through.

  47. #2097

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    Quote Originally Posted by Useful Idiot View Post
    It's much harder to sell players that nobody wants. I expect the players aren't that interested in most of the teams that are interested in for them and are hoping that more attractive offers come in later in the window if the clubs that they want to move to have other targets that fall through.
    Exactly this. I don't think many of the ones we're trying to offload would prioritise playing regularly above continuing to draw better pay for doing very little.

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  48. #2098

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batman View Post
    so far, we have moved on Targett and Gallagher

    thought we would have shifted more by now
    They were two of the easiest to offload as they are young, not absolute turkeys, have good attitudes, are capable of playing regularly, are not on huge salaries and we only wanted small fees for them. The other players we want to get rid of, like Lemina and Carrillo, don't tick many of those boxes. But, so far, on balance, this has still been our best transfer window for some time and Ralph seems to have brought some common sense back to our transfer activity.

  49. #2099

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batman View Post
    so far, we have moved on Targett and Gallagher

    thought we would have shifted more by now
    The only other ones I thought may be gone by now are Clasie, Stephens and Austin the rest will be last couple of weeks loans or abroad after our window shuts.


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    Just more proof of how much money Les was responsible for losing by paying exorbitant fees for utter dross which we now cannot even give away.

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