25 man squad

How will it look? There’s still time for it to change, but I’d say it’s initially looking like...

GK: Gunn, McCarthy, Lewis*

RB: Cedric.

LB: Bertrand.

CB: Yoshida, Vestergaard, Bednarek, Stephens, Hoedt.

CM: Romeu, Hojbjerg, JWP, Armstrong, Reed.

AM: Redmond, Djenepo*, Elyounoussi, Boufal, Sims.

Str: Adams, Ings, Long.

That’s 23 as it stands (assuming we are keeping the re-integrated Boufal, Cedric And Hoedt), But not including Forster, Carillo, Lemina, McQueen, Austin, Hesketh, Barnes, or Youth players like Valery, Vokins, Klarer, Slattery, Obafemi and all the others.

Who else makes the cut/do you think will be missing?

*Are Djenepo and Lewis classed as under-age players?

Lewis is over 21 but Djenepo has one more season as an U21

How will it look? There’s still time for it to change, but I’d say it’s initially looking like...

 

GK: Gunn, McCarthy, Lewis*

 

RB: Cedric.

LB: Bertrand.

CB: Yoshida, Vestergaard, Bednarek, Stephens, Hoedt.

 

CM: Romeu, Hojbjerg, JWP, Armstrong, Reed.

 

AM: Redmond, Djenepo*, Elyounoussi, Boufal, Sims.

 

Str: Adams, Ings, Long.

 

That’s 23 as it stands (assuming we are keeping the re-integrated Boufal, Cedric And Hoedt), But not including Forster, Carillo, Lemina, McQueen, Austin, Hesketh, Barnes, or Youth players like Valery, Vokins, Klarer, Slattery, Obafemi and all the others.

 

Who else makes the cut/do you think will be missing?

 

*Are Djenepo and Lewis classed as under-age players?

that defence will have us finish comfortably in the bottom half

We’re a good CB away from being comfortably top half though

GK: Gunn, McCarthy, Forster, Lewis

CB Bednarek, Vestergaard, Yoshida, Stephens, Klarer*

RB: Valery*, Cedric, Ramsey*

LB: Bertrand, Vokins*, McQueen (when back from injury)

CM: Højbjerg, Romeu, Reed, Slattery*

AM: Ward-Prowse, Redmond, Boufal, Djenepo*, Armstrong, Sims

FWD: Ings, Adams, Long, Obafemi*

23 Over 21's so far assuming that Hoedt, Lemina, Elyounoussi and Austin wont be part of things

7 Under 21's

CB is still the glaring position.

GK: Gunn, McCarthy, Forster, Lewis

 

CB Bednarek, Vestergaard, Yoshida, Stephens, Klarer*

RB: Valery*, Cedric, Ramsey*

LB: Bertrand, Vokins*, McQueen (when back from injury)

 

CM: Højbjerg, Romeu, Reed, Slattery*

AM: Ward-Prowse, Redmond, Boufal, Djenepo*, Armstrong, Sims

 

FWD: Ings, Adams, Long, Obafemi*

 

23 Over 21's so far assuming that Hoedt, Lemina, Elyounoussi and Austin wont be part of things

7 Under 21's

 

CB is still the glaring position.

That's actually 22. What are your plans for Barnes, Hesketh and Carrillo?

That's actually 22. What are your plans for Barnes, Hesketh and Carrillo?

Oh dear Maths....

I don’t think Barnes will get any first team time so loan or more Under 23 time.

Equally as much as I like Hesketh I just don’t see how he fits into the squad. So probably loan or sale.

I’m hoping that Carrillo to Boca gets over the line.

We’re a good CB away from being comfortably top half though

Comfortably top half?

Wolves, Everton, Leicester would still finish above us. Probably west ham too

We’re a good CB away from being comfortably top half though

we finished 16th last season and 17th the season before.

We have an even weaker defence, have signed a young lad from France and someone from the championship - who looks decent to be fair.

and you think we are just 1 player away from being 'comfortably' in the top half?

your head has well and truly gone! (along with those predicting we will finish 7th etc)

We are comfortably not top half.

we finished 16th last season and 17th the season before.

We have an even weaker defence, have signed a young lad from France and someone from the championship - who looks decent to be fair.

 

and you think we are just 1 player away from being 'comfortably' in the top half?

 

your head has well and truly gone! (along with those predicting we will finish 7th etc)

I agree that we're a long way from being comfortably top half, but how has out defence got weaker? We've lost Targett and gained Cedric (and Hoedt but that may not be a gain). Midfield / attack has gained Boufal, and up front we've added Adams and Djenepo. Looks like we've strengthened from front to back to me.

I agree that we're a long way from being comfortably top half, but how has out defence got weaker? We've lost Targett and gained Cedric (and Hoedt but that may not be a gain). Midfield / attack has gained Boufal, and up front we've added Adams and Djenepo. Looks like we've strengthened from front to back to me.

because we have 1 recognised left back to chose from

Bertrand was out a fair bit last season and Targett was fairly decent coverage - ie, he was a left back, playing left back in an already shyte defence.

Cedric was also here last season.

We have an even weaker defence, have signed a young lad from France and someone from the championship - who looks decent to be fair.

 

your head has well and truly gone! (along with those predicting we will finish 7th etc)

1) Who did Saints sign from France this summer?

2) How is the defence weaker than last season? Cedric is back and Vokins is very promising... I'd say we have a stronger defence now than we finished last season with!

1) Who did Saints sign from France this summer?

2) How is the defence weaker than last season? Cedric is back and Vokins is very promising... I'd say we have a stronger defence now than we finished last season with!

didnt we have cedric last season, before he was pushed out for being not very good?

I remember lots of posts saying good riddance etc and how shyte he had become

now, having Cedric and Hoedt is like strengthening the team...with our own players?

Obviously, I meant Belgium

Vokins is not as good as targett, simple as that

TL;DR

We had cedric, vokins and Hoedt last season.

We were shyte in defence with them. So much so,we push 2 of them out as not deemed good enough and the other maybe made 1 appearance? if any at all!

We are comfortably not top half.

True. Even RH recognised that at the fans forum indicating he would settle for somewhere between 9th and 14th. TBH, after the last two seasons, and at this stage of rebuilding, I’d very happily settle for 14th.

because we have 1 recognised left back to chose from

Bertrand was out a fair bit last season and Targett was fairly decent coverage - ie, he was a left back, playing left back in an already shyte defence.

Cedric was also here last season.

Feck me, you're obtuse. We shipped Cedric out half way through last season so he was barely available for RH. He's a new player to RH this season. People (you I suspect if I could be bothered to look) slated Targett as not good enough. Cedric is no less able than Targett to cover Bertrand. He can cover RB also so unless you're arguing that him covering there ahead of Ramsey is not an upgrade then even you'd accept that RB has been strengthened. Vokins is a huge talent (and don't be a huge helmet again and ask me to define huge). Hoedt at least gives another option ahead of Stephens and injury cover so we're better placed. Our defence is better than it was for the latter half of last season.

because we have 1 recognised left back to chose from

Bertrand was out a fair bit last season and Targett was fairly decent coverage - ie, he was a left back, playing left back in an already shyte defence.

Cedric was also here last season.

When chambers came through as alternative to clyne did we only have one recognized right back.

Unless we add some steel to the team, I feel we could be in for another disappointing season. We have too many bottlers in our team and we need desperately a leader who can organize our defence . If Stephens starts next week, then it shows yet again how our glaring deficiencies have failed to be addressed again

Unless we add some steel to the team, I feel we could be in for another disappointing season. We have too many bottlers in our team and we need desperately a leader who can organize our defence . If Stephens starts next week, then it shows yet again how our glaring deficiencies have failed to be addressed again

Who are the "bottlers"?

Who are the "bottlers"?

We threw away more points from winning positions then any other team in the Premier League last season. We are fragile mentally and have been for a while. We lack the toughness to get the job done on many occasions, thats why we need a personnel change. Bottlers - Stephens, Cedric, Vestegaard, Romeu, Hoedt, Yoshida etc... Too many players that wilt under pressure and make mistakes. Hope this cleared it up for you.

Feck me, you're obtuse. We shipped Cedric out half way through last season so he was barely available for RH. He's a new player to RH this season. People (you I suspect if I could be bothered to look) slated Targett as not good enough. Cedric is no less able than Targett to cover Bertrand. He can cover RB also so unless you're arguing that him covering there ahead of Ramsey is not an upgrade then even you'd accept that RB has been strengthened. Vokins is a huge talent (and don't be a huge helmet again and ask me to define huge). Hoedt at least gives another option ahead of Stephens and injury cover so we're better placed. Our defence is better than it was for the latter half of last season.

So how do they make us stronger now?

Unless Ralph never had a say?

But these are players Ralph shipped out for not being good enough.

So how do they make us stronger now?

 

Unless Ralph never had a day?

Do we have better options at right back...

1) During the second half of last season

2) Now

???

Do we have better options at right back...

 

1) During the second half of last season

2) Now

 

???

With defence, I'd argue it's a question of experience.

Valery/Cedric is stronger than Valery/Ramsay, so long as Cedric is content playing second fiddle and puts the performances in when required of him. No disrespect to Ramsay of course who may go on to become a good player, but Cedric has the experience.

Whether Bertrand/Vokins is stronger than Bertrand/Targett remains to be seen, although Targett did have a fairly decent season last year when covering for Bertrand, hence the transfer fee received. That said, with Cedric back (and eventually McQueen if he gets fit and ends up taking a squad place) we do seem to have more cover for left back than we had last season if Vokins does fail to make the step up successfully. (Although we all hope he's the next Luke Shaw/Wayne Bridge!)

Playing a back 3 as we were/currently are, then Yoshida, Vestergaard, Stephens and Bednarek was/are not a good enough amount of centre backs. Hoedt adds depth and experience, but like Stephens is prone to mistakes and lapses in concentration, and in a perfect world both would be shipped off and we'd bring in a complete, quality centre back and switch to Ralph's preferred back 4... but this is far from a perfect world. As it stands, if we continue with 3 at the back, then arguably we ARE stronger than last season because of the addition of the more experienced Hoedt over, say, Alfie Jones who was effectively our 5th choice CB last season, or Klarer this season.

Still, we do have more quantity than quality in defensive areas, and time is running out to sort it out. Fingers crossed for the next 5 days.

But these are players Ralph shipped out for not being good enough.

So how do they make us stronger now?

 

Unless Ralph never had a say?

Seriously question that Cedric was shipped out because he was not good enough. He was shipped out because he didn't enthusiastically sign up to Ralph's new ways. After half a season kicking his heels on the bench at Roma and a good talking to by his new wife he has seen the light and realised that he is better off at Saints fighting for a place and eventually a move to a bigger club. Not even sure that Hoedt was shipped out for being not good enough, but anyway looks like he is going anyway so who cares.

But these are players Ralph shipped out for not being good enough.

So how do they make us stronger now?

 

Unless Ralph never had a say?

They make us stronger because we didn't have them during the second half of last season. Do you seriously say that having Cedric available as an option at RB or LB makes our defence weaker? Seriously? Do you also believe that having Hoedt as strength in depth/an alternative to Stephens makes us weaker than not having him?

I suspect you agree with me and you're just trolling - nobody can seriously say that our defence is weaker now than it was at the end of last season.

They make us stronger because we didn't have them during the second half of last season. Do you seriously say that having Cedric available as an option at RB or LB makes our defence weaker? Seriously? Do you also believe that having Hoedt as strength in depth/an alternative to Stephens makes us weaker than not having him?

 

I suspect you agree with me and you're just trolling - nobody can seriously say that our defence is weaker now than it was at the end of last season.

seems weird if having them here makes us stronger when we decided to ship them out (without replacement) when we were looking relegation in the face

kind of weird way to go about it

seems weird if having them here makes us stronger when we decided to ship them out (without replacement) when we were looking relegation in the face

 

kind of weird way to go about it

Your point was that having them around makes our defence weaker than last season. I don't get your rationale one bit. We'll have to agree to disagree with your assessment. To my mind nobody could seriously argue that Cedric + Vokins + Hoedt in place of Targett make us weaker in defence. Very odd.

Your point was that having them around makes our defence weaker than last season. I don't get your rationale one bit. We'll have to agree to disagree with your assessment. To my mind nobody could seriously argue that Cedric + Vokins + Hoedt in place of Targett make us weaker in defence. Very odd.

Ralph wanted them out (and no one else came in). I doubt he did so with a view to purposely make us worse.

Ralph wanted them out (and no one else came in). I doubt he did so with a view to purposely make us worse.

I'm not sure whether you're a tedious troll or what. Decisions from last season are completely irrelevant to your stupid argument that we are weaker with Cedric/Hoedt/Vokins in place of Targett. We aren't.

seems weird if having them here makes us stronger when we decided to ship them out (without replacement) when we were looking relegation in the face

 

kind of weird way to go about it

You spent most of January and February arguing that we had a dreadful transfer window and that shipping out Cedric on loan was bound to end in us being relegated. Ralph, according to you, was taking us the same way as Swansea went the previous year. Didn't you get an infraction for using the phrase "deadwood" so often in a mocking context when referring to Cedric?

Surely therefore we must be stronger now that we have him in the squad. Isn't that what you wanted and repeatedly argued for ???? .... or is this another example of Batman's famous changes of mind ???