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Donald Trump Appreciation Thread


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  1. 1. Who would you vote for?

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13 hours ago, buctootim said:

The idea didnt originate with Trump, it was already circulating in January 2020. He simply jumped on it months later. 

Quite. And the scientists who have been working on that theory - the parallel one being wet markets - didn’t refer to the virus as the ‘Kung Flu’ to appeal to their bigoted supporter base. 

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4 hours ago, saint1977 said:

And the scientists who have been working on that theory - the parallel one being wet markets - didn’t refer to the virus as the ‘Kung Flu’ to appeal to their bigoted supporter base. 

They were unable to have their research peer reviewed as Nature and other "scientific" journals, refused to publish them. It's behind a paywall, but this article in this mornings Telegraph sums up what I have thought since the virus was first identified:

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The World Health Organization sent a team to Beijing to explore the origin of the virus. The team, which the Chinese government  hand-picked and led around by the nose, reported that it was “extremely unlikely” that the virus had escaped from a lab and “likely to very likely” that it had emerged naturally.
But this was not quite the propaganda victory the Chinese may have hoped for. What became clear in the wake of the WHO team’s conclusions was that the Chinese, after a year of presumably intensive search, had been unable to provide a single scrap of evidence that the virus had emerged naturally. The SARS1 epidemic left copious traces in the environment, including the bat population that harboured the virus, the animal species to which it first jumped, and the 20 or so mutational changes made as it adapted to humans. Strangely, the SARS2 virus has left not a single such trace. For the first time since the pandemic began, the natural emergence scenario began to look a little shaky.
Right from the start, there were two plausible explanations for where the Covid virus might have come from. The decoding of its genome in January 2020 showed it belonged to a well known family of bat viruses called beta-coronaviruses. One member of this family caused the SARS1 epidemic of 2002 by jumping first from bats to civets, an animal sold for meat in Chinese wet markets, and from civets to people. A second virus set off the MERS epidemic of 2012 by infecting camels and then people.
When Chinese authorities announced that the first cases of Covid had occurred at the wet market in Wuhan in December 2019, it was an easy assumption that the new virus, SARS-CoV2 or SARS2 for short, had followed the same route as SARS1 to becoming a human pathogen. The wet market connection was soon broken – Chinese researchers reported earlier cases in Wuhan with no link to the wet market. But that seemed not to matter when so much further evidence in support of natural emergence was expected shortly.
From early on, public and media perceptions were shaped in favour of the natural emergence scenario by strong statements from two scientific groups.

“We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that Covid-19 does not have a natural origin,” a group of virologists and others wrote in The Lancet on February 19, 2020, when it was really far too soon for anyone to be sure what had happened. Scientists “overwhelmingly conclude that this coronavirus originated in wildlife,” they said, calling on readers to stand with Chinese colleagues on the frontline of fighting the disease.
Contrary to the letter writers’ assertion, the idea that the virus might have escaped from a lab invoked accident, not conspiracy. It surely needed to be explored, not rejected out of hand. A defining mark of good scientists is that they go to great pains to distinguish between what they know and what they don’t know. By this criterion, the signatories of the Lancet letter were behaving as poor scientists: they were assuring the public of facts they could not know for sure were true.
It later turned out that The Lancet letter had been organised and drafted by Peter Daszak, president of the EcoHealth Alliance of New York. Dr Daszak’s organisation funded coronavirus research at the Wuhan Institute of Virology. This arguably acute conflict of interest was not declared to The Lancet’s readers. To the contrary, the letter concluded: “We declare no competing interests.”
Why would anyone want to create a novel virus of greater pathogenicity? Virologists argue they can get ahead of a potential pandemic by exploring just how close a given animal virus might be to making the jump to humans. These enhancements of viral capabilities are known blandly as gain-of-function experiments but are so obviously dangerous that from 2014 to 2017 the US government placed a moratorium on funding them.

With coronaviruses, there was particular interest in the spike proteins, which jut out all around the spherical surface of the virus and pretty much determine which species of animal it will target. In 2000, Dutch researchers, for instance, earned the gratitude of rodents everywhere by genetically engineering the spike protein of a mouse coronavirus so that it would attack only cats.
At the Wuhan Institute of Virology in China, virologists have been doing exactly these kinds of experiments. The programme is headed by Dr Zheng-li Shi, known as Bat Lady in China because of her intense interest in bat viruses. Dr Shi gathered many coronaviruses from the bats that live in caves in Yunnan in southern China. She then took the spike protein genes from various viruses and inserted them into the genomes of other viruses. The goal was to explore the natural ability of the various spike proteins to attack human cells. As with other gain-of-function studies, the idea was to explore the genetic pathways by which an animal virus might jump to humans, and thus help forestall an impending epidemic.
Dr Shi tested her viruses out not on real people but on cultures of human cells or on humanised mice. These are mice that have been genetically engineered to carry in the cells of their airways the human protein that’s the target of the SARS1 and SARS2 viruses.

But this programme may have put her on track to create viruses far more infectious than she realised, possibly including SARS2.

“It is clear that the Wuhan Institute of Virology was systematically constructing novel chimeric coronaviruses and was assessing their ability to infect human cells and human-ACE2-expressing mice,” says Richard H. Ebright, a molecular biologist at Rutgers University and leading expert on biosafety.

“It is also clear,” Dr Ebright says, “that, depending on the constant genomic contexts [ie. the particular viral backbone] chosen for analysis, this work could have produced SARS-CoV-2 or a proximal progenitor of SARS-CoV-2.”

How do we know for sure that this is what Dr Shi was doing? Because, by a strange twist in the story, she was funded by grants from the National Institutes of Health, the US equivalent of the Medical Research Council. These grant proposals, channelled through Dr Daszak, and a matter of public record, make clear that she was testing the ability of various spike proteins to infect humanised mice.
Not only was Dr Shi generating chimeric viruses – those made from a mixture of two viral genomes and thus potentially having novel properties – she was doing so in what would now be argued were unsafe conditions, even though they were in line with international rules. Despite many photos online of her working in a bubble suit in the highest-level safety lab, known as a BSL4, all her coronavirus work was done at lower safety levels, she said in an interview with Science, including one known as BSL2.
Despite the fancy acronym, BSL2 doesn’t require very much. You have to wear a lab coat and gloves, do experiments under a hood, put up a biohazard warning, and that’s about it.
“It is clear that some or all of this work was being performed using a biosafety standard  –  biosafety level 2, the biosafety level of a standard US dentist’s office  – that would pose an unacceptably high risk of infection of laboratory staff upon contact with a virus having the transmission properties of SARS-CoV-2,” says Dr Ebright.
There is a long history of viruses escaping from even the best run laboratories. The smallpox virus escaped three times from labs in England in the 1960s and 1970s, causing 80 cases and three deaths. Dangerous viruses have leaked out of labs almost every year since. Coming to more recent times, the SARS1 virus has proved a true escape artist, leaking from laboratories in Singapore, Taiwan, and no less than four times from the Chinese National Institute of Virology in Beijing.
Concern about safety conditions at the Wuhan lab was not, it seems, misplaced. According to a fact sheet issued by the State Department on January 15, 2021, “The US government has reason to believe that several researchers inside the WIV became sick in autumn 2019, before the first identified case of the outbreak, with symptoms consistent with both Covid-19 and common seasonal illnesses.”
1. Origin
The bats that harbour the closest known relatives of SARS2 live in caves in Yunnan in southern China. If the pandemic had first infected people living round the caves, that would strongly favour natural emergence. But it broke out 1,500km away in Wuhan, at a time of year when bats go into hibernation. Under the natural emergence scenario, it’s hard to see how the virus might have emerged somewhere outside Wuhan, and then popped up in the city without leaving any trace of its real origin.
Under the lab escape scenario, explanation is no struggle: researchers at the Wuhan Institute of Virology were cooking up hyper-dangerous viruses in arguably inadequate safety conditions, and one escaped.
2. Natural history
Viruses jumping to new hosts usually take a lot of time, and many mutations, before perfecting their adjustment to the new target species. This process has been mapped in detail for the SARS1 virus. But researchers looking for the same process of adaptation in SARS2 made a strange discovery. From the moment it first appeared, the SARS2 virus was almost perfectly adapted to human cells and has hardly changed at all since.
This is hard to explain in the natural emergence scenario. But from the lab escape scenario it’s pretty obvious. The virus was being grown in humanised mice, so of course was well adapted to people from the start.
3. The Furin cleavage site
Without getting too deeply into the details of the SARS2 virus’s anatomy, there is a small region of its spike protein, called the furin cleavage site, which is coded for by 12 units of its 30,000-unit genome.  
A virus usually acquires inserts like this by recombination – the accidental exchange of genomic units with a related virus when both invade the same cell. But no other known sarbecovirus – that’s the name of SARS2’s family – has this 12-unit insert. A virus cannot usually acquire, by recombination, an element its family does not possess.
The insert also contains entities known as arginine codons, of a variety which is common in humans but not in coronaviruses like SARS2.
What should happen now? The Chinese authorities have been under no pressure to open up their records because, until now, the world’s media have complaisantly accepted the natural emergence scenario. China would cease to get a free ride if credible scientific bodies like the Royal Society and the US National Academy of Sciences, either separately or jointly, were to appoint expert groups to examine both scenarios of origin. A strong conclusion by these and other institutions in favour of exploring the virus’s origins would for the first time put the onus on China to cooperate.
Given the nature of authoritarian states, China is unlikely to yield easily to the emerging new view of the pandemic’s origin. But the prospect of becoming the world’s pariah for the foreseeable future might go some way to deter further stonewalling.

Luckily for the West, MI6 are going to assist the US Intelligence agencies:

Quote

Britain's intelligence agencies are helping the US investigate whether Covid leaked from a Chinese laboratory, The Telegraph has learned.The move comes after Joe Biden, the US President, ordered American intelligence officials to "redouble" their efforts to identify the origins of the virus and report within 90 days.Mr Biden ordered the review following claims by leading Western scientists that the virus was man-made and not transmitted by animals as originally claimed.    British intelligence officials have conducted their own investigation into the origins of the pandemic following claims that Covid came from a laboratory in China – a claim the Chinese government has consistently denied.On Friday night, Sir Richard Dearlove, a former head of MI6, said the situation was becoming an "intelligence issue" where British security services may need to "incentivise" Chinese defectors to get to the truth if China did not open up its research to scrutiny. Sir Richard, who has consistently said that a lab escape of an engineered virus is a likely scenario for the outbreak of coronavirus, said it was "outrageous" that journals had failed to publish reports from leading scientists that challenged the standard view."It seems to me there has been absolutely no scientific debate," he told The Telegraph. "The Chinese made an assertion without any explanation and that the majority of the scientific community seem to accept it at face value. It's clear that they've run an information operation to try and suppress any other view."Some scientific journals absolutely refused to publish anything that disagreed with the Chinese view. I put Nature at the front of the queue, Nature has been absolutely outrageous in the way they have co-operated with the Chinese narrative. "This is the biggest disruptive event globally since World War Two. It's huge. We sit there and we take at face value what the Chinese say, and what I'm advocating is an absolutely clear debate and a proper discussion, and not complete suppression. "If it did come out of the lab it raises all sorts of questions about virological research, and the mere fact this has happened and disrupted all the world's economy, what does that say to an aggressive malign regime who might want to go mucking around with a virus?"

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Trump was right, again:

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The NHS is to offer patients radical antibody treatments which could prevent the worst effects of Covid if given within three days. Sir Simon Stevens, the head of the NHS, has asked health services to gear up to provide the antibody cocktails, which in future could keep patients out of hospital. The drugs were given emergency approval in the United States last year after Donald Trump, former president, claimed they "cured" him after he contracted Covid. 

106730902-1601939458946-AP20279831275678

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Daily Telegraph reports the antibody treatment is set to be rolled out, the FT and various other outlets report that in trials the treatment failed to live up to expectations.

Personally I doubt DT ever had Coronavirus and it was all just a publicity stunt.

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2 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

What was he right about?

Err....

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The drugs were given emergency approval in the United States last year after Donald Trump, former president, claimed they "cured" him after he contracted Covid. 

Previously, that well known billionaire, philanderer and Epstein chum, Bill Gates stated in October, 2020:

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Billionaire tech icon and philanthropist Bill Gates says it is “inappropriate” to refer to the experimental coronavirus monoclonal-antibody treatment that President Donald Trump received earlier this month as a “cure.”

Sir Simon Stevens, head of the NHS obviously disagrees with Bonking Bill Gates, asking yesterday that the  health services to get ready to administer the antibody cocktails, aka, the "Trump Treatment"

 

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Science relies on collecting data, you cannot just claim stuff are cures and then go round injecting people with stuff. How science actually works is people who have spent a lot of time acquiring knowledge, but mostly learning how to get a machine to give you a correct number, to use that existing information to make guesses at what would happen if we did something. Then they try varriations of it to see if what they expected to happen did or not, and then use the obtained information to refine it or rule it out.

 

it does not occur when people look at stuff and just say things with no back ground knowledge and no actual measuring. looking at stuff and proclaiming it to be a certain thing without proper study is what philosophers do and there scientific success rate was low.

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2 hours ago, Antrimsaint said:

Lol, too true. Apparently his own wife didn’t turn up to his own birthday. Totally irrelevant and a sad stain on democracy. Good riddance 

Is that Guided "jihadi John" Missile that you are referring to or the Donald?

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On 28/05/2021 at 17:54, Guided Missile said:

The Chinese are the only people that know for certain, whether or not the virus escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology. If they thought it jumped species in a wet market, it would be in their interests to continue to investigate how exactly that happened. They don't want to, because they have something to hide. So, all the other conclusions are so unlikely, that, together with the behaviour of the CCP, it makes the lab escape conclusion the only one left standing. My guess is that Biden has received intelligence that proves it and will be making it public, soon. That and the impending defection of the person responsible for the containment of viruses in the lab., Shi Zhengli, will provide all the proof needed, although I am afraid she and her lab notebooks are living on borrowed time.

Looks like the net is closing, guys. The first rat deserts the sinking ship:

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Rumours abounded on Friday night that China's top spycatcher had defected to the US, amid a growing focus in Washington on the theory that Covid-19 escaped from a Wuhan laboratory. Dong Jingwei, vice minister of state security, was reported to have flown from Hong Kong to the US in February with his daughter. There was no confirmation of the rumoured development from either the US or China

Over 3.5 million dead. China has to pay for this.

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  • 1 month later...
9 hours ago, Turkish said:


🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

That is so sad.

But wondering why Trump isn't helping the US-boys to win something. As it is "all in my head" I guess it is also "all in his legs" what is necessary.

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I have disliked the womens US team since they complained it was not fair that Sweden parked the bus at the last Olympics. Not helped by their complaining about the deal they negotiated was unfair and rejecting an alternative because they wanted a system with more guaranteed income and benefits but lower bonuses, then to complain when they figured out they would be better off with the alternative deal.

The US team has had a significant advantage over their rivals for many years that dominance is coming to an end and they wlll have to get use to it.

However trump is still a cu......

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  • 1 month later...
1 hour ago, buctootim said:

Just read he never ever went upstairs in the White House because he has bathmophobia - the fear of slopes or stairs. That's more bizarre than most of the bizarre things he did.   

Interesting. How brave of him then to build a skyscraper and call it Trump Tower. Does he have an office there on the ground floor?

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1 hour ago, buctootim said:

Just read he never ever went upstairs in the White House because he has bathmophobia - the fear of slopes or stairs. That's more bizarre than most of the bizarre things he did.   

That's got to be fake news, surely?

The guy's a nutter, but surely he would use the lift? (Apparently they have three in the white House).

Maybe explains why he was so incompetent coming down the stairs of the plane...

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15 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

That's got to be fake news, surely?

The guy's a nutter, but surely he would use the lift? (Apparently they have three in the white House).

Maybe explains why he was so incompetent coming down the stairs of the plane...

It’s in a recently published book based on 200 interviews with staffers. Seems well sourced and a bit too weirdly random to be fake. If you were going to make something up to damage him it would be something more direct surely?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-stairs-white-house-staff-b1874272.html%3Famp

 

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On 25/09/2021 at 16:03, swannymere said:

Still waiting for some of the predictions in the last couple of pages to be proved correct, unlike certain posters claiming they were gold standard nailed on. Hmm Tick tock.

Please remind us what predictions you are talking about.

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Donald Trump has overtaken President Biden in favourability ratings among American voters only eight months after the transfer of power — a remarkable turnaround that is attributed to crises at home and abroad.
He has a positive rating of 48 per cent compared with Biden’s 46 per cent in a new Harvard-Harris poll, a result that reflects dismay among US voters over the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan, surging numbers of coronavirus cases, migrants flocking to the Mexican border and deadlock in Congress, where the Democratic president’s ambitious plans are stuck in the mud.

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2 hours ago, Guided Missile said:

Donald Trump has overtaken President Biden in favourability ratings among American voters only eight months after the transfer of power — a remarkable turnaround that is attributed to crises at home and abroad.
He has a positive rating of 48 per cent compared with Biden’s 46 per cent in a new Harvard-Harris poll, a result that reflects dismay among US voters over the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan, surging numbers of coronavirus cases, migrants flocking to the Mexican border and deadlock in Congress, where the Democratic president’s ambitious plans are stuck in the mud.

A withdrawal from Afghanistan that Trump precipitated; a surge in Covid due to people folowing the "scamdemic" theories Trump suporters adhere to and promote; the migrants are always there; the deadlock in Congress is due to Republicans and Democrats refusing to work together on ideological grounds - many Republicans still support the "stolen election" falsehoods, and many Republican states are bringing in new gerrymandering laws to limit the access to polling sites in predominantly Democratic wards.

If DT had won the election the Afghan situation would have been the same, ditto the migrants and thedeadlock in Congress. The Covid situation may well have been worse.

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8 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

So you're suggesting that Biden is a better President than Trump was in his first year? #deluded 

FYI: Biden hasn't had a year in office yet, and he started in the dog's dinner of a pandemic response that Trump left, let alone trying to deal with the toxic fallout from the Jan 6th coup attempt. My chickens would probably make better Presidents than Trump - at least their heads are still attached.

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10 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

A withdrawal from Afghanistan that Trump precipitated; a surge in Covid due to people folowing the "scamdemic" theories Trump suporters adhere to and promote; the migrants are always there; the deadlock in Congress is due to Republicans and Democrats refusing to work together on ideological grounds - many Republicans still support the "stolen election" falsehoods, and many Republican states are bringing in new gerrymandering laws to limit the access to polling sites in predominantly Democratic wards.

If DT had won the election the Afghan situation would have been the same, ditto the migrants and thedeadlock in Congress. The Covid situation may well have been worse.

You mean gerrymandering like this?

Or is there another word when Democrats do it?

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8 hours ago, Picard said:

You mean gerrymandering like this?

Or is there another word when Democrats do it?

Hey, i just like destroying GM's delusions. I'm not saying the Dems don't do it - from my point of view the US Political setup is deeply corrupt all round, and as a definition of Democracy falls far short of even the UK version.

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10 hours ago, Picard said:

You mean gerrymandering like this?

Or is there another word when Democrats do it?

You are mixing up two separate issues.

One is redistricting, which is our boundary commission process, standard stuff that happens every ten years and the advantage always sits with whatever party is in power in each state, the reps and dems will both be acting in the same manner up and down the country.

The other is bringing in voting laws that have the intended consequence of restricting peoples access to vote. This is being carried out by the Republicans.

No democracy should seek to reduce the electorate, especially not the self proclaimed greatest democracy in the world.

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18 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

Remember Trump’s 'Covid cocktail'? It could be a vital weapon in this winter’s pandemic fight The former President's use of experimental therapy Ronapreve was met with alarm but, a year on, it has arrived in the UK with NHS approval.

What about the injection of bleach, or finding some way of getting artificial sunlight inside a patient's lungs ?

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31 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

Mate, you have shit for brains, like Biden. 

It may be shit but at least he HAS a brain, you just have a void space between your ears that acts like an echo chamber for whichever trite news headline you have encountered that day.

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10 hours ago, Guided Missile said:

Remember Trump’s 'Covid cocktail'? It could be a vital weapon in this winter’s pandemic fight The former President's use of experimental therapy Ronapreve was met with alarm but, a year on, it has arrived in the UK with NHS approval.

You're mixed up again, there was no alarm when Trump was given ronapreve. The alarm was for him advocating a tremendous light and washing the inside of your body. Then there was a bit of mocking when he did get ill because he didn't go for the crazy alternative therapies he was advocating for the man in the street, but straight for proper regular medicine, you know the type developed and by those awful experts and scientists. It's good that this treatment is now available for everyone and not just shit American presidents.

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3 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

You're mixed up again, there was no alarm when Trump was given ronapreve. The alarm was for him advocating a tremendous light and washing the inside of your body. Then there was a bit of mocking when he did get ill because he didn't go for the crazy alternative therapies he was advocating for the man in the street, but straight for proper regular medicine, you know the type developed and by those awful experts and scientists. It's good that this treatment is now available for everyone and not just shit American presidents.

Apparently Trump doesnt exercise as he reckons the heart only produces a certain number of heartbeats and he doesnt want to waste too many on exercise and that is why he uses a golf cart whenever he plays golf..

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11 minutes ago, spyinthesky said:

Apparently Trump doesnt exercise as he reckons the heart only produces a certain number of heartbeats and he doesnt want to waste too many on exercise and that is why he uses a golf cart whenever he plays golf..

His wives and mistresses must have been very disappointed.

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