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I know this is heresy but I think Gao hasnt done that badly considering he has his hands tied by te Chinese government.

He has allowed people like Semmens to get on with his job and IMo done that well.

We would all like to have an owner who spends like theres no tomorrow but very few are lucky enough to have one of those

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23 hours ago, SuperSAINT said:

 

From the BBC:

"The deal to take total ownership could be worth in excess of £500m." 

"He said the 49ers' plans were "pure" and promised to make Leeds "one of the biggest clubs in the world".

"He added they plan to keep Elland Road, but modernise and increase the capacity of the stadium."

 

Leeds United: San Francisco 49ers have option to buy 100% of club and Elland Road by January 2024 - BBC Sport

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4 hours ago, Nordic Saint said:

From the BBC:

"The deal to take total ownership could be worth in excess of £500m." 

"He said the 49ers' plans were "pure" and promised to make Leeds "one of the biggest clubs in the world".

"He added they plan to keep Elland Road, but modernise and increase the capacity of the stadium."

 

Leeds United: San Francisco 49ers have option to buy 100% of club and Elland Road by January 2024 - BBC Sport

Fuck I am getting envious of these buyouts now. 

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17 minutes ago, Saint86 said:

Anyone know how much debt are leeds are in relative to saints?

Think the issue isn't debt, the issue is the clubs perception to outsiders, the media love to tell the world how massive leeds, newcastler etc are, whereas the perception they give of us is the perennial strugglers, a little club on the south coast, now if you wanted to buy a club who would you buy?

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1 minute ago, Millbrook Saint said:

Think the issue isn't debt, the issue is the clubs perception to outsiders, the media love to tell the world how massive leeds, newcastler etc are, whereas the perception they give of us is the perennial strugglers, a little club on the south coast, now if you wanted to buy a club who would you buy?

Both are far bigger clubs than us to be fair. Leeds is i think the third or fourth biggest city in the UK and only has one club. Unlike most other clubs of comparable size who have at least two.

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39 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Both are far bigger clubs than us to be fair. Leeds is i think the third or fourth biggest city in the UK and only has one club. Unlike most other clubs of comparable size who have at least two.

For what it's worth I don't think Leeds are a bigger club then Southampton, but...

...yes Leeds is a bigger city. Stats are a little all over the place and there hasn't been a good estimate since 2018, but Leeds was 7th based off of the 2018 data (after London, Birmingham, Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester and Sheffield) but 4th looking at the 2011 census. Southampton is around 15th. However when you look at the wider metropolitan area of Southampton it's significantly higher up the list

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57 minutes ago, Millbrook Saint said:

Think the issue isn't debt, the issue is the clubs perception to outsiders, the media love to tell the world how massive leeds, newcastler etc are, whereas the perception they give of us is the perennial strugglers, a little club on the south coast, now if you wanted to buy a club who would you buy?

Maybe. But I would expect anybody contemplating spending serious money would be looking at more than perception: likely return on investment, increase of profile and potential for growth for example.

We have a finite local fan base that seems to be a maximum of 30,000 to attend games and a maybe 100,000 (200,000?) more who would call themselves supporters but don't attend games.  These are not big numbers compared to the national and worldwide followings of the "big six" and clubs like Newcastle, Leeds and even Everton.  Yes, there is potential to improve our numbers and make us a major "brand".  But that will give a much slower return than buying a club that is already halfway there.  

I hope we do find someone with the means and desire to build us into a bigger club. But I temper that hope with realism about who we are and who has that sort of money to say goodbye to.

 

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1 hour ago, Turkish said:

Both are far bigger clubs than us to be fair. Leeds is i think the third or fourth biggest city in the UK and only has one club. Unlike most other clubs of comparable size who have at least two.

True, only one football club, but then we don't  have the popularity of rugby to compete with.  I'd still put them ahead of us in the "big club" list though.

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1 hour ago, Millbrook Saint said:

Think the issue isn't debt, the issue is the clubs perception to outsiders, the media love to tell the world how massive leeds, newcastler etc are, whereas the perception they give of us is the perennial strugglers, a little club on the south coast, now if you wanted to buy a club who would you buy?

If I'm spending £500m on something I would do my own research plus use respected advisors, not look at what the media tells me.

We can put a positive spin on us too - a famed academy and only recently as 5 years ago a good decent scouting system in place.

Plus, we are based in the South, near London, and have been a consistent PL club.

Just because someone is overpaying for Leeds for £400m doesn't mean they will become amazing.

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23 minutes ago, Christophenburg said:

For what it's worth I don't think Leeds are a bigger club then Southampton, but...

...yes Leeds is a bigger city. Stats are a little all over the place and there hasn't been a good estimate since 2018, but Leeds was 7th based off of the 2018 data (after London, Birmingham, Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester and Sheffield) but 4th looking at the 2011 census. Southampton is around 15th. However when you look at the wider metropolitan area of Southampton it's significantly higher up the list

Leeds metropolitan area is significantly bigger than Southamptons, (which also contains Portsmouth!) I live in the area and until you do you have no idea of the amount of support they have. The town i live in is 15 miles from Leeds and the majority of people who live here are Leeds fans. Interested to know why you dont think Leeds are a bigger club.

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3 minutes ago, Wurzel said:

True, only one football club, but then we don't  have the popularity of rugby to compete with.  I'd still put them ahead of us in the "big club" list though.

Rugby is definitely more popular for sure, but football is still a clear number one by some distance. I'm not a member at Saints any more but could easily get a ticket for most games this season at St Marys. Leeds has been sold out every week and you need to buy a membership to even get in with a chance of a ticket and most games sell out well in advance. 

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42 minutes ago, Christophenburg said:

For what it's worth I don't think Leeds are a bigger club then Southampton, but...

...yes Leeds is a bigger city. Stats are a little all over the place and there hasn't been a good estimate since 2018, but Leeds was 7th based off of the 2018 data (after London, Birmingham, Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester and Sheffield) but 4th looking at the 2011 census. Southampton is around 15th. However when you look at the wider metropolitan area of Southampton it's significantly higher up the list

They so are a bigger club in every sense, history, fanbase, honours, achievements...

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26 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Leeds metropolitan area is significantly bigger than Southampton's, (which also contains Portsmouth!) I live in the area and until you do you have no idea of the amount of support they have. The town i live in is 15 miles from Leeds and the majority of people who live here are Leeds fans. Interested to know why you dont think Leeds are a bigger club.

Oh it does absolutely, but it doesn't go north or eastwards though. My rough Saint's catchment area is roughly only comparable to Leeds city population itself, not even factoring in the wider met area which, as you say, is huge - 4th largest in the country and with only 3 football teams of note.

I suspect why I don't think Leeds is a bigger club is probably irrelevant - by any real metric it is (fanbase, achievements etc.), just doesn't feel like it is, purely subjective.

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2 minutes ago, Christophenburg said:

Oh it does absolutely, but it doesn't go north or eastwards though. My rough Saint's catchment area is roughly only comparable to Leeds city population itself, not even factoring in the wider met area which, as you say, is huge - 4th largest in the country and with only 3 football teams of note.

I suspect why I don't think Leeds is a bigger club is probably irrelevant - by any real metric it is (fanbase, achievements etc.), just doesn't feel like it is, purely subjective.

I am guessing an age thing as Leeds haven't done a lot in the last twenty years.

As others have said, it's not really a debate.

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Do you have to be a big city to be a big club? Is past club success what makes a team 'Big' or is it the size of the city? I'd say it is the past success that is more important. I can see the logic of, the bigger the city the more potential fans there are to make money from. But there must be some examples of top teams in sports around the world who don't have big cities, but because of their past success have fans all over the world?

Either way does it matter? If the right owner comes along with the right motives and big enough wallet, then any team could potentially become a big team and win things. And by doing so increase their fan base numbers along the way. 

Southampton the city is in a great commercial location and the club has a rich history and currently has a great infrastructure to build from. I really do hope we can attract an owner with a vision and the financial clout to take us forward and make us competitive.  It would be great to know if the recent rumours are genuine or just put out in to the public to try and stir up interest again. I have no inside information but my current feeling is there probably isn't really much happening. I hope I am wrong and there is a serious bidder just waiting to finalise everything but I'll believe it when I see it. 

Edited by Saint J 77
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16 minutes ago, Christophenburg said:

Oh it does absolutely, but it doesn't go north or eastwards though. My rough Saint's catchment area is roughly only comparable to Leeds city population itself, not even factoring in the wider met area which, as you say, is huge - 4th largest in the country and with only 3 football teams of note.

I suspect why I don't think Leeds is a bigger club is probably irrelevant - by any real metric it is (fanbase, achievements etc.), just doesn't feel like it is, purely subjective.

i'm going to hazard a guess you are under 30. When Leeds got promoted to the old first division i'd barely even heard of them as they hadn't been a top flight team for 10 years or so during the 80s. It was only then that i realised how big they are. Even more so since moving to the area. Their catchment area does go north. i'm north of it. Leeds are a bigger club than us in ever single sense. Leeds catchment area is much bigger than us as well, in every single sense.

 

Edited by Turkish
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1 hour ago, Turkish said:

Leeds are a bigger club than us in every single sense. 

Not in terms of infrastructure they aren't. Bigger stadiums, but it is run down compared to ours. Staplewood is also better than they have. I'm not disputing them having a bigger fanbase.

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1 minute ago, Matthew Le God said:

Not in terms of infrastructure they aren't. Bigger stadiums, but it is run down compared to ours. Staplewood is also better than they have. I'm not disputing them having a bigger fanbase.

Since when have the size of a club been defined by how good their training ground is or if the paint on the walls is nicer? Kevin Hart Laughing GIF by Kevin Hart's Laugh Out Loud

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Leeds has been a sleeping giant for years, I hoped it would stay that way because I knew once they woke up the potential is unlimited. I lived there five years in the Revie-Bremner period, they were a vile lot and when they sank I hoped they would stay sunk but now the revival is on--look out!

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3 hours ago, Christophenburg said:

For what it's worth I don't think Leeds are a bigger club then Southampton, but...

...yes Leeds is a bigger city. Stats are a little all over the place and there hasn't been a good estimate since 2018, but Leeds was 7th based off of the 2018 data (after London, Birmingham, Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester and Sheffield) but 4th looking at the 2011 census. Southampton is around 15th. However when you look at the wider metropolitan area of Southampton it's significantly higher up the list

Guess you are about 10 years old if you think Leeds Utd is not a bigger club than Saints. Staggering.🤔

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Just now, thesaint sfc said:

Surely all this who is bigger stuff is nonsense? Man City were purchased when they were in close proximity to arguably the biggest club in the country.

And Man City are a bigger club than us too, even before they were bought by the Arabs 

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1 hour ago, Dellman said:

Leeds has been a sleeping giant for years, I hoped it would stay that way because I knew once they woke up the potential is unlimited. I lived there five years in the Revie-Bremner period, they were a vile lot and when they sank I hoped they would stay sunk but now the revival is on--look out!

They are what Pompey think they are.

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1 hour ago, Billy the Kidd said:

To be fair to MLG - you did say "bigger in every sense", and his example was an area they are behind us, and likely other clubs.

That said, id imagine they could fix that pretty quickly with investment.

They are behind us in that we have a better training ground. As far as I’m aware how good your training ground is has never really been a factor in how big a club you are. 

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2 hours ago, Saint J 77 said:

Do you have to be a big city to be a big club? Is past club success what makes a team 'Big' or is it the size of the city? I'd say it is the past success that is more important. I can see the logic of, the bigger the city the more potential fans there are to make money from. But there must be some examples of top teams in sports around the world who don't have big cities, but because of their past success have fans all over the world?

 

I guess you could argue Villarreal are quite a big club, yet they come from a town of only 30,000 which is incredible really. Outside of football you have the Green Bay Packers who are quite big in American football but Green Bay's population is just over 100000. They are exceptions to the rule though, generally more people = more fans/revenue = more success.

I have family in Leeds who are big fans so know the place fairly well, they are very passionate about their team and have a very big catchment area with lots of surrounding towns. Saints and the City of Southampton by comparison are very small, there's no shame in admitting that. We do alright for our size but it would be nice to have some ownership with a bit of vision.

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13 minutes ago, Turkish said:

They are behind us in that we have a better training ground. As far as I’m aware how good your training ground is has never really been a factor in how big a club you are. 

I wouldn’t disagree, it wasn’t really what was said. 

And on reflection all the bigger than this stuff is well boring so I’m leaving it there 😅

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2 hours ago, Turkish said:

Since when have the size of a club been defined by how good their training ground is or if the paint on the walls is nicer? 

Since when has there been a definitive list of what constitutes 'bigger'?

I don't see why looking at club infrastructure isn't relevant it is where a lit of value is for a takeover. Do you not think moving from the Dell to St Mary’s made Saints 'bigger'?

Edited by Matthew Le God
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10 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Just checking, is this the Leeds that is going through planning applications for a 55,000 stadium?  Because comparing their size to us given any sort of stadium metric is deeply flawed. 

We were talking about the present, not hypotheticals. 

As of today... Saints have...

- a higher quality but smaller stadium

- a higher quality training ground

- a smaller fanbase

In any case 'bigger' club debates are nonsense. There is no definitive criteria and so what if a club is 'bigger'? 

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Just now, Matthew Le God said:

We were talking about the present, not hypotheticals. 

As of today... Saints have...

- a higher quality but smaller stadium

- a higher quality training ground

- a smaller fanbase

In any case 'bigger' club debates are nonsense. There is no definitive criteria and so what if a club is 'bigger'? Most people would say Sunderland are bigger than Burnley, yet are two leagues below.

Yes, today they have a stadium that is 20% bigger than ours and they have plans underway to drastically improve it. The quality of the stadium doesn’t make much difference at all. Parts of Anfield are utterly shocking but one would be an idiot to suggest they’re anything other than one of the biggest clubs in the world.

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9 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

We were talking about the present, not hypotheticals. 

As of today... Saints have...

- a higher quality but smaller stadium

- a higher quality training ground

- a smaller fanbase

In any case 'bigger' club debates are nonsense. There is no definitive criteria and so what if a club is 'bigger'? 

Bit weak to add training/stadium to the argument to be honest. Leeds have a much bigger stadium and with a bit of investment that could be built out to be even bigger and aesthetically cleaned up. Historically it's one of the most well known grounds in the country and Europe.

I'd say as of today they have a much better mix of players than us too, more financial clout (even before this takeover) and higher revenue pull from all over the world due to their name, which no matter what you say is much, much bigger and well defined than Southampton.

Also, have you seen the outside of St Mary's recently? It doesn't look particularly higher quality, we don't seem to have the money to improve on it either given that those 'screens' have fallen by the wayside.

Edited by S-Clarke
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6 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Yes, today they have a stadium that is 20% bigger than ours and they have plans underway to drastically improve it. The quality of the stadium doesn’t make much difference at all. Parts of Anfield are utterly shocking but one would be an idiot to suggest they’re anything other than one of the biggest clubs in the world.

Please take note my final sentence. 

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1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

Bit weak to add training/stadium to the argument to be honest. Leeds have a much bigger stadium and with a bit of investment that could be built out to be even bigger and aesthetically cleaned up. Historically it's one of the most well known grounds in the country and Europe.

I'd say as of today they have a much better mix of players than us too, more financial clout (even before this takeover) and higher revenue pull from all over the world due to their name, which no matter what you say is much, much bigger and well defined than Southampton.

Also, have you seen the outside of St Mary's recently? It doesn't look particularly higher quality, we don't seem to have the money to improve on it either given that those 'screens' have fallen by the wayside.

Please take note of my final sentence.

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