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Saints vs Liverpool — Build-up & Match


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4 minutes ago, Totton Saint said:

Does Barcelona use tactics or play spontainusly? Not to mention Brazil in the seventies. Tactics are strangling the game. Saints v WHU springs to mind

Yes, Barcelona in 2020 use tactics.  A huge amount of work goes into preparing for each game, far more than the Saints team of 60 years ago you mentioned. 

Brazil 50 years ago also used tactics, but significantly less detailed.

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27 minutes ago, Totton Saint said:

I ca remember in the sixties rarely knew who the manager was (Ted Bates was an exception )let alone see lingering close ups of them  and their antics on TV every so often and missing the action in the meantime. The cult of managers has come with the arrival of televised games and the celebrity phenomenum

I remember Mick Channon saying that Lawrie Mac used to buy good players and just let them play. Those days are long gone.

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On 29/12/2020 at 23:06, S-Clarke said:

Agreed, it's only going one way whetherr you agree with it or not.

Tier 5 mooted (which will apparently include curfews) and almost certainly a 'pause' of all professional sport.

Meet 2021, same as 

Edited by Toussaint
Was talking bollox for a change
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28 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Yes, Barcelona in 2020 use tactics.  A huge amount of work goes into preparing for each game, far more than the Saints team of 60 years ago you mentioned. 

Brazil 50 years ago also used tactics, but significantly less detailed.

Preparing for a game is different from coaching during the game. I meant why not use the training (preparation)to take precedence.I realise that tactics are now used and need to change during a game but what are captains for. How can players be watching the manager for instructions at the same keeping their concentration on playing football? I accept that maybe I am living in the past and hankering for a golden age when the game was free of shirt tugging and diving, greed etc

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Newcastle effectively stifled the Scousers attack last night and it was interesting to see the league leaders resorting to long speculative balls over to the wings in order to try and breakdown the Geordies defence..... but without success. Not only that but in the early part of the game Newcastle looked the better side and should have gone ahead from at least one of the chances they created. The Liverpool defence looked all over the place at times and their much lauded full backs looked anything but the world class players that many hold them to be.

This should give us real encouragement as we comprehensively outclassed Newcastle in all departments and won convincingly when they came to St Mary's earlier in the season. That doesn't mean that there are grounds for complacency, far from it but it could mean that Liverpool can be beaten especially when they are on the road. This just might be one of the big upsets of the weekend fixtures.

I can see the copy lines now after Danny Ings grabs a hat-trick against his old muckers!

Edited by Charlie Wayman
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16 hours ago, Archers Road Stand said:

Newcastle were quite lucky that Liverpool didn't have their shooting boots on. They were wasteful, just like they were against WBA. 

Newcastle's keeper was also man of the match, on another day could easily have been 0-2. But it does give us hope we could get something, would 100% take a 0-0 if offered now 

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1 hour ago, EBS1980 said:

What makes you say that? Not sure what he did wrong and would have just been implementing  instructions 

I didn't say he did anything wrong, far from it. But he isn't a touchline coach, very important, underappreciated assistant to Ralph, who doesn't appear to welcome the limelight. At least he kept Dave Watson out of the picture.

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Anyone have any news on Vestergard? Or when he sustained what kind of knee injury he has? Is he now three weeks away form a return?

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10 minutes ago, DT said:

Anyone have any news on Vestergard? Or when he sustained what kind of knee injury he has? Is he now three weeks away form a return?

I think Ralph's press conference is this afternoon isn't it? :)

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21 hours ago, Totton Saint said:

I have a good feeling about this match. Can't explain why.

Oh, I do hope you are right. I would love a win. I would feel more optimistic if we had played the last couple of games with the sort of enthusiasm and never say die attitude we had a few weeks ago. My son calls them LiVARpool. I hope they don't get too much of that going their way. COYS!!!

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11 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

Oh, I do hope you are right. I would love a win. I would feel more optimistic if we had played the last couple of games with the sort of enthusiasm and never say die attitude we had a few weeks ago. My son calls them LiVARpool. I hope they don't get too much of that going their way. COYS!!!

Thanks for the reply. I hope Saints pace themselves during the whole game and not overdo the pressing first half, only to run out of steam second half.

Maybe the weeks break has had a positive effect

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On 31/12/2020 at 12:36, Totton Saint said:

I ca remember in the sixties rarely knew who the manager was (Ted Bates was an exception )let alone see lingering close ups of them  and their antics on TV every so often and missing the action in the meantime. The cult of managers has come with the arrival of televised games and the celebrity phenomenum

1937? 

Edited by Midfield_General
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Can't see anything other than a Liverpool win by at least two goals, they are too strong across the park..... please please Prove me wrong saints. Would be nice to at least score a goal 

Edited by Mr X
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On 31/12/2020 at 12:36, Totton Saint said:

I ca remember in the sixties rarely knew who the manager was (Ted Bates was an exception )let alone see lingering close ups of them  and their antics on TV every so often and missing the action in the meantime. The cult of managers has come with the arrival of televised games and the celebrity phenomenum

Nonsense. Clough, Allison, Docherty, Atkinson, Revie etc etc, all larger than life and outspoken characters who regularly made headlines.

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6 minutes ago, cloggy saint said:

Nonsense. Clough, Allison, Docherty, Atkinson, Revie etc etc, all larger than life and outspoken characters who regularly made headlines.

Some did, but how often during the game did you see repeated close ups of the managers?

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20 hours ago, VectisSaint said:

I didn't say he did anything wrong, far from it. But he isn't a touchline coach, very important, underappreciated assistant to Ralph, who doesn't appear to welcome the limelight. At least he kept Dave Watson out of the picture.

Hard to judge that from the tv coverage. He seemed to spend most of the game in the technical area whenever the camera showed it so assume he was being active rather than just standing there watching the game 

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14 hours ago, SuperSAINT said:

 

Hmm! Not sure this is wise, there is so much that isn't known about this virus.

If people don't believe a positive result then why would they believe a negative one? Sounds like the philosophy here is keep testing until you get the result you want. Never trust anybody who has a vested interest in brushing problems under the carpet.

If he does turn up for training before Monday then please SFC make sure he wears mask. At least it will help limit the damage that could be done.

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Unfortunately I think it's going to be a long time until we see any points again. Liverpool, Leicester,  Leeds and Arsenal will be very stern tests.  Normal service is about to be resumed methinks. 

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3 hours ago, cloggy saint said:

Nonsense. Clough, Allison, Docherty, Atkinson, Revie etc etc, all larger than life and outspoken characters who regularly made headlines.

 

10 minutes ago, Totton Saint said:

Were these managers in the sixties

Yes. All of them apart from Ron Atkinson and he started managing in 1971 so was close.

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29 minutes ago, Totton Saint said:

Were these managers in the sixties

Most, and doesn't even include Bill Shankly or even Matt Busby who were huge personalities, especially Shanks. 

Reason you didn't get managers in your face during TV coverage in the 60s was because of the limited number of cameras in use, BBC  and ITV basically showed the action because they didn't have access to much else, nowt to do with not showing personality managers. 

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2 hours ago, EBS1980 said:

Hard to judge that from the tv coverage. He seemed to spend most of the game in the technical area whenever the camera showed it so assume he was being active rather than just standing there watching the game 

I think maybe you are over analysing and completely missing the point. 

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5 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

How often during the game did you see repeated close ups of the managers?

You didn't for good reason... TV companies only had one camera at a game in the 1960s!

Edited by Matthew Le God
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2 hours ago, Charlie Wayman said:

Hmm! Not sure this is wise, there is so much that isn't known about this virus.

If people don't believe a positive result then why would they believe a negative one? Sounds like the philosophy here is keep testing until you get the result you want. Never trust anybody who has a vested interest in brushing problems under the carpet.

If he does turn up for training before Monday then please SFC make sure he wears mask. At least it will help limit the damage that could be done.

It turned out his contact that caused the isolation was twice retested due to a suspected false positive and both tests negative RH tested negative. No apparent problem.

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3 hours ago, Charlie Wayman said:

Hmm! Not sure this is wise, there is so much that isn't known about this virus.

If people don't believe a positive result then why would they believe a negative one? Sounds like the philosophy here is keep testing until you get the result you want. Never trust anybody who has a vested interest in brushing problems under the carpet.

If he does turn up for training before Monday then please SFC make sure he wears mask. At least it will help limit the damage that could be done.

The testing is a bit farcical ... Wtf .... False positives and false negatives !!!

You get your temperature taken if you visit a hospital or other establishments which again means nothing. You can have Covid for several days before a temperature develops and that is apparently the period where you are most contagious..

The science is still so unreliable and the scientists still groping in the dark..

If Ralph feels well he may as well be at work..

 

 

 

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Only one way this is going...0-4 L’Pool. We’ll knock it around a bit and take at least 50% possession, but ultimately not score because of the ponderously slow build-up play allowing 11 men to get behind the ball. They’ll hit us on the break...0-1 at HT with the remainder coming as we try to catch the game. We just don’t have the quality I the team to match them.

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2 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Only one way this is going...0-4 L’Pool. We’ll knock it around a bit and take at least 50% possession, but ultimately not score because of the ponderously slow build-up play allowing 11 men to get behind the ball. They’ll hit us on the break...0-1 at HT with the remainder coming as we try to catch the game. We just don’t have the quality I the team to match them.

You are quite possibly right, but Fulham, Brighton, West Brom and Newcastle have all matched them (all draws) within the past month or two, and I don't see them as having any more quality than us. I guess it all depends on who turns up on the day. If it's us then we stand a chance, if it's them, then we may struggle.

Edited by Saint Keef
Apostrophe in wrong place
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9 hours ago, VectisSaint said:

I think maybe you are over analysing and completely missing the point. 

Just curious as to how the original decision was made when all we have is the tv footage to use.

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5 hours ago, Saint Keef said:

You are quite possibly right, but Fulham, Brighton, West Brom and Newcastle have all matched them (all draws) within the past month or two, and I don't see them as having any more quality than us. I guess it all depends on who turns up on the day. If it's us then we stand a chance, if it's them, then we may struggle.

Understand why you’ve said that, but I don’t think any of those teams set-up to play like we. We try to play proper football and generally tend to do OK against the better teams, but only if we move the ball fast and utilise the chances which is not happening enough lately. That will make a huge difference to the outcome of the game IMO, so the likes of JWP, Bertrand, Djenepo and Adams all have to really be firing on all cylinders. Unfortunately I think the tactic will be ‘hold the ball to limit their opportunities and try to counter without causing risk’ and that conservative approach will fall straight into Klopps hands.

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11 hours ago, Matthew Le God said:

You didn't for good reason... TV companies only had one camera at a game in the 1960s!

Thank you all for these interesting comments. How wrong could I be.But certainly sparked the posters into life

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Banking on this being the match that Ingsy recovers his form in front of goal, inspired to impress against his former club.

This will have a big TV audience, hopefully do ourselves justice. No idea how this one is going to go.

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1 hour ago, jawillwill said:

Fulham game v Burnley now postponed. There's going to be a big backlog of fixtures soon...

Expect Klopp is writing out his moan and rant on the subject in case it affects them

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On 31/12/2020 at 13:40, Totton Saint said:

Preparing for a game is different from coaching during the game. I meant why not use the training (preparation)to take precedence.I realise that tactics are now used and need to change during a game but what are captains for. How can players be watching the manager for instructions at the same keeping their concentration on playing football? I accept that maybe I am living in the past and hankering for a golden age when the game was free of shirt tugging and diving, greed etc

Teams with inexpensive squads (which includes us ) need to think tactically against the big clubs. They usually have several top international players for each position. Whether it be packing the defence, pressing or when to press, options surely have to be planned. We don't yet have strength in depth, and this is going to be the main difficulty in containing Liverpool. Thank goodness Ralph is back shoutmg and cajoling from the touchline.. If we are at our best we can beat them, bu I will be thrilled to play well and not loose, whatever the score..

 

 

Edited by eelpie
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5 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Understand why you’ve said that, but I don’t think any of those teams set-up to play like we. We try to play proper football and generally tend to do OK against the better teams, but only if we move the ball fast and utilise the chances which is not happening enough lately. That will make a huge difference to the outcome of the game IMO, so the likes of JWP, Bertrand, Djenepo and Adams all have to really be firing on all cylinders. Unfortunately I think the tactic will be ‘hold the ball to limit their opportunities and try to counter without causing risk’ and that conservative approach will fall straight into Klopps hands.

Good comments. I've noticed teams seem to be countering our opportunities by setting offside traps.  Something Ralph needs to address.

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