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1 hour ago, Disco Stu said:

What with this and the Qatar world Cup I've become increasingly disillusioned with football in recent times. Everything good in this world gets eaten up by greed 😞

More and more old school fans I know are following non league clubs just for this reason, can still meet up with mates, have a few beers, go to the match on a Saturday 3pm , watch a competitive game without the hype, I think that's where the future is for people like me. 

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6 minutes ago, skintsaint said:

Hmm not sure on that one. Probably size wise on par with teams like Villa/Everton/Leeds. Only Rangers/Celtic fans i've met are ex-pats and Aussies seem to all follow EPL. Can't remember seeing any Rangers or Celtic shirts in lots of trips around Asia but again tons of locals in Utd shirts etc. USA probably have a few followers as there 8th generation Scottish or something random. 

But a lot of similar clubs to them around Europe including the likes of Marseille, Benfica, Ajax, Sevilla, Napoli, Galatasaray etc. How big is this league going to get ....or maybe that's the long term goal....3 or 4 tiers. Horrible thought that.

Can't agree, I think you're underestimating their clout and, size wise, Rangers and Celtic are  on another level to Villa/Everton/Leeds.

On a separate point, this is bad news for any SFC takeover, Gao will be lumbered with a £200m millstone around his neck with the real prospect of (as most other PL clubs) having to finance long expensive player contracts. There's a real danger that some of these owners will asset strip while there's still value in the assets.

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9 minutes ago, alehouseboys said:

Gao will be lumbered with a £200m millstone around his neck

Yep he has invested really badly here, bit like me and the timing of my investment purchases down the years 😆

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These teams are not looking to breakaway from the Premier league, this ESL is being set up to rival the champions league, clubs would only leave domestic competition if they were kicked out and I don't think the Premier league will have the balls to do that. 

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14 minutes ago, alehouseboys said:

Can't agree, I think you're underestimating their clout and, size wise, Rangers and Celtic are  on another level to Villa/Everton/Leeds.

Maybe on domestic support. Not internationally though I think you are overselling them :) Be good to see stats on that but not sure how you would measure it ! 😄

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8 minutes ago, JRM said:

I don't think the Premier league will have the balls to do that. 

Well maybe the other 14 members might have something to say especially given the fact these 6 are given I believe 500m per season to start with?

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8 minutes ago, JRM said:

These teams are not looking to breakaway from the Premier league, this ESL is being set up to rival the champions league, clubs would only leave domestic competition if they were kicked out and I don't think the Premier league will have the balls to do that. 

I think you are right. If they don’t get kicked out of the Premier League then what the hell are most of them playing for? The best you usually get is a two horse race to win the league so what are the others playing for? What’s to stop them fielding a much weakened side in a league they blatantly don’t care about therefore compromising the integrity of the league even further.

Edited by beatlesaint
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8 minutes ago, beatlesaint said:

What’s to stop them fielding a much weakened side in a league they blatantly don’t care about therefore compromising the integrity of the league even further.

Not to mention the fact these clubs can even cherry pick the best players even more from the non competing clubs. Agents are licking their lips all over this money being promised.

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10 minutes ago, Baird of the land said:

Hopefully Premier league have guts to kick out those 6 clubs.

International football could be interesting with players banned from competing, which would likely affect bigger countries more.

Well that's England f*cked!

Pope

Cash Smalling Mings Bertrand

Phillips Rice

Grealish Sancho Barnes

Calvert-Lewin

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2 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Well that's England f*cked!

Pope

Cash Smalling Mings Bertrand

Phillips Rice

Grealish Sancho Barnes

Calvert-Lewin

Think it will effect the better countries even more TBH.

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I hope that any UK broadcaster will not sign up to this 'league'. At the moment they fall over themselves to be more woke than the other, they should show some balls and turn their back on this proposal.

Edited by M271
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4 minutes ago, Baird of the land said:

Curious who the 3 gutless teams are who've indicated they want to join but just not yet. 

I was wondering the same. I think it is probably teams from 3 other countries. Maybe something like Ajax, Benfica and Celtic?

Really hope the EPL and EUFA stick to their guns and ban these 6/12 from domestic and European competitions next season.

Kick the big six out and replace with: top 3 from Championship, the teams that finish 18th and 19th in prem stay up + play-off winner from champ (don't really mind if that is from those who finish 4th-7th or 4th-6th plus (probably) Sheff Utd.

Deduct all points from the big 6 for this season so that we have legitimate teams to qualify for the EUFA competitions.

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6 minutes ago, Minsk said:

I was wondering the same. I think it is probably teams from 3 other countries. Maybe something like Ajax, Benfica and Celtic?

Really hope the EPL and EUFA stick to their guns and ban these 6/12 from domestic and European competitions next season.

Kick the big six out and replace with: top 3 from Championship, the teams that finish 18th and 19th in prem stay up + play-off winner from champ (don't really mind if that is from those who finish 4th-7th or 4th-6th plus (probably) Sheff Utd.

Deduct all points from the big 6 for this season so that we have legitimate teams to qualify for the EUFA competitions.

The Premier League could never be a fair competition if these six clubs are going to get a huge wad of extra cash every year. It’s uneven enough already  and no competition organisers could ever agree to such a gross imbalance.

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Jeez, it’s going to be boring for the majority about a third of the way through, when any realistic chance of winning has gone. The rest of the games are in effect friendlies because there’s absolutely nothing to play for. It’d be especially boring if FIFA, UEFA, and the domestic leagues stick to their guns with kicking out teams and players at both club and international level.

The Premier League would certainly survive, for every player that makes it at a Premier League club, there are hundreds that didn’t lining up to replace them.

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1 minute ago, Jimmy_D said:

Jeez, it’s going to be boring for the majority about a third of the way through, when any realistic chance of winning has gone. The rest of the games are in effect friendlies because there’s absolutely nothing to play for. It’d be especially boring if FIFA, UEFA, and the domestic leagues stick to their guns with kicking out teams and players at both club and international level.

The Premier League would certainly survive, for every player that makes it at a Premier League club, there are hundreds that didn’t lining up to replace them.

I don't think they realise that eventually even plastics would stop watching if there is absolutely nothing on the line for the majority of the season with players putting in minimal effort because of it.

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Just now, Saint_clark said:

I don't think they realise that eventually even plastics would stop watching if there is absolutely nothing on the line for the majority of the season with players putting in minimal effort because of it.

Most people, myself included, just need to look at their attitude towards their own Fantasy League team for a decent comparison.

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If we're not adding £10m to the price of Ings et al now, then we should be...

Vestergaard might well not consider Leicester now, methinks, and hold out for the loathsome Spurs.

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I can’t see anyone being kicked out of the PL for the simple reason that they’re every bit as greedy as the clubs involved. Without these six clubs, the PL TV rights will plummet, so they’ll have to cave in eventually. I think the end game is it’ll just be a sh*t Champions League replacement and the domestic leagues will become even more unbalanced.

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1 hour ago, JRM said:

More and more old school fans I know are following non league clubs just for this reason, can still meet up with mates, have a few beers, go to the match on a Saturday 3pm , watch a competitive game without the hype, I think that's where the future is for people like me. 

I really enjoyed watching Harrogate Town mate. £14 to get in, can get a beer at half time easily enough, can go to any of the 4 stands where there are terraces and stand with your mates, no idiots taking selfies. Can walk to the ground via a couple of pubs. It's definitely the way forward. 

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3 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

I can’t see anyone being kicked out of the PL for the simple reason that they’re every bit as greedy as the clubs involved. Without these six clubs, the PL TV rights will plummet, so they’ll have to cave in eventually. I think the end game is it’ll just be a sh*t Champions League replacement and the domestic leagues will become even more unbalanced.

They have to stick to their guns. This will be a rot that slowly eats away at the premier league. 

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Take this to its logical conclusion and you eventually end up with a global league.

I would not be surprised if in 30 years fans will be tuning into Sydney Sharks vs Manchester Devils or LA Galaxy vs Madrid Laticos or something like that.

Why the surprise? It's all about money and has been for decades.

And as for all the multi millionaire ex players on our screens who were more than happy to get very rich off the back of the gravy train now getting all indignant about it's inevitable conclusion, please spare me.

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6 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

They have to stick to their guns. This will be a rot that slowly eats away at the premier league. 

If I were them, the best f**k you I could think of (without any legal ramifications) would be to rearrange all their PL fixtures so they're the day before their ESL games.  

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1 hour ago, M271 said:

I hope that any UK broadcaster will not sign up to this 'league'. At the moment they fall over themselves to be more woke than the other, they should show some balls and turn their back on this proposal.

They will - but like everything else, because of money. Sky and BT won't be able to compete with a proper global streaming services like Amazon, YouTube or Facebook. TV rights are up for auction again soon.

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2 hours ago, alehouseboys said:

Can't agree, I think you're underestimating their clout and, size wise, Rangers and Celtic are  on another level to Villa/Everton/Leeds.

On a separate point, this is bad news for any SFC takeover, Gao will be lumbered with a £200m millstone around his neck with the real prospect of (as most other PL clubs) having to finance long expensive player contracts. There's a real danger that some of these owners will asset strip while there's still value in the assets.

No doubt. The financial impact on the other clubs will be disastrous, unless there are large handouts from the "Super" clubs. Clubs rely on a TV deal to survive and that deal will be massively diminished in value. Good chance of clubs folding on the back of this.

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2 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

Mourinho has just quit his Spurs job, if it's related to this then massive respect to him.

Apparently it was... great to see some integrity if true. Doubt many others will follow suit..

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42 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

I don't think they realise that eventually even plastics would stop watching if there is absolutely nothing on the line for the majority of the season with players putting in minimal effort because of it.

That sounds familiar.

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4 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

Mourinho has just quit his Spurs job, if it's related to this then massive respect to him.

Apparently refused to take the team training in protest and was fired.

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1 minute ago, Crab Lungs said:

Apparently it was... great to see some integrity if true. Doubt many others will follow suit..

They're now saying he's been sacked. Don't believe that with a cup final right round the corner.

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3 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

They're now saying he's been sacked. Don't believe that with a cup final right round the corner.

He on my said this a few months back...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/sports-news/football-news/jose-mourinho-takes-a-dig-at-project-big-picture-says-football-cant.html

 

Really hope he did tell them to poke it

Edited by Crab Lungs
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21 minutes ago, Crab Lungs said:

Apparently it was... great to see some integrity if true. Doubt many others will follow suit..

If it's true then good on him. I always felt underneath all his bravado he was a decent guy. Would love to see a few high profile players come out as well. Although i doubt it'll happen as they know it'll mean more $$$$ for them.

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46 minutes ago, Turkish said:

I really enjoyed watching Harrogate Town mate. £14 to get in, can get a beer at half time easily enough, can go to any of the 4 stands where there are terraces and stand with your mates, no idiots taking selfies. Can walk to the ground via a couple of pubs. It's definitely the way forward. 

I did same went to watch Solihull Moors same league as Eastleigh was brilliant just fans no selfie sticks no happy clappers.

Fans mixed friendly banter easy to get a pint same shit refs 🙂 

I have lost love of it all now been going since 65/66 May give up season ticket and go watch Totton/Eastleigh but hard to do after so long.

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If the PL doesn't have the guts to kick the 6 out , then the other 14 should instantly open negotiations to rejoin the Football League, leaving the 6 to play each other every weekend as well as midweek. Let's see how long tv viewers and live supporters can stay interested in that.

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2 minutes ago, Wurzel said:

If the PL doesn't have the guts to kick the 6 out , then the other 14 should instantly open negotiations to rejoin the Football League, leaving the 6 to play each other every weekend as well as midweek. Let's see how long tv viewers and live supporters can stay interested in that.

Saturday Night Live Thank You GIF by HULU

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4 hours ago, whelk said:

I hold out no hope that any bold move will be taken. Even the FIFA statement is mild in some respects as referred to ‘closed competition’.

I am glad my kids have some fight in them for a fairer world as this epitomises the greed controlling everything.  Morgan Stanley bailed by the public in 2008 funding to support billionaires getting richer whilst majority seem to be content (for now)  to be distracted and manipulated by other billionaires’ algorithms. Wealth needs to be fairly distributed to give everyone a stake in society and when you feel you have nothing  to lose then comes the volatility.  Anyway I digress but nauseating that statement talks about distribution when pure greed. Some PR cunt thinks we are stupid. 

Exactly this. Football has been a microcosm of society for a long time, and it is playing out again. In a year where many people have struggled, either financial, mentally or physically, the wealthiest on the planet profited. And likewise when many football clubs are really struggling, particularly those with strong links and meaning to their local communities, it is the richest who do a cash grab to punish all below them.  To hoard more money. Money that will never be enough. We've recently seen one of the biggest companies who are owned by the richest man in the world resort to posting fake accounts to stop their workers asking for a tiny bit more. The tiniest of fraction of what their owner is worth. To be able to work with dignity. And yet even that is too much for them. The idea that the money will be re-distributed with the ESL is pure fantasy and simply will not happen. 

And just like the real world, there will be very little negatives for those responsible. There is talk about the little clubs standing up, or the EPL making a stand, or UEFA and FIFA. But that's not real life. Real life see's very few people punished for doing big wrong things. See the 08 Financial Crisis, see Grenfell, see Football Index (I'm sure a few on here have lost money there). For all the indignation, what will happen is that companies and politicians (on both sides) will try and get on the gravy train themselves. They will huff and puff in public, but privately will be already working out how this benefit them

I do hope non league and lower league teams win from this. The big 6 have enough plastics that will support them whatever. But hopefully a decent amount of their fans split to support local clubs with meaning to them

Edited by sydney_saint
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Been listening to BBC2 online while doing administration at home. The news said Boris will try and stop this.  Hope he does.  They've done something like this with rugby in NZ when they created what's now called "Super 15" that now consists of professional franchise rugby teams from NZ, Australia, South Africa and Argentina. It's killing the sport. When it started in the early 2000s it was very exciting and popular becuase it was new but the novelty's well worn off with the same teams playing each other year-in and year-out. Crowds have dwindled and I also think TV viewing is far less than it was.  I played rugby and can't be bothered with it. The only games I watch is a national compdtition called the ITM Cup which is a  traditional provincial competition and has far more meaning for me. The problem for the administrators is that there's so much rugby these days that they now get really small crowds here also.

Personally, I think this Super League could go the same way.

Apologies - I wrote this while Disco Stu was posting so didn't see his post first.

Edited by Jeremy
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Strip all the club of their historic titles.

The moment they are told thy are to leave they will mess themselves as they want their cake and eat it.

A midweek league, apparently. I thought they play too many games.....oh of course they will want the PL to be reduced in size and they will get parachuted in to the FA at the 5th round.

When will the other get the balls to actually stand up.

I think Im right in saying when Celtic tried to do something 10 years ago or so their league said goodbye, that immediately made Celtic withdraw their plans

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41 minutes ago, OldNick said:

Strip all the club of their historic titles.

The moment they are told thy are to leave they will mess themselves as they want their cake and eat it.

A midweek league, apparently. I thought they play too many games.....oh of course they will want the PL to be reduced in size and they will get parachuted in to the FA at the 5th round.

When will the other get the balls to actually stand up.

I think Im right in saying when Celtic tried to do something 10 years ago or so their league said goodbye, that immediately made Celtic withdraw their plans

And retroactively award us the 1984 title?

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A lot of people on here moaning about all of this will carry on paying subscriptions to Sky and BT. 
This business model can only work if people pay to watch it and the people in the grounds won’t help. It’s all about the TV rights and subsequent sponsorship deals, which will only work if people are subscribing. 
No subscribers, no business. 
Effectively, it’s down to the fans. 

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2 minutes ago, Noodles34 said:

A lot of people on here moaning about all of this will carry on paying subscriptions to Sky and BT. 
This business model can only work if people pay to watch it and the people in the grounds won’t help. It’s all about the TV rights and subsequent sponsorship deals, which will only work if people are subscribing. 
No subscribers, no business. 
Effectively, it’s down to the fans. 

I'll only carry on paying and watching if they're kicked out the league, if this franchise league goes ahead and they stay in the Prem I'll be cancelling both and never watching another Prem, FA cup or league cup game.

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17 minutes ago, Noodles34 said:

A lot of people on here moaning about all of this will carry on paying subscriptions to Sky and BT. 
This business model can only work if people pay to watch it and the people in the grounds won’t help. It’s all about the TV rights and subsequent sponsorship deals, which will only work if people are subscribing. 
No subscribers, no business. 
Effectively, it’s down to the fans. 

Yeah, if it's a separate subscription then it'll be interesting to see how that plays out.  Obviously the fans of the respective clubs will subscribe but I doubt many others will, meanwhile it leaves UEFA free to go back to the old European competition formats which I would certainly be more interested in.  Champions League is boring beyond belief when compared to the old European Cup.  As many have said I also doubt the premier league will have the balls to kick out the big six although I hope they do.  My ideal scenario is for this to happen and the big six effectively kicked out of football and anyone participating in the new super league banned from international football.  Let them rot in their super league wasteland and make it akin to playing in China - there's money for sure but it's the end of your career. 

Course this will never happen because these big clubs have us over a barrel financially but much like Kevin Keagan I'd love it if it did happen.

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36 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

And retroactively award us the 1984 title?

Expunged from history in 1992 unfortunately!

I thought the Champions League reforms were enough to destroy football on their own - 'wildcard' qualification so teams like Arsenal can finish 11th and still be guaranteed CL football. Suspect this is a power play and the closed shop will happen on the quiet anyway.

Pleasantly surprised at the depth of feeling even from supporters of the 'big six'. Feels like they finally see the writing on the wall - it's an MK Dons moment en masse, although not sure how effective it will be if there are enough overseas 'fans' to fill the void.

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18 minutes ago, revolution saint said:

Yeah, if it's a separate subscription then it'll be interesting to see how that plays out.  Obviously the fans of the respective clubs will subscribe but I doubt many others will, meanwhile it leaves UEFA free to go back to the old European competition formats which I would certainly be more interested in.  Champions League is boring beyond belief when compared to the old European Cup.  As many have said I also doubt the premier league will have the balls to kick out the big six although I hope they do.  My ideal scenario is for this to happen and the big six effectively kicked out of football and anyone participating in the new super league banned from international football.  Let them rot in their super league wasteland and make it akin to playing in China - there's money for sure but it's the end of your career. 

Course this will never happen because these big clubs have us over a barrel financially but much like Kevin Keagan I'd love it if it did happen.

Was thinking of that Keegan quote myself today. I'd definitely love it if clubs stood up to the big six. There would be a lot of short-term pain but then they would adapt to the altered landscape, whereas imo the big six would suffer long term pain from being excluded from everything. Best thing i heard was that Council's apparently have power to revoke use of city names, so Liverpool might have to rebrand themselves as Mersey Reds

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