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Just now, Ed Rooney said:

De Ridder was branded the messiah on here following posters watching you tube clips. 
 

I have never heard of the guy, but research better than you tube must have been done within the club. 

youtube shows the best of a player. You can get some insight, but you need to view them very critically, however, if the `best of' video doesn't impress you have problems.

His videos show a very skillful player.  He is going to help us keep the ball, which is very important. He takes chances, so may get mugged a few times. They just don't show much dominant powerful defending. Doesn't mean he doesn't have that in his locker, its just not clear. 

Anyone know how many scouts do we have?  I wonder how many Torino games we have attended over the last 12 months?

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1 minute ago, Chez said:

youtube shows the best of a player. You can get some insight, but you need to view them very critically, however, if the `best of' video doesn't impress you have problems.

His videos show a very skillful player.  He is going to help us keep the ball, which is very important. He takes chances, so may get mugged a few times. They just don't show much dominant powerful defending. Doesn't mean he doesn't have that in his locker, its just not clear. 

Anyone know how many scouts do we have?  I wonder how many Torino games we have attended over the last 12 months?

I suppose if you want to put an optimistic slant on it - the recruitment and scouting during the last few windows has been pretty good; with limited finance.  Let's hope we're all pleasantly surprised by this lad from Torino.   The chances of another significant signing beyond him look slight.

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11 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Like Lemina, Hoedt or Gunn?

Lemina had the potential to be an outstanding signing and make us a decent profit unfortunately his character has ruined his career! Hoedt also looked potentially decent but turned out to be a disappointment and Gunn while over priced looked like a good buy for the future but unfortunately we ruin goalkeepers somehow!

It certainly isn’t fair to compare them to Guido who was obviously pants they were all much more calculated risks that just didn’t pan out, pretty much every club signs more duds than stars regardless of budget as you can never be sure when you bring someone in even more so when operating on a budget!

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1 minute ago, a1ex2001 said:

Lemina had the potential to be an outstanding signing and make us a decent profit unfortunately his character has ruined his career! Hoedt also looked potentially decent but turned out to be a disappointment and Gunn while over priced looked like a good buy for the future but unfortunately we ruin goalkeepers somehow!

It certainly isn’t fair to compare them to Guido who was obviously pants they were all much more calculated risks that just didn’t pan out, pretty much every club signs more duds than stars regardless of budget as you can never be sure when you bring someone in even more so when operating on a budget!

Boufal, Mohamed Elyonoussi?  The contract for Forster, Long and signing Walcott this summer?

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15 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Boufal, Mohamed Elyonoussi?  The contract for Forster, Long and signing Walcott this summer?

Boufal had his moments and it was obvious why we bought him he looked like a good player, similarly with Elyonoussi although I’m puzzled how the scouts missed his total lack of pace but clearly neither were obviously rubbish players before they came here and Boufal was a close shave with a decent signing.  The revisionism that goes on round here really is something special!

Forsters contract really isn’t that baffling it was around the time he was in the England squad and before his decent into mediocrity had kicked in, there was a time when he looked a very good keeper.  Long’s contract I agree was odd and Walcott I still think is a decent squad player for us, I’m really not sure who people on this board think we should be signing!

 

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Time will tell if the club have made the right call or not, but in my opinion I believed the club always saw Vestergaards first choice replacement as already being in the building - Salisu.

I don't think the club saw the urgency to buy a superstar CB to come straight into the team, as much as we'd have all loved to see. So they've gone down the road of squad depth. If this allows us to go out and bring in a bit more in CM or full back then it's sensible. I think the club always saw Vestergaard as a 'worry-free' sale in the sense of the trust they have in Salisu. I have seem the infamous ''The club are relaxed about the situation'' comments to, so it does kinda reaffirm what I believe.

If this proves the right call or not - no idea, too early to tell. But from the outset we have lost Ings, Bertrand, Vestergaard - spine of the side for around £45ish. And spent about £30m+ replacing them with less experienced players (you have to factor in that we had no money to replace Bertrand, so we've had to suck up some of the transfer funds to repay that I'd have thought). It's a worry, but it's a case of sink or swim really. This is the market we are in and I think we will start to see the disappearance of the 'reinvest what we get' mantra, we will reinvest bits of what we get, yes, but It looks like we're having to keep some back for a rainy day.

Martin and co have got a proper juggling act going on, on one hand they are having to add to the squad and on the other hand they have to be aware that we have absolutely no money.

Edited by S-Clarke
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Thinking this over and it could well be that the lead has come about from Matt Crocker in plate spinning mode. Crocker was at the Toulon Tournament as FA Head of Pathway Development in 2019. Brazil fielded a talented young side and won, and Lyanco apparently had a stormer overall - runner up in player of the tournament, no mean feat for a centre half.

Just putting two and two together but it may well be that this is where the potential was recognised, with his intervening patchy form in Italy overlooked in the manner of form is transient, class is permanent. This one will likely either be a Forren/Gardos or a Lovren/Alderweireld signing for us, a gamble, and I hope it’s the latter for the sake of us and the lad’s career.  Swapping the Italian sunshine and Med for English drizzle and Western shore is probably just what El Gorilla needs to get him tearing up trees.

 

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1 hour ago, Chez said:

youtube shows the best of a player. You can get some insight, but you need to view them very critically, however, if the `best of' video doesn't impress you have problems.

His videos show a very skillful player.  He is going to help us keep the ball, which is very important. He takes chances, so may get mugged a few times. They just don't show much dominant powerful defending. Doesn't mean he doesn't have that in his locker, its just not clear. 

Anyone know how many scouts do we have?  I wonder how many Torino games we have attended over the last 12 months?

Agree 

Edited by Ed Rooney
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29 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Time will tell if the club have made the right call or not, but in my opinion I believed the club always saw Vestergaards first choice replacement as already being in the building - Salisu.

I don't think the club saw the urgency to buy a superstar CB to come straight into the team, as much as we'd have all loved to see. So they've gone down the road of squad depth. If this allows us to go out and bring in a bit more in CM or full back then it's sensible. I think the club always saw Vestergaard as a 'worry-free' sale in the sense of the trust they have in Salisu. I have seem the infamous ''The club are relaxed about the situation'' comments to, so it does kinda reaffirm what I believe.

If this proves the right call or not - no idea, too early to tell. But from the outset we have lost Ings, Bertrand, Vestergaard - spine of the side for around £45ish. And spent about £30m+ replacing them with less experienced players (you have to factor in that we had no money to replace Bertrand, so we've had to suck up some of the transfer funds to repay that I'd have thought). It's a worry, but it's a case of sink or swim really. This is the market we are in and I think we will start to see the disappearance of the 'reinvest what we get' mantra, we will reinvest bits of what we get, yes, but It looks like we're having to keep some back for a rainy day.

Martin and co have got a proper juggling act going on, on one hand they are having to add to the squad and on the other hand they have to be aware that we have absolutely no money.

Good sensible post.

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54 minutes ago, a1ex2001 said:

Lemina had the potential to be an outstanding signing and make us a decent profit unfortunately his character has ruined his career! Hoedt also looked potentially decent but turned out to be a disappointment and Gunn while over priced looked like a good buy for the future but unfortunately we ruin goalkeepers somehow!

It certainly isn’t fair to compare them to Guido who was obviously pants they were all much more calculated risks that just didn’t pan out, pretty much every club signs more duds than stars regardless of budget as you can never be sure when you bring someone in even more so when operating on a budget!

This - Lemina on his day was the best midfielder we had but unfortunately his day was few and far between 

Hoedt was highly rated and had just started getting in the Dutch squad. Again didn’t work out unfortunately 

Gunn was rated highly by those in the game and was signed for potential but didn’t work out. 

Some signings do not work out, that’s the same at every club 

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So, 

Boufal, Carrillo, Hoedt, Gunn, Lemina were good signings! Just never really worked out and left for a grand total of around £5m

Long signing a new contract was very odd, and was simply not required. Forster maybe, but he had a fair few years when he was given his massive pay rise (unless it was written into his previous deal).  The signing of walcott - at a club counting every penny allegedly - is very odd.

I notice many people praise the current lot running club, but clear and obvious errors are still being made.  Time will tell if this unknown will improve us (or need half a season to establish himself).

Edited by AlexLaw76
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12 minutes ago, Ed Rooney said:

This - Lemina on his day was the best midfielder we had but unfortunately his day was few and far between 

Hoedt was highly rated and had just started getting in the Dutch squad. Again didn’t work out unfortunately 

Gunn was rated highly by those in the game and was signed for potential but didn’t work out. 

Some signings do not work out, that’s the same at every club 

The problem is that we had so many fails in quick succession, and these were big fee's £15m upwards. You can probably add Elyonoussi and Boufal to that list as well. That must be coming onto £70-80m spent on players that just never had an impact and we made losses on all (substantial too), we can't absorb that sort of failure rate in such quick succession, and that is why we are where we are today.

Edited by S-Clarke
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6 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

So, 

Boufal, Carrillo, Hoedt, Gunn, Lemina were good signings! Just never really worked out and left for a grand total of around £5m

Long signing a new contract was very odd, and was simply not required. Forster maybe, but he had a fair few years when he was given his massive pay rise (unless it was written into his previous deal).  The signing of walcott - at a club counting every penny allegedly - is very odd.

I notice many people praise the current lot running club, but clear and obvious errors are still being made.  Time will tell if this unknown will improve us (or need half a season to establish himself).

Correct 

Edited by Ed Rooney
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1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Boufal, Carrillo, Hoedt, Gunn, Lemina were good signings! Just never really worked out and left for a grand total of around £5m

How have you worked that out? 🤔

Gunn alone went for a fee that could rise to £10m.

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3 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

How have you worked that out? 🤔

Gunn alone went for a fee that could rise to £10m.

what did he go for, not what we may get if Norwich win the league?

Is he even first choice?

Either way, those listed were awful signings.  proof being they were shit on the pitch, no longer here as all left for peanuts and we are now in real danger of going down.

Edited by AlexLaw76
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2 hours ago, Matthew Le God said:

The season did not start on 26th August. So that isn't his first month, plus not sure why you've included the cup game. His first month was 2 league goals as I said.

Do you ever give it a break?

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1 hour ago, S-Clarke said:

Time will tell if the club have made the right call or not, but in my opinion I believed the club always saw Vestergaards first choice replacement as already being in the building - Salisu.

I don't think the club saw the urgency to buy a superstar CB to come straight into the team, as much as we'd have all loved to see. So they've gone down the road of squad depth. If this allows us to go out and bring in a bit more in CM or full back then it's sensible. I think the club always saw Vestergaard as a 'worry-free' sale in the sense of the trust they have in Salisu. I have seem the infamous ''The club are relaxed about the situation'' comments to, so it does kinda reaffirm what I believe.

If this proves the right call or not - no idea, too early to tell. But from the outset we have lost Ings, Bertrand, Vestergaard - spine of the side for around £45ish. And spent about £30m+ replacing them with less experienced players (you have to factor in that we had no money to replace Bertrand, so we've had to suck up some of the transfer funds to repay that I'd have thought). It's a worry, but it's a case of sink or swim really. This is the market we are in and I think we will start to see the disappearance of the 'reinvest what we get' mantra, we will reinvest bits of what we get, yes, but It looks like we're having to keep some back for a rainy day.

Martin and co have got a proper juggling act going on, on one hand they are having to add to the squad and on the other hand they have to be aware that we have absolutely no money.

Good post. Thanks 

Interesting how Vest has gone from donkey status to colossus in a couple of weeks 

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1 minute ago, Highfield Saint said:

Good post. Thanks 

Interesting how Vest has gone from donkey status to colossus in a couple of weeks 

I mean he really hasn't has he. There's a general consensus that he was vadyku improved last year and was probably our best centre back. That doesn't mean he was anything amazing though, it just highlights how poor we are in that position. 

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We had a lot of unsuccessful signings in a short period, but we also made all of these signings in a pretty terrible time for the club. It’s a bit of a chicken and egg scenario. Were we shit because the signings failed, or did the signings fail because they came into a shit team on a downward trajectory and never really recovered. Probably a bit of both, between all of the different signings.

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4 hours ago, Matthew Le God said:

The season did not start on 26th August. So that isn't his first month, plus not sure why you've included the cup game. His first month was 2 league goals as I said.

Fucking hell, I bet you’re a right laugh down the pub.

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3 hours ago, maysie said:

Do you ever give it a break?

He did.

He took a 2 day break last week after we laid a cow pat in the second half of the Everton game.

Interesting timing that...hmmm

Edited by OttawaSaint
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15 hours ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

I suppose the positive is that if he can learn to defend, then his ability on the ball will make him one of the best in the world. Big if though

He'll have to teach himself because clearly none of our coaches have the first idea about defending.

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16 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

There are a lot of negative posts here from what I can see from a quick scan. Let's just wait and see shall we? Personally, on looking at those videos I find myself seeing both massive potential and yet also some things that may be of concern. Whether they will be of concern remains to be seen as does whether we can bring out the best in him. Nevertheless, this is what I observe so far:

  • He has far more flair pushing out of defence than your typical centre back and great ability moving forwards. That makes him a potentially great defensive midfielder.
  • He looks good at turning a defensive position into an attacking one. Again this makes him good at both CB and DM.
  • He looks good at intercepting passes within a high line - that suits the Saints way of playing. Also good as a DM.
  • He looks good at making raking long passes out of defence. That replaces what we have lost in Vestergaard.
  • His marking in the 7-0 defeat was ok at first but seemed to drift as the game went on. He may need some coaching in that area.
  • In the 7-0 defeat the other defenders around him seemed particularly hopeless, especially for some of the first few goals where Lyanco was not to blame at all. No defender can be expected to do it all - they operate as a defensive unit. We will need to ensure that our defence builds that level of understanding.
  • There is limited evidence of him tackling. Potentially he may need some coaching in that area.
  • He looks good in attack - both scoring from headers and making telling assists. That's brilliant and exciting to see. He may be more of a Ward-Prowse type DM than a Romeu but may have potential in both styles of DM play.

Hopefully by buying a cheaper player we can also buy a couple of other players such as Thierry Small and who knows, maybe another player too?!

A centre back who shows little tackling ability - sounds just what we need. He'll not learn that skill from our coachibg staff either.

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7 hours ago, Billy the Kidd said:

I’d agree with this for one.

I’d be going 4-2-3-1, or 5-4-1 (I guess we can manage many variants of this in and out of possession). 

The 4-2-2-2 clearly isn’t working, and unless we change it I’m not sure how we expect things to get much different. 

Although, the keeper issue clearly costs us many goals over a season.

4-2-2-2 is set in stone I'm afraid. It's written in Ralph's play book that is serving us so well at every level.

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Just now, Teddeer said:

4-2-2-2 is set in stone I'm afraid. It's written in Ralph's play book that is serving us so well at every level.

Yep I dont disagree, just think it makes us predictable and therefore easy to play against.

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6 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Time will tell if the club have made the right call or not, but in my opinion I believed the club always saw Vestergaards first choice replacement as already being in the building - Salisu.

I don't think the club saw the urgency to buy a superstar CB to come straight into the team, as much as we'd have all loved to see. So they've gone down the road of squad depth. If this allows us to go out and bring in a bit more in CM or full back then it's sensible. I think the club always saw Vestergaard as a 'worry-free' sale in the sense of the trust they have in Salisu. I have seem the infamous ''The club are relaxed about the situation'' comments to, so it does kinda reaffirm what I believe.

If this proves the right call or not - no idea, too early to tell. But from the outset we have lost Ings, Bertrand, Vestergaard - spine of the side for around £45ish. And spent about £30m+ replacing them with less experienced players (you have to factor in that we had no money to replace Bertrand, so we've had to suck up some of the transfer funds to repay that I'd have thought). It's a worry, but it's a case of sink or swim really. This is the market we are in and I think we will start to see the disappearance of the 'reinvest what we get' mantra, we will reinvest bits of what we get, yes, but It looks like we're having to keep some back for a rainy day.

Martin and co have got a proper juggling act going on, on one hand they are having to add to the squad and on the other hand they have to be aware that we have absolutely no money.

Not sure how a left back can be considered part of the spine of the side unless we're talking about a very crooked spine.

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6 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

So, 

Boufal, Carrillo, Hoedt, Gunn, Lemina were good signings! Just never really worked out and left for a grand total of around £5m

Long signing a new contract was very odd, and was simply not required. Forster maybe, but he had a fair few years when he was given his massive pay rise (unless it was written into his previous deal).  The signing of walcott - at a club counting every penny allegedly - is very odd.

I notice many people praise the current lot running club, but clear and obvious errors are still being made.  Time will tell if this unknown will improve us (or need half a season to establish himself).

Who has said Carrillo was a good signing I think he is the only pretty much universally acknowledged obviously terrible deal apart from the two or three nutters that thought he had a career record of a goal every other game!

I’m really not sure what you are trying to say what clear and obvious errors every club makes mistakes and we have made plenty but most were understandable gambles as is this latest proposed signing.

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6 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Time will tell if the club have made the right call or not, but in my opinion I believed the club always saw Vestergaards first choice replacement as already being in the building - Salisu.

I don't think the club saw the urgency to buy a superstar CB to come straight into the team, as much as we'd have all loved to see. So they've gone down the road of squad depth. If this allows us to go out and bring in a bit more in CM or full back then it's sensible. I think the club always saw Vestergaard as a 'worry-free' sale in the sense of the trust they have in Salisu. I have seem the infamous ''The club are relaxed about the situation'' comments to, so it does kinda reaffirm what I believe.

If this proves the right call or not - no idea, too early to tell. But from the outset we have lost Ings, Bertrand, Vestergaard - spine of the side for around £45ish. And spent about £30m+ replacing them with less experienced players (you have to factor in that we had no money to replace Bertrand, so we've had to suck up some of the transfer funds to repay that I'd have thought). It's a worry, but it's a case of sink or swim really. This is the market we are in and I think we will start to see the disappearance of the 'reinvest what we get' mantra, we will reinvest bits of what we get, yes, but It looks like we're having to keep some back for a rainy day.

Martin and co have got a proper juggling act going on, on one hand they are having to add to the squad and on the other hand they have to be aware that we have absolutely no money.

I think this signing, if it happens and is the only CB signing (which I think it will be), pretty much confirms your thoughts above. The club see Bednarek and Salisu as our fist choice CB partnership. Therefore, also see Salisu and Vestergaard's replacement with Lyanco taking his 3rd/4th choice spot.

I also agree that he shouldn't be written off before he has even signed, let alone kicked a ball for us. That said, surely you can see where, and why, people are concerned by this signing? He is a very inexperienced player, who was only a squad player last season in a team equally as inept at defending as we were. We had the 2nd worse defence in the PL last season. Since then we have lost our 2 most experienced defenders, both replaced in the starting 11 by 2 'promising' yet inexperienced ones. The back-up for one of those is an even less experienced player and, seemingly, even less 'promising' (in term of defensive capabilities). Indeed, I would go to say that Jack Stephens is now firmly our 3rd choice CB, with this guy being 4th choice. It does also look as though he will be 4th choice CM too, so would expect to him on the bench a lot (especially now 9 can be on there).

We desperately needed to shore up our defence this close season, especially given that we also sold our top scorer from last time around. In response to that we have swapped 2 experienced but slow players with 2 inexperienced but more mobile ones. That is a gamble. As is the fact that should Bednarek or Salisu pick up an injury we are left with starting Stephens every match and with an even less experienced player back up. Most people were expecting a 'younger' player to come in, but most were hoping it would be someone a bit more promising - with more experience. Such players are available and we had been linked with them. They also should have been within our budget. Maybe Caleta-Car was a bit of a pipe-dream, but shouldn't have been. If not him, I feel most wouldn't have been too concerned if we had to field Worrall or Adarabioyo in our team against Newcastle or West Ham.

Maybe Lyanco will prove to be as good a signing as Mark Wright once was. Or maybe he will be more akin to Florin Gardos, but shorter! Which ever, at this present moment in time, it does not appear to me that we have addressed the defensive issues we desperately needed to. I hope to be proved wrong.  

 

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29 minutes ago, Minsk said:

I think this signing, if it happens and is the only CB signing (which I think it will be), pretty much confirms your thoughts above. The club see Bednarek and Salisu as our fist choice CB partnership. Therefore, also see Salisu and Vestergaard's replacement with Lyanco taking his 3rd/4th choice spot.

I also agree that he shouldn't be written off before he has even signed, let alone kicked a ball for us. That said, surely you can see where, and why, people are concerned by this signing? He is a very inexperienced player, who was only a squad player last season in a team equally as inept at defending as we were. We had the 2nd worse defence in the PL last season. Since then we have lost our 2 most experienced defenders, both replaced in the starting 11 by 2 'promising' yet inexperienced ones. The back-up for one of those is an even less experienced player and, seemingly, even less 'promising' (in term of defensive capabilities). Indeed, I would go to say that Jack Stephens is now firmly our 3rd choice CB, with this guy being 4th choice. It does also look as though he will be 4th choice CM too, so would expect to him on the bench a lot (especially now 9 can be on there).

We desperately needed to shore up our defence this close season, especially given that we also sold our top scorer from last time around. In response to that we have swapped 2 experienced but slow players with 2 inexperienced but more mobile ones. That is a gamble. As is the fact that should Bednarek or Salisu pick up an injury we are left with starting Stephens every match and with an even less experienced player back up. Most people were expecting a 'younger' player to come in, but most were hoping it would be someone a bit more promising - with more experience. Such players are available and we had been linked with them. They also should have been within our budget. Maybe Caleta-Car was a bit of a pipe-dream, but shouldn't have been. If not him, I feel most wouldn't have been too concerned if we had to field Worrall or Adarabioyo in our team against Newcastle or West Ham.

Maybe Lyanco will prove to be as good a signing as Mark Wright once was. Or maybe he will be more akin to Florin Gardos, but shorter! Which ever, at this present moment in time, it does not appear to me that we have addressed the defensive issues we desperately needed to. I hope to be proved wrong.  

 

To be honest, I'm just willing to give him the benefit of doubt. £5m on a squad player isn't a great deal in this day and age, that's all he will be. Would I have liked to use this opportunity to evolve Bednareks position? Absolutley. But I realise that as a club we are in the pits financially and we're not able to compete for those sorts of players who would make a huge difference. 

We are very close to the inventible in this league with this model, I'm not doubting that. But what else do we do? Until we have a change of ownership and some direction from those above we will continue to tread water, and that will inevitably mean that we drown in the riches of the other clubs.

The club are doing the best they can in the circumstances they have been dealt. We've just got to hope they've made the right choices, it enables us to keep our heads above water for another 1 year or so and we may end up closer to that illusive ownership change. Until that happens, we're going to have to get used to these sorts of signings.

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45 minutes ago, Delmary said:

Unfortunately, this feels like another Carrillo signing.

Nah, this is a cheap low risk signing. He’s not what we need but ultimately cheap. Carillo was a joke 

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46 minutes ago, Delmary said:

Unfortunately, this feels like another Carrillo signing.

 

2 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

It feels exactly the opposite to me.

It feels like selling Carrillo?

Barack Obama GIF by NowThis

 😉

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46 minutes ago, Minsk said:

I think this signing, if it happens and is the only CB signing (which I think it will be), pretty much confirms your thoughts above. The club see Bednarek and Salisu as our fist choice CB partnership. Therefore, also see Salisu and Vestergaard's replacement with Lyanco taking his 3rd/4th choice spot.

I also agree that he shouldn't be written off before he has even signed, let alone kicked a ball for us. That said, surely you can see where, and why, people are concerned by this signing? He is a very inexperienced player, who was only a squad player last season in a team equally as inept at defending as we were. We had the 2nd worse defence in the PL last season. Since then we have lost our 2 most experienced defenders, both replaced in the starting 11 by 2 'promising' yet inexperienced ones. The back-up for one of those is an even less experienced player and, seemingly, even less 'promising' (in term of defensive capabilities). Indeed, I would go to say that Jack Stephens is now firmly our 3rd choice CB, with this guy being 4th choice. It does also look as though he will be 4th choice CM too, so would expect to him on the bench a lot (especially now 9 can be on there).

We desperately needed to shore up our defence this close season, especially given that we also sold our top scorer from last time around. In response to that we have swapped 2 experienced but slow players with 2 inexperienced but more mobile ones. That is a gamble. As is the fact that should Bednarek or Salisu pick up an injury we are left with starting Stephens every match and with an even less experienced player back up. Most people were expecting a 'younger' player to come in, but most were hoping it would be someone a bit more promising - with more experience. Such players are available and we had been linked with them. They also should have been within our budget. Maybe Caleta-Car was a bit of a pipe-dream, but shouldn't have been. If not him, I feel most wouldn't have been too concerned if we had to field Worrall or Adarabioyo in our team against Newcastle or West Ham.

Maybe Lyanco will prove to be as good a signing as Mark Wright once was. Or maybe he will be more akin to Florin Gardos, but shorter! Which ever, at this present moment in time, it does not appear to me that we have addressed the defensive issues we desperately needed to. I hope to be proved wrong.  

 

I agree with all of this. The overriding consideration is that we were shit in defence last season and instead of going all out to strengthen that area of the pitch - all the more important given the attacking part has lost it's main threat - we are trying to muddle through. 

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34 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

To be honest, I'm just willing to give him the benefit of doubt. £5m on a squad player isn't a great deal in this day and age, that's all he will be. Would I have liked to use this opportunity to evolve Bednareks position? Absolutley. But I realise that as a club we are in the pits financially and we're not able to compete for those sorts of players who would make a huge difference. 

We are very close to the inventible in this league with this model, I'm not doubting that. But what else do we do? Until we have a change of ownership and some direction from those above we will continue to tread water, and that will inevitably mean that we drown in the riches of the other clubs.

The club are doing the best they can in the circumstances they have been dealt. We've just got to hope they've made the right choices, it enables us to keep our heads above water for another 1 year or so and we may end up closer to that illusive ownership change. Until that happens, we're going to have to get used to these sorts of signings.

Exactly right! We will never compete with the clubs owned by billionaires (don't ask how they got  their money) and the Semmens/Crocker/Ralph combine have done the best with limited resources, they have given us a good summer even if the latest isn't as well known as we expected.

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43 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

To be honest, I'm just willing to give him the benefit of doubt. £5m on a squad player isn't a great deal in this day and age, that's all he will be. Would I have liked to use this opportunity to evolve Bednareks position? Absolutley. But I realise that as a club we are in the pits financially and we're not able to compete for those sorts of players who would make a huge difference. 

We are very close to the inventible in this league with this model, I'm not doubting that. But what else do we do? Until we have a change of ownership and some direction from those above we will continue to tread water, and that will inevitably mean that we drown in the riches of the other clubs.

The club are doing the best they can in the circumstances they have been dealt. We've just got to hope they've made the right choices, it enables us to keep our heads above water for another 1 year or so and we may end up closer to that illusive ownership change. Until that happens, we're going to have to get used to these sorts of signings.

The best they can do would be to get a manager that can get the best out of the limited squad we have, not one that blindly sticks to a system/tactics that have not worked for nearly 3 years (yea yea I get we were lucky to be top  for a day)

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29 minutes ago, Dellman said:

Exactly right! We will never compete with the clubs owned by billionaires (don't ask how they got  their money) and the Semmens/Crocker/Ralph combine have done the best with limited resources, they have given us a good summer even if the latest isn't as well known as we expected.

I think good is pretty strong. If this is really it then it's been a competent summer at best. Losing ings and vestergaard without replacing their experience let alone strengthening the squad is a bit of a body blow to be honest and I think that overall we start the season probably a little weaker than we ended the last season. 

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51 minutes ago, Red said:

The best they can do would be to get a manager that can get the best out of the limited squad we have, not one that blindly sticks to a system/tactics that have not worked for nearly 3 years (yea yea I get we were lucky to be top  for a day)

Not worked for 3 years is a bit of a stretch, for an entire calendar year we were a Top 8 side, just sadly across two seasons and not a full season.

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2 hours ago, Minsk said:

I think this signing, if it happens and is the only CB signing (which I think it will be), pretty much confirms your thoughts above. The club see Bednarek and Salisu as our fist choice CB partnership. Therefore, also see Salisu and Vestergaard's replacement with Lyanco taking his 3rd/4th choice spot.

I also agree that he shouldn't be written off before he has even signed, let alone kicked a ball for us. That said, surely you can see where, and why, people are concerned by this signing? He is a very inexperienced player, who was only a squad player last season in a team equally as inept at defending as we were. We had the 2nd worse defence in the PL last season. Since then we have lost our 2 most experienced defenders, both replaced in the starting 11 by 2 'promising' yet inexperienced ones. The back-up for one of those is an even less experienced player and, seemingly, even less 'promising' (in term of defensive capabilities). Indeed, I would go to say that Jack Stephens is now firmly our 3rd choice CB, with this guy being 4th choice. It does also look as though he will be 4th choice CM too, so would expect to him on the bench a lot (especially now 9 can be on there).

We desperately needed to shore up our defence this close season, especially given that we also sold our top scorer from last time around. In response to that we have swapped 2 experienced but slow players with 2 inexperienced but more mobile ones. That is a gamble. As is the fact that should Bednarek or Salisu pick up an injury we are left with starting Stephens every match and with an even less experienced player back up. Most people were expecting a 'younger' player to come in, but most were hoping it would be someone a bit more promising - with more experience. Such players are available and we had been linked with them. They also should have been within our budget. Maybe Caleta-Car was a bit of a pipe-dream, but shouldn't have been. If not him, I feel most wouldn't have been too concerned if we had to field Worrall or Adarabioyo in our team against Newcastle or West Ham.

Maybe Lyanco will prove to be as good a signing as Mark Wright once was. Or maybe he will be more akin to Florin Gardos, but shorter! Which ever, at this present moment in time, it does not appear to me that we have addressed the defensive issues we desperately needed to. I hope to be proved wrong.  

 

If it works out like that, thats the issue for me, not Lyanco. Will wait to see him in action before making any judgement, but we needed to be signing a first choice CB, not 4th choice. After the defensive shambles that was last season, none of our CBs could feel hard done by if they dropped to 3rd/4th choice (Salisu the exception as hes only had a limited number of games). I rate Bednarek but he was dreadful at times last season so does not deserve to start. He needs to know that his position is at stake and needs to work his way back in, same with Stephens. Its unlikely to be the case if Lyanco is brought in as a squad filler.

Unless the club are going to move Bednarek on and bring another new face in. Extremely unlikely but he was linked with a move away last season

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1 minute ago, woodsaint1 said:

If it works out like that, thats the issue for me, not Lyanco. Will wait to see him in action before making any judgement, but we needed to be signing a first choice CB, not 4th choice. After the defensive shambles that was last season, none of our CBs could feel hard done by if they dropped to 3rd/4th choice (Salisu the exception as hes only had a limited number of games). I rate Bednarek but he was dreadful at times last season so does not deserve to start. He needs to know that his position is at stake and needs to work his way back in, same with Stephens. Its unlikely to be the case if Lyanco is brought in as a squad filler.

Unless the club are going to move Bednarek on and bring another new face in. Extremely unlikely but he was linked with a move away last season

Lyanco is probably being brought in as first choice.

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I’m no expert on our finances, but would we pay £7 million for a 4th choice CB? My guess would be that they expect him to be good enough to play (at least to be in contention for the first team)

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5 minutes ago, Simon3737 said:

I’m no expert on our finances, but would we pay £7 million for a 4th choice CB? My guess would be that they expect him to be good enough to play (at least to be in contention for the first team)

If I was a betting man we won’t see much of this side of Christmas maybe even this season with the “getting used to how we play” line being used. Salisu and Bednarek to be first choice this season 

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