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Man City 0-0 Saints - Match Thread


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57 minutes ago, Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd said:

City supporting mate sent me this message at full time. 

Mate, that was as bad as we have played since Stuart Pearce days, collectively. Truly abysmal. However, you were excellent, defended very well & with a decent striker would have been easy winner's. Well done Saints.

We're back to opposing teams/fans thinking they just played badly against us when actually we stifled them with our system 

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2 minutes ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

We're back to opposing teams/fans thinking they just played badly against us when actually we stifled them with our system 

Agree, there is true old saying you have to play what is in front of you, we were excellent and completely disrupted their game, Ralph just might know a bit more about this game than some on here think.

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9 minutes ago, moonraker said:

Agree, there is true old saying you have to play what is in front of you, we were excellent and completely disrupted their game, Ralph just might know a bit more about this game than some on here think.

It happens every week when we're on one of our good runs. "Credit to Southampton but City/United/other played really poorly". Yes there was a reason that they played poorly, we made them.

Edited by Ex Lion Tamer
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First class team performance and great result, well done Ralph for getting your tactics right and bamboozling Guardiola. Now let's do the same every week.

Romeu excelled today and was a class above. What a star! 

The other big success story was Elyonoussi who brought intelligence and creative insight to our attacking midfield. As he gets more game time the more his underlying qualities emerge. He is not a spectacular high energy player but is quietly efficient, popping up in all the right places and creating chances for others that would be seized upon by half decent strikers. Big shout our for KWP who bossed the defensive left side third and still found time and space to run the line and get in some decent crosses.

On what planet was that not a clear penalty and red card. The ref should have stuck to his guns. Judging by the number of times he had to watch the re-wind the benefit of any doubt should have gone to the attacker. We were cheated out of a win which would have been fully deserved.

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4 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

On what planet was that not a clear penalty and red card. The ref should have stuck to his guns. Judging by the number of times he had to watch the re-wind the benefit of any doubt should have gone to the attacker. We were cheated out of a win which would have been fully deserved.

Think it was probably reasonable to rescind the red card. But not the pen. Red card is discretionary these days if I understand correctly.

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34 minutes ago, Saint_lambden said:

How on earth can that fat fuck Jon Moss think that’s not a penalty after looking at it again? Another one that shouldn’t be anywhere near a Premier League game. 

Saw it in real time. Knew it wasn’t a pen, Armstrong played for it. Our Crowd knew it at the time and knew it would be overturned.

However after VAR overturned it and we saw the replay  in the stadium we were stunned. In the replay it looked more of a pen than in real time.

On another note VAR in stadium is awful. Needs scrapping completely. I can live with ref mistakes,

VAR kills the fluidity and rhythm and flow of  the game.

It also adds 10 minutes injury time and you have no idea how long is left in the game.

Edited by Warriorsaint
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1 hour ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

We're back to opposing teams/fans thinking they just played badly against us when actually we stifled them with our system 

Nonsense, City fans most generous fans you’ll find. They were glad to have a game. Fans that go to games are knowledgeable and most at that game gave Kudos to a team that had a gameplan and came to play.

40,000 City fans were supporting their team in Div 2 and we had idiots singing “ where were you when you were shit” 

They support their team through thick and thin. Much rather have them than that other lot in Salford.

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MOTD analysis; definite penalty but not a red card for Walker. Jermaine Jenas said they thought that the ref was invited to the pitchside monitor to review and negate the red card, not the whole decision.

Edited by badgerx16
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4 hours ago, M271 said:

I don't know how BBC work out the players scores, seems flawed though as the scores given doesn't coincide with the views on here from people who saw the match. They have Romeu as 6th best for Saints as an example.

 

My 500th post, it's only taken me 12 and a half years to get there!!

It takes Trousers 12 and a half days to achieve that.

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19 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

MOTD analysis; definite penalty but not a red card for Walker. Jermaine Jenas said they thought that the ref was invited to the pitchside monitor to review and negate the red card, not the whole decision.

That’s how I saw it. Definite pen not a red. But as usual a decision against a big club might impact the premier league brand so can’t have it

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I've been entertaining since seeing a City goal on a dodgy thread and saying a very loud "shit" and then having to dash to see to my guest. Since saw that we drew and just got the chance to comment. Did Walker touch the ball for the disallowed penalty? Anyway, well done Saints for a cracking performance, and not conceding 5 goals like the previous 3 teams at City. 

To the pre-game commenters on here.. Phthtttphttt!!!

 

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7 minutes ago, suewhistle said:

I've been entertaining since seeing a City goal on a dodgy thread and saying a very loud "shit" and then having to dash to see to my guest. Since saw that we drew and just got the chance to comment. Did Walker touch the ball for the disallowed penalty? Anyway, well done Saints for a cracking performance, and not conceding 5 goals like the previous 3 teams at City. 

To the pre-game commenters on here.. Phthtttphttt!!!

 

No. Walker didn't touch the ball, at all.

The way I (and many others I think) saw it was he (Moss) was checking whether it was a red card offence, then overturned the whole f**king decision. It was stonewall penalty. Little push, then a complete clatter and no ball touched. 

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39 minutes ago, Dark Munster said:

It takes Trousers 12 and a half days to achieve that.

Since November 2006, I've posted 8.84 times per day on average, ergo it would take 56.56 days for me to amass 500 posts. (and, yes, I was indeed sad enough to spend the last 7 minutes working that out ;) )

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4 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

Just back from the game, Fantastic performance. Some really good players on show. Did not look like hundreds of millions of pounds between the teams.

Really good down the wings but seeing Armstrong in the flesh is disappointing. Id rather have Brett Ormerod to be honest.

Broja is a unit and when he came on you could tell he is a step up. If he scores goals he’s a £50 million striker.

The real reason City didn’t win is they don’t have a Striker. Lots of side to side when they get into the box but they didn’t have it. They miss Aguero badly.

Thought Stephens looked good and gives a bit to the oppo team. Just the kind of disrespect our players need.

Have to say Ralph is the right man for the job. Got the  team selection just right. Redmond gets a lot of stick but up close you could see his experience and you could tell he is playing the way the manager wants. A really well drilled performance and a lot of compliments from city fans on the way back.

Got fucked off with a bunch of our retarded fans who thought it was more fun to goad opposing fans than watch the game and support the team. Some of the stuff they came out with was embarrassing.

Also in the dying minutes some really good shithousery and time wasting and some of our fans got on the teams back. 
 

All in all, really good performance and a draw a fair result.

shoutout to the City stewards and staff. Really chilled people and a good laugh. Balti Pie good , not as good as Burnley’s but pretty good anyway and at £4.50 it needed to be.

 

Thanks for the report. Not sure I agree with some of it though but it's an opinion forum so my thoughts:

Firstly Redmond - I think he's ok/average, not great but not shite either. You probably didn't get a chance to see the MOTD analysis on him (and others) yet but it summed up exactly what is lacking with Redders - he doesn't have the vision when in good positions to make the incisive pass where a player might/should end up when the pass arrives. Hard to explain in words but the BBC with their tech did it really well. It's kind of football chess - think one or two steps ahead. Don't blame Redders for this - it's just not in his locker and at this stage he will never get/learn it. Other than that he tries hard, has reasonable pace, can dribble at times (not sure why he doesn't more often? Maybe instructed by Ralph not to in case we lose possession - Ralph does seen obsessed by this), and his grin/stupid smile is just frustration at not having achieved what he was trying.

Ralph - really not sure with him being the right man. He has been manager nearly 3 years now which is fairly long in the PL these days and I'm not convinced he knows how to succeed in the PL. He's gone from wanting a small squad to large, from different formations, to not knowing his best 11, taking instant dislikes to certain players etc. Not picking Lyanco as he can't speak English allegedly (Leeds manager still can't after 3 years doesn't seem to be an issue). Being stubborn against all other evidence. Again I think he's an average manager who doesn't get the PL and is in awe of some of his hero's (crying when beating Klopp was embarrassing enough but he is always drooling over Pep etc. as well). He was unemployed when we appointed him and in reality hadn't achieved much before that. I don't want him sacked but he does need to step up.

Final part - agree, great performance and result and if not for the great injustice would have been eve better - for me the greatest travesty was to over turn a decision already given with a clear and obvious error.

Anyway onwards and upwards and hope we get our first win next week.

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10 hours ago, VictiAbNonem said:

the guardian is more generous:

"Jonathan Moss gave a penalty and showed Walker a red card. VAR ordered him to the monitor, and the referee decided the right-back crashed into Armstrong as the latter wrapped a leg around the ball, so overturned his decisions. If Moss adjudged this a clear and obvious error, the official may wish to consult a dictionary to reacquaint himself with the terms’ definitions."

both panels from motd and sss unanimous that it was a stonewall pen, the check perhaps was to rescind the red but never should have affected the pen

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6 hours ago, Red said:

Ralph - really not sure with him being the right man. He has been manager nearly 3 years now which is fairly long in the PL these days and I'm not convinced he knows how to succeed in the PL. He's gone from wanting a small squad to large, from different formations, to not knowing his best 11, taking instant dislikes to certain players etc. Not picking Lyanco as he can't speak English allegedly (Leeds manager still can't after 3 years doesn't seem to be an issue). Being stubborn against all other evidence. Again I think he's an average manager who doesn't get the PL and is in awe of some of his hero's (crying when beating Klopp was embarrassing enough but he is always drooling over Pep etc. as well). He was unemployed when we appointed him and in reality hadn't achieved much before that. I don't want him sacked but he does need to step up.

Jesus Christ. Deserves a permanent ban. 

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7 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

No. Walker didn't touch the ball, at all.

The way I (and many others I think) saw it was he (Moss) was checking whether it was a red card offence, then overturned the whole f**king decision. It was stonewall penalty. Little push, then a complete clatter and no ball touched. 

This sounds feasible. The red card decision was probably wrong, as the rules say it's only red for denial of goal scoring opportunity if there is no attempt to play the ball in the penalty area (although, bizarrely, outside the box it's red anyway it it's denial of goal scoring opportunity). So the question was did he make any attempt to get the ball, and I'd accept that he did.

But still a clear foul and the pen should never have been reviewed. Why didn't VAR make that clear to Moss?

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6 hours ago, saint lard said:

If Ings was playing for us today…..we win. 

I thought that, we aren’t creating a lot, and the strikers we have have a low conversion rate, whereas Ings could score out of very little. 

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54 minutes ago, Shroppie said:

This sounds feasible. The red card decision was probably wrong, as the rules say it's only red for denial of goal scoring opportunity if there is no attempt to play the ball in the penalty area (although, bizarrely, outside the box it's red anyway it it's denial of goal scoring opportunity). So the question was did he make any attempt to get the ball, and I'd accept that he did.

But still a clear foul and the pen should never have been reviewed. Why didn't VAR make that clear to Moss?

I think the even weirder thing is they gave the foul against Armstrong. I cant really get my head around anyh of it, other than it probably wasnt a red.

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Interesting that even the MOTD analysts concluded that Redmond is rubbish at choosing the right option when he gets in or near the box. They highlighted a couple of moments where he wasted a good attack which, on repeat viewing, look even worse than they did at the time.

If it's a confidence issue then he really needs to engage with a sports psychologist.

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11 hours ago, redder freak said:

Stonewall penalty from the highlights. Walker nowhere near the ball. Pure body check on top of Armstrong. If that had been Salisu on Sterling we all know how it would have gone. But money talks. They bought that draw.

and Jon Moss also thought about ......whether he'd still be able to find his car to drive home after the match !

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1 hour ago, Toussaint said:

I thought that, we aren’t creating a lot, and the strikers we have have a low conversion rate, whereas Ings could score out of very little. 

He can, but he was never going to stay at the club so it's pretty irrelevant. Plus the person who replaced Ings won a penalty which might have led to 3 points if it wasn't for Jon Moss's lunacy.

Maybe we'd have won if Stuart Armstrong was fit because he's our best attacking midfielder.

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6 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Interesting that even the MOTD analysts concluded that Redmond is rubbish at choosing the right option when he gets in or near the box. They highlighted a couple of moments where he wasted a good attack which, on repeat viewing, look even worse than they did at the time.

If it's a confidence issue then he really needs to engage with a sports psychologist.

I watched that twice, the first occasion he has 2 options he went for the player closest to him, and the ball across the box would have to be very precise the second! he was running in the opposite direction when AA made his run and so would have had to do a back heel or the like. I suspect AA run was to make space as it did. Had they done a similar piece on any of the City forwards they could no doubt find bits where they should have made a btter or perfect pass.

Anyway its like talking to a brick wall he will never win people over. As I have said previously had he have all the skills he would have gone elsewhere and we would be spitting bile for being disloyal

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Another thing we get a nil nil away at City and there are still moans lol. I doubt many expected anything, I did tell a another Saints fan I felt we would get something today, I just had the feeling

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Looking at their forum, a lot giving us praise. One said Romeu and Ward Prowse bossed the midfield, loads saying we easily deserved the point and probably more.

"The drive and desire of Southampton is something we could learn from"

"Saints were impressive"

"Saints were brilliant and comfortable, deserved 3 points"

"Whole team was poor"

"We were lucky to get nil"

Quotes like these show just how well organised we were which is obviously down to the preparation in training and the players on the pitch carrying out those instructions.

Some of their fans think Sterling is shit. Some are moaning about the manager.

And that's just from the first 20 pages of 97. If there's one downside to becoming one of the best teams in the world it's having to trawl through nearly 100 pages of a post match thread after every game.

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29 minutes ago, OldNick said:

I watched that twice, the first occasion he has 2 options he went for the player closest to him, and the ball across the box would have to be very precise the second! he was running in the opposite direction when AA made his run and so would have had to do a back heel or the like. I suspect AA run was to make space as it did. Had they done a similar piece on any of the City forwards they could no doubt find bits where they should have made a btter or perfect pass.

Anyway its like talking to a brick wall he will never win people over. As I have said previously had he have all the skills he would have gone elsewhere and we would be spitting bile for being disloyal

Shows how much we miss Stuart Armstrong. He runs directly and can shoot, but also is intelligent and good at seeing a pass. Even Walcott has better vision than Redmond.

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11 hours ago, Saint_lambden said:

How on earth can that fat fuck Jon Moss think that’s not a penalty after looking at it again? Another one that shouldn’t be anywhere near a Premier League game. 

Agreed. When did tackling from behind stop being a foul?  The refs should let us know.  Moss should do the decent thing and resign or retire

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34 minutes ago, Totton Saint said:

Agreed. When did tackling from behind stop being a foul?  The refs should let us know.  Moss should do the decent thing and resign or retire

At the very least he should be hauled in front of the PGMOL and made to explain the thought process behind his decision, because it appears that he didn't apply the rule about 'clear and obvious error' correctly.

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23 minutes ago, Papa_Waigo1 said:

Rescinding the pen decision so hard to understand. 'Clear and obvious' it wasn't! Communication between VAR ref and on field ref ought to be public, like in rugby. Transparency would improve decision making.

The only thing  "clear and obvious " was it shouldn't have been overturned 

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10 hours ago, Red said:

Thanks for the report. Not sure I agree with some of it though but it's an opinion forum so my thoughts:

Firstly Redmond - I think he's ok/average, not great but not shite either. You probably didn't get a chance to see the MOTD analysis on him (and others) yet but it summed up exactly what is lacking with Redders - he doesn't have the vision when in good positions to make the incisive pass where a player might/should end up when the pass arrives. Hard to explain in words but the BBC with their tech did it really well. It's kind of football chess - think one or two steps ahead. Don't blame Redders for this - it's just not in his locker and at this stage he will never get/learn it. Other than that he tries hard, has reasonable pace, can dribble at times (not sure why he doesn't more often? Maybe instructed by Ralph not to in case we lose possession - Ralph does seen obsessed by this), and his grin/stupid smile is just frustration at not having achieved what he was trying.

Ralph - really not sure with him being the right man. He has been manager nearly 3 years now which is fairly long in the PL these days and I'm not convinced he knows how to succeed in the PL. He's gone from wanting a small squad to large, from different formations, to not knowing his best 11, taking instant dislikes to certain players etc. Not picking Lyanco as he can't speak English allegedly (Leeds manager still can't after 3 years doesn't seem to be an issue). Being stubborn against all other evidence. Again I think he's an average manager who doesn't get the PL and is in awe of some of his hero's (crying when beating Klopp was embarrassing enough but he is always drooling over Pep etc. as well). He was unemployed when we appointed him and in reality hadn't achieved much before that. I don't want him sacked but he does need to step up.

Final part - agree, great performance and result and if not for the great injustice would have been eve better - for me the greatest travesty was to over turn a decision already given with a clear and obvious error.

Anyway onwards and upwards and hope we get our first win next week.

Agree with Redmond analysis, but can’t agree with Ralph comments.  I would say he has come on leaps and bounds tactically this season, and every one of our points accumulated so far was a defeat in corresponding fixture last season.  A strange day to call him into question

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4 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

The footage Moss saw on the monitor was just from one angle over and over on a loop. There was an even more damming angle they chose not to show him.

They only ever seem to show one angle, the one that is most likely to overturn the decision. How many time has a ref reviewed something and stuck with the original conclusion ?

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I suspect they were covering up the red card double jeopardy fuck up. It probably should have been a penalty, but no red card. Jonathan Moss probably didn't want to be in the position of removing the red card but still giving the penalty. If only we could hear the conversation between the VAR and ref!

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13 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

I suspect they were covering up the red card double jeopardy fuck up. It probably should have been a penalty, but no red card. Jonathan Moss probably didn't want to be in the position of removing the red card but still giving the penalty. If only we could hear the conversation between the VAR and ref!

Don’t worry Billy Shite has a reliable source for the VAR transcripts - we should see it in the next couple of days when he submits his post match report 😜

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A neutral observer could even suggest there was no great reason for reviewing the red card  - did that really look like a genuine attempt to play the ball?

It had all the hallmarks of there's a player through on the keeper, I'll desperately lunge at him from behind just to prevent a goal and take my chances with the ref.

I wasn't especially impressed with Moss making time to discuss it with the already-dismissed Walker before he went to the monitor either.

 

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