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Chelsea 1-1 (p.4-3) Saints - Match Thread


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Lyanco brought some solid defence tonight, dovetailed well with Salisu, occasionally looked like a Brazilian playmaking CB going forward, and gave us a real threat at corners, not just a token tall man presence.

But he brought something else that we've lacked - and grown too accustomed to lacking - a bit of PASSION.

He's not a "ho hum" type of player, and if celebrating getting a free kick fires him up, it fired me up too.

One swallow doesn't make a Spring, but at least he looks like a swallow.

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3 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

I honestly can't name an attribute of his that stands out. He is mediocre in every aspect of his game. 

Mediocre, behave. He's got pace, touch, movement, sees a pass, strong ish, gets stuck in, has a good engine, an eye for goal. Apart from that, he's got fuck all about him. 

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Just now, Saint_clark said:

Go ahead, name an attribute of his that stands out? 

Try and define what type of midfielder he is - you can't, because he doesn't do anything especially well.

His passing for starters. But you must have seen so much of him and assessed all his attributes as mediocre. He has slow start but clearly a decent player there and was improving nicely until his injury

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1 minute ago, Saint_clark said:

Go ahead, name an attribute of his that stands out? 

Try and define what type of midfielder he is - you can't, because he doesn't do anything especially well.

Bit harsh. I can't say I've seen enough of him to form a solid opinion either way, but based on the bits I've seen over the years he seems like an advanced midfielder - someone who plays on the edge of the box, or inside forward. Good touch, can pass. Definitely worth a place in the squad.

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3 minutes ago, bpsaint said:

One minor wobble from Fraser but quality aside from that. Pulled off a couple of worldies which I’ve got 100% confidence AM wouldn’t have got anywhere close to.

 Disagree. You may not rate McCarthy, but he has made some absolutely outstanding saves this season. Some I'd argue Forster wouldn't have made. They both have done well. Maybe just praise them both? 

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3 minutes ago, egg said:

Nothing for anyone who watched. 

Lots if you didn't and just assume. 

I thought he was decent but he was offside a lot (which is a very Long thing to do) which gave them opportunities to get the ball back when we really needed to hold it. Also I feel if he had gone for goal with his header from Stu's freekick he could have had a very good chance against a pretty average keeper. May not have gone in but was better than what he went for in the end. 

Again, I thought he did well and was impressed, just saying "nothing" isn't quite accurate imo.

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3 minutes ago, CanadaSaint said:

Lyanco brought some solid defence tonight, dovetailed well with Salisu, occasionally looked like a Brazilian playmaking CB going forward, and gave us a real threat at corners, not just a token tall man presence.

But he brought something else that we've lacked - and grown too accustomed to lacking - a bit of PASSION.

He's not a "ho hum" type of player, and if celebrating getting a free kick fires him up, it fired me up too.

One swallow doesn't make a Spring, but at least he looks like a swallow.

Well put.

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Have to add that despite yet more disappointment I think better things are around the corner for this team. We just took the Champions of Europe (alright sort of 2nd string but so were we) to the wire - unquestionably one of the top 6 or 7 teams in the World. I think we’ll come good and survive quite comfortably.

Edited by stknowle
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1 minute ago, TWar said:

I thought he was decent but he was offside a lot (which is a very Long thing to do) which gave them opportunities to get the ball back when we really needed to hold it. Also I feel if he had gone for goal with his header from Stu's freekick he could have had a very good chance against a pretty average keeper. May not have gone in but was better than what he went for in the end. 

Again, I thought he did well and was impressed, just saying "nothing" isn't quite accurate imo.

A header from that wouldn't have troubled Kepa. He played well and improved us. 

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6 minutes ago, Saint Billy said:

Headed across goal when he should have headed into goal. 

it was a looping cross. Not sure he would ever have scored if he had directed at the goal. I am not a fan, but I think you are playing the man not the ball, or is it the other way round? 

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No complaints here, you just can't expect Chelsea's first five shooters to miss twice in a shootout.

Forster, what an improvement he's made. He's now far from the goalkeeper who used to let in routine shots from outside the box and have any saves he did make ironically cheered. Kept us in the game tonight with some top drawer saves and it's a shame after years of the famous contract, that it's expiring just as he's able to offer us something and that he's reportedly looking to leave at the end of the season.

Lyanco. Could we have found another bargain gem? Give him a start against Watford and see how he gets on. Deserves it after tonight. The scouting/recruitment seems a lot more solid now, than the Wilson/Reed era, so I'm positive about this one. Funny that some wrote him off after watching goal highlights against Sheffield United, as there weren't any streams for the live match.

Last year, if we had made 9 changes to our eleven from a league game we'd have been playing a load of dummies. Now, tonight's proven that we've finally got squad depth again. They went up against a Chelsea side with no amateurs, containing a £70m Kepa, £40m Kovacic, £40m Ziyech and £70m Havertz. Just four players who together likely  cost more than our entire 25 man team. That's the difference in resources, but this squad has got something and from our performances has enough to stay up. Now back onto the league we go and hopefully get a result Saturday.

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Just now, egg said:

A header from that wouldn't have troubled Kepa. He played well and improved us. 

Maybe, he wasn't that far out. Also Kepa is a pretty poor keeper, shots on target could force mistakes. But I very much agree with your second sentence, he did play well.

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12 minutes ago, woodsaint1 said:

I refuse to believe that Lyanco was a MOTM candidate. Not after all the experts on here told us that he was a wasted signing after only his first game. Guess its not the first time they've been spectacularly wrong. Hopefully he can push on now and put pressure on Bednarek/Stephens.

Forster was very good, great save in the shootout as well. Its clear we've decided on McCarthy long term, god knows why though. Everybody but the McCarthy fanboys can see that he does the GK basics better.

Our squad depth is so much better this season. Plenty of food for thought for Ralph as there were good performances all over the pitch. Also fair play to the boys stepping up for pens. Surprised Lyanco didnt as he scored a winning one for Brazil u23s in the Toulon final.

It wasn't after one game that the experts on here told us he was a wasted signing, it was before he had put the shirt on, it was before he had landed in the country. That's what our 'fans' do to newcomers who need a bit of support.

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10 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

I honestly can't name an attribute of his that stands out. He is mediocre in every aspect of his game. 

To be honest when I first saw him I thought he was a bit lightweight but before his injury he started putting himself about a bit and looked a lot better. He always seems to have good vision and was good with little flicks etc. Kind of player that’s worth giving a bit more of a chance to impress IMO

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14 minutes ago, Chez said:

why? Adams got a knock. Good job Long was on the bench. What other options were there? It was the league cup. No issues bringing him on in a game like this. The Walcott hatred on here seems a fraction harsh. Isn't he working his way back to fitness? 

It’s just that he’s really bad at football

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8 minutes ago, Chez said:

 Disagree. You may not rate McCarthy, but he has made some absolutely outstanding saves this season. Some I'd argue Forster wouldn't have made. They both have done well. Maybe just praise them both? 

Can’t recall any “absolutely outstanding” saves from McCarthy tbf, certainly not any that resemble the top corner stops Forster made tonight.

I have no faith in the guy. I believe Fraser has a bigger presence in the side, and a much better control of his defence.

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5 minutes ago, TWar said:

Maybe, he wasn't that far out. Also Kepa is a pretty poor keeper, shots on target could force mistakes. But I very much agree with your second sentence, he did play well.

There's no way he could have generated any pace on the ball from that cross. It would have been powderpuff into the goalie's arms and pelters from saintsweb

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Just now, DT said:

It’s just that he’s really bad at football

sure, but we only have so many strikers on the books. Three started and one was out injured.  I don't see the point in moaning about Long. If we started him, then fair enough, but he is 4th choice at best.

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I don't think I've ever felt so positive after a loss.

We nearly won that game three times in injury time. We clearly have a world class (reserve) keeper. Lyanco might be an absolute steal. Salisu must be worth 40m already. Tella is electric, he puts pressure on defences in possession  and causes mistakes. 

Djenepo and Valery were part of a defence that only conceded one goal that neither can be blamed for. Romeu had a good game, Stu Armstrong looked like he's fully recovered. I thought KWP had an excellent game and covered a lot of positions.

The only two starting players that disappointed me were Adams and A Armstrong. At least Armstrong scored his penalty.

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A very strong performance from us tonight. We took them all the way to penalties. On another day we win on penalties. Forster absolutely outstanding tonight, he made several worldie saves to keep us in it and the penalty save too. Lyanco quality too tonight, he could be in contention to start on Saturday in my opinion. Pleased for Che that he got his goal. Hopefully Adam can get one too at the weekend. Nice to see Smallbone back, he had a good cameo. Felt for him with his penalty along with Theo. We move onto Saturday now COYR :)

Edited by davefizzy14
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5 minutes ago, bpsaint said:

Can’t recall any “absolutely outstanding” saves from McCarthy tbf, certainly not any that resemble the top corner stops Forster made tonight.

I have no faith in the guy. I believe Fraser has a bigger presence in the side, and a much better control of his defence.

Mccarthy has made several great saves this season, including one vs Chelsea in the league game.

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Just now, bpsaint said:

Can’t recall any “absolutely outstanding” saves from McCarthy tbf, certainly not any that resemble the top corner stops Forster made tonight.

I have no faith in the guy. I believe Fraser has a bigger presence in the side, and a much better control of his defence.

Not keen on either, but both have done well this season. McCarthy makes some outstanding saves. If you don't care to credit him for those, that's up to you. 

 

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Great performance against a quality team - although I’d caveat getting too excited by that as Chelsea struggled in the previous round and won on pens too. There is consistent defensive improvement - and I think you have to credit the coaching staff and system as well as the player for a strong Lyanco (and Valery) performance. Credit to to the board and Ralph for improving the squad and providing genuine competition for places.

Now the big negative - I’m still not seeing many goals in this team, and think aside from Broja we have a load of championship level strikers and attacking midfielders. Let’s see how we get on against Watford - but realistically I think success this year will be avoiding relegation and hopefully a couple of those at mid and strikers become genuine Prem talents.

Result is annoying - it’s one of those winnable trophies for teams like us. But not faulting Ralph for team or subs (although the Walcott signing was ridiculous - you can’t not play a fit £70k a week player you have just signed in a league cup game against at weakened opposition).

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10 minutes ago, VictiAbNonem said:

The only two starting players that disappointed me were Adams and A Armstrong. At least Armstrong scored his penalty.

If Che hadn't scored, in game, Armstrong wouldn't have got to take a penalty...! 

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Just now, Micky said:

If Che hadn't scored, in game, Armstrong wouldn't have got to take a penalty...! 

I know. But my stream of the game cut out for the goal and the replays. I didn't see him do anything else useful for our team.

I think our performance deserved a goal or two. 

Theirs obviously did too or we wouldn't be talking about what a great game Forster had.

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Great atmosphere in the away end, top drawer shithousing of Mount when he was warming up, nearly took the roof off when Fraser saved his penalty, and a brilliant effort from the lads. Chelsea fans as awful as ever. 
 

Standouts for me:

Fraser - some great saves

Lyanco - legend

Tino - just for warming up in front of the Chelski fans

Salisu - immense 

Diallo - was everywhere

Tella - proper nippy

Shane - excellent when he came on 

 

 

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Smallbones, Big hooves. Schoolboy penalty, don't lean back. Good to see him back though, he'll be like a new signing if he improves.

Foster>McCarthy for sure. The Keeper problem seems to be that once they get in the first team they get more work with our goalkeeping coaches, which is why their form tails off.

Reassuring performance from Theo in that we'll miss absolutely nothing in getting a place ready for JWP.

Lyanco in for 'after you Claude' Bednarek at the weekend please. Bednarek is decent but needs a kick up the arse right now, and needs to fight for his spot.

Fully anticipated improved performance against a top team tonight, let's see what we get in a game we have a fair chance of getting something at the weekend. I think I can see what's coming.

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39 minutes ago, VictiAbNonem said:

I think Lyanco might just have had the fastest turnaround from completely shit to legend in Saints' history.

 

He’s definitely wasn’t even terrible v Sheff Utd as some people made out - 95% of the time he was actually extremely solid. Problem though, as with so many Saints players is that a poor 5% lead to conceding a goal.

 

He’s is certainly a good player but in my eyes he’ll definitely continue to be 95% great and 5% poor, and at times that 5% will cost us. But he’s definitely nowhere near as bad as some made out after Sheffield.

Edited by Nemi
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If injury time had gone on any longer I'd have collapsed. It was brilliant, they threw everything at Chelsea. 2000+ Saints fans roaring them on and they really responded.

Salisu was MOTM for me by a country mile. I think we are just getting use to his performances. Going to be hard to keep him.

Lyanco played very well, knackered at the end but boy does he care.  Love his passion. I saw him live at Sheffield and you could see there was a player in there. He just needs time to adjust to the EPL.

Forster had a very good game, but the contract situation means he is on his way. We just have to live with that.

Nobody has mentioned KWP he was fabulous. His covering tackle at the death was seismic. He has to play.

Really positive night. Result was a shame but we had a lot of 2nd string players out there so to go so close remains creditable. Had a lot worse nights at Stamford Bridge.

Negatives are Walcott. I'm afraid time has caught up with him. 

Valery had some good moments and had a hand in the goal. However in defense he was a weak link, that was very clear.

Lyanco needs a Prem game soon and I'd like to see Armstrong team up with Broja.

I need a lie down after that.

COYS

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Great performance to be fair, pretty pleased with that despite going out.

Positives - Lyanco, Forster, Diallo, KWP. Long played well when he came on.

Negatives - Valery (got caught on the ball way too much), A.Armstrong, Adams & Walcott.

Stuart Armstrong and Diallo are too similar to play as a two in CM. 

Walcott offers virtually nothing. 

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2 hours ago, macca155 said:

I agree with that, except A Armstrong. I thought he did well. His pace caused the Chelsea defence all sorts of issues.

Think we need to be patient with him.

I think there's a lot of wishful thinking going on with A.Armstrong based on the fact we've spent a lot of money on him.

Still early days but so far he's looked a very limited player. He needs to improve significantly

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4 hours ago, macca155 said:

If injury time had gone on any longer I'd have collapsed. It was brilliant, they threw everything at Chelsea. 2000+ Saints fans roaring them on and they really responded.

Salisu was MOTM for me by a country mile. I think we are just getting use to his performances. Going to be hard to keep him.

Lyanco played very well, knackered at the end but boy does he care.  Love his passion. I saw him live at Sheffield and you could see there was a player in there. He just needs time to adjust to the EPL.

Forster had a very good game, but the contract situation means he is on his way. We just have to live with that.

Nobody has mentioned KWP he was fabulous. His covering tackle at the death was seismic. He has to play.

Really positive night. Result was a shame but we had a lot of 2nd string players out there so to go so close remains creditable. Had a lot worse nights at Stamford Bridge.

Negatives are Walcott. I'm afraid time has caught up with him. 

Valery had some good moments and had a hand in the goal. However in defense he was a weak link, that was very clear.

Lyanco needs a Prem game soon and I'd like to see Armstrong team up with Broja.

I need a lie down after that.

COYS

Great summary.  Cup tie or not, that was an outstanding game of Football - high tempo; intensely contested; end-to-end movement; great crowd involvement with plenty of Saints support.

Just about every Saint's supporter would have been interested in Lyanco's game - he was outstanding.   Noticeable how well he read the game as Salisu does too.   He showed good speed, timed his tackles well, ok in the air, kept his cool in tight situations and in the second half took the ball forward high up the pitch and then nearly won the game with a bullet header from a Smallbone corner.    The best CB combination at the Club became apparent tonight!

KWP was very good again tonight - it's pointless to keep banging the play KWP and Tino on the right drum, but it will be a great shame if one our best players (KWP) is not starting regularly.   Diallo once again did well; manages to get high up the pitch but still be diligent with defensive duties - he really has an instinct for quick ball movement and I hope upon JWP's return that style of play continues.    Forster certainly put himself in the shop window; Adam Armstrong looks on the cusp of another goal and there's more to his all round game than Che.    Hoping the A.Armstrong/Broja combination will get an opportunity soon.  Felt a bit sorry for Theo, but he shouldn't be getting much game time from this point.  And if that was a Shane Long finale he did ok, including the rolled in pen.   Super game, let's hope it can be backed up at Watford.

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A most enjoyable game and the team played  very well after 9 changes. Lyanco and Fraser were excellent and good to see Che get a goal and Will Smallbone back playing.Stu Armstrong looked a though he relished the captain role too,

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I still haven't been fully convinced by our first team lineup this season and I think we could benefit if some of the players who played last night started in some of the league games. Our team should feature kwp, Diallo, possibly Lyanco, possibly forster and Stuart Armstrong. 

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When this draw was pulled out of the hat I thought that was it. Playing the European champions at Stamford Bridge would be a big ask but all credit to Saints they put in a solid and encouraging performance. We can build on that and hopefully lift ourselves out of the bottom half of the league. Some posters have said how happy they feel. Well, I don't. I feel really dejected that penalties finished us off. I wasn't confident at all in seeing Walcott, Long and Smallbone step up to take one. I don't know what Ralph's procedure is on penalties. Does he ask for volunteers or choose them himself? Whichever way, for me there were other players on that pitch who may have delivered a better outcome. Walcott has had his days, as has Long and it was a lot to ask of Smallbone. That's football for you but it's hard to take sometimes.

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5 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

When this draw was pulled out of the hat I thought that was it. Playing the European champions at Stamford Bridge would be a big ask but all credit to Saints they put in a solid and encouraging performance. We can build on that and hopefully lift ourselves out of the bottom half of the league. Some posters have said how happy they feel. Well, I don't. I feel really dejected that penalties finished us off. I wasn't confident at all in seeing Walcott, Long and Smallbone step up to take one. I don't know what Ralph's procedure is on penalties. Does he ask for volunteers or choose them himself? Whichever way, for me there were other players on that pitch who may have delivered a better outcome. Walcott has had his days, as has Long and it was a lot to ask of Smallbone. That's football for you but it's hard to take sometimes.

You know Long scored his penalty, right?

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46 minutes ago, rooney said:

A most enjoyable game and the team played  very well after 9 changes. Lyanco and Fraser were excellent and good to see Che get a goal and Will Smallbone back playing.Stu Armstrong looked a though he relished the captain role too,

You do know that (well, according to the national media) it was only Chelsea that made changes, right?

Big disadvantage once we lost the toss for the end to take penalties, gave their support a chance to finally wake up and put the pressure on. If it had been the other end in front of nearly 3,000 Saints fans it may have panned out differently and the skate would have been the scared little rabbit in the headlights. At least he still fooked it up anyway.

Excellent performance, something to build on, interesting to see who makes the first 11 on Saturday…………..

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The only thing we did wrong is let Walcott & smallbone take penalties. If you had the list of five you would have had them down to miss.  Smallbone looked incredibly nervous to be taking one and hadn't been on the pitch that long & had fluffed a couple of chances, Walcott well I don't need to tell you why he should be nowhere near a penalty.  Yes it's good that they probably offered but either the manager should have had the mental strength to say no and picked lyanco and others  who had had a good game or other players should have come forward, anyway it's over now onwards and hopefully upwards!  

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