bridge too far

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-10988478

Even though the grammar is wrong?

bore

Phil - every child born is, to use a hackneyed phrase, a blank canvas. How they turn out depends on a whole host of factors - parents, innate intelligence, opportunity and environment. It behoves us, as a country, to develop each and every child to its full potential. Contrary to your assertions it does happen in state schools. I've already mentioned my grandson. He is 7 and has a reading and maths age of 13. He gets special tuition in his state school to cope with his ability and to stop him getting bored. Back in the 70s his father was equally bright but this special attention wasn't available in those days - it was only children with learning difficulties who got extra attention then. So you're being very unfair when you say that bright kids in state schools are 'held back' by those who are not so fortunate. I can't see that private education offers anything to clever children that the state system doesn't. It may well offer something extra to the not-so-gifted child. It may well offer some parents some sort of satisfaction by seeing their children mix with children from posher backgrounds.

Let's have a virtual bet on it, shall we? I'll bet £10 he wins a major before the Olympics and, if I'm wrong, I'll give a tenner to a local charity. Will you match me?

This. And it's common practice these days, in state schools, to give very bright children extra tuition / time to ensure they don't get bored and to ensure they're constantly challenged. My grandson is classified as 'special needs' because he is so bright and his parents have chosen to continue his education at the local state school although they could afford to send him to a private school.

And he wins!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Goodness me, Art. What a pedigree you have! The closest I ever came to Dame Margot was borrowing her niece's dress for a party! I've enjoyed watching that clip of Rudy and, yes, I can see the similarity with Ivan. Great 'ballon'. My first brush with dance was seeing 'The Red Shoes' when I was a very little girl. I just fell in love with ballet there and then and I never looked back. Sadly I was too tall to be a ballet dancer ( you had to be under 5ft 6in then) but I did enjoy a number of years as a jazz / cabaret dancer. I then taught jazz dance for a long while before the joints started to complain I'm now about to enrol my 2 and a half year old granddaughter into my friend's dance school. She already knows the five positions of the feet and arms!

But no-one's asking for everyone to be equal. Unless you're Stu, who wants everyone to be an infantry man because nothing else is worthwhile, we are all different, thank goodness. All is being discussed is equality of opportunity, not equality per se.

Stu - this is my last post on this subject, mainly out of respect for the OP who has had his thread hijacked. I do know about recruitment for the armed forces. Many of my family were / still are in the RAF. My own brother was in the RAF as was my cousin and my ex-husband. Some of my son's friends have been in the army. One was very highly decorated because of bravery in the first Iraq war.

No, I don't know what you do. Others have referred to you as a submariner. And you're right, I don't know where you are right now - Plymouth seems to be most often referred to. However, given that I'm retired and you are employed by the state, I think it's quite interesting to compare our post counts

What a shame Stu that you have to retort to such language and such a bad attitude when all I've done is point out facts. Is that what you were taught in the army? Were you a squaddie? Did they teach you to read comprehensively? I only ask because your reading seems to be selective. Please note that I wrote: Both professions are worthwhile and much respected by me

I'm not being personal - I'm curious. Mainly because you seem to spend so much time on here and I can't imagine that would be possible in a war zone. I get heartily sick of people knocking nurses and to try to compare armed forces with nurses is just plain stupid really (even though I'm doing it with regard to pay). Most nurses take up that career as a vocation. I know that many army officers and other ranks also join the army as a vocation but some, if not quite a lot, join at the lower ranks because there aren't many unskilled jobs available and they'd otherwise be on the dole (that is also commendable - better to be employed for the good of the country than be on benefits.)

I think a lot of that is to do with the fact that he prefers hardcourt rather than grass court tennis.

Depends on the levels of responsibility of both, doesn't it No doubt you and your comrades in arms (do YOU actually bear arms, TDD?) don't need nurses in theatres of war then, Because you're all such tough cookies. Do you actually go to theatres of war, TDD?

Aah here we go (since no-one can directly answer my questions: How much will I get paid when I become an officer? You can expect to start on £24,615 - 30,368 depending on your level of education. Your food and accommodation will be heavily subsidised meaning more of your salary ends up in your pocket for you to decide how to spend it. http://www.armyjobs.mod.uk/toughquestions/pages/HowmuchwillIgetpaidfirstupasanofficer.aspx So, assuming a GRADUATE officer starts nearer the top, I shall compare that with a graduate nurse who will earn: Band 5 (covers 7 years' increases) Point 16 21,176 Point 17 21,798 Point 18 22,663 Point 19 23,563 Point 20 24,554 Point 21 25,472 Point 22 26,483 Point 23 27,534 and the nurse will NOT get heavily subsidised food and accommodation and will have to contribute 6% of salary to pension whereas forces staff enjoy a non-contributory pension. A private in the army earns between £17K and £26,500. http://www.armyjobs.mod.uk/benefits/pay/Pages/Soldier.aspx No specific qualifications are required to be a private (much like a burger flipper then although I have to say I have more regard for someone who puts his / her life on the line so I'm not being derogatory). http://www.armyjobs.mod.uk/howdoijoin/canijoin/Pages/EntryRequirements.aspx No specific qualifications to be a nursing assistant either, but they usually undertake NVQ Level 3 and so, to compare them to a private, shows that they earn: Band 3 Point 6 15,610 Point 7 16,145 Point 8 16,753 Point 9 17,118 Point 10 17,604 Point 11 18,152 Point 12 18,577 Incidentally, I lived for a number of years in a garrison town and, from my experience, there are as many 'mongs and retards' (to use Stu's words) on the loose on a Friday night as there were such men from other walks of life. Both professions are worthwhile and much respected by me. Because of the commitment of people in both professions, I think it should be understood that, comparing like with like, army personnel come out best at any rank.

I'm sorry you felt unable to answer my question to you. If someone is a graduate and then decides to join the army, at what rank would they enter the army? And what entry qualifications are required to join the army as a private?

I thought King Edwards was a Grant Maintained school? It used to be a state grammar school IIRC. GM schools are obliged to offer scholarships and bursaries. Unfortunately not every town in the UK has such schools.

Is one set up against Federer in the final of the Toronto Masters. Go Andy

You need to compare the pay of a nursing assistant with a private even though a nursing assistant requires some qualifications. A nursing assistant is on Band 3 - £15,500 - £18,500 approximately. So comparing (almost) like with like, a private earns more for less qualifications. And a nursing assistant gets no 'perks'. A fully qualified nurse is a graduate these days. What rank would apply to a new entrant to the army with a degree?

I couldn't agree more. Education should be secular. Full stop.

I think, as the economic outlook turns increasingly gloomy, more and more parents will withdraw their children from fee-paying schools and send them to state schools. In fact, I'm sure I read somewhere that this is already happening. It will / already has put enormous pressure on some state schools to provide these unexpected places. Sadly though, even in the state sector, some parents 'buy' advantage by moving to catchment areas of 'good' schools. That's their right and I wouldn't deny them that right (to move house, that is). But it's a shame that, even in the state sector, some schools are perceived to be better than others.

Because, WSS, it perpetuates the divide in our society. And what possible 'advantage' can having a Bugatti or a Porsche bring over a 1 litre Renault 5 - what actual advantage in any attempt to improve your lot in life? We arrive on this planet in the same way and depart this mortal coil in the same way. Why shouldn't we all have the same opportunities? It's then up to the individual as to whether s/he wants to take advantage of those opportunities. The 'better' teachers don't necessarily gravitate to fee-paying schools. I would say the BEST teachers are those devoted to teaching in the state sector because they're doing what their vocation demands of them - enabling children from all walks of life to achieve their potential.

Absolutely agree. It's no wonder people don't understand each others' problems and achievements if they're separated at a young age as far as education is concerned. I'm a great believer in people's freedom to spend their cash as they wish but I don't believe that any one person deserves to have better access to good health, good education, good legal advice than anyone else. We chose to send our children to state schools - they did just fine and are all successful in their chosen fields. It goes against my principles to 'buy' advantages.

Watching that video of Nureyev makes me realise just how much male dancers have developed over the years Nureyev had so much charisma and, in his time, was a great technician with great emotion. But, starting with Baryshnikov, male dancers have become so much more athletic. My current favourite is Ivan Vasilev. Here's a clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=MjH4zU0WIY4&feature=related What do you think?