coalman

For the crime of being unworthy I sentence you to... Russball

The other four teams could also point to things which went against them. Everton for starters against us.

No chance of that. Martin doesn't see the point in defensive midfielders

It's funny how football fans only remember the times they were unlucky.

Let's examine how lucky we've been over the course of the season. v Newcastle 0-1 (xG 1.95 - 0.43) we had the chances to win this but - we failed to capitalise on them going down to 10 men and gave away a stupid goal v Nottm Forest 0-1 (xG 0.21 - 2.86) we were lucky not to lose by more v Brentford 1-3 (xG 1.65 - 3.86) so about what we deserved from the game v Man Utd 0-3 (xG 1.36 - 3.03) we missed a penalty and then folded but again seems to be what we deserved v Ipswich 1-1 (xG 2.90 - 1.65) we deserved more from the game but failing to mark properly at a corner gave them a goal at the death v Bournemouth 1-3 (xG 0.70 - 1.44) we deserved to lose though Bournemouth didn't create as much as the scoreline suggested v Arsenal 1-3 (xG 1.27 - 3.25) we got what we deserved after a plucky opening v Leicester 2-3 (xG 2.43 - 2.84) we conceded late goals including failing to mark from a corner again but Leicester had the better chances overall v Man City 0-1 (xG 0.37 - 3.16) we were lucky not to lose by more v Everton 1-0 (xG 0.54 - 1.79) we we lucky to win the game, Everton created more and better chances and had a goal disallowed that was marginal (and given the time taken probably not a clear and obvious error) v Wolves 0-2 (xG 0.79 - 0.91) Wolves deserved to win barely - however, we didn't trouble the goalkeeper. Had a goal disallowed that might have stood on another day If you look at the quality of chances created then, other than against the 10 men of Newcastle and Ipswich where we gave away silly goals we come out worst in every single game. Our only win wasn't exactly a display to build confidence from. Throw in the fact we've given away more chances by mistakes passing around the back than any other team, are the worst at defending from crosses and can't turn possession into chances it's hard to look at those results and say we're unlucky to be where we are in the table. In the games where it has been close then our style of football has led to us dropping points - that's not luck - that's tactics. The idea that we've just had bad luck is an example of what is known as Outcome Bias in decision making. It means we fail to learn and adapt because we assume that when something goes against us it's out of our hands and when something goes for us it's because we did something good. It's telling that we have turned some good positions into defeats - but those have all come because of the way we play not because we're unlucky. Watching Martin purring over the praise he got from Pep the other week was telling. It reminded me of one of my favourite quotes from the Basketball coach, Doc Rivers. Average players want to be left alone, good players want to be coached, great players want to be told the truth. In the case of our manager, he gets so prickly when anyone questions his style. He operates on the basis that it's just bad luck that we are where we are. Then we start saying it's because our players aren't good enough to play his system - the players he oversaw the recruitment of during the summer. If the players aren't good enough - play a different system. If the system is good enough then why should we expect to lose almost every single game we play? Gio, I get that you want Saints to do well but simply restating your belief that it's going to turn around and this is the only to challenge the footballing super powers is not grounded in any kind of reality.

Russball knows the first thing you have to do is silence the crowd.

Don't cross the streams

I'm not asking what SR's targets are - I'm asking what you would want to see. For example - you said that you'd be ok to keep Martin if we were relegated but didn't get relegated next season. So where you would be happy with at Christmas to feel confident the plan is working? What would you want to see if we were relegated to feel confident that Martin was the correct manager to keep next season? Let me give you an example - one metric you might use to determine whether we're in a good spot would be to compare the xG and xGA for each match to see if we're making better opportunities than our opponents. So, hypothetically, if we're consistently expected to concede 1 or more goal more than our opponents every game then would you consider that to be a sign that our style / plan isn't working?

I can't believe we're that good against through ball attacks, protecting the lead, aerial duels and finishing scoring chances.

What would sufficient progress against the plan look like? In particular - where should we be right now? Where should we be by the end of December? Where should we be by the end of the season? How will we know the plan is working?

Out of curiosity - what would need to happen or you to see in order to change your opinion of Russell Martin as a manager? What would be the tipping point for you to think that we needed a change? How long should we keep persisting with our current approach both with Martin and also as a club under Sport Republic?

I have it on good authority that the chimpanzee just accepted an offer from Jim Radcliffe to join Man Utds back room staff. It also had an offer from Todd Boehly to join Chelsea but thought there were too many monkeys there already.

You're assuming they're not just using the player stats from Football Manager...

We can get another 3 attacking midfielders to play out of position for that.

I think we need to be aiming for more this season than simply "beating" Derby's all time points record. This is a Russell Martin team that can achieve anything so why not make sure we alone hold the record defeat with a solid 10 or 11-0 loss as well?

Imagine what that group could have done with the money that Dragan has poured into the club.

Well, fuck.

So you're saying Russball can't work?

Why the fuck are you watching Saints with your eyes open?

At it's heart, Russball is about possession. And, when we hit that magic 100% possession, combined with our deliberate and patient attacking play, we'll be on course for 38 nil nil draws a season and 38 points has a great chance of keeping us up. Thus ensuring perpetual Premier League survival and for Rasmus and Henrik to flip lots of promising youngsters for big profit. Hell, we may even score the odd goal and get even more points. Trust the process.

I'm assuming that's taking into account Pep leaving City for Southampton and getting a 500M war chest in January.

He made Stephens captain when he started and in true Russell Martin style doesn't feel any need to change his approach. Luckily he can play Stephens at left back so that he can get Manning as a budget winger up the left. That way he ensures we aren't going to attack at pace up our left wing and aren't going to be able to defend attacks down it as well. On the other side it's a bit harder because even if KWP is injured then Sugawara has a natural tendency to want to stretch play and get early balls into the box. However that's something that can be coached out of him.

Totally agree. This quote sounds like it came from a man shortly after being kicked in the head by a horse.

You want the players who are the worst with the ball to see the most of it. It's the only way they'll get better. The players who are good on the ball have already had their turn. Common sense.

David Ornstein now giving his opinion on Martin. "No doubt it's precarious there, but I don't know of him being in imminent danger of being removed from his position, and that's because he's highly thought of. He bought Southampton into the Premier League. Their ambition was to stay there, and they very well could do so this season. The view of him is high, not only inside Southampton among the ownserhip, but outside as well. There's a feeling that perhaps the players have not been good enough, and they're going to need to do something in the January transfer window." So that's it. The players, who aren't good enough and are going to be replaced think highly of Martin. As do the ownership who are high on something and the solution is to let him buy even more players in January to turn things around. I'm guessing these same players, who aren't good enough, are feeling really bad that they're the thing holding Martin back from achieving his vision. It's unclear who the people outside Southampton (also clearly high) that like Martin. At least that's what I got out of this. In fact, this situation might be more easily explicable (and even forgivable) if it turned out that everyone at or involved with the club was totally bollocksed out of their fucking minds on a truly incredible cocktail of substances. Meanwhile Russmus comes late to Southampton as Martin and Ankersen are set for another shopping spree in Jnauary to fill our squad with more randomly scouted players that we don't need and will in no way form the financial millstone that causes us to financially implode again (a la Redknapp).