pap

There's that word again, obviously. Things aren't as obvious to me sir, but we don't have to fall out over it.

Only because you blindly refuse to accept any validity in the bloodless hand video. Large font, eh? Classy.

Yeah right Keep on with your "obviously", "patently" and your "genuinely". That makes you right.

I'm not going to tell you I've seen something I haven't ( I haven't ). Are all stabbings the same? Accounts of this one were fairly graphic. I quite enjoyed your Carrie reference, but its completely at odds with what one eyewitness said, who likened it to a horror movie, speaking of hacking and removing organs, etc. Let's not forget this started out as a decapitation. On a separate point, that information could have been released on the day. I do wonder why the public were left to seethe over it for days.

I'm well aware of confirmation bias, and well aware that I probably suffer from it. I think you probably have the same condition. This is the third thread in which we've discussed conspiracy related matters. Unfailingly, I don't think you've conceded a single point. Usual suspects doing the name-calling in those threads, too. You are so keen to put me in with the infowars crew. It's just another example of you letting your imagination run wild and completely missing the mark. If a smoking gun was ever found on one of the big conspiracies, Alex Jones would be the last person in the world I'd want to run the story. I can't think of a bigger turnoff in the conspiracy movement, a shouting unfocused boorish man who happens to cream loads of cash out of it. There's a reason he's the go-to guy whenever they want to put a truther on the telly.... Still, let's hear your "sinister" accusations. Go further than what you've actually written. I'm interested in seeing whether you cross the libel border.

I'll pay your fiver for you if you can keep all your posts this civil

Pap can not reply. He is busy being an implement of industry and adding to his legendary professional status. Actually, that's not quite true 'cos I just did, twice. How's the form with yourself, Bazza?

Just for clarity, I'm having difficulty reconciling the bloody nature of the attack with the bloodless attackers. Same issue I raised in an initial thread when I was just pointing out the clean state of the jacket. Since then, I've seen video footage of the same event that shows different things. Go and ask people what happened in Woolwich last week, and 9/10 will probably tell you that a soldier had his head cut off, yet it's still not clear that Lee Rigby was actually decapitated. The post-mortem revealed the cause of death to be multiple, incisive wounds. The more I look into it, the convinced I am. One of the most interesting things I've found is one of the least sensational. It's a picture taken from the top floor of the bus. Linked, rather than embedded, because it does show the victim. It's just another incongruent artefact from what was billed and reported as a bloody massacre.

Over the long term, yeah. Makers of games hardware have often been a little different. They'll often sell their machines as a loss leader, as they know they're due a cut on all software as the platform holder. Sony and Microsoft have taken this route in the past. Nintendo used to employ this model, but I think they've made money on every hardware unit since the GameCube. The pre-owned thing will be a big deal for a lot of customers. Personally, I'm not a fan of the Kinect camera spying on you.

And yet again, this is more quantity masquerading as quality from your good self. You begin your post by knocking the Illuminati type that released the vid. Completely irrelevant btw, as I don't believe the person who posted the video is making any claims whatsoever about the blood, or lack thereof, on the hands. Seems to me that the only agenda on this video is reminding people of the dangers of divide and rule, even if the term "higher ups" is embarrassing. I have to ask, when the person who posted the video isn't making those claims, why are you doing so? Same old Verbal, obfuscate, ascribe what is not there, and discredit. That kind of makes all of your points about the malicious intent of the video's poster null and void. Before we travel into your description of interlace vs progressive, I think it's important to address one thing. How many separate recordings do you think you're watching here?

No, I haven't delved into those settings before today, but thanks for the tip. I can indeed get the bloody result by changing the colour balance. Two problems. The levels of red increase universally across the video. So yep, I can get bloody hands etc, but I also get a rosy face. I'm not seeing that reflected universally between vid 1 and vid 2. Can you easily mask parts of the footage you don't want to touch? Genuine question. The other thing is no artefacting. The blurs around the hands just aren't there. Cheers for the tip on VLC though. I enjoyed playing with that.

I said I honestly didn't know. I don't think that's quite the same thing as blatantly lying. Besides, your colour balance explanation doesn't really explain the artefacting that is all over vid 2 that doesn't appear in vid 1.

Nah, it's not. It's a p!ss poor attempt to explain away some major discrepancies.

That's a possibility, but remember that this is a video we're talking about here. Someone would have had to gone through every frame of that and painstakingly remove the blood from each frame, giving the impression of natural skin underneath. I honestly don't know whether there are video editing suites that can remove gore from hands quickly. The pertinent bit of the vid lasts about 21 seconds. At 24 frames per second, that's roughly 500 separate images to alter, retouch and stick back together. It was posted the same day of the attack. Enough time to make the images look less horrific? Possibly. My personal opinion is that this video, in terms of artefacting and all the other stuff you see when images are changed, is more likely to be closer to the original content than the very different videos we saw on television and still frames on the TV. Here's the vid that was on ITV news. This one actually shows signs of tampering. Check the ghosting around the hands. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54F4lROHpmM

Ah, so it's the video that has been tampered with, eh? Sorry mucker, but you've given me enough crap on this topic - I'm not going to let you get away with the "quite obviously" attempt to shut this point down. What are the obvious signs of tampering?

Difference between amount of blood on hands in vid I posted (scroll up) and the pictures we saw in the national media. My contention is that due to the stark difference between the two sets of footage, and the fact they relate to the same bloke, the pictures in the paper were sexed up to make the killer look more convincing.

Nothing you've written relates to the matter at hand and you are arguing as a child does. I appreciate your attempt to bung some genuine concern in there, but do I really want the pity of someone I'm respecting less and less with each encounter? Confronted with that video, you have no explanation. That's fair enough; neither do I.

Yeah, I found the tacked-on message at the end to be a bit noddy too. However, I could not escape the fact that his hands are nothing like the bloody messes of compressed colour they are in the photos plastered over the national media. It's not rocket science, mush.

As long as they don't produce the kit in JPG format, we should be fine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Vc62gkSN8W0 Where's the blood, Bazza?

That's the sort of debating tactic I would expect, and have heard, from a young kid. The difference is that they don't know any better.

They chose the wrong file format. JPEG is really good for photos that have a lot of variance, but you're better off with a PNG for logos and suchlike.

Nice. Always my brand of choice when I was a nipper and cared about such things.

I posted the vid after he made his comments, so I have to wonder what subject he was dealing with. Ah yes, he was analysing the results of his own imagination ( and a very good job he did too! ). I look forward to being schooled on the particular compression algorithm that was used to produce those results.

I'm not discrediting Verbal at all. I'm saying that his assertions are based on a false assumption, which is fair enough, I reckon. Everything Verbal posted pertained to analysis of compression routines. I said up front that the evidence was video-based and reiterated that I didn't think compression caused no blood effects, so I'm really not sure why he embarked on that area of investigation. It wasn't germane to the point, is all. On a more general note, I'm really not that interesting in "playing the man", Smirking. I leave that to the experts.