Chez

does it factor in the state of game (lot easier tucking away a chance at 6-0 up than 1-0), `size' of game, form and confidence of player, timing of chance (tiredness must effect things), whether it was on a players good foot, the specific skillset of the player?

genuine question. What are those two CBs like on the ball? If we are going to ask them to play out from the back, which they don't do as much at Burnley, can they do that? Every time I see McNeil with the ball he looks classy. I wonder what formation would get the best of him.

I have to say that a lot of the chances/goals came as a result of our midfield being totally ineffective. No pressure on the ball, being the wrong side, allowing players space in between the lines and of course not keep the ball when we got it. That has been the case a fair bit recently. Even the best centre backs look frail when exposed to breaking opponents and the number of times our CBs have been faced by an extra attacker in recent games explains why we have conceded so many relatively `easy' goals. I thought Stuart Armstrong was particularly bad on Saturday. Romeu was very poor and JWP ineffective. Diallo often gets the wrong side. If you attack, you will inevitably leave space, but on Saturday we were hardly being caught in transition, we were just caught flat footed and wrong side, time after time. That needs addressing.

he can play, no doubt it, but he ball watches and is positionally suspect. KWP is a better defender. We are shipping goals. We need to get pressure o the ball in midfield and defenders that can defend to give us something to build on.

Forget balance, KWP should play right back because Livramento simply isn't a great defender. We need to tighten up.

a fair bit of `noise' (today agent created no doubt) about Chelsea's Levi Colwill, on loan at Huddersfield. We sign a 19 year old (20 now) Chelsea CB and he goes on loan to a terrible league 2 side, while here is a 19 year CB from Chelsea who's playing well at a Championship side. Did we sign the wrong player or are both gonna be good?

£90m debt, Broja returning to Chelsea and only a coupe of players out of contract in the summer (Long and Forster...plus the reserve keepers and some nippers) means it will be very tough for us to improve next season. Unless someone spends ludicrous money on Livramento, which they won't, especially if they have watched him in the second half of the season, then where is the money to buy players?

me too. Just how Werner missed that header in the first half I will never know. Extremely lucky Alonso didn't score in the second too (just wide of the far post) - no pressure on him, on his left, no pressure game wise. They destroyed us. The goals they did score weren't `amazing finishes' either. There was a tad of fortune that Forster's saves fell to the feet of opponents for tap ins, but we were lucky the initial shots didn't go in in the first place.

You've waited 15 years to make your first post and that's it? Blimey.

The 1-4 defeat to Palace at home on the first day of the season in 2007 was as shockingly bad as any. My word, did we know it was going to be a long season after that. There were three horrible away defeats that season too. Smashed 5-0 at Sheff wed, Hull and 5-1 at Preston. Hull got promoted, but the other two finished 15th and 16th for god's sake. I know we survived, just, but I think that is the worst season in living memory (the relegation season the one after was actually better for some reason, as at least we were watching kids do their best, not seasoned pros failing). I went to pretty much ever game too, Horrible. It's scarred me.

as pitiful a Saints display as you will ever see, but not helped by the line up. Surrendered before we kicked off.

it was 6-1. I was at that game. It was remarkably similar to yesterdays debacle, with players never getting close, the likes of Telfer getting run ragged, lots of saves from Jones that fell straight to Pires and a wanker like Mount (Pennant) helping himself to goals. I seem to recall there was no lack of effort on our part, but we just couldn't get near them. On reflection, maybe we just didn't want to get hurt or suspended. It was the ideal storm. Our `reserved' performance in the cup final can be put down to this game. We were scared of getting burned again, so never left ourselves exposed. It was a bad night, but Chelsea display was much worse (plus that was an away game, no cup final to look forward to, a great season etc)

If we play like that again, wide open, no ball retention, anyone could beat us. After this defeat and five or six game run, confidence is going to be low. It's now going to be tough to turn it around. We are in a slump, again. That probably means five at the back next week - which we don't have a clue what we are doing and Shane Long to run around a lot. How have we gone from turning Spurs over and running United ragged to this.

I agree. Now back to this game. Jesus, what was wrong with our midfield?

yes we agree, Broja was outstanding in February.

the injury knocked him out of his stride. Perhaps he aint got back to full sharpness? Others on here have pointed to him having his head turned. Not sure that is true, but he hasn't been at his best. I put the mockers on him by saying I felt confident when he has the ball at his feet. I knew that would come back to bite me.

Maybe you missed the Man City, Spurs, Man United and Everton games, all in February, where Broja was outstanding. Ah, forget it. I don't know why I even read your posts. You've made you mind up and nothing I type is going to change that. You are entitled your opinion and when you argued that we shouldn't be spending £40m on him you had a point, but that seems to have morphed into rewriting history.

So what you are saying is you made a mistake, you should have put Broja in your "looked great" category. No problem.

I agree. He said what many Saints fans were thinking, but strange that the manager would say it. In the end, all that matters is how we play next week. We need a performance and a result.

I am starting to think you have a problem with Broja. 😉 To deny that he, like Adams "looked great" earlier in the season suggests so. Did he fuck your wife or something? Not that it matters, but AA, in your words, was completely anonymous today. Adams too, except when missing an absolute sitter. Both needed to do better, but both suffered from lack of supply too - as has been the case with Broja when you have labelled him anonymous.

There is nothing he can say really other than throw himself and/or his payers under the bus.

his tactics have been questioned a lot. His team selections have been questioned, perhaps more than any previous Saints manager (maybe that has a lot do with having a lot of similar standard players???) what did he say in the interview?

You might be right but I tend to focus on confidence rather than motivation. I see you chose to put Adams in your first category and Broja in your second category. LOL.

whenever we get tonked fans always point to a lack of care, fitness, bottle, fight, but usually its just playing utter shit. It was very hard to watch today. We just didnt get close to them, ever. They murdered us. All our frailties were exposed today. We simply ain't all that.

Not sure I agree about him unable to motivate. we are a lower mid table side. it's just when you win away at spurs and are flying, you think perhaps we are something more. We're not.