Sir Ralph

That looked like a disgusting tackle

Ok I’m not going to discuss the ins and outs of my business on this forum and don’t need the advice of people I don’t know. I have an accountancy firm for that. in terms of the reasons some of my values align with Reform I’ve already explained this earlier. If you want to understand from a cultural perspective then their stance on putting British people first in relation to welfare and housing, their genuine (not fake) desire to address the issues around illegal immigration and cultural integration, their anti woke ideology stance (and how this will impact the environment that my children are raised in) and desire to encourage free speech. When Reform are leading by a country mile in the polls it shouldn’t be difficult to believe that there are a lot of people like me who hold similar values, because there clearly are, including former Labour voters. A question for you and @Farmer Saint who would you vote for in the next GE? How do you think they align with your values?

what’s your question? I’m not going to start talking about my own business with you.

I appreciate your concern about my business set up. The point she was making was not a racist one so not illegal. It was based on factual evidence and the police would be investigating if it was. She maybe could have made her point by using more diplomatic wording. Unfortunately the bar for some people alleging racism now is so low, making factual points is now seen as racist if it involves any reference to colour. The Housing Minister avoiding paying stamp duty and essentially lying about advice received and breaking the Ministerial Code is much more serious. She had to resign over it. Also if people were genuinely worried about racism they wouldn’t be voting for Labour but maybe only Reform and the Tories can be racist? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/jul/17/labour-suspends-diane-abbott-for-second-time-over-racism-comments https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/investigation-into-antisemitism-in-the-labour-party.pdf https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/kemi-badenoch-dawn-butler-tweet-conservative-party-leadership-b1191674.html

So there are incidences of Reform Cllrs being racist so I can accept that some maybe but I don’t believe the majority. The you gov survey is a perception surveys not facts. To say that Labour is not racist is laughable when an investigation produced a report which said they are racist - what further evidence do you need? Some Jewish MPs were in the party even at the time of the investigation. I could say that because Reform have Zia Yusuf they aren’t racist at all. I think the point is that this “holier than thou” attitude is bollocks

So no then! You’re not indulging me - you made the point! Interesting to see who the real racists are unless you think anti- semitism isn’t “real racism”

Do you support this? Only party I’m aware of that. Is institutionally racist….or does this not count? https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/investigation-into-antisemitism-in-the-labour-party.pdf Also give specific examples of Reform being found to be racist…..

When I voted in the Referendum for Remain, I would have voted Tory as they aligned with my world view at the time (not UKIP). Brexit has happened and, whilst I didnt vote for it, it that is the world we are in. With age your world view changes and I think that economics is important but so is your cultural view of the country and what you perceive to be right / wrong and fair / unfair. These are your moral values. With the Tories now in oblivion and being a shiteshow, on balance I would say that Reform may be closer to my values as a whole, which is why I may vote for them. In terms of Labour I see little that I align myself with, including economically and culturally. There is the odd thing they do which I agree with but mainly I dont align my values with them. Reforms policies are not fully detailed at the moment which is why I would want to see them in full, but their overall approach to the economy is to reduce tax liability and reduce public spending where appropriate. Welfare reform, NHS reform, and a number of other approaches are what align more closely with my beliefs. I'm aware they wont be able to fulfill them all but I prefer their overall policy stance (which at this stage of the election cycle is all you can typically go on for a party not in power). Also I have lots of friends voted to Remain and are now voting Reform for the same reasons I have said so its not that unusual. Have you read their policy position as a vast majority of former Tory voters (like you) are now saying they will vote for Reform?

Fair enough - I can’t disagree if that’s your experience of them.

So they aren’t worse then - you speculate they might but, respectfully, that’s speculation and doesn’t count for anything.

I voted remain (not a strong remainer but one nonetheless) but for various reasons I’m considering voting reform. I’m aware of the potential downfalls but I think we need to see the shape of the party in a couple of years time. The point that Pochin made was a fair one she just said it clumsily. What rayner did was a lot worse in my opinion. What extremely serious stuff have they done out of interest?

No I dont think that. My point is that @tdmickey3 is trying to pick up a few relatively minor misdemeanours from the Reform Party to show how incompetent they are. If I did a list of Labour MP's and Cllrs who are in the proverbial at the moment for much more serious stuff I think it would say a lot. If Reform had misdemeanours coming out of their ears compared to other parties I would get the point, but I think the comparison exercise would prove another point.

Most of these dont seem particularly bad to be honest (I thought you would find worse). This is getting into dangerous territory for any Labour supporter......if we produced a list it would probably crash this Forum.

No but you just called a whole bunch of people obnoxious and you don’t expect someone to say something. If you agreed with their political stance you wouldn’t have said it so that’s really your motive

You only think that because they disagree with you. It doesn’t mean they are obnoxious. Differentiate between attacking the person and their view

From what I can deduce he may not be the most mentally stable player which explains a lot about his absences for unusual reasons

I agree with that - not sure what’s stopped him in last 3 games

There is a possibility of this. Also there is a possibility that we get another manager who actually plays in a way that we create fewer chances than we have and our shite strikers have fewer chances to score. If we weren’t creating any chances and were 20th just because we were soft defensively and creating limited chances I would agree with you. To put this another way, if our strikers had done half their jobs we would have 9 points from the last three games and people would be happy I think he needs to be given time to sort this out but I think that’s respectfully where we differ.

Ok so what other stats are there to assess the teams performance when we know Individual errors and missing guilt edge chances are our problem? How else to we quantify overall performance? Or we just say bollocks to it, not enough points because players are making mistakes so sack him. That’s what we have been doing for 4 years and it isn’t working! To me Still isn’t the root cause of this problem, the players are mainly to blame and it mainly shite strikers and dumb defensive mistakes and that supports it. If you sack him will another manager make sure that Armstrong and archer finish their chances? Do you honestly think that?

I think your posts makes some reasonable points. However I think that being overly empathetic is why we have some of the issues we have now. Empathy is a good thing in principle (obviously) but blind empathy is naive. The reason why we have illegal immigration issues, a bloated welfare state and social issues linked to the prevalence of trans matters and other Woke promotion (BLM etc) is because of an over sensitivity and being overly empathetic to people who promote hard agendas around these issues and benefit from them. What we should have is a more balanced view which is empathetic yet takes a real world view to the potential implications of excessive adherence to these philosophies without challenging them and the negative social impact that they can have. That is one of the key reasons why people are kicking back and are minded to vote for Reform because there is a cultural disconnect between voters and the main parties in respect to a lot of these issues. I’m pretty certain that if the Woke agenda hadn’t gathered so much attention and support among some on the left (including the media) Farage would not be performing half as well as he is doing.

I agree - I don’t think changing him will help. This is Spors fault for not getting a striker (downs doesn’t count as a player) and the players like Armstrong and archer for not finishing

This explains that Still isn’t the problem but the players are and recruitment

The worst option of all the parties. Absolutely mental. Polanski is an 'eco-populist' and whilst he might think his policies are cool, the capitalist market that the western world works within will not. The markets will freak out if he gets in and that is bad news for all of us and our national debt. If he ever got in, I think very, very quickly, without him even doing anything, people will realise it was a bad move. There is a reason why its mainly kids with a lack of life experience that are supporting them (mainly supported by under 24's). On the face of it, their policies are lovely and I can see why people might thinks its a great idea to vote for them but we live in the real world. The saying is 'if it seems too good to be true, it probably is' applies to them. https://www.thesun.co.uk/fabulous/798031/can-you-really-think-your-boobs-bigger/

I appreciate this is a considered response but I can quote people who might suggest the current government falls within some unsavoury categories. Your conclusion seems to suggest that anyone to the right falls within this category but parties to the left dont, which I cant agree with. So far we can only go on Labour's record to date and even you are saying they havent been great - I think they have been pony, so record to date is all we can go on. The Greens have mad policies that would be destructive economically and for our reducing status in the world (I might as well vote for the Monster Raving Looney party). The Lib Dems have limited experience in Government and I'm not sure how they are any more credible than Reform in terms of experience. The fact is the three you have mentioned are shite, as are the rest of the parties. They all have shortcomings and its essentially voting for the least shite one which aligns with your values.

A bad apple should be somebody who throws their passport or ID away. It shows bad faith from the start and a commitment to play the system. Currently we just have to accept these characters. If that happens it should be immediate deportation to a third party country or island.