gio1saints

That’s Sekou Maras twin brother ffs.

Yup agree. Think he’s on about £55k pw so paying that plus a chunky loan fee gives him a year to show he can cut it in English football. An obligation to buy like with THB may make sense. I’m certain Still knows who he is and what he’s capable of. If we lost Tyler and Mateus to big fees but got oreilly in on loan I’d say fair enough, reluctantly, a team with Mateus O’reilly and Tyler on the other hand. Now that would be worth paying to watch!

Just a thought after reading that Matt o’reilly has been linked with Roma after a disappointing first year at Brighton : He’s not been played in his favoured position (8), apparently, and has said he’s unhappy. And apparently open to a move. He cost them £21m - so we are not paying that ( well I’m 90% confident we are not!) - but given our strong interest last year it does not sound totally mad to suggest he might be somebody we would love to have on loan if available - and of course would be a guaranteed starter - especially given Mateus and Tyler employment status at SMS may be changing. I think he’d be a fantastic fit at Saints if he took up the challenge but I suspect there’s a lot better and wealthier clubs than us would take him as a loan- or even as an attacking midfielder punt - and that’s if Brighton even let him go.

Just a thought after reading that Matt o’reilly has been linked with Roma after a disappointing first year at Brighton : He’s not been played in his favoured position (8), apparently, and has said he’s unhappy. And apparently open to a move. He cost them £21m - so we are not paying that ( well I’m 90% confident we are not!) - but given our strong interest last year it does not sound totally mad to suggest he might be somebody we would love to have on loan if available - and of course would be a guaranteed starter - especially given Mateus and Tyler employment status at SMS may be changing. I think he’d be a fantastic fit at Saints if he took up the challenge but I suspect there’s a lot better and wealthier clubs than us would take him as a loan- or even as an attacking midfielder punt - and that’s if Brighton even let him go.

One not too often discussed nuance of the window is the difference between wholesale squad change and incremental squad change. Many on here would be happy for the former. In other words get rid of lots of the current squad ( but god knows how) & bring in lots of new players with no “scar tissue”. Maybe a 60-70% change overall. An equal number would keep some of “ the ones that proved they can do a job at Championship level “ , just sell the inevitable gems plus a fair few that were squad fillers. That’s maybe a 40% change overall. And then a minority might argue that the current squad, taking out the loan returnee /contract ending players and the obvious few selling ones is good enough with a few decent quality transfers in. Ie about a 20-30% change. Don’t forget- the new Manager counts as part of the turnover. I have no accurate idea who the 2 in c is going to be for instance or what role the rest of the coaching staff have or do not have. I think we will probably go down the middle path - though the first option feels more exciting it’s also more risky and the last option may seem a little too passive and though it’s probably financially cheaper at outset it may not be as cost effective as the middle way.

If what @Farmer Saintis so eloquently stating is true then the logical deduction is that, far from being feckless useless fools, SR are, in fact, gaming the system and not inexpertly either. And this season might see first flowers blooming from that. One might also deduce , if premise is true, that they believe navigating the hinterland between Championship and EPL can be a profitable enterprise in the medium to longer term. And they mean to reap that profit - in that relatively unheralded market, for investors. Furthermore, that this profitability ( or economically sustainable if you prefer) is relatively unreliant upon Saints being anything more than just good enough to go up every now and again. it’s NOT about actually winning the league or getting into Europe or a cup - those are all once in a lifetime bonuses- it’s about making a reliably consistent profit from the business of football.

You’ve just succinctly described one of the strangleholds that the wealthiest clubs of the EPL have on us. The loan system, ostensibly helpful to teams like us, simultaneously guarantees disruption to squad after squad once they leave. That Disruption undermines clubs that cannot afford the stockpile of talents that the Chelsea’s and Man City’s have and basically, as you describe, have to fix the house whilst repairing the foundations year after year. The big clubs - and their Managers- can concentrate on just fixing the house. Southampton FC and all the other non elite clubs are just tarted up Academies for the big boys. Nothing more. When we are told winning the Championship playoff is the most valuable match in world football it’s true on one level - but it’s also the classic magicians trick of distraction creating the illusion that it’s not a fixed system, fixed in favour of the biggest, wealthiest clubs. We won the worlds most valuable football match and yet - look at the state of us.

Do you think he is a Will Still system player though? My understanding is that WS is fairly pragmatic but generally likes to press high. The Flynn I saw v Arsenal was pressing them in their penalty area second half. Like he was auditioning.

@Farmer Saint think you are a bit harsh on FD. Last match v Arsenal I thought he played very well. He fell out with Juric for sure but I think he will would do well at any Championship club- or at Rangers.* Does not need RM to be a good player at that level. I accept that he is not a good or even probably average EPL player - but, for me, he would start at any team in the current Championship - whatever style they play. Or if the Manager has a handsome beard and fine hair🥰 ps that is not to say he is not probably overpaid and we overpaid for him v his actual quality - but in terms of the championship there’s not many players his level.

General squad composition thinking is to have one spare player for each position plus an extra goalie (or two) That means 23 -24 first team players in a tight, competitive, cost-effective, high quality to quantity ratio squad. Our current squad is > 24 players and quality to quantity ratio ineffective, certainly at EPL level. Not shock news but lots of work is required to move back towards optimum squad size/quality ratio. I agree with all those saying that this squad should be composed with half an eye on being able to Play EPL the following season. In other words, they are ALL up for sale. None showed they can play acceptable EPL bar Mateus and Aaron. Those two are the ones I would and should shift heaven and earth to keep. It seems like a foregone conclusion that our two best players will go. But I’d rather sell the other 28 + players and keep them two, build the new team totally around them - than keep the others and lose the best we have..

Does anyone truly believe that Martins EPL squad was good enough to finish anywhere other than the bottom three? If you do just look at the squad lists of the other epl teams… Supposedly star managers like McKenna could not do it for Ipswich. The best you could say for the EPL campaigns of Man Utd Spurs and West Ham was that they avoided relegation - ignominiously - and with way better squads - and supposedly way better managers, than ours. The single biggest factor in our relegation was failure to upgrade player and squad quality upon promotion. And yes, maybe, that should have included RM himself. But We would have gone down playing any formation and style you wish under any Manager with that squad. So, this whining about how shit Martin was or still is may actually be a massive red herring obscuring the real key factor. Keep crying about Martin and forget all he did was play the cards he had only real way he knew how. You need to look upstairs for the real people at fault.

Through that lens these “ transfer windows” are seen for what they are - simply the equivalent of Xmas or Black Friday for the biggest and wealthiest clubs. The best and purpose designed time to make returns for their investors. Not a shinpad or dab of ralgex required. Put more bluntly it’s the primary reason for club investment and by virtue of that club existence. To make profit by player trading. And to try to make it continue to be attractive for investors there must be profits. As a spectacle football today is about as much to do with “ fair play” despite the disingenuous virtue signaling as pitching Christians up against lions in the colosseum.

Post script to the above : If you had to say what does football - one of the very few if not alone by itself universally understood languages of the earth - really teach our kids today one answer might be : greed is good, money is god, fame and fortune are the most important things in life. It’s a very low bar sadly.

Agree with you and @Farmer Saint- It’s the designed-in result that they required. Sell-on clauses for promising youngsters that have been hoovered up by the wealthiest clubs simply protect the investment interests of those big and rich clubs. Those with the biggest and best national and international scouting infrastructure. Not those that cannot afford to maintain even regional academies anymore. The rest of the teams - and the leagues - are, quite literally, feedstock. Any perception of this being anything to do with “fair play” or anything remotely worthy of what many consider the importance of football for our society is just the wealthiest investors PR firms doing what they do. It’s cynical beyond belief. Yet few actually see it. The last few decades jumping in on Women’s football, BLM and LGBQT+ for example are essentially the same principle that the Saudis are using by sportwashing in the kingdom.

Flynn Downes is an excellent Championship player. If he joined LCFC makes them stronger. I doubt he’d be received badly. Players who might be badly received might be those with a current Midlands connection. Will or Armstrong for instance. Bad Surprises might be Manning or Captain Jack. CA also a possible. Given how important the GK is in Martins game it may well be a loan move for Gav.