dune

Substitute "less intelligent voters" with "Labour core vote" and it's a more accurate description nick.

After Browns gaffe it may yet turn blue. Fingers crossed that the Labour core vote splits.

It's a fact that is seats such as Southampton any swing towards the Lid dems will help the Tories. That's why they are being targetted and why Cameron visited.

Tony Blair would never have made a gaffe like this because blair wasn't a control freak and bully and a generally horrible creature like Brown. Mandelson has been trying to shiled brown from the public up until now for the very reason that he's such a liability. Thank goodness he's shown his true colours before polling day.

Agree 100%, but with the Labour vote splitting it'll let the Tories in in the 8-10% swing Labour/Tory marginals. What a brilliant day today is turning out to be.

In that so called apology interview he was trying to paint the woman as a racist. What a **** Clown is.

No it doesn't, it extrapolates the 1997 FPTP results into PR form. The voting pattern would be different under PR with people voting for smaller parties knowing it wouldn't be a wasted vote. That study is fundamentally flawed.

Clown with his head in his hands. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8649200.stm

Oh dear oh dear oh dear, just seen Clowns so called apology and he's slumped in front of the mic's with his head in his hands. The blokes heading for a nervous breakdown.

lol

Not if the tabloids get there first and according to SKY news they're already camped outside her house.

Who cares what she does, it's what the other working class ordinary people think that you've got to worry about. Brown was totally disrespectful to a decent lady. He's a **** of the highest order and this will turn a lot of Labour voters to the Liberals in the northern seats. FACTAMUNDO.

So that's Rochdale going Lib Dem.:smt043 Get back on the road Mr Clown and visit some Tory/Labour marginals.

Thanks for that. That has made my day because Gordon Brown has just blown his election chances. Ha Ha Ha, that footage is priceless.

I do hope this get's maxiumum media coverage.

And look how SWF voters think politically without a FPTP system.... http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=13364&highlight=european+election

Yeah of course I am, and i agree that PR is the fairest system, but that's not point i'm making. The point i'm making is that the left/right coalitions would be comprised of powerful minorities that would push the the coalitions away from the centre ground. Top Gun used the results from the 1997 general election to extraoplate how parliament would look under PR which as i explained is fundamentally flawed. I'm now going to give a flawed example using the 2009 European election results. it's flawed because people vote diffrently in european elections to general elections, but never the less it illustrates how PR allows the smaller parties to gain influence. Conservative 28% UK Independence Party 17% Labour 16% Liberal Democrats 14% Green Party 9% British National Party 6% Others the remaining votes. The South East results show an even more right wing vote! http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/bsp/hi/elections/euro/09/html/ukregion_35.stm

Tell us more.

Give me an honest answer - are Liberals right wing or left wing?

Those scenarios are based on the 1997 votes for the general election where voters ignore parties such as UKIP, the greens, the bnp etc because under the FPTP system any vote other a vote for Tory or Labour is pointless in most places. Under PR you wouldn't get results like that. You are using chalk to extrapolate the popularity of cheese.

I said it could be debated because the Liberals at present are wishy washy. The Liberals are one thing to voters in Winchester (i.e an alternative to the Tories) and another thing in places like Sheffield (i.e an alternative to Labour). Eventually if they are put in a position of influence they'll have to choose what they really are and it's my belief they'll have no choice but to be the party that the rank and file demand and that is a left wing party. If and when this happens and the Liberals are natural allies to the Socialists they are going to be screwed in seats like Winchester and many other traditionally right wing seats in the south. This could well herald the break up of the party. PR is not a left wing thing, but it is a system that the left wing potentially have the power to bring about. If UKIP were currently in the same position as the Liberals they'd bring it about for example. I agree with you about the old parties demising, but I disagree that we'll see more centre ground parties gaining influence over and above the rise of more extreme parties. UKIP are going to be a major player in a few years time on the right.

Sinn Fein will always be the political branch of the IRA as far as i'm concerned. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinn_F%C3%A9in

Yeah it's a vote to allow hardline leftwing and hardline rightwing politics into Westminster. It's democratic, but those on the left will have a hissy fit when they've reaped what they've sown.

You're talking about European parties, i'm talking about Britain. Under the assumption of a 500 seat house tell me how you think the seats would be distributed between the parties under PR?

This thread is comedy gold.