Unbelievable Jeff

I just wonder how bad Les's life must be/have been for him to be so ridiculously blinkered to the country he's lived in, and the benefits that he, his family and friends, and his country have benefitted from.

Like what? Give us an example.

Amazing post this. The second paragraph, a ***** about Remainers thinking Brexiteers are thick, which follows a paragraph that proves that Brexiteers are thick. Bravo Les - you make yourself look stupider than any of us ever could.

I don't know, I've never said that. One is racist, one is ageist. Saying you don't like someone for their colour or creed is different to saying that people over a certain age shouldn't have as much say about our future. Both are discrimination, but I know which one I see as far, far worse.

It's like watching a car crash isn't it? Just can't look away...

Tell me what my selective dislikes are. I think you'll find they all have one thing in common (and unlike you and your type, it's not race).

But you said empathy, so where have I mentioned that in that post? Not quite sure what's classed as different to you, apart from the fact they voted different to me and have some rather unpalatable views on foreigners. However, I'll be charitable to you and I'll change the bit you quoted to be '...those that have a foreign accent or different colour of skin...'. Either way, I'm sure Les doesn't need you ****ing his point up before he's even had the chance to reply.

Where have I even started to talk about empathy here (which is what Les replied to)? "The oddest thing is I'm a Conservative traditionally - so I should dislike those that are different, and enjoy watching the poor get poorer...people change I guess, and this vote has shown me the people that I don't want to have anything in common with."

I think his racist accusations are against the fact that you don't like Arab's, and there is nothing more quintessentially racist than saying you don't like a race of people.

My other half has really noticed how my stance has changed, predominantly since the vote, and that I have certainly moved left - although the generally held view is that you should become more right wing as you get older. For me, I think having children has also weakened my stance, and the thought of children in poverty, and moreso post Brexit is something I can't abide by. Those Brexiteers who continue to argue that we should leave at any economic cost, are those who should have blood on their hands post Brexit.

Sorry, explain what is cobblers about that?

The oddest thing is I'm a Conservative traditionally - so I should dislike those that are different, and enjoy watching the poor get poorer...people change I guess, and this vote has shown me the people that I don't want to have anything in common with.

If they don't like change I presume they'd want to stay considering we've been in for 40 odd years...

For many of us, the battle is to keep the poor from getting poorer, the economy from struggling and to keep a relationship with our close friends and neighbours in the EU. The other side seem to be wanting to get rid of them pesky foreigners. It'll be interesting though, as from those Brexiteers that I've spoken to, they prefer white foreigners to those of other colours, and we're likely to get a large mix of races going forward. As an aside, do you know that when you foster, you can specify that you only want 'White British'? Disgraceful IMHO.

If we leave on WTO terms, does that mean a hard border in Northern Ireland straight away?

It seems like we have quite a few members on here TBH.

I guess it depends if the continuing consent of the majority of people has changed.

As "It is written by one of the most preeminent authorities on British Constitutional history, Vernon Bogdanor" I would presume he does, as well as admitting that his interpretation of the original article was flawed...

So this is interesting, as not seen this before. As post EU we will be looking to lower corporation tax for multi-nationals, the harmonisation of corp tax within the EU could actually help the UK to attract investment going forward, and much of it from Ireland. https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/eu-should-scrap-national-vetoes-on-tax-says-juncker-1.3626563

Because there isn't a way, and no-one on here is economically enough inclined to even start to debate why we wouldn't. It's all about the amount of damage that is being debated. Some of us think it will be a huge, detrimental effect. Others think we'll see little difference.

It's the way of the world now, instead of actually dealing with the situation, cry fake news and ignore it.

I didn't see that - looks like we both posted at the same time. So, if that's the case, you'll both be able to show me some causality between those economies, the strength of the Euro, and the rise in youth unemployment. I'm happy to discuss that and even admit I'm wrong, but I need some empirical economic and statistical evidence to show that. Personally, I think it's due to historical economic and political weaknesses rather than that.

He voted to leave, so doubt he's doing that.

So, on the New Year I was at a gathering with a few local Councillors and civil servants. Obviously Brexit came up, a few times, with a mix of views and voters. However, I got chatting to a civil servant who is heading up the “no deal” planning for the Nuclear and Scientific Research rules and regulations. Although he commented that “no deal” would be an utter disaster to try to organise due to the lack of time left before we 'crash' out, the real issue they have at the moment is that due to the instability of the ‘deal’ and the way that it has been dealt with, they have not been allowed to start work on no deal preparations properly. I think the quote was “I just don’t care anymore, but those ****ers in parliament just won’t let us get started.”

That's just very, very lazy. Has every Euro economy done badly over the same timeframes? If so you may have a point. If not, you're talking **** and you need to delve deeper into the figures, and stop using spurious correlation as an answer to causality.