up and away

Lowe had first option on the shares garaged by Invesco and never took up the offer. If he failed to do that for the sake of £1.7M, can’t see him throwing in now? What I can see is someone else stepping up to the plate, but not even sure Lowe would stay on. I have heard of someone else maybe getting involved, but best to load that onto Aunt Sally Lowe to stir the masses, heh! These influential supporters, not made promises to Wilde previously? Frightened to attach their name until the prospect of administration is out the way or will quickly state what stupidity it was to buy Euell, yet take up Trappist vows about Saga and several others? Or have their toecaps lost that shine to a rubbery glaze after too much business?

There are several that went along with that theory the first time round, me included, but not again. The same muppets that were peddling that line then, are still doing it now. As always the answer has been to work together, but these numpties put the removal of Lowe higher than the good of Saints. They can clearly see how their original choice was totally flawed, yet still keep peddling the same old sheite as if they had previously backed such a marvellous success for Saints. Who can take these idiots seriously when you look at the positions and logic they employ. Wanting the club to go into administration, wanting Saints to lose, starve the club from funding just to emphasise a point. Typical of the flawed logic is that the rosy cheeks deliberately filed the accounts prior to a outstanding team display to sneak them through. Irrespective that those accounts are nothing to do with the current board and even quoted as such. But this little nugget has no chance of registering with the likes of these, along with the fact that the accounts could not be stopped, irrespective of the Reading result. I am glad Lowe is back and we are actually taking the actions we now see. It did not have to be Lowe, but out of what was available, he was the only one who showed any understanding of the mess we had got into and what was required to get out of it. I still think the task is too big, but wish him all the luck in trying.

I posted on Friday afternoon that the results had been signed off by the auditors and were likely to be released this morning. Last time I checked, Friday came before Saturday, and therefore before the Reading game. This just does not sink in with the muppet / anti saint crossbreds. It was obvious to Lowe that Reading were a push over and he would be able to produce these results in the glow of the Reading result.

I think the return of Robertson had a bigger impact IMO. He is alot stronger than McGoldrick and can hold the ball up much better. Not only that, but he wins more in the air and gets in the faces of the oppo defence. Having said that, I think we see the best of DMG when he is 'in the hole' or out wide as he is better when the ball is at his feet, which in part, helps to bring others into play. Of course you are correct, there are two parts to this answer not one. Robertson has to perform the lone striker role, then we need someone to play in the hole. DMG is that little bit more selfish than the other strikers and as such naturally drifts closer to the striker than the defensive position, which is the problem we have been having. Just hope it continues to work, but it does mean he has to keep putting a shift in, otherwise we will be hearing about the man in the hole getting too detached from the midfield.

I don't think it is as easy as that, but I can see merit in what you are saying. The one thing you cannot do is play Svennson and Perry together, as previously seen they are strung out even against moderate pace. Svennson maybe more of the issue that Perry though. Pearce is not that bad and has a slight edge, as he always looks a threat in the opposition box. The one area where I feel Perry is weak is against the physical strikers we normally find in this league. My preferred selection would be Perry and Pearce, but I would not set that in stone for every occaision, it really depends who they are up against and who is partnering them. I am not disputing what you saw against Wolves and Reading (two teams that play football), but there are other points from other games to take into consideration.

Just been listening to BWP and he confirmed there was no change in the formation, just the personnel. Without actually being there it is difficult to give an informed opinion, but from what I have seen previously, playing DMG in the hole may have a lot to do with it?

The FANS have not killed this club, only a PR plant would claim such a thing! How much do plants get paid nowadays? Is it worth it, do they realise they are being used like Lowes bitc*es to sing from his song sheet. The PR plants must be from poopey as no average football fan would want to cause this much antagonism to a fellow supporter who is distraught at HIS clubs lack of LEADERSHIP. PR plants are the scum of the earth. A true saints fan wouldn't respond to this post, but a PR plant would use it as a platform to attack a true saints fan. Over to you Red & White Army, Plant or no plant? You really have lost the plot! So in your view it is natural for a true Saints fan to want their team to get hammered? Along with your logic, you have got your definitions ass about face. Why does every Lowe hater leave the brain cell behind when responding, or is it shared?

Are you for real????? Do you think Hone & Co had never heard of exchange rates???? You sound like my nephew who was **** a hoop when he found a 1,000 Lira note. SAGA "You must match my wages" HONE "What are you on?" SAGA "10,000 pounds (cypriot)" HONE "No worries, we'll give you 10,000 pounds (sterling)" Saga walks away having increased his wages by 50%.:rolleyes: And the village idiot tries to join in with adults. When we signed Saga with an option to buy we basically took over Saga's contract. Whether we were paying him in Euros or the £ equivalent I do not know. If we agreed to keep paying him in Euro's, because of the weakening of the £ against the Euro we would now be forking out more on his salary.

So, if rumour is to be believed (and why not this one is!!), Stern was on £18K a week. I can't see Saga or Rasiak being on much less than. I cannot quite believe that we would be paying those three an average of £6k a week each. £1-2k maybe.. Not exactly what I heard for Stern but very close. Stern got an increase with promotion to the Premier and his contract was not renegotiated, but just transferred over to Saints from Sunderland for the remaining period. I believe Sunderland paid a significant amount of his wages during his first season (could even be longer?). Saga is on £12k a week, possibly more. The only way we could guarantee his signature was to pay him at least what he was receiving at his previous club. The original was in Euro's and I would have assumed that was converted to £'s. If it remained in Euro's, could be even more. Rasiak I would assume will at least be the same as Saga, probably more. I don't know what the new players are on for certain, but nothing like the previous gravy train. The only indicator I do have was that Wright was not even offered 1/2 his previous salary to resign.

My argument is that if Pearson was our manager and we were still in the same position, people like yourself would be calling for his head, yet are willing to accept what we have at present. You are spouting absolute ******. Go back and look at the posts following escaping relegation last season and you will clearly see the qualified support for Pearson, when considering that he was going to be left with. This is no knee jerk response in relation to the position we now find ourselves in, but one that could easily be seen coming. I seriously doubted whether Pearson would avoid relegation this season with the resources he would have, that still did not stop me believing we should keep him on. The post by OB encapsulates exactly where we are and how we got here.

Just go back a year and you could easily figure this out. If at that time you knew we were unable to sell on any of the senior pro's and get the wage bill down sufficiently, anything and everything would be up for sale to avoid administration. It's as if this situation has popped out of nowhere to surprise us all? We could have done a lot about the situation, but now we are too busy fighting fires than building for the future. So glad you eventually noticed.

I had nigh on the exact views myself and would not be unhappy if he were here now. Initially I thought Pearson looked a good long term appointment, but was unsure if he was the correct person short term. We scraped through and at the end of the day a lot of the facts get glossed over in the jubilation. Like yourself I cannot come up with a better manager for interviews, no bull****, no finger pointing, takes it on his shoulders and goes about his job with dignity. But in the grand scheme of things, what importance should you be giving to that aspect? Someone within the club commented to me, that yelling and screaming all the time to get your point across in training or a match, will eventually wear off when that level of db's become the norm. As you say we saw a noticeable improvement in fitness and he got two of our worst players in Wright and Euell to actually turn in a performance. But equally he never had the knack of getting the side to break down teams that stuck men behind the ball, something still evident from Leicester comments. Where I felt he really let us down was against Burnley, THE match of season for us as it would give us such a big edge should we win it. The performance of that team on that day was diabolical, no effort no guts and it was if we were already safe just playing out the season. We should have been fired up for that match, but we came out like a bunch of wet lettuce. This from a Burnley team who had the worst current form and had not won away or at Saints since god knows when. Then we move on to the Sheffield United match, with our fate now out of our hands. Sheffield Utd being the opposite to Burnley and the team of the moment on recent form, but luckily for us they had the previous weekend lost their only two remaining CB's and the leagues top scorer. We put in a great performance that day and our luck held, but that was one big dollop of luck. I was equally sure that Pearson would be kept on and Lowe / Wilde were on a hiding to nothing if they never kept him. An easy scapegoat that could be put onto the previous regime if things went wrong. When I heard that Pearson was let go I was taken aback, not understanding the logic. But as subsequently came clear, in the euphoria of escaping relegation, our performances were not that great. Then take the heart out of that squad and do you think the same feat is achievable with the same manager afterwards? and that is a very difficult question to put a yes to. Then factor in the shear scale of our financial problems and what would be required from the youth to fill the gap and again we arrive at a different place. Looking back to when Pericard made the bench and our own youth forwards were in the stands concerned me. Already having lost Cranie, Mills and Best because of a similar attitude, I had real fear of a repeat in this area. I can't argue seriously with Wilde and Lowe on the appointment of the two Dutch as it still makes sense. So why would I still give the edge to Pearson, well like you I think he comes across very well in an interview and has integrity.

This really makes me laugh "Crouch as the only one fundamentally doing something active to keep the club alive" You are quickly forgetting the idiots master plan has always been the 100% backing of the takeover fairy.What you should explain here is that he is not putting any money in at the present, having to wait until administration wipes out all those debts and costs he cannot afford to deal with. I suppose the fact he has not even indirect influence over the finances, can be seen as a major positive step, because this one has had is arm in to the hilt on where we find ourselves now. As has been shown true over all these past few years, only all of them working together makes any sense. But that would never fit with the agenda, let alone the ego.

I really cannot understand the fascination with Merlion, but for the fact it is not going to be increasing his bank balance at any time soon. Once you have made money via a plc, your objective is to have direct control over that capital, without it subsequently being subject to risk or taxation. Anyone with any sense will have designed this strategy in the beginning. Ask your self what is better, having all that capital under your own personal control at minimal taxation and leaving the shell of the plc behind, or have that capital sitting within the plc? All perfectly legal and you have the option of giving secured loans to the plc from your own holding.

What singularly fails to register is that Pearsons results were not that impressive. Then add to the fact that this season he would have lost R Wright, Lucetti, Pearce, Saga, Stern, Rasiak, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, Ostlund, Powell, Wright, Licka. Even though I was happy to accept Pearson for this season, it was clearly obvious that relegation was still the most likely outcome because of what he had managed to do with the squad and how much of that squad would be left for this season. Which ever manager we had if we were outside of the relegation zone I would not be complaining, such was the task we had against us. I can clearly see the pro's and cons between JP and Pearson and cannot see a lot in it. The ability to bring on the youth players is the key issue here and I cannot complain too much with what JP has done. Even though my personal preference would still go to Pearson, there is no logic to expect us to be any better off than what we currently are, considering what Pearson did with the resources available last season. This is not a view manufactured to suit the moment, but a realistic analysis of the position stated at the end of last season, perfectly happy to keep Pearson.

You can argue either way on the manager and I can accept the rationale for either, but it becomes marginal when administration comes along. As soon as we failed to gain fees for our senior pro's and the ability to move on those high salaries our goose was cooked. Based upon last season and the gates we were then getting, there is nothing I can see that gates would be in sufficient numbers to get us out of the mire. A lot of fans are so fed up and have turned their back on the club, but Lowe going tomorrow would not solve that problem, although some improvement would occur. There is no interference from Lowe in team affairs with the exception of the financial aspects of running the club. This was desperately needed beforehand and is the main reason we are in this current mess. So for Crouch to highlight his failings in this manner, just empathises how little he has learnt and where the main problem has laid. Would Crouch have put us into administration already? Not so sure but there is nothing in his record to believe he would improve matters, in fact just the opposite. He knew all the problems that would be coming along and did very little. His one strategy was to plough on regardless and hope the takeover fairy would get him out of the sheite. Nothing wrong with hoping for the takeover, but why should that stop you implementing safeguards to avoid administration? I look back at the statements made by Crouch and they are truly cringeworthy and so indicative of why we are in this mess today. As it is I cannot see a way of avoiding administration, with the possible exception of what Crouch can add to the pot delaying matters. The amount that Crouch brings to the table would just be wasted without implementing all the cuts we have, so what would have been better in the first instance is a difficult call. An idiot with shed loads can afford to make mistakes and still do a job, but an idiot with that small a wedge is hardly an advantage, unless others do the ground work. If Crouch does eventually throw in to help once again it will show what could have been. We could have had all 3 coming together before the end of last season and our chances would have been so much better. Throughout all of this, because no one has had sufficient cash the only sensible way forward was working together. But all we have seen is a continual ****ing contest where the misguided concept of saving the club just continually placed it in greater peril.

Thanks WS - a good and accurate analysis. What is interesting is how Wilde was trying to sell it (Crouch's appointment)to the recipient of the e mail. Blaming Lowe, in fact almost slandering him if it wasn't true. Is this the post for the bleedin obvious? If you can't even work out the most basic of issues, best to keep quiet and leave some doubt. Are you sure you are not Mark Dennis? he's the only other one I know who can't do anything past 10 without wearing open sandals.

You should have got miffed a lot earlier, before we got into this financial bear trap. Of course Lowe is not the the only person who could save us from administration. All you need is someone with just basic common sense, without an ego the size of the IOW, could more than perform the task. But even for this simplest of tasks they would rather put their faith in the takeover fairy and do nothing to upset the fans. We had the classic example recently from those stating that Lowe would do nothing anyone else would do regarding the implementing of the youth players under Redknapp. This was then roundly condemned as meddling in team affairs, but was exactly what was needed when you look at the financial mess we are in and how we got here. I have seen all these great fans of the club on the board and what exactly did they do during their tenure? Absolutely fook all and just hid from the real decisions that needed to be made. All I have ever wanted during these last few years is for someone to actually have the balls and make these difficult decisions, rather than hide under one excuse or another. The fact it was Lowe who eventually took the bull by the horns is immaterial to me, I just wanted anyone to do so before it was too late.

Just basic logic tells you that this is ******. If Crouch insists upon a seat on the board, there is nothing anyone can do about it. Because not only do you need Crouch's votes to remove Lowe, you equally need his votes to elect a new board. Without a new board, nothing would happen. So trying to make up this convoluted bolllox that Lowe had this influence is stupid beyond imagination. Crouch always had that power and there was no way of bypassing him. Or are the Walter Mitty's trying to tell us that Wilde said to Lowe "we will kick you out, but then back my board upon being removed?"

Leon Crouch? Cometh the hour, cometh the donkey! One of the two main reasons we are in such a financial mess at the present and you want this idiot back? Quite happy to twiddle his thumbs until this mystical investment comes along, terrified to do anything unpopular no matter how desperately it is needed. Crouch cannot do anything whilst we are still running with these losses or afford our debt. He can only wait for administration to remove those costs and pick over the charred remains. The only way Crouch can do any good is in joining Wilde and Lowe, but it does not look like lightening will strike again here. Go back to any point where Lowe, Wilde and Crouch have been involved at Saints and the answer has always been to work together.

So this is the direction we should take, stop supporting the club. So if the idiot Crouch returns I should withdraw all the monies I contribute towards Saints? Very sound plan, I can see us storming up the league.

And you don't of course. Like I said last night it is because of fans like you that we are where we are. The "Lowe apologists" will have much to answer for come the final reckoning which by all accounts (now theres a word to strike fear into Wilde's heart) is not far off. I believe Um Pahars's agenda to be, ultimately for the greater good of the club, yours, like Lowe's, is driven by no more than self-justification and self-glorification. There are no apologists, this is about looking at all the facts and making the best decision upon those facts. Just because you don't discount immediately anything that includes Lowe in the analysis and just concentrate on what is best for Saints is not being an apologist, just common sense. As for Um Pahars agenda we have seen so many of his failings it is a total embarrassment. Throughout all of this there has been only one answer to get us out of the sheite, all shareholders working together. But it's impossible to play the blame game that way so you prefer to back the village idiot on a self destruct mission. I am still ****ing myself laughing over his last campaign of discrediting the OS regarding Poortvliet's resume. Did he actually think Lowe or Wilde put that up personally? Mind you he never complained too much when Hiley went bumping down the road.

Absolutely no arguments there until we reached this season. I have been crying out over this period for someone to do exactly as Lowe indicated. It does not have to be Lowe, anyone with half a brain could do it, but it must have been so revolutionary that it bypassed all, including most that are moaning now. If we had applied that action at that point we would not be in the financial mess we are now and could easily of had the correct blend of youth and experience. This season is a separate issue where we are effectively in administration without the title. When we failed to move on the higher earners or gain player fees, we had to get the wage bill even lower to accommodate this over a longer term strategy. We are living from hand to mouth at the present time, hoping we can make it to the January window and gain capital from who ever we can. There is no Bale or Walcott to lend a helping hand this time and realistically, I cannot see us being able to avoid administration. I have no problem with what Wilde and Lowe are doing at the present time, I would want any BoD to come up with the best direction for the slim possibility of getting us out of this mess. A lot of fans are disappointed that we are relying so heavily upon youth players, something I felt equally when we found Pearson was to be replaced. But such is the magnitude of the mess we were in, I can go along with this plan as it makes sense. Fans will quickly point out that this is folly as the way we are heading it will result in league1 anyway, along with the mandatory administration. But that is akin to pointing at dark clouds in the distance, whilst failing to notice the piano coming off the 20th floor. For all those who have found their voices, just a pity you never found them when we going headlong into this mess. Even the purchase of donkeys at exhorbitent salaries was greeted with cheers and we will eat this division, solely based upon an afternoon in the sun. Well we have ****ed it all against the wall and the only value left will be any salt content remaining, but the donkeys will have had that as well. And for the brave ones who hold no fear of administration, just look at York. Where the administrator had to sell it off for a £1 because of the expense of holding on to it, only to see it eventaully go for £400k profit. All of a sudden Lowe gets elevated to Mother Theresa status. Lowe is not the issue here, our prevailing conditions are. Can we do anything about it? Yes, very easily by attending home games, but that does not hold up to some that hate Lowe more than they love Saints and cannot see the position we are in. Others find the hurt too much and just can't bear to watch and Lowe is such an easy target to pin all our ails upon. But if we do not go to home games, who the fook will? I fully expect a lot of these fans will be going round with the bucket to rally round the club when we have the vultures picking on the bones. We will get what we deserve according to our fan base and I cannot see a more deserving case out there.

Do you live in a bubble? Have you not twigged in even the slightest degree, that taking that action of using the youth players could have averted us from the financial mess we are now in? The failure of not introducing the youth and continuing to rack up horrendous losses is why we will go into administration, unbelievable! Introducing the right youth players and complementing them with the correct type of senior players at that time is without doubt the best action we could have done based upon everything that we have seen happen and the financial mess we are now in. You really are deluding yourself with these statements, whilst totally ignoring the perilous financial position we are in. In case you have not noticed, managers will spend what ever they can get their hands on and let someone else worry about the consequences. Someone has to give fiscal direction and the manager is one of the least capable from experience.

Who is hiding behind the fact? I have not seen one post where anyone is denying this did not happen or is plausible. Critical flaw? This is ludicrous beyond belief. It is obvious from Satchel’s statements to the press that Lowe was asking him to play more of the youth. It is also apparent that this was ignored until we got to a low ranking cup game and they were all thrown in together, with very little chance of success. You feel that because Basset is not being taken to court for repeating the obvious gives further gravity to your conspiracy theory? There will be no action because it is obviously true, but trying to build a sinister plot around that basis is ridiculous. The question that then needs an answer is "was Lowe correct in making the suggestion he did"? Well in my opinion, given the position we now find ourselves in and how we got here, it was paramount this was done. How do you think these decisions were made at Norwich and Palace? The manager off of his own bat decides he has had enough of all these old pro's and wants to play the youth players instead? It would not worry me who made this decision, Mandaric, Crouch or Uncle Tom Cobbley. The chairman is there to make such influences / decisions because it can have significant impact on our ability to trade in the future. The main criticism we have levelled at the team at present is we do not have the balance correct between the senior pro’s and the youth players. Well at that time we could easily have afforded the correct balance and saved so much funds to keep us going for a long time in the future.