Matthew Le God

That is exactly the point, many fans aren't that attached to the club in the same way the hardcore fans are. They turn up when the times are good, desert them when times are bad. This is the same for every club. What is impressive though is that Saints had a lot more fans turn up during those times of points deductions and going into admin than many other clubs in the similar circumstances. The "sold out" sign on the electric board by the ticket office was a regular sight at St Mary's between 2001 and 2005. Often a week or two before the match. At that point people stopped trying to buy tickets because there were none. You can't sell more than 32k in a 32k seater stadium (often that figure was lower due to segregation).

No, what you did was show that the least attractive 25% didn't sell out. However the remaining 75% of fixtures in the Premier League are a lot more attractive. The top 25% of that, being extremely attractive and the number of tickets you could sell for those would more than make up for the lower figures of the least attractive games. For example, just say Saints St Mary's was 45k capacity sold 45k for a game vs Man Utd and 28k for a game vs Wigan. That averages out at roughly 37k. Compare that to how it would be currently. Saints sell 32k for Man Utd and 28k for Wigan. That averages out at a 30k. As I've said on numerous occasions now, this is nonsense. Games in the Premier LEague often sold out long in advance of matchday and many were left unable to get a ticket. I don't see how you can compare the process of expanding a stadium by thousands on its capacity with a training ground upgrade. The stadium is a far more complex issue and has many more issues surrounding it as regard to planning applications. Staplewood although it will be bigger will see little impact on the surrounding area as all it will be is a larger two storey bulding in place of a one storey building in an already fenced off area.

Again you aren't grasping the concept of a glory supporter. Saints in League One averaged circa 22k for both seasons. For some games over the last two seasons it was as low as 16k/17k. Yet on the day they knew promotion was going to happen the glory supporters flooded back and it was a sell out long in advance of matchday and many fans were left unable to get in. Have you forgotten the numerous fans that were posting on this forum upset they didn't have tickets for the Walsall game because it sold out? The Premier League will grab the attention of these glory supporters from day one. As it has shown to have done in the past for Saints, and at numerous other clubs. People that rarely went to a League One game would be willing to buy a Premier League season ticket. The same happened in reverse as Saints fell through the leagues.

As you keep ignoring it, can you address each of these please... 1) Are you privy to the same information Cortese has in regard to the ticketing database over the last 10+ years at Saints? i.e. do you know how quickly many of the games sold out in the Premier League, how many unique customers there are on the database in the last decade, how many people were turned away because the game sold out etc etc This information isn't in the public domain, and provides evidence that you claim there isn't. 2) Many games at St Mary's between 2001 and 2005 sold out a week or two before the matchday. Why do you think this means the club couldn't have sold more? You can't sell more than 32k tickets in a stadium that holds 32k. Saints maxed out on many occasions which is good evidence the stadium is too small.

From someone at one of the "Cortese dinners"... Also in the BBC interview last year Cortese doesn't rule out the possibility of a new stadium if it can't be done at St Mary's and that they have been making plans for St Mary's. Now there is no point moving to a new stadium if it is only 36k or 38k. That is a lot of expense for a small capacity increase from the current 32k. To make it worthwhile it would have to be over 40k. It is very unlikely there will be a new stadium, but the fact they talk about it as an alternative in a worst case scenario for improvements at St Mary's not able to happen, suggests that any increase in capacity would be large.

That is what "glory supporters" do. They don't turn up when times are bad. What they do is flock in large numbers when times are good.

I didn't say there was no evidence for it though. Read the last paragraph.

Lets flip that... What evidence do you have that there isn't? Also do you have access to the ticketing database to view numbers of unique customer purchases in the home end? And also how many customers were turned away. Cortese does and he has decided along with over bits of evidence not in the public domain that the club can support averages over 40k.

The Mirror was also convinced Chamberlain was sold to Arsenal in the January window and that he is going to Liverpool... no wait Arsenal... no wait Man Utd... no wait Arsenal in the summer window. They don't have a clue! I wonder what excuse they will use if Chamberlain is still at Saints on 2nd July?

He will be 35 years old in two weeks time. How many 35 year olds have you seen go for more than £4m?

Goblin

What was I "pathetically wrong" about in regard to Alan Pardew? Did the press (or indeed anyone) ever substantiate the rumours about his sacking with anything even bordering on credible?

As you are here CB Fry, what did you make of Blackpool's relegation that you assured me wouldn't happen? Predictions at their best...

£650 is £34 a match £700 is £37 a match That is cheap in comparison to many Premier League clubs today.

Why do you think they aren't meeting the terms of the CVA?

I've been here from the day this forum started. Just because you don't agree with me, doesn't mean I "ruined it". A number of people have a similar viewpoint to me in this thread. In any case, this is a public forum, the purpose of which is to debate Saints related topics. Most on both sides of the debate have done so relatively civilly, so what is the problem? If you don't like my posts you can block me.

It was more than just the "big sides" that St Mary's sold out for in that period. It was also a period of three mid table seasons and one relegation campaign. Yet all averaged over 30k. Cortese has bigger plans than Lowe ever did whilst he was in charge during that period, and importantly he has money match those ambitions. All clubs have a core fanbase, they make up most of the crowd when we play teams like Dagenham on a Tuesday night in League One. There are also large numbers of casual Saints fans that will turn up if things are looking good. A strong Premier League team with investment is a more attractive proposition for many than a "Rupert Lowe happy to be mid table side" *****il lack of investment led to relegation in 04/05). Many of those that did (and would int he future) get a season ticket for a Premier League campaign wouldn't attend many League One games.

http://www.saintsfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10280~2381103,00.html £14 for adults, £10 for concessions (seniors and young adults), whilst under 17s can get in for only £5. I'll be going.

It ignores my point that many games were home end sell outs long before matchday. Had the stadium been bigger more home tickets would have been sold. 4 or 5 matches out of 19 League games is not a lot. You then have nearly 75% of Premier League home games against more attractive opposition that you might sell many more home tickets for and thus cancels out the 4 or 5 smaller games. You then also have home cup games and concerts with a larger capacity to increase revenues with. Do you honestly believe Saints couldn't sell more than 29k home tickets for a Premier League match against Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City, Tottenham or Liverpool?

On what is that based? Saint have never had a stadium larger than 32k. You can't have more than 32k people in a 32k seater stadium. They do however have access to a ticketing database and to build up a picture how many unique customers have been in the home ends at St Mary's and The Dell. They also have a four year period of 30k+ crowds and numerous home end sell outs long in advance of matchdays.

Nonsense again, many of the games sold out in the home end long in advance of the match. If the stadium was bigger those unable to get tickets due to it selling out would have attended. Also you choose a figure of 31k, again this is strange because Saints had official sell outs of 30k in the 32k stadium, but the attendance was restricted due to segregation and/or the away fans not selling out. For example the Saints vs Pompey game in 2004/05 had an attendance of 30,921 in a stadium with 1,700 empty seats. Yet it was officially a home end sell out long in advance of the day of the match.

Read the first paragraph in combination with the second paragraph (which you ignored).

Jake

Is this from regular, recent and first hand experience of Cork and Howard playing or something else?

Because I doubt his recollection is correct. If you weren't a season ticket holder or a member you wouldn't have been able to get a ticket for a Saints vs Man Utd, Saints vs Arsenal, Saints vs Liverpool etc game on the day because it would have sold out a week or two weeks beforehand. Many people that wanted to go, couldn't.