hypochondriac

Isn't that the whole point of why the kneeling is a futile exercise? Supporters have said it is important because it keeps the conversation going, yet its pretty likely made things more divisive and hasn't changed any minds of any real racists that I have seen. Surely the point is that this is clearly a contentious issue. With actual open racism at football there's less to discuss because the response is almost universally negative against those who are racist. Not sure anyone is really angry, it seems the personal insults have come from those on the other side of the discussion. My concern is with the incorrect portrayal of Britain as a racist, sexist and homophobic nation when its one of the most tolerant and open on Earth. These false narratives are then used to push for things we've seen on this thread like racist diversity officers on 80k a year, to erode women's rights, to discriminate against people in the jobs market based on their race and sex, to hand social media companies incredible powers of censorship and to spend precious man hours of police time recording non crime hate incidents. So it's not just a case of getting angry at so called anti racism.

Yes soggy we've had this fallacy come up in these conversations before. It's a class thing not race and these studies are biased because there's no such thing as "black names". Asked and answered and we are a lovely tolerant nation. Here is another one of your racist dragons slain. For example, in his study, the name most-commonly and correctly judged as a black-sounding name was “DaShawn.” This name was also most-commonly given by black mothers with a high school degree or less. Names most-commonly given by black mothers with a college education, such as “Jalen,” were much less likely to be associated as a black-sounding name. So these names do not always convey race in the ways that researchers have previously assumed, Gaddis said. “Only commonly given black names from lower social status origins are a strong signal of a person’s race. We are sending signals of both social class and race when we use names like Lakisha and Jamal.”

Of course the clarifications are going to keep getting repeated whilst the lies about the UK being a racist country and English football being awash with racists keep being repeated. Whilst these falsehoods still exist myself and other normal people like me will keep calling it out for what it is. I'm sorry it bores you but don't blame me.

Suppesedly because there's no one else.

Which bit? That the issue of racism at football has been wildly exaggerated by the media who have been in a moral panic about racists posting abuse to people online? That racists have been promoted to positions of power in the NHS and feel they are entitled to address a group of people based on their skin colour and ask them to feel uncomfortable? That no one has denied on here that racism exists? None of that is bollocks.

The example I am using is the example the media were using when their front pages were festooned with this stuff. They used this racist abuse on social media as evidence that Britain is an incredibly racist and bigoted society when the very opposite is the case. It was a lie and this investigation- from the BBC no less-highlights that.

For my part I was very nervous at the start and was overly cautious if anything. I took a few risks last summer with eat out to help out and some more calculated risks over the Christmas period outside of my job where I had no choice but to be near people. I did however make a promise to myself that once I was fully vaccinated I would be returning to my life as normal. I actually waited a couple of months until my wife had been fully vaccinated too but since then I've ditched my mask and am just living as normal a life as I can because if not now then we never will.

No its about setting the problem we do have in context and not over inflating things and wildly exaggerating in order to force through racist and discriminatory policies (or to put racists in prominent positions like the lady who wrote the NHS blog this week.) It's never ever been about denying that racism exists.

Many people on your side of the argument were making that very point. It's worth pointing out the facts pest it be misinterpreted again.

I think if there's another lockdown many people will not be as compliant. Many will think they've followed all the rules as best as they can and have been double jabbed as they were told to in order to get normality back so why should they suddenly go back into lockdown? For that reason I think it may not work.

It doesn't matter for the player where the tweets come from but it certainly matters if you're trying to argue that the UK is a systemically racist country and you're using these comments on social media as evidence when the majority originated outside of the UK. Certainly the way its been reported by the media is misleading at best and it seems like they have an agenda with the reporting of things like the defacing of the mural. "Police looking into the online abuse that followed the final say more than half of the 396 posts being investigated are from accounts overseas, with most coming out of Asia and Europe."

Probably this one: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9964889/amp/Majority-trolls-sent-racist-abuse-Bukayo-Saka-lived-abroad.html?__twitter_impression=true https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58466849

What unpleasant things were our fans caught on camera doing at the euros that was comparable to monkey chants? Racism aimed at players from the stands is something entirely distinct from a bit of disorder outside the stadium before a game and of course if monkey chants occurred then we are fully justified in complaining and the behaviour of our fans is irrelevant to that.

Have you forgotten that we've made a lot of progress but that we still have a way to go then?

Looks decent and we are stronger in attack this year imo.

Or looking at someone's skin colour and then telling them to be uncomfortable...

What do you think about that NHS link posted earlier?

Apologies I thought you were being sarcastic.

I think you'll have a real job on your hands to convince a majority of the British public that major UK institutions are systemically racist. Best of luck.

It was fake news.

Yes the police in general stop more young black men than other demographics. That doesn't make them institutionally racist.

Cool looks like we agree then. Its very small minorities that are racist as most people have said all along. Calling something institutionally racist is imo an excuse to tar every member of a group as racist and do a bit of guilt by association without having to give specific examples.

That's true but that depends what is meant by "certain factions." I don't believe that the UK is institutionally racist.

Needless to say I completely disagree with your assertion. I don't think we need to go into the minutiae of each example you've given but let's just say I don't subscribe to your theory of institutional racism. Britain is one of the most tolerant and accepting nations on planet Earth (hence why so many want to come here) and we should be proud of that fact.

Given his comment, I'd imagine that Turkish's view aligns quite closely with mine as outlined below: