Nineteen Canteen

And that is the issue I am trying to discuss. Is it just unlucky or could it be at a key time of his development he did not play enough to improve his strengthening and conditioning. Had he stayed at Saints under an option to buy or loan back both clubs may have been in a position to benefit and improve his development. Being acknowledged as a great talent is one thing getting the opportunity to show it on a regular basis like his peers is another thing entirely. No one is disputing Arsenal was the best club just the timing and nature of the deal.

Rooney was playing Premier league football at 16 but had the physique to deal with it, Walcott didn't. All I am saying is that maybe there is a case at that age to play regular football to build a resistance to the knocks and scrapes encountered from the rise of youth to senior football. Walcott IMO would have benefitted from a loan back deal to Saints under the watchful eye of both clubs. It is deluded to discount other theories for a player so talented and yet so injury prone. You can have a supercar straight from the showroom and it will soon deteriorate for the purpose it was original intended if it does not get used regularly. There are countless examples of the bigger clubs trying to hoover up the best talent from home and abroad and for the home grown talent what happens to them? Chelsea have one of the biggest academies in the country when was the last time a home grown talent from that academy grace the first team on a regular basis? At 16 most boys still have a lot of growing to do both mentally and physically and a move to top club could be to much too soon IMO - deluded doesn't come into it unless your mind is a closed book.

The Mazda 6 IMO is better than both and Ford have just put up their prices again. The Mondeo is huge but if you want a car that big for less money and better equipment the Skoda Superb is superb apart from the dodgy name. Put May in charge of a 5th gear-esque programme with Tiff and send VBH to the misogynist Clarkson and the generalist and dull Hammond. Put TG on BBC1 and take 5th Gear from the murky waters of 5 to BBC2.

Sorry, see what you mean now.

Kevin Davies possibly but obviously not the answer to question 1 and James Beattie and Rory Delap and Danny Higginbotham?

Gemmel, I agree with you 100% in your analogy but I was specifically referring to ESB's comment that he hopes AL has a decent agent who will look after his interests. I'm not so sure they all do and the cut that they can benefit from is no different than any salesman they want to cut a deal. In the event it is not as good as you outline be it money,club,potential or all 3 then I feel his family and friends would have to be supportive and help him resist a deal that maybe detrimental to what maybe on offer in the future given his undoubted but still a bit inconsistent talent. I am sure clubs that really want him will also realise that he may take a while to acclimatise to the top level and will need to play football competitively week in week out. So I would be recommending in your scenario dependent on the offer and the buying club's need i.e. the Walcott route or straight into the first team. If the former could it not be possible to buy an option to have first refusal on the player in say 6 to 12 months time or buy the player outright and then loan the player back for an agreed period. Walcott suffered IMO from going to Arsenal too early in football playing terms if not monetary and an option to buy or loan back for say 12 months would have kept everybody happy and secure. Walcott is very injury prone is that because at 16 he was wrapped up cotton wool to much instead of playing whilst his growing body got more used to the the inevitable knocks and at a time when injuries can heal themselves that much quicker? I have zero expertise in this regard and its just a theory that young players if they are ready are actually better off playing more regularly and in AL's case I think he should have been a regular in our penultimate season in the Championship.

Trouble is VBH is the only presenter I can think of with any credibility when it comes to cars other than Penny Mallory who has a face for radio not to mention a bit of primary school teacher attitude IMO. Presenters will always come down to personal choice, one man's meat and all that.. Stig was ruined with the lame Schmacher sycophantic reveal. Personally, I would prefer to see Tiff do the fastest lap in the feature cars and the in car commentary to go with it. They are getting paid for it and so lets see the real fun when they try these cars out that most of us can only dream of driving. Either that put the Star in the expensively priced Veyron!

I couldn't get to grips with the touch screen. Nice tactile well designed phone but not as good a scren as the Samsungs IMO and Iphone as already suggested is really streets ahead although O2 poor value when you compare to 3. Symbian software (I think its called that) in the Nokia was very easy to use on my old N95 and the A-GPS very useful. If you can cope with the screen and don't suffer fat/heavy/shaky/younameit finger syndrome then good value phone.

Opinions both positive and negative have the same characteristics as fires.

I think Phil you can work it out for yourself rather than me post my layman's view of the world and you pick me up on the minutae of what is meant to be just a broad observation about what students like to do in thsi country and may not be so well received in your current residence. Weston Saint gave a good analogy and I am neither moth nor light and as this has gone way off the original subject and no one has made a worthy argument against what I hoped was a well reasoned comment I am officially the switch. No light, no moths, opinion unchallenged bar a few insults and unreasoned statements. Agnostically yours

True and his support diminishes expotentially with the passage of time? Phil, excuse my ignorance but I was referring to the freedom that students have in this country and both genders compared to Dubai. It was not a racist remark but a comment on the laws of the different countries and which one given a choice I would prefer.

Our posts have just crossed and I have just confirmed this with Hypo. Thanks

Derry posted it , but thanks for putting BS to rights on the main proncipal that I did not raise it initially. For the record I realise race doesn't come into but being derogatory about a person's health is a prejudice not dissimilar to racism. Enke spent 6 years trying to avoid letting people know about his illness because he knew how people would react and that unfairly fuels shame, fear and a whole host of other serious emotions for the sufferer that can end in tragic consequences. Banter and insults I can take. Slander and prejudice I can't and will respond but thanks Hypo for your effort but it definitely was not Weston Saint who posted the original statement.

Exactly, Lallana would upset the rest of the team overnight, morale would go through the floor and the weight of the salary and resultant expectation of the fanbase and Lallana, no longer enjoying the commaradie of his teammates would be screaming 'I'm a celebrity get me out of here' a la Jordan. Pay him good money but if at this level it is seriously out of kilter with his colleagues the effect would be very detrimental and the end result would be the same - Lallana leaves.

Is there such a thing ESB as a decent agent? Are they any different to estate agents or insurance agents etc? If the golden handcuffs from some big gun come riding into town Adam Lallana will be leaving on the first stage. Footballers have to maximise their income and their agents can't afford to let the odd golden egg to go uncashed in amongst all the dross. The only way AL will stay at this club, if a big move is offered, will be through his own determined self will IMO. Personally, I think he should go if for no other reason that at the moement for every game like yesterday's he can throw in a stinker like the Brighton game that i was hoping would put a few lazy scouts off tbh - at least until the end of the season. If his head is turned and he doesn't go he could end up like Bale in the second half of the season who if I remember had a less than good last 4 months with us after his name was linked to Premiership clubs. Surman as well was never the same after his England call up although that IMO was alot to do with Nigel Pearson dropping him then asking him to play at LB. It's not the agent that needs to be good it's his family and those he confides in that need to be very tight and supportive. If they all start seeing £ signs then he is finished as a Saints player I'm sad to say. Patience and loyalty in football are not exactly common as they once were on both sides of the white line.

Disdain or a lack of respect? What many can't appreciate is it's a simple case of integrity and for MLT to be blaming the Echo as reported above is avoiding the issue. If as a relatively well paid individual at the time he had the integrity not to get involved his reputation and hero status for me would have remained intact. We all have different moral codes by which we live our lives and I fail to see why people cannot understand that for me what MLT did was wrong. With honesty comes common sense and I would question if the latter was a quality lacking in MLT's involvement with Pinnacle? Francis Bacon said that 'all moral philosophy is but a handmaid to religion'. This is very true as has been discussed elsewhere and if I can get disillusioned with my religion and become a confimed agnostic then I guess it's easier to remove myself from this particular altar even though other's choose to carry on their worship regardless of, for me, the loss of trust and negative questions that one action can raise. I am obviously not alone in my feelings and it does not detract in anyway my status as a supporter of SFC. How can it? I have barely missed a home game since the move to SMS and supporting Saints is an important part of my life. Dubai Phil in his MLT in Dubai thread mentioned that MLT spoke about the loss of an important business contract of some description that had cost him financially. If a persons integrity throughout their life is not important why would MLT have lost that contract off the back of his revelation? I can understand why people defend MLT but equally they need to acknowledge that people may have a different view of the situation and those people should be afforded some respect as they did not create the problem / issue in the first place. Unless any new material comes to light this is the last time I am going to be dragged into this debate but its difficult not to get involved when people start throwing the insults and acting in a racist manner with regard to a persons health or general well being. It's important to address the cowardly comments in these instances.

I agree - if you could take the best bits from both you could get the programme back on track and TG could benefit from having VBH as a presenter to get away from it's misogynistic image. Bring in Tiff and VBH drop limelight hogging steroetypical Clarkson and the stale joke of Stig and away we go.

Quite, and all things considered even I don't believe MLT in his need for good PR would turn round and say to a member of the general public that he found Q&A sessions a bit boring. Mind you he had just come back from Dubai.

Phil, don't suppose you have those in Dubai 'too much free love' and all that. Better suited to golf and the self-absorbed.

Not really JB. Tonight you have a chance to ask MLT 4 questions. The first 2 you can get from reading his book the 3rd you may as well ask him if Saints will get promoted this season and the 4th? Is he going to slag off a colleague in public? The sweat must have been pouring off his brow with the cross examination. Interesting comment that MLT said that these sessions are usually boring. A Q&A in Southampton with probably Saints fans in attendance? I actually don't believe a word of the OP or at best it is hugely embellished and a tad juvenile.

Miss the point entirely Wes and your logic overly simplistic. If the fixture was reversed and we were at home tonight do you think I would be making the points I have done? We still don't know if they flew up yesterday and stayed overnight (Derry) or if a private flight had been booked for them today which would obviously ease the stress of travel and hanging around time. I think we are at the moment on a par with Hartlepool as someone has already suggested regards our respective points totals so your much better team than them statement is not exactly backed up. Once again Wes you appear to be unnecessarily confrontational and more to do with the poster than the post itself. Shame, because I use to give your opinions some thought.

I guess it depends if the flight is a private or public flight? If the latter then it can be energy sapping and also it disrupts player's routines which can have an adverse effect on performance. I would actually consider it worse if they flew up yesterday and apart from training spend a day killing time in the hotel. I suspect some of our team will need oxygen to get through a long period of inactivity without their games consoles. I agree that fans have got it harder but they don't have to run out at 7.45pm after a day of potential 'drift'. The fans are having a great trip without the reponsibility whereas the players need to deal with the mental mindgames as well as the physical challenge and I dont think it should be underestimated. This surely is a prime example of why away games are so difficult within your own league. A Saturday game in Hartlepool after a week long break then yes the players maybe chomping at the bit but the same starting 11 as Saturday just 3 days after an energy sapping game against one of the best teams in the league and you should start to lower you sights a little.

I think you'll find FF was pretty erudite in his warning but was lost in the blind euphoria as usual. That same blind euphoria is now at times forgotten by those who missed FF's original post and those more reserved in the summer are left to support the reasoning of Messrs Cortese and Liebherr's approach to the 5 year plan. Blind support rarely equals patience and tolerance IMO.

Well it registered with me FF. Whilst there were pitfalls with public ownership accountability to the shareholders for your actions wasn't one of them. The issue is Mr Liebherr owns the club and with that sort of power demands a degree of respect in my opinion. A bit victorian maybe but it is a victorian set up and probably in a perfect world a private shared ownership is probably the best solution for a club of our size. Upset Mr Liebherr to the degree we have got on the backs of previous chairman (acting on behalf of collective owners) and we could be in a difficult position. At the moment everything in the garden is rosy for most of us but already there are a few dissenters but they thankfully have an air of the ridiculous about them. A draw tonight would be a great a result and to suggest otherwise is madness, likewise moaning about a thin squad of 39 they need to deal with the hand that has been dealt them and why the playoffs this season was always about as likely as us winning the FA CUp in May.