Had We Turned The Corner?

[St Marco]

Last year with the last 5 games to go we had a very tough run in of teams. Of those 5 games we beat Bristol City at home. At that point they were i believe 1st in the league? The next game we played Charlton and got a draw. Then we played Burnley at home and lost 0-1 even though we dominated the game we got done by a goal in the dying seconds of the half etc.. Then we had to go to high flying West Brom and get something. We played excellent and got a point (im sure we all remember that goal). Then in the final game it was a must win at home to in form Sheff Utd. A game where if they won they would recover from the **** they started the season with and nick a playoff spot. We came back from 0-1 down to win 3-2. You all know the history.

 

So we had 5 tough games against teams doing very well and we came out with 1 loss. And that 1 loss was unlucky.

Now you could be here until eternity trying to predict what could have been if Pearson had stayed or if Lowe had not returned. But the facts that we do know for 100% is that Crouch said he would appoint Pearson full time. The bank had agreed to the then boards plans for the forthcoming season and publicly backed them saying they would support it financially. Crouch and the board before him had been activley trying to find investment with a reported deal being only hours away. We had players in on loan who improved the squad who were experienced i.e Perry,Lucketi,Wright etc.. We had people behind the scenes who really were Southampton people i.e Big Mac.

 

But now roll on almost 6 months since that last game in May everything has started to fall apart even more. It is very possible that had the Crouch regime remained we could of gone backwards again and still be in the situation we find ourselves in now.

 

But i don't believe that would of happened. I think we had turned a corner in those last 5 games and for the first time in as long as i can remember things were settled. If it stayed as it was i have no doubt Pearson would of done what he is doing at Leceister and create a team on the cheap (pretty much all free's) and got that team working well as a unit. I think while he was here he got the best out of players who lets be honest were pretty awful the whole of the season i.e Euell etc..And i think that was the key to our imediate future. Someone who can get the best out of average/poor players. He turned the defence around and made us hard to score against. That is what we needed to be at that time.

 

So now it is like the past 10 months never happened. We have 2 people at the club who only communicate with the fans when it is to say how great they are and their way of doing things is the only way of doing it.

 

A lot of the fans turned into jerks and tried to hound out people who have done a lot for the club like Mcmenemy. They were looking for someone to vent at and they picked him because his son is an agent.....I wonder if some of you know regret the way you treated him?

 

Our defence is once again a joke (only 1 goal difference from this time last year), we can't score to save our life. And we have a manager playing people in positions they have not really played in. Add to this the in game tactics are baffling (moving DMG to midfield on saturday when we needed 2 up front) etc.. etc..

 

Now it is only 11 games into the season. There is a long long way to go. We could put some results together and move away from the bottom. Then people would be saying all this is just a over reaction. That is all very possible and i think we all hope that happens. None of us want to see what is happening here continue, it is really heart breaking to see how far we have fallen in such a short time. But right now the facts remain. We have a very poor team. We all want the team to do well but we have to be realistic these players are years away from 1st team standard. They are just sacrificial lambs who have been put out to be eaten by the big bad wolf. The guy in charge of them is a very personality driven person. Someone who believes in their own style and will stand by that without changing it. We have seen these people before at this club and it has cost us more then it has rewarded us.

 

You can go on but i can't help but think we had turned the corner. We were set for the following season at least as it was. Which begs the question why have we had to have 2 people return? Why have we gambled on a manager with as next to no experience in competative football? Why have we adopted a system of football that is largely extinct in this league? And so on.

 

This is of course just my opinion

[L1Minus10]

Good points well made and I agree with all of it.

[Halo Stickman]

Towards the end of NP’s reign I thought we had started to play some slick and effective football. Also, I saw Saints players – even the ones on loan – playing with the sort of passion, spirit and commitment I expect from someone who pulls on the red and white stripes. Hopefully the full facts behind his departure will one day be revealed; but whatever they are, I struggle to believe that we wouldn’t be in better shape if he was still here.

[sunrise]

Its hard to say if we had turned the corner because we don't know if Pearson would've been successful with our current players.

 

The one thing I don't believe however, is that Pearson demanded too much money to stay here. It was clear from the outset that Lowe did not want Pearson here, Lowe already had his own plans in mind.

[davefoggy]

getting rid of NP was the most stupid decision RL has ever made.

 

can't wait until the AGM when RL tries to defend himself (if he shows his face)

[Crouchie's Lawyer]

The bank had agreed to the then boards plans for the forthcoming season and publicly backed them saying they would support it financially.

 

I agree with most of what you say StM, however, the above point maybe slightly different as the credit crunch may have forced Barclays to re-think the proposed plan Crouch et al had had accepted. This maybe why Lowe had to go to the bank and change things? :confused:

[John Smith]

Quite simply, NP was not the type of manager Rupert envisaged in his revolution. He was considered 'old school' and Rupert does not like to think of himself as a backward thinker. JP was on Ruperts mind long before he even returned and it was always his priority to install him.

 

IMO, the downfall of NP came about, not because of the wages, not because of NP's ability or lack of perceived ability to work with youngsters and a limited budget, but because he was not going to be the puppet that Lowe wanted. Rupert wants things done HIS WAY. We all know this, there is no room for deviation from the narrow minded path that has been chosen by Rupert. Any dissent or mutterings of discontent are dealt with and moved on. In some business' this would be a good thing, hell, even in a football club, this could be a good thing, BUT NOT WHEN YOU ARE WRONG!

[Weston Saint]

Last year with the last 5 games to go we had a very tough run in of teams. Of those 5 games we beat Bristol City at home. At that point they were i believe 1st in the league? The next game we played Charlton and got a draw. Then we played Burnley at home and lost 0-1 even though we dominated the game we got done by a goal in the dying seconds of the half etc.. Then we had to go to high flying West Brom and get something. We played excellent and got a point (im sure we all remember that goal). Then in the final game it was a must win at home to in form Sheff Utd. A game where if they won they would recover from the **** they started the season with and nick a playoff spot. We came back from 0-1 down to win 3-2. You all know the history.

 

So we had 5 tough games against teams doing very well and we came out with 1 loss. And that 1 loss was unlucky.

Now you could be here until eternity trying to predict what could have been if Pearson had stayed or if Lowe had not returned. But the facts that we do know for 100% is that Crouch said he would appoint Pearson full time. The bank had agreed to the then boards plans for the forthcoming season and publicly backed them saying they would support it financially. Crouch and the board before him had been activley trying to find investment with a reported deal being only hours away. We had players in on loan who improved the squad who were experienced i.e Perry,Lucketi,Wright etc.. We had people behind the scenes who really were Southampton people i.e Big Mac.

 

I think you will find the bank agred to support Mr Crouch and Mr Lowe plan. It amounted to the same...do not increase the debt..try to reduce the existing debt...get the club finances on a sound footing.

 

You are correct Pearson would have been retained by Mr Crouch but I am not sure the loan players would as we could not afford to continue to pay their wages

 

But now roll on almost 6 months since that last game in May everything has started to fall apart even more. It is very possible that had the Crouch regime remained we could of gone backwards again and still be in the situation we find ourselves in now.

 

Quite possibly we would have gone backwards but we will never know

 

But i don't believe that would of happened. I think we had turned a corner in those last 5 games and for the first time in as long as i can remember things were settled. If it stayed as it was i have no doubt Pearson would of done what he is doing at Leceister and create a team on the cheap (pretty much all free's) and got that team working well as a unit. I think while he was here he got the best out of players who lets be honest were pretty awful the whole of the season i.e Euell etc..And i think that was the key to our imediate future. Someone who can get the best out of average/poor players. He turned the defence around and made us hard to score against. That is what we needed to be at that time.

 

Are you sure Pearson is doing it on the cheap when it comes to wages bearing in mind he is bankrolled by Mandaric? I am not sure Mr Crouch would have kept the likes of Euell who he thought was on too high a wage.

 

So now it is like the past 10 months never happened. We have 2 people at the club who only communicate with the fans when it is to say how great they are and their way of doing things is the only way of doing it.

 

Agree and it is unacceptabe but understandable

 

A lot of the fans turned into jerks and tried to hound out people who have done a lot for the club like Mcmenemy. They were looking for someone to vent at and they picked him because his son is an agent.....I wonder if some of you know regret the way you treated him?

 

Are you sure he was hounded out. A few silly comments on a message board ffs

 

Our defence is once again a joke (only 1 goal difference from this time last year), we can't score to save our life. And we have a manager playing people in positions they have not really played in. Add to this the in game tactics are baffling (moving DMG to midfield on saturday when we needed 2 up front) etc.. etc..

 

Agree our defence is a joke and has been for a few years including the Pearson era. As for playing people out of position did Pearson not employ Surman as left back first?

 

Saturday (I was informed) our starting formation was 4 3 3. McGoldrick was on the right but up front. Robinson in the middle and Smith on the left.

 

Cork and Surman in midfield with Lallana. Lallana told to play a little deeper than usual.

 

Now it is only 11 games into the season. There is a long long way to go. We could put some results together and move away from the bottom. Then people would be saying all this is just a over reaction. That is all very possible and i think we all hope that happens. None of us want to see what is happening here continue, it is really heart breaking to see how far we have fallen in such a short time. But right now the facts remain. We have a very poor team. We all want the team to do well but we have to be realistic these players are years away from 1st team standard. They are just sacrificial lambs who have been put out to be eaten by the big bad wolf. The guy in charge of them is a very personality driven person. Someone who believes in their own style and will stand by that without changing it. We have seen these people before at this club and it has cost us more then it has rewarded us.

 

I think we have a good team but they lack experience and leadership. However I cannot see them avoiding relegation at present. I agree with your comment on personality driven if you were referring to Mr Lowe.

 

You can go on but i can't help but think we had turned the corner. We were set for the following season at least as it was. Which begs the question why have we had to have 2 people return? Why have we gambled on a manager with as next to no experience in competative football? Why have we adopted a system of football that is largely extinct in this league? And so on.

 

Not sure we had demonstrated we had turned the corner if you take the view, as I do, that we would still have had to dispose of many of our high earners. We would have retained Davies but he is still injured anyway

 

This is of course just my opinion

 

My informed but equally arguable opinion

[ladysaint]

getting rid of NP was the most stupid decision RL has ever made.

 

can't wait until the AGM when RL tries to defend himself (if he shows his face)

 

When is the AGM its normally about October/November time isnt it.

[SaintDonkey]

Pearson brought moderate success with expensive loans and a lot more experienced players than we have at our disposal at the moment. And remember that sucess was exceedingly moderate - if Leicester hadn't managed to self-destruct at home against Wednesday before failing to score against an already promoted Stoke while Coventry tried to commit footballing suicide at the Valley we would have been relegated ourselves.

 

Yes it's a big if but some people who seem to be hailing Pearson as some kind of messiah who would have led us to glory are forgetting he came within an inch of being reviled as the manager who took us down.

[Wes Tender]

Quite simply, NP was not the type of manager Rupert envisaged in his revolution. He was considered 'old school' and Rupert does not like to think of himself as a backward thinker. JP was on Ruperts mind long before he even returned and it was always his priority to install him.

 

IMO, the downfall of NP came about, not because of the wages, not because of NP's ability or lack of perceived ability to work with youngsters and a limited budget, but because he was not going to be the puppet that Lowe wanted. Rupert wants things done HIS WAY. We all know this, there is no room for deviation from the narrow minded path that has been chosen by Rupert. Any dissent or mutterings of discontent are dealt with and moved on. In some business' this would be a good thing, hell, even in a football club, this could be a good thing, BUT NOT WHEN YOU ARE WRONG!

 

Spot on. I said at the time that if Lowe kept on NP, it would be an insurance for him, as he could have stated that the fans had been happy with him and if it all went tits up, then he couldn't have been blamed.

 

But no, Lowe wanted to gamble with a much more experimental set-up, hoping that if that succeeded he would get all of the plaudits instead of just the reflected glory from a choice by Crouch. And that is the crux of the matter; that Pearson was Crouch's appointment.

[Wes Tender]

Pearson brought moderate success with expensive loans and a lot more experienced players than we have at our disposal at the moment. And remember that sucess was exceedingly moderate - if Leicester hadn't managed to self-destruct at home against Wednesday before failing to score against an already promoted Stoke while Coventry tried to commit footballing suicide at the Valley we would have been relegated ourselves.

 

Yes it's a big if but some people who seem to be hailing Pearson as some kind of messiah who would have led us to glory are forgetting he came within an inch of being reviled as the manager who took us down.

 

Don't you just love this selective praise? So Pearson only succeeded because Leicester and Coventry failed to pick up points in their matches? Equally we wouldn't have been in the relegation zone either had we not dropped winnable points when either GB, Dodd and Gormless were in charge either before Pearson even arrived. If, if, if.