bridge too far

Too late for our fishy friends http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17841566

She has history

But the trouble with law is that we have to take its application for good and bad. To ignore the law would be like belonging to a club but only choosing to abide by some of the rules. This is the bit you need to understand, Jamie, regardless of our collective views on this man. You can't pick and choose which laws you'll abide by.

It's worth remembering that these courts were set up following suggestions by none other than Winston Churchill at the end of WW2 to ensure that never again, in Europe, were people subject to evil governments. The remit has been extended, as Frank says, to ensure that we're not complicit in torture. Most of the work done by these courts relates to Eastern European citizens apparently. There's no doubt in my mind that this man is evil and that he doesn't belong in this country. But the trouble with law is that we have to take its application for good and bad. To ignore the law would be like belonging to a club but only choosing to abide by some of the rules. I want to see him gone. I just hope the Home Office hasn't f**ked up big time.

Didn't a footballer lose a finger by crashing into some netting whilst wearing a wedding ring? Isn't that why they now have to either remove rings or tape them?

Hardly ever eat crisps TBH - until I tried M & S Sea Salt and Cracked Pepper ones the other day.

You've got a serious problem, sunshine.

Luckily for me, my daughter decided to get married on Friday rather than Saturday. However, my little granddaughter is going to have a crash course in supporting Saints, since we're looking after her for the weekend!

My lucky dishwasher loading obviously worked then

Radio 5 Live apparently

Technically, Mr H, technically. Didn't need a funeral, of course, but he still had the minute's applause

Having finished my latest Robert Goddard, I'm now reading an Ian Rankin spy novel, Watchman. http://www.ianrankin.net/pages/content/index.asp?PageID=34 and I've also just started reading an unputdownable Nicci French book too. It's called Complicit http://www.niccifrench.co.uk/item.asp?cid=46. Nicci French is actually a husband and wife writing team and I got hooked after reading Blue Monday http://www.niccifrench.co.uk/item.asp?cid=56 None of these fall into the chick-lit category

I was alluding to the fact that Mwamba died, technically. But there have been others, professional and amateur.

FWIW so do I. This could have been a sensible thread discussing an appalling event. Shame it had to be hijacked.

Interesting points there, Suomi Saint. On Radio 5 this morning, there was reference to an American soldier who had been decorated for killing loads of Japanese during World War 2. He was a hero. He'd been killing in what was considered to be a justifiable cause. He returned to the States and became a serial killer. Still killing, but not for a justifiable cause. Tough to equate the two or to draw lines? It's a point of view (not mine, I hasten to add).

My knee-jerk response was that he's got to be insane. Anyone who holds such extreme views and kills so many innocent people in cold blood has to be, surely. But apparently insane people are incapable of planning things and he planned this meticulously.

I bet he wouldn't do anything. He's a little man with a big chip on his shoulder and a big hole where his brain should be. He'd be cowardly without a gun.

Listening to the names of the victims and the detail of their injuries was really quite distressing. Those poor, poor people.

BBC My bank Yahoo Facebook RightMove Guardian and first and foremost, SWF

Did this government ever bring in the rule they banged on about, namely if enough people petitioned it, a bye-election could be called? If this wholesale defection actually happens, that'll be the end of Dave, that's for sure.

Mickie played for loads of clubs.

That's a bad omen

The Middlesborough match being on TV

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-17719966

Yes I do agree it's better for children if the parents are together - I've never said otherwise so thanks for pointing out to me something I've already said. You're the one who implied couples should be married, in quoting the Telegraph article. My own view is that a piece of paper doesn't necessarily mean that that family unit is more likely to work. In 'stating the bleeding obvious' I'm countering your argument that couples should stay together for the sake of the children even if, to quote you: In fact a good friend of mine only keeps their marriage together because when they split up for a while the little boy was very unhappy, despite how they feel about each other the happiness of their child is the priority. Unlike you, I wouldn't dream of telling people how to live their lives (evidenced by my statement that I would have supported my daughter if she had wanted a full-blown traditional wedding). But I have a very good friend whose parents stayed together 'for the sake of the children' and who then divorced once she'd gone to university. The thought that her parents had been so unhappy in their efforts to provide a 'happy' household when she was growing up absolutely destroyed her and she was wracked with guilt for years.