bridge too far

Well I know that their actions led to the deaths of 6 children but, from all accounts, the children were actually well fed, well clothed and happy. Was there any evidence of physical cruelty towards the children? I don't know. I can think of instances of poor parenting where, to the outside world, the parents appear to be first rate. Think of the huge percentage of sexual abuse of children perpetrated by members of the child's own family - children from all backgrounds. Who would ever want to be the arbiter of what makes a good parent? Smacks a bit of eugenics to my mind.

http://www.actionaid.org.uk/103548/tell_your_mp_to_fight_tax_dodging.html http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/apr/03/offshore-secrets-offshore-tax-haven?CMP=twt_gu&CMP=SOCNETTXT6966

I'm not so sure that a 'debate' will achieve anything at all quite frankly. Let's face it, there have been many, many cases in the past comparable to this and worse where the perpetrator(s) haven't been on benefits. The debate should be about why some people have the need to control others in such a way but there will forever be different schools of thought about behaviour, psychology etc. and no conclusion will ever be reached. I'm a big fan of Oliver James who has much to say on the subject. FWIW I don't think they intended to kill those poor children (hence the manslaughter rather than murder charge). I think he manipulated her into taking part in the plan and none of them foresaw the consequences or risks.

I'm not so sure that his underlying motive was to get more child benefit, Trousers. I think the whole thing is an awful, dreadful tragedy and I also think that he is despicable. I'm sure he'll get his just deserts in prison. But I've just read this interesting piece and it does suggest to me that fathering so many children is part of his 'need to control everything' mindset. And whilst I think she has been rightly punished, when you read her back story it is clear that she and his other women were also part of this 'control' fixation he had. People wil say that women should walk away from abusive relationships such as the Philpott ones, but none of us have walked in those shoes so we can't really begin to understand why they don't. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22029904

A piece of classical ballet music (once my choice would have been the overture to Romeo and Juliet but not so sure now) Comfortably Numb And hopefully my daughter and SiL will write / perform something original

Some on benefits are doing OK though http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22003165

Wrong - £1 in every £3 goes on welfare AND PENSIONS

Maybe they bought them before they went on benefits / were made redundant?

Absolutely this

Don't they need clothes, shoes, bus fares then?

Whereas, had he stayed as a director at Sunderland knowing De Canio's views, he would have been called a hypocrite #somepeoplecantwin

Don't know TBH For those on here saying there should be a genuine leftist option, it seems that some are trying to organise one http://leftunity.org/appeal/ and there are lots of on-line left-leaning pressure groups like Change, Avaaz etc

If you think that the only politicians 'controlled' by power blocks are on the left, you are so mistaken. Far more control is exercised by big business and big money over the right wing parties. The only ones not so controlled are perhaps the Liberals but then it's difficult to know what their policies are in the first place as they sway with the wind.

It depends on your interpretation of privelege I guess. To me, it's about nurturing parenting and consideration of values. It's not about money.

I grant you they were lucky enough in that they had very supportive parents and got to mix with the likes of Tony Benn when they were growing up. And they had state educations - that's a bonus in itself. His parents were immigrants and his father was a Professor so probably not that loaded if money is your measure of privelege.

Oh dear - you've ruined Trousers' monologue

Is he CURRENTLY working though?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

If you read his Wiki entry you'll see that he went to state schools and has worked outside of parliament in political research and teaching at Harvard. Much as David Cameron did but of course he had a much more priveleged upbringing. So I reckon Ed is more in touch with your average Joe than Cameron and his Bullingdon buddies will ever be. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Miliband

I'm a pensioner. Fixed income = worse off.

Not quite right actually. Individual unions have votes, based on membership numbers, and those individual unions cast their votes accordingly.

Yvette Cooper? Chuka Umanna? Sorry to see DM go - decent man

Be very careful if you buy a leasehold property #fingersburned

I use my 'I wanna be 'Arry's girl' T shirt as a duster:blush:

I think you're wrong on that bit WG. My NHS pension cost me 6% of my salary and I think the same is true for local government workers and teachers and probably more. I haven't got time to check, but I think that the police and armed forces are the only ones who don't make contributions.