CHAPEL END CHARLIE

You have obviously failed to noticed that I have decided not to initiate conversations with you anymore . The principle reasons for this are that I find your posts irritating , tedious & entirely predictable . But more serious than that you have deliberately misrepresented my point of view at least once (in this very thread) and have subsequently displayed the utter lack of grace to issue the apology I have requested . I find this unacceptable . As you have refused to debate in a civilized manner I feel under no obligation to discuss any points with you Sir . All I ask is that in future you show me the same consideration .

If it came to a straight choice between the two (which of course it doesn't) I put it to you that the majority of managers (and SFC fans on here for that matter) would opt for Michail Antonio over Jason Puncheon . I suggest you think back on that wonderful game this young player gave us last April when we beat Carlisle Utd 3-2 . That devastating performance we all saw that night is the crucial difference between a decent but limited player who has already found his level , and a youngster who just might go far in the game . It not just a question of raw pace either . But we are both well aware of each others opinion now , so I think I'll leave it there .

No - you said he'd struggle in the CCC currently - which has nothing to do with the point I was making . If memory serves Antonio is still a teenager - I'm quite confident he's already at least as good as Puncheon and when he matures over the next 3 or 4 years he will probably become the better player technically . As with any young player only time will tell of course .

Err .. I did say "if he continues to progress at the rate we saw last season" Do try reading what people say before criticizing them .

Oh really ? Puncheon is a sound , better than average , L1 or CCC player - no more . Michael Antonio on the other hand if (big if) he continues to progress at the rate we all saw last season then he could well reach a higher level I'd say . Frustrating as he undoubtedly is at times Papa Waigo is the type of impact player who could (and indeed has) won football games for his team - that type of player has a value far beyond that which you would give a decent , lower league winger in all honesty . You just can't lose good attacking players of that quality and then blithely argue that we're so veryyyyy good anyway that we won't miss them somehow . There's a level of complacency implicit in this point of view that is bordering on arrogance . There is no middle ground in football - if you fail to strengthen your squad every season then you don't just stand still - more often than not you go backwards .

What a strange thing to say . Please explain exactly why we have to back the opinion of the Manager/Chairman/Owner/Uncle Tom Cobbley , at all times . Are we not allowed to express our own views on here anymore then ? I had been under the impression that this was supposed to be a FORUM - a medium for open discussion or the voicing of ideas - rather than some dull teenage fan club where we are obliged to park our brains outside and sit around all day congratulating ourselves on just how wonderful everything is in the SFC garden . Does anybody with even half a brain in their head really think that debating some perfectly reasonable doubts regarding the true strength in depth of the squad at this time will somehow effect the real team in the real world ? If we all keep 'mum' on the subject then does that mean the potential problem go will away ?

Lets cut to the chase . If you look at the current squad list then (excluding the kids) we have about 18 or 20 experienced outfield players left on contract, Do you (or anybody else for that matter) really consider this situation to be ideal ? Experience shows that we could easily have 4 or 5 out injured at any one time and in my view any well financed and ambitious football club should have at least 23-25 experienced players on the books . Of course there's plenty of time for new signings to arrive - indeed I expect more signings - all I'm saying is that (as it stands) we look a little short right now . Others of course have differing opinions but that's how I feel about it .

Pure speculation based on little or no evidence .

Loans or full signings makes little practical difference - they have still left the squad and will need replacing . Wayne Thomas frequently played (quite effectively) as a full back and I would remind you that the record shows Simon Gillett has moved up to the CCC from L1 - so at least one manager doesn't consider him as a piece of deadwood won't you agree ? Trying to argue against the fact that we're weaker today than we were on the last day of the season is just plain daft .

If you are really saying the likes of Antonio , Thomas , Papa Waigo and even Simon Gillett were mere 'deadwood' then all I can say is that we must agree to disagree . I've seen this club simultaneously have no less than 3 goalkeepers out injured - sometimes its good to have strength in depth .

1 - A team is comprised of more than its full backs . 2 - How do you know with such utter certainty that Butterfield & Richardson will prove to be an noticeable improvement on Thomas & Otsembor ? I hope they are , but this remains to be seen . 3 - I must repeat for the last time that any squad that losses 15 players and replaces them with only 2or 3 (so far) must be significantly weaker .

You twisting what I said again - this is the most despicable form of lying . As you very well know I was not at any time comparing today's squad with that which already existed of 6 or 12 months ago - I was specifically comparing it with the squad that finished last season . Please display the common courtesy to criticise me for what I have said - not on what I most certainly haven't . I expect an immediate apology .

Just a tad more than two subs I think - Lloyd James, Simon Gillett, Oliver Lancashire, Chris Perry, Wayne Thomas, Graeme Murty, Michael Poke, John Otsemobor, Jake Thomson, Kayne McLaggon, Tom Dunford, Jack Boyle, Lee Molyneux, Michael Antonio, and Papa Waigo N'Diaye have all left and been replaced by two full backs . I invite all fair minded Saints fans to use the intelligence God gave them and evaluate whether the squad is really stronger today compared against the squad that finished last season .

In my view signing two replacement full backs hardly compensates for the loss of decent players such as Antonio, Papa Waigo , and Wayne Thomas ....etc and the fact that Paul Wotton is still here doesn't inspire much confidence in this fan either to be brutally frank . As for our youngsters only time can tell of course , although I do hope 'Fish' Mills gets a proper chance to show us what he can do this season . I notice you too are calling for two more signings to reinforce the squad which is more or less what I said in the first place - so we're actually in agreement my friend .

In all honesty I can't say I ever viewed Lloyd James as a particularly special young player but if memory serves his manager did consistently praise him as a rising star for much of last season . His fall from grace therefore has been rather spectacular and not a little mysterious I might add . Did AP just reevaluate or did something happen behind the scenes ? We may never know . Good luck to the lad anyway - I never saw him give less than his best .

If you compare the squad as it is today with the squad that finished last season then the only possible conclusion to draw is that we're significantly weaker now . For the time being one can only trust and believe that the club do plan to sign at least 2 or 3 quality players in the time available . If they don't then the chances of us actually being promoted this coming season may in reality not turn out to be quite the 'nailed on' certainty that many on here seem to presume . Interesting few weeks ahead methinks .

One of my favorite Hitch films and a true classic . I do hope your Grandson learns to appreciate the grounding you're giving him in the basics of cinematic history . I think that uber classy grey business suit Cary Grant wears for much of the film should get award itself - I want one . PS - it's surprising how many people never really understand the meaning of the title 'North by Northwest' despite having seen the film on numerous occasions !

+1 One of , if not the , finest warfilms ever made , and in its unadulterated form at least a true 'David Lean' rivaling epic . Having a life long interest in the subject the authenticity shines right through almost every scene (despite some reservations from its author & real-life WWII navel war correspondent Lothar-Gunther Buckheim) and the brilliant set must surely rank among the very best constructed for any movie . Every time I watch this I constantly marvel at how the numerous long tracking shots were achieved in such a frighteningly claustrophobic and realistic set . The camera work and the production design fully deserve the Oscars they never received for some inexplicable reason . The two Oscars this film did aquire ('Best Director' & 'Best Adapted Screenplay') are fully merited . The largely unknown German cast (with the exception of the superb Jurgen Prochnow) are universally excellent , and how Petersen manages to give them the genuine pallor of someone who has actually spend two months underwater in some utterly filthy overcrowded noxious tin can without proper ventilation or the benefit of sunlight is a wonder in itself . Although Wolfgang Petersen would go on to direct 'bigger' Hollywood films on the back of this , having something as monumental as Das Boot on your early CV means you inevitably fall into the same trap that so blighted Orsen Welles career after Citizen Kane - however hard you try it's just impossible to better (or even match) cinematic perfection . Every submarine movie ever made tends to have smiler depth charge exploding & hull crushing deep diving scenes - but I'd suggest the climatic segment when U96 is virtually destroyed while attempting to break the formidable Gibraltar Blockade takes the genre to new heights - or should I say depths . Put simply I've never experienced a more intensely pressurized and dramatic 20 minutes in a cinema - and I include the opening to Saving Private Ryan in that . A magnificent effort from all concerned - 10/10 PS - if I find out anybody intends to view this wonderful film in any other way than the subtitled , full-length , and above all in its original German language version then I'm sending the boys round to sort you out .

I haven't said he's too old - only that he must be past his prime . I'm interested to hear why you think defenders need to be less athletic and injury free than any midfielder or forward ? You can certainly have relatively slow centre halfs (such as Chris Perry or Claus Lundekvam for instance) that can still play because years of experience allows them to anticipate a dangerous situation before it becomes critical - but the more I see of the game the more convinced I become that sheer pace and athletic ability are priceless assets for any footballer in the modern game . Danny Butterfield may be as quick as a racing pigeon for all I know , but I'm prepared to bet he was a sight quicker when he was 22 compared to how he is now ...... weren't we all .

You can form any opinion you like shipmate , based on real knowledge of the player in question or the utterly uniformed (and often over-optimistic) speculation that this type of player signing thread habitually generates . All I'm saying is that experience has taught me that it's better to wait and see new players perform for this club before pronouncing judgment on them . This is a simple enough concept I would have thought but obviously it's a tad too complex a notion for the forum's regular dullards to comprehend . I remain quite confident however that there are still enough thinking fans on here to make the point worth making . As for those claiming that players who's 30th birthday celebrations are rapidly disappearing events in their rear view mirrors can still be in their 'prime' somehow .... well , I can only state that I favour Arsene Wenger's take on that subject over the esteemed opinions of little Nick and his ilk .

I of course said no such think but thankfully for you the libel laws are seldom applied on fans forums . Never mind you're not the 1st (or last) person to lie on here . You and little Nick can play your silly games , I will rise above it .

That's the whole point you see - I prefer to form judgments on what I see in front of me at St Marys , not on what other fans opinions may be . I've seen many players come to this club with good or great reputations - a fair percentage never manage to live up to them in all honesty . Wait and see .

I see , so you are basing an hypotenuse on little or no empirical evidence then . Can I suggest you stick to your internet cheer-leading hobby and don't pursue a career in science ?

I asked you how often you have seen this player actually play recently - the forum will note you have declined to answer that rather pertinent question .

You take an somewhat 'unauthodox' view on simple mathematics . Players over the age of 30 are (as a rule) past their footballing/athletic prime and are more likely to pick up injury's you will concede ? If we must talk about higher level players such as Gerrard & Lampard then I would point out how easily a much younger German midfield totally outplayed England in the World Cup just a few weeks ago . Had you chosen you could have employed another 30 year old big name footballer (Micheal Owen's) record last season to prove the polar opposite of the case you are trying to make . The truth is that some 30 something players still have much to offer the game and some unfortunately (Paul Wotton for instance) are past it frankly .