Verbal

The more you disappear into meaningless small print, Lord Pony, the more fatuous you look. Quit while you're only miles behind.

You really are desperate. That article by Davis, and therefore that claim, dates from 14 July 2016. It hardly invalidates Shylock's point.

What does this even mean? Four of those 'top ten economies' are in the EU! Besides, if the EU are 'utterly pathetic', where does that leave the US? It has a few more FTAs (14) but again only one with a top ten economy - the bottom one, Canada. And it's busily destroying even that.

Here you go, Pony. Clueless leaver Grayling on how it'll take 'a very short period time': https://twitter.com/sturdyAlex/status/919841081063301120

You and other Jihadists should wait until you see tomorrow's lead story in the Telegraph's business section. The message will sink in eventually...

This (minus the weird last sentence; the OP might take it seriously and fall among the Lounge plankdom). Just got back from an extended whirl around Orangi Town (google it), so seeing this thread now I'm back is a bit of a head snap.

Did Sky tell you that? Or were you the one to tell Sky that you wanted two more years because you couldn't get the right side of your brain to agree with your left about what the **** it was you wanted in the first place?

Would you mind popping a ski mask on and recording this into a video camera? Because it really does read as utterly unhinged. The difference between Brexit Jihadists and normal people is really quite simple. If Jihadists had dropped their cultish fanaticism and instead made a convincing case for how we'd all be economically better off by being outside the EU, then many more of us would be in favour of Brexit. Prosperity is the cornerstone of a decent welfare state - austerity (and recession) its enemy. So who wouldn't get behind that? What we get instead is irrational wailing like this. You should try applying it to other things. Ring up Sky, tell them you're cancelling your subscription, but you still want to keep all the channels - and you want them to thank you for refusing to pay. All of us can point to flaws with the EU. Equally all of us can point to flaws with the British political system. But we don't throw a hissy fit and declare ourselves non-British, just because the UK's electoral system is in bad need of reform. So calm down, banish those fantasies about beheading Juncker, and find a route back to rational thought. Then we can talk.

So: The all-important Brexit bill is on hold because of multiple revolts; the country's finance minister, a moderate, is accused of the one thing that still attracts the death penalty; and the EU/UK talks are stalled largely because of needless 'red lines'. At what point do you Brexit Jihadists start to question the most incompetent political party in living memory? Tick tock.

Adjust your dog whistle, Lord Pony. Place all of Britain's Muslim population in a single neighbourhood and what colour, in general, do you think they'd be? Gosh, how can I possibly defend an opinion I don't agree with?

It did indeed. http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/channel-4-british-muslims_uk_570badf0e4b0fa55639d65a9 The most damning quote from the pollsters is this: 'Not possible within the budget,' in this case, meant producing a poll that was bound to get a sensationalist write-up in the listings pages. Still, at least C4's dodgy poll pandered successfully to the brown-people-hating halfwits on here. Job done.

You've got this all wrong. Brexit Jihadists place the blame on everyone but themselves for any negative consequences of Brexit. They want their 72 virgins - WTO rules - and they want them NOW. Then we'll be in those sunny uplands that their caliphs have promised them.

So you can't say 'CN UT' now? He was one of our kings ffs!

The Brexit Jihadists' last resort for 'it's okay, really' - a consumer bubble. At least King **** was self-aware. Modern ****s have absolutely no clue.

Holy fu ck. The table on p.19 of this is scary (Trigger warning to Brexit Jihadists - you won't understand this, therefore will dismiss it as project fear). http://documents.worldbank.org/curated/en/853811484835908129/pdf/WPS7947.pdf

Says a pony trying to style it out.

You can bluster about all you like, but he's right. Your argument is moronic. And surprisingly it doesn't get less moronic by your repetition of it. By your measure, as someone who voted Labour in June I'm not a remoaner but a Brexiteer. Care to explain how I don't understand my own position on Brexit?

By throwing a few more millions onto the help/rent-to-buy pyre, apparently. And also by not firing Brexit Jihadist-in-chief BoJo, who's polished his street cred with Millennials by quoting a patronising colonial-infused poem by Kipling. That'll get the younger vote out for the Tories. Especially as they come to realise that the next leader of the Tory party wants a Brexit that drives the thickest wedge possible between Britain and the EU, in order to return to some kind of Kipling-esque Nirvana of Commonwealth countries lorded over by a new British Raj. It is entertaining, though, watching such a monumental (especially the last two syllables) case of someone inside the tent pi ssing in.

Is there a timetable for when the government will complete the negotiations with itself? Boris's latest intervention contradicts just about every point made in May's Florence speech.

Companies (and governments by different routes) can bring cases to international trade panels. Only governments, not companies, can make or alter trade barriers. The Bombardier case, like the Airbus saga, has not reached a legal conclusion. Yet the US government decided to throw up a tariff barrier that, with taxes, triples the cost of Bombardier's plane overnight. The decision was taken by Wilbur Ross, Trump's commerce secretary and a fully paid up member of Trump's highly protectionist America First agenda. It's as clear a warning as we're likely to get as to how the Trump administration will view an enfeebled UK outside of the EU. It can easily push Canada around even with its trade deal (NAFTA). It can't push Airbus and the EU around anywhere nearly so easily - and hasn't, even though the Airbus case has been in the works far longer. It's also also a clear warning to May - she personally pleaded with Trump not to impose a punitive tariff little more than a week ago. So much for the special relationship. As for Boeing - who last year alone spent $17 million just on lobbying Washington politicians - the case doesn't even eliminate a direct competitor because Boeing doesn't actually make a competing aircraft (a case made strongly by Bombardier's customer Delta Airlines). Boeing has a reputation as a slash-and-burn company against foreign and domestic competition - its corporate instinct is to monopolise. It would like nothing more than to wipe out Airbus, but takes out a non-competing minnow instead. Even if the tariff is eventually dropped, it will have been enough to drive away a major customer in Delta. By the way, Airbus will tell you that the net cost of the subsidies it receives is nil - because they're what are called launch subsidies which are repaid incrementally to governments as royalties on sales. Meanwhile Boris yesterday launched his think tank on FCO property, dedicated to pressing May towards a jihadist Brexit - a WTO free-for-all in which the UK unilaterally pulls down all its own tariff barriers. It even (says it) wants to abandon EU product standards, thereby cutting off the EU increasingly as a market into which UK companies would be allowed to sell. The latter is more likely yet another of Boris's jolly-jape EU wind-ups. It'll have the opposite effect, of course - as before, galvanising the EU into an unsplittable negotiating pact. Boris thinks this is the way to Nirvana. This comment in the FT yesterday sets out a more likely trajectory:

Canada has a trade deal with the US - result: 219% punitive tariff. May personally pleaded with Trump not to impose the tariff - result: 219% punitive tariff. The US and EU have gone to-to-toe on Airbus about exactly the same issue of state subsidies - result: lots of hot air for over a decade but nothing yet.

Very well argued. Whether it gets through the noise of a certain wing of Corbynism is debatable though. There's a small hard core of fanatics, largely older and drawn from the 'extra-Parliamentary' left - Trotskyists and others who've snuck back into Labour and temporarily given up wondering whether ISIS for example might be a 'progressive force' - who persist with the ignorant and utterly false criticism of the EU as a 'neo-liberal project'. Actually the EU is ordo-liberal - in favour of mixed public/private markets. Younger and more idealistic Corbynistas are strongly pro-Europe, but this older, deeply cretinous wing of Corbynism makes the most noise because, frankly, Corbyn himself is one of them, clinging to the pathetic fantasy that the EU is the brainchild of Friedrich Hayek. Bin these gimps and Labour has a chance of formulating a winning strategy for the UK's relationship with the EU - one that, paradoxically, is more pro-business and more pro-state enterprise than anything dreamed up by the vastly incompetent intellectually bankrupt May regime.

So 'we' made ISIS throw (alleged) gay men from rooftops? 'We' were responsible for the regular beheadings in Raqqa's town square of any Syrian who got in their way? 'We' are responsible for ISIS's most violent thugs being Chechens, Gulf Arabs, and South east Asians, as well as British late teens with drug and petty crime problems? And the overwhelming targets of their violence being Syrian and Iraqi civilians? In short, can you not break free of a simpleton's view of the world, in which all its problems are invariably and exclusively sourced to 'us' (i.e. the evil West)? As if Putin's regime and Assad (and Saddam) were all merely benign actors, whose gross abuses (over 90 percent of all civilian casualties in the Syrian conflict) are wholly determined by what 'we' do?

An appropriate and patriotic response. The last time citizens' rights were threatened with forcible removal was in the second world war. The one the Brexit Jihadists keep trying to re-fight, but on the wrong side.

We should call this Remoaners' Day. Watching all the Just Get On With Its go into meltdown has been a delight.