mrfahaji

Get him out asap. Horrific again. Huddersfield really weren't very good (unlike at their place, when they actually played quite well and a point wasn't a bad result for us). Yes you could point to Austin's miss and Yoshida's header, but that would have disguised an all round poor display with no cohesion whatsoever.

I’m surprised our fans didn’t join in.

I’d rather win. But if a draw would keep him and a loss would definitely get rid of him, I’d be tempted...

I thought Gary Birtles hated Saints, but now I’ve realised he just hates life

He is. He’s been sent on to muster something from nothing and change the game again, with the promise of securing his spot on the bench if he manages it

Which he’d probably be banned for anyway. People have also forgotten that Gabbiadini is one of our best players. We just have to play more to his strengths.

It’s schoolboy stuff. I can forgive players being outjumped, but not losing their man completely when there’s no justification (eg being dragged out of position by another free man). But also, could Stephens not have shouted or covered. Depoitre is right in front of him, needs to sense the danger.

What’s that?

Yes, he took on his man by going round the outside! Maybe that will give him confidence to do it more often.

“And this is where Nathan Redmond can use his pace!” Exclaims the commentator, with Southampton on the break, moments before the entire Huddersfield team catch up with the Southampton winger.

Are the board myopic enough to only look at a result before deciding on the manager? I hope not, the ideal scenario would be to win and then give a new manager a decent platform to build from. Anyone who criticises Austin for poor all round play should look at a number of bits he did first half. Brings the ball down with nice touches, keeps the move going etc. Redmond makes the wrong choice every single time... Targett is in the clear, he has a shot. Chance to take it down the wing, cuts inside. Chance to take it into space or in on goal on his favoured right foot... hesitates, ends up turning onto his left! ARGH!

But that's my point/defence, is that the keeper did have both hands, so Austin doesn't make a challenge, and then the ball starts to slip out. Having not thought there was anything on, and then seeing the ball starting to move in the corner of his eye, maybe he instinctively reacted by putting his foot out. I mean, even writing that feels like clutching at straws, and irrespective of the reason, you can't simply kick someone in the face. Edit: watching the replay, I think the reason I give would stand up if he had 'flicked' his foot out into Lossl's face, but it's a weird movement, looks deliberate. Not sure what he was thinking...

Hard to defend that from Austin, but if I was trying to, the keeper spills the ball just as he is running past, and I wonder if sticking the foot out is an instinctive reaction to seeing the ball coming loose. That being said, even if the intention wasn’t to kick the keeper, I’m not sure you can excuse it, need to be more responsible.

Yeah exactly, it might be an inspired team selection that runs out 5-0 winners. But if we don't win, he has to go.

But no-one bid for him in the summer...?

Although I believe Pellegrino is a poor manager and we are in trouble with him at the helm, I do think this is a legitimate argument/concern. That being said, against Chelsea I didn't see a lack of effort, but a better test of that will be vs Huddersfield. I do wonder though - say we appointed Guardiola, Mourinho or Klopp next week. (Bear with me). Do you think the players would respond to them? Or do you think they'd still be thinking "I don't want to be part of this, I want to leave"? I think they'd be enthused by the manager, and even if they thought the long term future was elsewhere, they would at least be motivated in the short term. Obviously it's fanciful to imagine a manager of that calibre joining us, but surely (if you agree) that would suggest that a manager is capable of engaging the players to an extent, and therefore any case of the team not clicking or trying is at least partly down to the coaching staff.

As you've referred to form, if we take the last 6 games and repeat them, how does that leave the table looking? West Ham 24 Watford 23 Saints 20 Brighton 20 Stoke 19 Bournemouth 18 WBA 17 Newcastle 16 Swansea 15 Think that shows that a) there are plenty of teams struggling at the bottom, b) it doesn't take much to get out of it, c) it doesn't take much to get dragged into it... Let's be honest though, with the players we have (and not many injuries so far either, touch wood), there's no way this team should be looking over their shoulders wondering if a bunch of terrible teams are going to overtake us.

I tend to agree with that. I thought he was excellent against Newcastle (I was at the game) but most people slated him. But is he any better than our other defenders at the moment? And therefore, if Man City offered £50m for Yoshida in January would you take it? Essentially that's my point - you might say no even to that, because we need all the 'good' players we can get, or maybe you think the scenario is different in that it's only a matter of time before van Dijk starts playing brilliantly again. On the other hand, there is an argument that Yoshida/Hoedt/Stephens can do equally well as a 90%-effort VVD and therefore better to use the money somewhere else in the team.

Hope he comes back soon and starts seeing some first team action. Of course, Boufal also plays in a similar way (he's the only other player I can imagine making that run). And if we're talking a "level down Christian Eriksen equivalent", then I immediately think of Tadic...

While you are totally right about these, I think the issue is that they shouldn't be starting even with our current bunch of players (ok, the Forster situation is definitely a problem, but the club seem so oblivious to it I have given up hope!) I was composing a detailed message about having good players and not being able to fit them all into a system etc, but even then I started having my doubts whether that's true. Our team is good, and I'm not sure there are many positions that need improving. It's our tactics and style of play (in other words, the manager). Going off on a bit of a tangent to your post: Defenders: Only potential weakness here is reserve full backs. Defensive midfielders: Can't see we need any of these, with Romeu & Lemina, Hojbjerg showing signs of improvement, and Davis and JWP as last-resort back ups. Wide/attacking midfielders: Probably our weakest area, but only because different combinations don't seem to work. I would prefer to see Boufal and Tadic on the pitch, but neither of them are suited (at least I don't think Boufal is?) to wide-right, so you either play one out of position, or you play JWP/Redmond instead, or you play JWP/Redmond as well and drop Gabbiadini or Austin. But then, the manager persists on playing Tadic right and Redmond left, so all this analysis is futile. Forwards: A target man would be a different option for us, but I think Austin and Gabbiadini are both good enough forwards. Austin is scoring, and anyone who was at Stamford Bridge would have seen a quality player in MG totally isolated for most of the game. Long gives an option for certain scenarios.

Thanks for lumping our opinions together. Do you think van Dijk has been our best player since he's been back? I don't. There may be reasons for it - i.e. recovering from injury, whole team playing poorly, tactics etc, but he isn't currently playing like our best player. That was the only point I was making really, though I should have added, as Hypo says, that it's only worth considering selling if we invest in other important areas. No point spending the second half of the season admiring our bank account. I don't think the questions I am asking are unreasonable, and certainly not the same as saying "van Dijk is going through the motions and is the reason we are in a relegation battle"!

He's only our best defender if he plays to, or close to, his full capacity. I don't think he's been bad since returning, but he's hardly been the colossus we've seen in the past. I don't think we should sell him at a cut price, or to Liverpool at any price, but I'm doubtful how big an asset van Dijk is going to be if we are in a relegation scrap. Is he going to put his body on the line for the team at a crucial moment in a crucial match?

Forster Stephens Yoshida Hoedt Bertrand JWP Lemina Romeu Boufal Gabbiadini Austin Would consider Tadic, VVD, Hojbjerg and Pied for inclusion. JWP gets in on the basis of giving the side a better balance rather than because I think he's one of our better players.

Really? I didn't think so. Sure, it wasn't raucous from first minute to last, but we were singing a fair bit, and stayed supportive of the team the entire game. You might be right about our 'acceptance', but I'm not sure that continuing to be positive/lighthearted instead of getting angsty about our play should necessarily reflect badly on the support!

Just back from the game (best part of the afternoon!) A predictable result, the positives being that we were still in the game for 90 minutes and thus the game remained interesting. Whereas sometimes a bad result a la Leicester can provoke knee-jerk reactions, I am more sure after today's result that Pellegrino is not the right man. First of all, the team selection wasn't too bad. Perhaps van Dijk is going in January, so we need to see whether our other CBs are good enough, and if he isn't going to play to his full capacity (I don't think he's been bad, but not exceptional either), maybe he shouldn't be an automatic starter. A few dodgy moments here and there today from JS, MY & WH but overall I thought they all did well. Yoshida was superb, and I feel for him that he gave away a seemingly "good foul" which they then scored from. Forster pulled out some good saves and kept the score down, but once again found wanting for a low shot. Yes, Alonso placed it well but questionable from the goalkeeper. As for the manager: - Cedric was clearly too injured to continue early in the game. He is signalling to the bench but nothing. Chelsea nearly score from an attack where Cedric can't make a tackle because he's struggling so much and we still don't make a change, it takes Cedric going down again before we finally take him off. I think the reason is because Pellegrino didn't know what to do. Once the sub was made, he didn't give any instructions. Stephens, Ward-Prowse and Lemina were all looking to the bench for instructions. You can bet Conte would have been making it abundantly clear who was going where and doing what had Moses had to come off. - Start of second half we looked completely out of sorts. No shape whatsoever. People are debating whether the players can be bothered, but that didn't look like a performance where the players weren't trying, they just simply didn't have any direction. - I know Redmond is trying his best, and he wasn't terrible every time he got the ball, just more often than not! He never turns and runs at players. His blistering pace is a myth, but even so, is he being instructed not to take risks? Boufal eventually comes on and makes an immediate impact because he runs at players. The two are not even comparable, yet Redmond is relied on time and again while Boufal always seems to be a last resort. Although our shape improved when Boufal came on, it did seem odd that Hojbjerg made way as he had been one of a better players and was just starting to assert himself with more attacking freedom. - I felt a bit sorry for Gabbiadini. I'm sure people will accuse him of not doing anything, but in the first half I thought every time the ball came to him he did something good with it. And second half had absolutely no service. Just before he was replaced he made several good runs but was never picked out, he looked in despair! Austin comes on and immediately gets a through pass. Bet Gabbiadini was thinking "seriously? why couldn't someone have played me in like that?!", maybe he'd even have scored it. Either way, it looks like we don't work on the attacking third at all in training, because it was so incoherent. - Strange that Pellegrino doesn't speak to the players he substitutes. Almost like he's annoyed with them. I don't want to be sucked into thinking that a quiet/focused man lacks 'passion', but I couldn't help but wonder about the difference in managers when Chelsea had a free kick near the end. Conte was shouting and gesticulating giving instructions, while Pellegrino stood with his hands in his pockets. As a one off, ok that means nothing, but over the course of the game it's amazing how many more instructions their manager seemed to want to give than ours. Not necessarily a problem, just an observation.