gio1saints

TBF this is quite a strong Championship team. Albeit it looks a bit toothless now Tyler is out. Certainly when compared to teams like Sheff Utd who are winning a lot in the league below without anything like our squad quality. The home match v Forest was one of the most baffling Saints matches i've ever seen - so it wont take much to improve on it - though we still have a lot of the same starters as that match - just three different - BBD, Ramsdale and Captain Jack not playing. I hope we remember how sick inducing that performance was and actually show some passion. Got a feeling with our most skilful players not playing or bench we will show that passion by using more brawn on the pitch than is strictly necessary so watch out for cards, plenty yellow AND red my prediction.......but I don't care if we kick them off the park and end with 8 players as long as we win...COYY!

Well done. Supporters like you are why we are proud saints. Taking your son on a mission impossible but doing it anyway with good cheer. Good man and good saints stock! 😇

As an Anglo Italian I feel it’s ok to take a mildly humorous take on his accent, “No, No“ Ivan Juric already has a number of linguistic idiosyncrasies that could make him a terrace legend. 😄 COYS!

Yes I think in part that was what was hoped might happen. He IS technically superior to the rest of our lot but his body isn’t , as far as I can judge , unfortunately. Cant tell you how gutted I was first match away at Eastleigh when I basically went hoping to see his debut but he pulled out after the pre match kick around on the pitch. Sadly was a sign of things to come…

Point think worth making is we should not expect too much of our current players. Especially if SR sell KWP or God Forbid Aaron, Tyler, Taylor or Mateus - which are all possible imo were the right offer to come in. The squad camp mood, from my understanding, has gone from diehard belief in a failing cause to professional pragmatism. That has got to be an improvement. Ivan has already shown he has grasped the situation by putting our (probably) three most gifted players together on pitch at same time, in close proximity. And allowed KWP licence to attack more defend less. The Kameldeen, Mateus, Tyler forward line is clearly an intelligent attempt at making something different happen when we attack. K with his unpredictability/pace and Tyler/Mateus with their raw skill. We should see more shots more on target and with luck more goals. The rest of season I see Juric playing 3 centre backs and a mostly defensively solid rest of team set up to stop goals conceded and support those three/four. They are tasked with basically doing whatever it takes to get a goal. When and if they get knackered then Cameron, TP and Adam get to try. Think Ivan will have got that plan settled in his mind now until end of season, unless an unlikely top technical player but who is a bit past it agrees to join - think along the lines of a Tadic or a Balotelli type player for a last hurrah short term deal.

I think I'm always going to think of him as No-No Ivan Juric. Every answer in his press conference starts the same - "No No". And his theme song, assuming we get to win an EPL game with him as Manager, or maybe its safer if I say if we get to score a goals and are, at least temporarily, in the lead in an EPL match, will surely be the 2 Unlimited "No limit"...: No No, No No No No, No No No No No No ....IVAN JURIC...yeah it's dead easy easy. 😎

Agree. He was playing against L1 standard defenders was the main reason. The second ( imo) is he was being watched by scouts ( from Genoa apparently) because I don’t think he will be up for playing Championship football with Saints next year - everything about him and the situation he’s been in shouts he will want to be sold before he ever gets picked to play for us in the Championship. I think Juric will certainly make the case to SR that KS is a potential difference maker up front that may be our salvation - and SR might agree on the basis that if he gets a handful of goals at EPL it won’t do his resale value any harm - so unless it’s a very meaty offer in the Jan window ( over £15m nearer £20m id say) I think he will be playing a lot more for Saints between now and end of season - if he’s not sold. What won’t happen is that he won’t even make match day squad anymore- which I always thought was crazy given our best tricky winger got sent away start of season ( Sam E).

FWIW Roma are my second team and I have many Roma supporting cousins and friends. The first reaction from them was “ oh dear” after what happened at Roma - but I see it differently. We are more Verona and Torino than Roma end of the table -as Juric put it at the press thing. I think Roma and its supporters - and the squad - were still reeling from losing the idolised De Rossi but who could not get a tune out of his team. Juric came in and it seems some of the players got a rude awakening. High profile players were dropped and results did not improve fast enough so they pulled the plug. Many going on about seeing Sulemana but I Would not be surprised, certainly in short term, to see the work rate of Fraser back on the pitch - which, sadly reminds us that Juric can only cut the suit according to his cloth. And ours is pretty thin. BBD , an injured striker who has hardly played, invisible Wesley and frankly our main ( and only realistic) hope apart from Cam and AA both not top EPL players and Tall Paul is what he’s got to pull something out the bag. I think most Saints fans will understand and value the commitment shown no matter the results under the new man. COYS!

The style that Juric wants us to play demands intelligence, technical skill AND super fitness. Im pretty certain the team are technically capable - enough - although I don’t think we are as fit as I’ve ever seen Saints teams and wonder if we got the puff for 90 minutes of hard pressing. They won’t get that extra sharpness and fitness this week ~ so supporters ought to be aware that he and players will need extra support from us last twenty minutes of matches in particular. We will go out fast v West Ham but if it’s still tight at the end that’s when our supporters can really make a difference. And if West Ham score first even more so. Got a feeling the crowds going to be lively and the atmosphere electric Boxibg Day!

Wow. Childishness hits a new low.

The slaughtering of Jack Stephens is not hilarious. Bloke is getting and has got torrents of abuse and he will be his own worst critic - but hey keep piling in with the cheap shots on a thread meant to be discussing the rumour RM is sacked. He made some football mistakes but he’s a honest pro decent bloke - and still our Club Captain. So, abuse him and yiu are disrespecting Southampton Football club. And whether you hate him and hate RM or whoever the hell you need to hate to make it through the day - you should take that on board because there’s many who are Southampton til we die and don’t like people dissing the club like that.

Why ? I would have thought it’s obvious. He was saying that the ( many) critics of some or all of the tactical playbook RM employs need to know what players like him think of the situation and style - because it’s become topic of the season. tHB has hit a job in the EPL next season whatever - so he is no need and is NOT sucking up to his boss. Just pointing that out.

You are having a go at THB. Our best Centreback and a bloke always gives his all for Saints acknowledges support every match. Those were his words being quoted in the Echo. Very rare for a young player to be so specific. Especially a young England international. I don’t think you realised that - giving you benefit of the doubt here - but check Frannies words on same subject in the Echo - which made a lot of sense. If you did mean it - 😵‍💫

Maybe so now I’ve been able to stop working for money…what’s your excuse?

Do you think Brighton and Bournemouth are baked into the top table then? Compared to us currently - yes - historically no. In future also most likely no, for reasons stated.

Unless you are baked into the world football top table, you will never gatecrash the party for too long. Sorry for expressing that cynical view at this time of year but sadly more likely right than wrong. It’s not my personal belief but objectively it looks pretty much the way it is. The argument goes : Clubs like Saints are here to just make up the numbers for the Top Table teams. And when they unearth a new talent - be it manager or player - and results improve - it’s only a matter of time before they get sold to those teams and the results reverse. The argument goes further though - and this part makes me chuckle - “well at least we are not a Derby County, Middlesbrough, LeedsUnited or God forbid a Portsmouth - and we could be unless we do XYZ right now. XYZ usually means spend somebody else’s money on new players new managers or new owners. It can also mean new tactics but usually new tactics are the first thing tried before the new players, managers or owners are brought in. Funnily enough new tactics - though vocally demanded by supporters of a losing team - are often greeted with contempt and more dismay as they are recognised for what they are - a desperate attempt to avoid getting the sack - and unless the results change immediately the chants of “ you don’t know what you’re doing” ring out loud forcing the inevitable. The timescale given to any Manager forced into a “change tactics” scenario is measured in days and weeks not months. Thats why you won’t hear that Saints are “ changing the way we play” - but, ominously or thankfully, take your pick - you will notice that they ARE playing in a different way / ways than before. If you hadn’t noticed or don’t watch the matches you may not be aware but the way we play currently is different to last seasons “possession for its own sake” football ( as some call it- not me). It’s also different from the way we started this season ( which was poor btw😵‍💫) It is evolving - which is a euphemism meaning RM IS changing the way we are playing and changing his instructions to players. One simple example - How many crosses did you see from our fb last season? Earlier this season? How many crosses have Ryan Manning and Yuki been responsible for in last few matches? Crosses were not a feature of our play last season or early this season- they are now. There’s other examples but the point is- if the change, relatively disguised and unheralded as it is, does not work, it’s weeks not seasons usually before RM gets sacked before players get bought and sold indeed if owners change, because this is how the cycle usually works. That means the January window looks like the test of SR willingness to brave it out / splurge more money on a new boss and new players ~ or start wheels in motion to get out of this money losing business. If the results have not improved- regardless of points - then the inevitable will happen. What results? I reckon that next six matches or so we need at least 1.5 points per match RM to still have a job. Not my personal view but just an objective assessment. My personal view is keep him keep the project see it through to the end and go again battle scarred and wiser in the Championship if needs be next season with him and the approach. But that’s just me. Acknowledge most on here think very differently.

Sounds pretty much like the way Saints treated MLT back in the day - just give him the ball let him do whatever he wants with it - the rest of you run around more so he can rest and prepare in/between doing genius stuff! Although TD version of Inbetween genius stuff usually amounts to getting a yellow for shirt pulling - five already this season! Having the level of uncertainty that TD brings- and that of MF let’s not forget who though less flashy still has clearly got @extra@ in him, has made a big difference to our game. And to opponents plans to thwart that “shit passing game” you mentioned. TD is often doubled and trebled up when he gets the ball - and that’s not happened for a long time on a Saints player. It most certainly releases space for others at the very least. I personally think that there was hope and a plan that Charlie, Sam E, Amo or Kameldeen were also able to be that kind of player - but only Tyler - and MF to a degree - have managed it. The rest of our squad, though decent professionals, hardworking and loyal, do not , so far, despite having good intentions, have that higher level of extra “class@ in their locker - only KWP and Aaron deserve the “good EPL player “ tag imo apart from the two kids. The rest - perhaps THB is pushing to join those four - are certainly, and rightly, bottom end of the EPL standard, more accurately described as good/ decent Championship players in the main. Just because you playing in the EPL does not make you an EPL player. It’s quite obvious many of our players are simply not able to raise there standard. Instead- we are blessed with the two talents and just have to hope that the “water carriers “ put in as much work as possible to allow the talents to make things happen.

I’m not sure I understand your point? Are you saying that maybe the “patient passing moves opponents out of position strategy” is evolving under this hapless unable to change Manager of ours? 😂 Or is it that Dibling is deliberately disobeying orders from Russell? 😂 On reflection how is it that three of our most recent goals we scored ( Archer v Arsenal, MF v Liverpool and Downes yesterday) have come from breaks and transition swift passing play? Have the team en masse decided to play differently to the slow boring useless passing way the Manager asks/ tells them? Some mutiny that is! I wonder which it is. Or maybe it’s just luck. Or coincidence. Could not be playing to instructions in an evolving system because RM is a useless stubborn unable to change or adapt manager as we all know. 😂😂😂

I cannot make this now. One seat. Sold Out. Anybody wants my place in Block 41 Northam let me know. Face value of course. Will put it in the Saints exchange next week if no interest here by then. Message me & leave mob. G.

Yes I think you are right. The defence is bad. Our attackers do t score as much as they should. The goal (s) we conceded many was rubbish. Our best young players will get stolen/ sold. That scenario has happened on and off the last fifty years. Whether it’s under SR and RM or any other ownership leadership. I just have a small flickering flame of belief that there is something going on that could really be different this time at SFC. If and when it restarts from the Championship next season I’m sanguine. We kept KWP last time but I doubt we can keep both TD and MF if we go down which would be a great shame as they give me value for my ST. BUT : we got two perhaps under this regime we will get more.

Yes I think that’s what happened. But in real life football not with a hundred replays and var that goal looks offside to me as a ref Lino flagged it or not. And I would have chalked it off. Human error I know - wrong reason apparently - but I prefer that to the explanation ultimately given.

On the offside - agree with many on here. As a HantsFA qualified ref I would have given that offside without a seconds hesitation. Lino flagged its offside carry on. That VAR took so long to faff about before ultimately confirming the onfield decision was shitty and pisses everyone off. Russell’s explanation from a pro footballers perspective is exactly what he should say - the goalie was not impeded - But the on-field decision was offside and if it was for Brighton I’d have been aggrieved if it had been not been disallowed. Just annoys me the VAR interpretation on “interfering with play for an offside goal” ends up being just as subjective and liable to human error as if there was no var and it’s back down to the ref and his assistants. No difference really just we lost 4 minutes waiting and all got angry.

Thought the away support was brilliant all match. Yet again. Bad first half epitomised by Archer shinning a chance someone like Vardy (or insert 90% of forwards in this league - ) would score in their sleep. Second half competitive but not dominant. VAR has not been our friend this season but neither have our set pieces or general defending - which is bottom of the league standard rubbish. Noticeably our main goal threat last bunch of games appears to be mostly from fast breaks on the transition - and it’s planned - and seemingly effective - Archers goal v Arsenal, his contentious disallowed goal and the Fernandes goal v Liverpool all last few weeks examples. Kind of disappointing if you are one of the many who like to go on about how boring and slow we are as a team. Kind of ruins the narrative. The team is evolving. The style is evolving. Arguably, progressively in recent matches there’s signs. Probably way too slowly to avoid relegation. None of Liverpool, Arsenal, Brighton or Man City have made us look “out of our depth”. The top four in this league. Decapitate the boss, install a new regime and unsettle this now near 18months in the baking evolving team with some breakout young stars now flourishing and leading it - like TD and MF - at your peril SR! Each match they look better and better. And that’s been versus the best in the league. Credit where it’s due.

I am not. That is not correct. Lots of what you say is legitimate and informed even prescient but that comment is not one of them.

@verlaine1979I respect your POV but the style of football played is not really the key point. My rebelliousness or stupidity if that’s what you see it as is because ultimately, we never win. And I do not see that changing. Unless other big things change. Saints do not win. Whatever style we play and have played in our history - and there’s been MANY variations - we do not end up winning the league winning the cup winning in Europe or even close. Thats the backdrop and our history and, frankly, our future. Whatever manager whatever style. We have had Poch, Koeman, Keegan, Bale and Shearer VVD and Mane - but we still never win. What we do, if we have had a bounty of great players all at same time plus manager, is have maybe a season or two in which we look competitive. Get to a Final perhaps. Then we sell and go back to being what we’ve always been. A feeder club to the clubs you say “ play better football”. Back to struggling Saints. No big revelation here but the main reason those other clubs “ play better football” is because they are able to snatch the best players and the best managers from the other clubs like Saints year after year. Find outliers by all means but for the most part that’s the way it is. And how has that situation arisen and is it now locked in so that teams like Saints can never get to Top Table?? I think the answer is yes. And I resent it. Small aside : I actually thought the Liverpool match was the opposite of navel gazingly boring shit - but we all view matches differently. The ultimate outcome is pre ordained - and most Saints fans would have told you at 2-1 v Liverpool we were still going to lose this. Not in the sense of “ match -fixing” but on a deeper, structural way football is set up level. My 50 years of watching Saints NOT win but supporting them throughout with a smile despite it all tells me that this is the status quo. Get over it I used to say to myself. Enjoy the little victories we are allowed. Enjoy some nice moments on a match day. Smile wryly in that Saints dark humour way when we lose again. I still do all that but here I’m espousing the other side if it as well. I can hold both beliefs simultaneously. And in any case why should Saints fans and the rest of the also ran clubs in this grand money making scheme be too bothered about how we or they play ? Indeed, as long as it’s “ entertaining” what’s wrong? The gladiator contests were also meant to be entertaining. But watching the charade of competitive football matches in this fixed system is sometimes too much even for my mature stomach. And this is the nub of the argument, why not do something counterintuitive like play in this almost freakish style of ours? If playing the game the way we have played it for 50 years with so many variations has delivered the square root of f all why not try this freakish way? Why not? Because we might lose even more? Because it’s humiliating? I think what’s humiliating is the big screen at SMS constantly replaying Bobby Stokes goal from 1976 as the highlight of our existence. Or beating Carlisle. Or those c ants on the TV smugly grinning when they talk about us.