Sheaf Saint

And so the cycle of misunderstanding continues. If you understood the muslim culture in any way you would understand why that particular action was deemed so offensive. The cartoonist might as well have accused every musilm in the world of being a pig-loving whore. And while some of the reaction to it was extreme (we all saw the 'behead those who insult Islam' banners), there was always going to be a massive backlash to it. With a little cultural understanding and mutual respect, the whole situation could have been avoided.

Well he has already been kidnapped twice and had two fatwas issued against him (which were both subsequently overturned by senior clerics who fully support what he is trying to achieve)

I'm not so sure we really had much of a chance. The Taliban only seized control of Afghanistan in the late 90s, and we invaded in 2001.

Are you familiar with the work of Greg Mortenson and the Central Asia Institute? I recently read Three Cups of Tea which is the true account of his fight to overcome the influence of the madraasas in the Karakoram and the Hindu Kush. In just a few short years, hundreds - even thousands - of these madrassas popped up while he, with the blessing of the Pakistan government, was attempting to build secular schools for all of the deprived children - specifically for girls - in the region. If you haven't read it then you should give it a go. It has taught me more about the politics and the religions of that part of the world than any other book/video has since the whole issue came to the world's attention in 2001.

You could make it up... But it wouldn't be as funny!

Yep, that pretty much sums it up for me as well.

I say let them do it. It's all being orgainsed by that Choudary chap who is just a publicity-seeking moron. Let him have his five minutes of fame and just ignore him. I imagine though that the police will have their work cut out that day, because it seems pretty obvious that the EDL or others will most likely turn up to wreck the whole thing. Could get messy.

Sounds like we are leaving the back door wide open again though.

Damn!

Hopback's finest :smt023

In which case their financial affairs need to be thoroughly investigated, because there can only be one reason why they would do this and that would be to disguise the state of their finances. Not for the first time, something very fishy is going on at PFC.

Drinks in town with a couple of friends followed by a house party to see in the new year. Hopefully I won't be quite as ill the next day as I was last year!

Road Rash & Road Rash II (Megadrive) Rambo (C64) Sensible Soccer (Megadrive) Wipeout & Wipeout 2097 (Playstation) There are loads more if I can be bothered to think about them. And to Ponty I would say that although graphical capabilities are so much better now than ever before, and will obviously continue to improve, graphics aren't everything. It is ultimately how playable a game is that defines how good it is.

Not sure if it is still there but when me and a few mates went in about 1994 there was a Medieval Torture Museum, somewhere on the main drag between Dam Square and the Leidseplein. Worth checking out, if you're into that sort of thing.

Well maybe if you did look deeply into the reasons why you hate them, you might realise that you don't actually have any.

Suffer administration and relegation, and then we can hopefully get to play them again in the next couple of years and take our rightful revenge for that 4-1 at Fratton in 04/05. I'm 34 and I started following Saints in 1988/89 season.

No I never have. I have seen first-hand though the level of hatred some of their fans have towards us. Doesn't mean I need to reciprocate it though. Like I said, hate is such a strong word that I cannot bring myself to apply it to anybody.

Well then you have my sympathy. Hate is such a strong word, I feel sorry for anybody who has to go through life experiencing it.

:smt102 Normally I like you as a poster VFTT, but I'm at a loss to understand how you have come to this conclusion.

No it shouldn't be too much to ask, but consider the circumstances. Our massive rivals come to SMS for the first time, the first time we have played them in any competition for over seven years, in an evening cup-game meaning plenty of drinking time before the match. Did you honestly expect every single one of them to respect the min's silence impeccably? Do you honestly believe that every single one of our fans would have done the same if the situations were reversed? If your answer to both of those questions is no then I think you are a little out of touch. Look, I don't want to come across as a closet skate or anything, but I'm just being realistic. They have some d1ckhead fans, and so do we. They have a large majority of decent fans, and so do we. No matter how much people like to brag about things like years in the top flight, attendances or whatever, the fact is there are a lot more similarities between our two clubs than most people are rationally capable of recognising. I'm truly sorry if my views upset anybody, but I'm just trying to look at it from a neutral point of view, which I appreciate is a very difficult thing to do when it comes to supporting a football club because by very definition, being a football fan requires a certain amount of blind loyalty.

Once again though, you can't blame their entire fanbase on the peurile actions of a handful of their more moronic fans. I was at that game, and yes I was as angry as anyone at the time, though it wasn't entirely unexpected, but I recognise that in fact a lot of the noise was coming from their fans trying to get the idiots to shut up. And plus, can you honestly say that Every Saints fan in the ground would have behaved impeccably had the situation been reversed? I seriously doubt it, because we have our fair share of idiot fans as well, as does every other club in England.

Me neither. I think your opinion is probably representative of a large majority of Saints fans. What I can't undserstand is the attitude amongst some that wanst to see them pop out of existence entirely. Whatever anybody's views on some of their neanderthal fans, most of us are capable of recognising that most of their fans are just like most of ours - decent, hard-working people who enjoy watching their local team - and don't deserve to lose their club due to the greed and unrealistic expectations of the club's current and previous owners.

Actually, where are all the mods? Are they on christmas shut-down or something? They are conspicuous by their absence at the moment.

Only an observation on my part that a handful of internet messageboard users are the ones shouting for liquidation. Out of interest, and I ask this of everyone who wants PFC to go out of business, is the fact that some of them gloated about our situation one of the deciding factors in you forming your opinion, or do you think you would hold the same view if our financial problems and administration had never happened?