austsaint

Yes, I meant someone like Winks (proven, experienced) playing regularly in cm would have been a better proposition than Smallbone, and Charles for that matter. Your point is well made, buying Charles (one for the future) has cost us as our midfield woes have mounted.

With hindsight, someone like Winks rather than Smallbone in any central midfield role would have benefited Saints greatly.

I see S. Clarke's point - that people are entitled to hope (and a "winning mentality") as a Football fan, just as hope is crucial to just about every aspect of life. As you point out though; even the most basic of mathematicians could tell us we weren't going to make up that deficit on Leicester in the remaining games. In that sense hope of winning the title was not hope, but pie-in-the-sky. The more realistic hope was/still is that we finish second - a couple of weeks ago, that hope burned brightly, despite the proximity of Leeds and Ipswich. Now it's a slightly flickering low wattage globe after the defeats at Bristol and St Marys v Hull. It's still possible - the hope of automatic promotion lives on.....precariously.

Don't forget Meghoma - he'll likely go past all three you mention inside 12 months.

You're breaking our hearts. But you're absolutely right.

Great summary. I don't think RM is being arrogant - he just seems to have a blind spot with players like Manning and Smallbone... Too much faith in them; and comments about "unnoticed contributions" and WS doing a great job against Bristol City as the 6 just leave you baffled as to how he can say that. It really was like a re-run of the Bristol City game - as you say, he really should have reacted to the mistake of the starting line up before half time, that's how obvious the mistakes were.

You're probably right.

Downes and Aribo for Rothwell and Smallbone - Downes can hold the midfield on his own - Airibo more advanced. Stephens for Manning; Adams for Mara; Fraser for Edozie (on later), Brooks for Arma (on later) and stick with Stu who can share the 10 and wide role with Brooks.

His hold up play and first touch is much better than Maras'. The starting lineup seemed wrong today - Smallbone and Rothwell was never going to work as a midfield pair. Why re-instate Manning? The improvement when Brooks, Fraser, Adams and Airibo came on was instant - it's not as though we had a comfortable cushion of points - should have started with a stronger line up.

Smallbone and Rothwell = no midfield.

No, but he looks to be up to standard, six years younger than JWP and probably already a better defensive midfielder - which is what we're short of. You'll also note I agreed about a hypothetical Downes/JWP pairing being a good match. Could happen I suppose if we don't go up and Downes goes back to the Hammers.

Agree with both your sentences.

Perraud would be more than handy for the run in. For that matter, he's already demonstrated that he handles the LB role at Prem level quite well. Whose decision was it to farm him out on loan? I think we have a gem in Meghoma, but he won't be ready for first team Football (in August) if we go up. The Jack Clarke rumour sits well with me too. Just looks like a young player who will make the transition.

One of the Armstrong brothers, wasn't it?

Don't forget Chaplow's dome.

If Leeds win, the prospect of us finishing 3rd becomes more likely. That's a nightmare outcome in my book. Foxes please.

You're better than that, Tame.

One of the great crimes against Footballing commonsense.

Indeed. RM's faith in the Armstrong brother Stu is well justified. He might be prone to a knock or bump, and may cough up the ball now and again - but more often than not he runs, drives, assists and last night busts a gut to track back which both inspires others and lifts the team to a winning performance. Takes a decent corner and free kick too! The other reflection I have about last night after watching the replay.....when you're thinking about the players who have done well, helped the team, played a blinder; I found myself forgetting about KWP. It is so mainstream for him to deliver a sublime, classy, smooth-as-silk performance you almost rate it as routine!

That was an extraordinary miss by the referee. But what a brilliant away win. Two quality goals and apart from a few nervy moments leading up to and after half time, a well controlled performance - very satisfying to quieten the crowd and rain on the prospective new owner parade. Stephens to LB tightened the defence up well. THB and Bednarek once again gave polished performances, and the strength off the bench was a key factor in the win. The cameos of Aribo, Edozie and Brooks not only sealed the win but put pressure on the Baggies ability to counter attack. A memorable moment was the tracking back run from Stu Armstrong before half time to snuff out a cross inside the box. A brilliant response to the blip at Bristol.

Russell Martin is overseeing a magnificent season with Saints, and has an enormous amount of credits, no matter what happens from this point - not-with-standing his brief was/is to return us to the Prem. One of the things I like about his player management is the encouragement and support for players, even if they have a bad game or stuff up - especially important for the younger lads. Just the same, I've thought for a while that RM is greatly overrating Manning and Smallbone. Manning's repeat weaknesses defensively and positionally have been well discussed. The Daily Echo quoted Martin as saying that "WS did a great job" as the 6 against Bristol City! Really!. Admittedly he wasn't helped by young Charles' disappointing game in the first half, but his own game was awful. I think we've seen enough of him as a central or defensive mid to say he's not up to that role, especially when a player like Downes is missing. WS' role as a more attacking mid is certainly more impressive - he covers ground (though not athletic), gets into the box well and has good eye for a pass even though his instinct is often sideways or backwards. The question I ask...... is he any more effective in that more attacking role than players like Aribo, Brooks or Rothwell? Not quite good enough to be a first choice defensive midfielder and similarly as an attacking mid with the depth we have. The hybrid role he is often entrusted with seems a luxury against the stronger opposition. I'm quietly confident that if Wilcox and RM had a chance to bolster the squad right now, an experienced defensive mid-fielder would be high on the list.

Manning really is limited defensively and positionally. The dilemma Martin has is knowing that in 6-12 months time a player like Meghoma is likely going to be leaving Manning for dead, but at such a pointy stage of the season he can't afford to gamble with the inexperience of Meghoma. More likely he thinks about a fit Bree in there at LB as an alternative to Manning.

We could have done with a Schneiderlin, Cork, Wanyama or a Romeu tonight! As many feared, without Downes, our central midfield was hopelessly exposed tonight. Charles was poor, hasn't played a lot of Football and clearly isn't yet ready for a holding midfield responsibility. Yet Smallbone was equally as dire. The lack of a clinical striker and the complete reliance on a fit Downes to secure the midfield looms as a big threat to automatic promotion.

And so for that matter is Will Smallbone.

He has had a very good season, and if he falls short of the 28 or 29 goals he scored for Blackburn in the Championship a few seasons back we can probably point to the tame one-on-one lob attempt yesterday as one of the great chances squandered. Everything I've seen of AA this season just confirms what an outstanding Championship player he is, who, very likely falls short of the quality needed at Prem level, judged on his 50 or so Prem appearances so far. Still crucial to the Club's promotion prospects though.