egg

Indeed! We did the Yorkshire dales and Moors last year. Picked up a few scars. We'd only do Devon in the autumn or spring when it's less mental. Can't be doing crowded lanes, or actually anywhere crowded.

Ha!! We avoid the crowded touristy places. Little sites in the countryside are where it's at.

Spotify threw that at me earlier today. Splendid 😊.

Camping in a tent, cooking all out meals, no, but we've got a campervan and love it. King size bed, central heating, bathroom, flushing toilet, shower, electric, proper fridge, and the ability to go wherever we want. We only stay on sites with proper facilities and somewhere walkable to eat. We ate out yesterday, today we barbequed, tomorrow, who knows. Done properly it's decent.

Yep, we're doing a road trip in Belgium. The Brits stand out a mile everywhere we go - fat and either pale or orange. The locals are nearly all in great nick.

I think that's the case.

I think it's gone quiet because Tonda is in the middle of an internal disciplinary process, and the club are saying nothing until that plays out. If he had our backing, the club would have said so.

Yes, but, he/we failed to grasp the distinction between the intent to gain an advantage and getting one, and having maintained that no real harm was done, the panel viewed the club’s defence as an attempt to downplay a "top-down" operation, ultimately leading to our playoff expulsion. Absolute cock up all around.

Relating that to our case, when McLaren stole Ferraris data to attempt to get an advantage, they had Hamilton and Alonso (the reigning world champion) as their drivers. Just having the best drivers/players wasn't enough for them, they felt the need to spy to gain a sporting advantage. The panel referenced the McLaren case for good reason.

That's like saying you can't grade stealing. You walk into a jewellery shop and instinctively nick a silver ring, it's stealing. You walk in and nick all the diamond rings and out of the window, in a planned theft, it's stealing. Both stealing, but different grades, and get a different penalty. This advantage gained point is nonsense. The panel were spot on when they said "sporting advantage is different from sporting success". They ruled that an "advantage" is gained the second a club compromises an opponent's privacy with the intent to cheat—regardless of whether they actually go on to win, lose, or play poorly on match day. In truth, who knows what our kid saw. Whilst Tonda testifies that it was nothing , his credibility was shot by that point so the panel wouldn't have believed anything he said. Regardless, the decision was that we were seeking an advantage to help us sew up the tie and get to Wembley for the big one. That, on any objective assessment, is unarguable.

I don't read your posts as discussion. You have this view that we've been really hard done by, have suffered the mother of stitch up, and only a real fan would agree with that. That's not discussion, it's an entitled Gen Z attitude which boils my piss.

Tis the way of the world CB; no accountability, always someone else's fault, always someone to blame, it wasn't that bad, whataboutery, etc.

And funnily enough against the other team involved, not some other team, which makes the whole "why did Boro go through when we cheated against Boro" I keep hearing argument a tad odd. On your main point, I'm sure even you agree that there's a world of difference between a player instinctively going down and the ref giving the wrong decision, and a clubs manager coercing a kid to go on a planned spying mission, wearing a disguise.

There isn't. There are people who view what's happened objectively, not the way you want them to. That's different.

Literally the 1st post in response, and you emphasise his point. There was no "biased jury", or "dodgy review process". We pleaded guilty. They had to give us a sporting sanction, yet there we were asking for a fine. That's after lying through our back teeth. No humility, no genuine remorse, no reality. It'd be like drink driving, initially trying to blame your mate, then putting your hands up, but asking to keep our licence. Boro went through because we tried to get a sporting advantage against them. As qwrrtyyell says, this is not complicated.