Lord Duckhunter

What a load of old pony. The referee decides what is and isn’t cheating, there is absolutely no comparison between what happened here with anything that happens on the pitch. These ridiculous posts make our supporters look a right bunch of numpties…

Reading the last couple of pages, I seem to be. Fucking hell,some of the excuses are ridiculous, we’ve got as many, if not more chumps than Boro. Fucking hell, the bloke was going for a pint and just popped down to the training ground, it was all a cunning plan by Middlesbrough, it was a double agent. Dear God, the simplest explanation is the correct one 99% of the time. We sent someone to spy on them, (I don’t know why, probably to see if their star man featured in their shape drills). Looks like we sent a bit of a half wit, and the said half wit got caught. At least Bielsa had the balls to say what he’d done, how many times he did it, and what he hoped to gain from it. I prey to god that some of our legal team aren’t posters on here, because we’re fucked if they are….Wake up and smell the coffee.

The breached that when they put Baz in nets & got Will Still managing them. Nearly ruined entire careers.

Why do people keep pushing this pony. Teams work on their shape and formation for the upcoming games in the last 3 days before the game. There’s absolutely no point in “spying” on a team outside of this window as it won’t help you. FFS, 72 hours isn’t some figure plucked out of thin air. Basically it is against the rules to watch a team prepare for a fixture you’re involved in. There is no “grey area”.

It’s unusual because……. We’re in an unusual situation. People can read what they like into it, but anyone who reads anything into it, is a plank…

Dear god. Here’s an idea. They picked the officials who could officiate Southampton V Hull or Boro V Hull. I’d imagine, it’s not that difficult to pick them on that basis.

Yep, trying to claim he acted alone would be laughed out of the hearing. I think the best case for us is the head of his team sent him up there, without the knowledge of Tonda or his staff. And that Tonda and his staff are totally separate from that team. When they got the reports, they would act on it without knowing the specifics as to how it was obtained. Thinking this didn’t come from the very top of the that department is for the fairies. Yes

No it wasn’t. The only thing dodgy about that was the Lino flagging when the bloke was yards onside.

He’s right though. Some of the pony on here is ridiculous. I’ll bet my life when the verdict is back, future recommendations won’t include Boro building a wall or not training where they can be overlooked.

What a load of pony. It’s got nothing to do with Wrexham or Millwall. If we’re kicked out it will because the independent body thought Middlesbrough weren’t knocked out “fair and square”. What makes is so difficult for people to understand. If we’re kicked out, Boro will play Hull, it’s as simple as that…

The question should be has anyone been charged with it in respect of a knock out game. The Canadian birds were docked 6 points and the coach banned for a year, but it was in the group stages. Had it been a league game, we couldn’t be chucked out, but in a knock out game, what is the sporting sanction. People keep going on about the lack of advantage we gained, but surely that’s irrelevant. To make that mitigation, you’re punishing Middlesbrough for catching us early. The decision makers are hardly going to say, “had you managed to watch the whole day & analyse the data you would have had an advantage and we would have chucked you out. However, because Middlesbrough were able to stop you, we won’t”.

Don’t be ridiculous, the information the keepers use is based of data collected legally. From watching matches where penalty takers took penalties. This is totally different.

Absolutely. Pretty much every single set of supporters would be the same as Middlesbrough’s have been. There still people who hate Derby because they kicked us and we got wet 20 years ago.

Brown would probably have won an election had he called one earlier. Jim Callaghan was also popular prior to The Winter of discontent & Maggie wasn’t as formidable, I guess having 2 General elections in ‘74 put him of calling one early ‘76 I think the Tories got too carried away with Major not calling one and winning the subsequent election. However, had he called one early, he’d probably have got a bigger majority than he ended up getting. There’s no doubt in my mind that if Burnham wins the leadership and then goes to the country for another mandate, he’ll win (maybe a reduced majority, but still a decent working one). Obviously he doesn’t need to, and I’m not saying he morally should do (I don’t believe he should). But tactically it makes absolute sense.

No chance Celtic don't win today, none whatsoever.

I think the complete opposite. If we’re not kicked out the EFL will want to announce it ASAP so fans can make plans and they knock the uncertainty in the head straight away. Middlesbrough may kick off and sue us, but the games not affected. The EFL may think the punishment too soft, but they’ll take it. It’s their biggest game of the season, they picked the time and date to maximise its appeal/importance, they want it on the day they choose, over any appeal against the leniency of our punishment. You can’t tell me these bods making the decision don’t work weekends. So it’s feasible a decision is being made today or tomorrow. If we’re kicked out, they’ll want all their ducks in a row before announcing. The last thing they want is another period of uncertainty. They’ll want to say, we’ve been chuck out, who is contesting the final, when and where, in one hit. And of course, there’s the logistics of any appeal which will lengthen the announcement timescales, but will lead to leaks. If we’re out, the leaks will start prior to any announcement imo…. Obviously, there’s different opinions, but mine is, the longer this goes on, the more likely we’re kicked out.

I’m with you on this one. The more I think about it, (and I’ve been doing way too much of that), the more I think this is the absolute key to it. If this was the FA Cup, I reckon we’d be chucked out, if it was a league game we’d face points deduction. It’s obviously a grey area which legal people would understand more than me. The other complication is it’s a two legged game, with the second leg having been played. The standard “result” is normally 3-0 against the transgressor, but they can’t do that having allowed the second leg to go ahead

They’ll have no proof whatsoever, are probably on holiday now, and know that in the grand scheme of things it wouldn’t affect their league position. The question is would they be kicking off had they been in this one off crucial game and the team instead of Middlesbrough we were spying on and then beat. I imagine the answer would be yes. For all this slagging off of Middlesbrough, this forum would be in meltdown had Portsmouth spied on us and then knocked us out of the playoffs, so I find this Middlesbrough pony a bit disingenuous from some of our supporters. People keep posting that we didn’t gain an advantage. True, but only because we got caught. I’m not a lawyer but “yes we tried to gain an advantage, but we’re so useless at it, we didn’t”, doesn’t strike me as carrying much weight as a defence. Neither is “it was legal an hour ago”, or “they should have made it harder for us to watch”. I’m just glad the likes of Soggy & MLG aren’t on our legal team. If it was a simple case of a lone wolf, it would be done by now. If it was a half arsed Billy Smart circus cock up, it would be done by now. I’ve no doubt if they find on the balance of probabilities it was an organised attempt to gain an unfair advantage, we will be chucked out. Maybe we could appeal that on the basis, this is part of the league season, and we wouldn’t be chucked out the league for it, but the longer it goes on, the more we’re in jeopardy imo.

Don’t talk pony man. We broke the fucking rules, we knew we were breaking the rules. It wasn’t some sort of timing issue. Thhi pathetic defence of our club is as ridiculous as the Boro over reaction. We are entirely 100% in the wrong, however much people try to dress it up. The only issue now is what is a proportional punishment.

Bielsa gave a long explanation and presentation as to what he hope to achieve from it, I don’t recall too many people saying “what a load of old pony, there’s no advantage to be gained”. Do people think the EFL put this rule in for no good reason (although some of our Nods probably think they did it as an anti saints conspiracy).

I don’t think it made much difference, but do we really believe this was the first time we’d done it. Twist it round the other way. Tonda caught Frank Lampard by surprise with his shape up there. Imagine if they’d managed to spy on us and knew what we were doing, so changed his line up and shape to counter us. Would people on here be making excuses or would some be jumping up and down. You only have to read the match day threads and the countless times opponents should have been sent off or penalties awarded to know the answer to that.

Why is it unlikely. Chances are they’ll have midweek game in this league, if they don’t Monday would be a light day I’d imagine. What with injuries & other factors I doubt the manager knows his starting 11 much before that. This figure wasn’t just plucked out of thin air. It was specifically set to stop sides spying to see line ups and set plays/shape.

Because that’s when most teams work on their shape & set pieces with the players who are starting the game.

Does anybody know the actual process of getting an independent body involved or the threshold etc. By that I mean, do the EFL look at the evidence and then decide there’s a case to answer and it’s so serious we need to be water tight. Do they just refer it to the independent body regardless of what they think or has our guilty plea, with mitigation mean the body are just dishing out the appropriate punishment. If we’d been accused of something else, tapping up for example, would that also go to this body, or would the EFL issue the sanction. I’m trying to work out whether the EFL getting this body involved automatically means there will be serious sporting sanctions. In short, why couldn’t the EFL decide the punishment, with an independent body hearing any appeal.

I just saw a great point about Hull. Both us & Middlesborough will have 10 days to prepare for playing Hull, whereas they might not know until Tuesday who they are playing. If watching training within 72 hours of a game, gives you an advantage, what does an extra week knowing your opponent must do similar….