UpweySaint

This. I get the pragmatic approach and the ingrained negativity from others given recent experiences as a saints fan but all the more reason to enjoy the current spell. We look bloody good going forwards - dare I say exciting to watch. We’re far from the finished article and hiring a rookie coach may come with inevitable “learning on the job” but if we can keep out scoring enough teams while Tonda and our relatively young team develop some steel and game management it could be an exciting second half of the season. In the thread somebody mentioned the Coventry game and it struck me how mad it seems given where we were when Still left to be actually doing autos maths rather than looking over our shoulder at Oxford and worrying we may be down there with the Blue mob!

We didn’t though. We won. We’ve won six out of seven under Tonda and lost the millwall game to a worldie from a centre back. Are you enjoying it at all? It may all go to shit but given how the season started I’m surprised you are so focused on the negatives when the positives seem to outweigh them.

Lots to like about us but the second half was tough. We almost beat their press and got out a few times but couldn’t hold up the ball. I found myself thinking how useful it would be to bring a more combative forward off the bench. Archer didn’t do much wrong but a fit Stewart could have made a real difference and given us the option is hitting long forcing them to either drop a little or risk us going over long where there was space to find.

You are probably right but there is a small bit of doubt. If Newcastle don’t sign him there is only a small pool of clubs who are likely to be interested at the prem level (or equivalent) and even fewer who would be willing to meet his wage demands/pay the level of fee we would expect. I don’t expect to see Ramsdale back but we can’t wholly rule it out.

I don’t think this is an accurate representation. Bazunu is not the best shot stopper - nobody disagrees. He could do with more presence commanding his box. You seem to imply there are posters saying he is brilliant- if there are, can you point them out? i think you will find a lot of the defence of him is because some of the criticism goes OTT and can feel as though people have an axe to grind “see - I told you he’s terrible”. I have seen posters saying he’s non league standard which is palpably untrue and hyperbolic. The way some fans seem to be so determined to run down our players is something I genuinely don’t understand. He’s not a great keeper. Ramsdale is better. He can start play with his feet in a way that Macca can’t and this is clearly a valued attribute for Tonda and a lot of coaches in top level football. To say he won’t improve at all in ten years is bizarre. Training at a high level under good coaches for ten years you don’t think he’ll improve decision making or positioning?

Matty Etherington is there as his assistant I think.

Americans pack up sport ‘franchises’ and move them across the country. Their sporting culture is very different from ours. I would be put good money that if the two clubs merged you would see one, if not two, fan led clubs formed that would draw fans away from Sheffield Unitesday.

I think we could end up splitting hairs a bit. It holds value - how much value is subjective. I agree some overestimate it. I have been in the camp of wanting an experienced manager to get the season back on track. Tonda has some division experience and is not a novice coach but he still wouldn’t have been my pick. If saints do well I’m always happy to be wrong! I found myself looking at the gap to the play offs yesterday. If we get results against Leicester and Millwall I think there will be a few nervous glances over the shoulder from teams above us…

I don’t agree. I think we can get hung up on experience/names but they do have value. Coaches and players can do well without it but that doesn’t negate it holding value. An example would be say, game management which typically develops over time. If we do stick with Tonda I would like to see him having some experience added to his coaching staff.

This. Nobody hates him because we know fuck all about him - nothing too hate. He’s a risk because of the lack of experience. If he keeps doing well then fair play, risk worth taking, credit to Spors.

Genuinely curious why Lallana is now with the 21s. Is it a promotion? A demotion? A sideways move? Does it mean Tonda doesn’t need him around the first team? Feels just a bit odd 🤷‍♂️

Perhaps but I would rather we get him in the right physical shape before putting him in. If we can keep him fit for the season he could be a key part of the team.

Individual work. I’m all for legitimate criticism of the club but I anticipate this will have been managed by sport science staff. Romeu has not had a preseason or played any competitive football since before the summer so will need to build up accordingly.

A good blast from the past. If it is Tonda some proper experience and nous around him would be valuable - I wonder if Pearson would be up for a supporting role?

Hard to argue that four wins on the spin would not be impressive if he gets them but it’s a big IF. He deserves some credit for the two wins he has picked up but the context does matter - the QPR game was a lucky win in my book and beating Sheffield Wednesday in their current state is par at best. He has had a bit of time with a decent chunk of the squad over the international break so seeing how we look against Charlton will be interesting either way and a reasonable yard stick for him. They are a well organised side and have bought into Jones’ philosophy - even if he still is a massive bellend! I’m not convinced Tonda is the answer and can see why he is being seen as the ‘clever dick/spreadsheet wanker’ type of appointment but if he gets results then fair enough. The other names linked aren’t exactly awe inspiring. There are a few I would feel much more confident than Tonda but most have their flaws.

As you say, bizarre if that’s the case. Physicality is surely something you can get a good sense of ahead of getting a player in - it’s not something a little more subjective like personality type/aptitude. We’re not blessed with options so I would like to see more of him should he stay and be able to get fit. He does look more than decent for this level.

Injuries have limited his game time severely which could be a factor I guess? Possible he just hasn’t settled either. We have seen very little of him but he does look decent if he can stay fit (god that feels a familiar refrain!)

I think I have missed something today! Has something happened to convince everyone we are going with Tonda? Without going back more than a couple of pages it seems like the consensus is it’s a done deal …

Betting odds reflect the betting market but also take into account other factors that impact on probability. As an absurd hypothetical - Poch quits the USA citing his desire to rekindle his love of Southampton. He might not get the job. People might not bet on him. But the odds would naturally come down to protect the bookies profit margins in case it DID happen. Or, for a less absurd example, the odds are likely to be lower for somebody without a club with championship experience even if nobody is betting on them specifically. I take the point that in the absence of much concrete information about who we are looking at fluctuations are most likely a result of betting patterns but reject your conclusion that odds do not reflect the likelihood of an event happening. That’s what they are.

I keep looking at the lists and wonder why there isn’t a few more continental names on there. I’m not saying we will/should go that way but it looks like a narrow field of candidates otherwise. Carrick I am so so O’Neil uninspired but would make some sense. Rodgers is a prick but has some pedigree. Martin - never going to happen. Ralph could be interesting but I don’t see it happening. Corberan I like but get why others don’t. Eckert has done okay but doesn’t feel like the man we need here and now - no point judging him too much after two games but the fact that they are the only two games he has managed in first team football is exactly why appointing him feels like an absurd risk. I would be surprised if this is therefore our actual list which leads me to conclude that there probably is not much public knowledge of who we are actually interested in.

Yeah fair points. It’s a deal until the end of the season too so depending on how he gets on/where we are we can revisit if an extension suits both parties. Three points and Ori back. I know things are pretty much still a shit show but god it’s good to have something positive saints related. Being a saints fan has felt like such a slog for so long. You can feel it on here - there are always a range of opinions but the level of frustration and negativity feels heavy. Massive personal tangent but on Monday my twin boys turned two. When they were born they were very early and we were rushed from our local hospital to Winchester so they could get the care they needed - my joke is the boys were such saints fans they were determined to be born in Hampshire. A few weeks after birth one of my boys was very poorly and spent a long time in Southampton paediatric intensive care - a lot of it in an induced coma. I can’t put into words what it was like but one of my few distractions was Saints. There were plenty of games where I would be by his bedside either listening to commentary or telling him about my plans to take him and his brother to Saints games. I told him about our European adventure and my first game. He heard oh when the saints and a cleaned up version of what should I be more times than I cared to mention. This is a long roundabout way of expressing what the club means to me - albeit something of an overshare. Seeing Ori’s genuine love for the club feels so very important and I anticipate it will be similar for others who have an attachment to the club that goes well beyond what happens on the pitch each week. It’s alway means something to fans to see players who seem to get it.

I don’t think you will find a single saints fan who isn’t made up with this. It feels right on every level. Even if it doesn’t go perfectly he is a quality player who cares deeply for the club and will make a contribution on and off the pitch. Welcome back Ori!

Largely agree. It’s balance. Taking punts on potential is reasonable when combined with squad building that includes enough seasoned pros to integrate new players alongside. I’m okay with having some hits and some misses but when it leaves us with Stephens, Downes, Armstrong, Aribo and McCarthy as the ‘senior pros’ to fall back on we’ve clearly fucked it.

Perhaps a slight tangent and any answer is entirely subjective but how attractive do people think our job is/isn't? If we’re being generous we have a squad with quality but one or two obvious holes. We have parachute payments this year and next. The league feels pretty open and a Steve Cooper at Forest style play off charge is possible (albeit not likely) though from our current position the measure for success bar is low this season. We seem financially stable and have an ambitious owner - yes, he has got some big calls wrong but he has put his money where his mouth is. For many managers the premier league is the panacea and getting a job with an existing team in there isn’t easy - okay Wolves can’t be too picky at the moment - so taking a team up from the championship is a potential route in. The academy is still well respected and we have some age group internationals which suggest potential in the pipeline. There are counter arguments aplenty but if you’re an elite level coach (or aspiring to be) I expect many would back themselves overcome the issues and make a decent fist of things. Somebody mentioned Rose. While it would clearly be a big step down could someone of his ilk see us as one step backward to hopefully take two forwards if they can get us back up this year or next?

Did anyone actually demand we keep Still until the end of the season?